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FAA Scolds Passenger For Using iPad To Shoot Video Of Bird Strike
The Consumerist ^ | 2MAY2012 | Chris Morran

Posted on 05/03/2012 6:45:02 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine

Remember that bird strike in April that forced a Delta flight to make an emergency landing? The actual incident was caught on video by author Grant Cardone, who is now on some FAA "you're a troublemaker" list because he shot that video when his iPad was supposed to be turned off.

Cardone was on CNN this morning to discuss the letter he'd received from the FAA's Supervisory Principal Operations Inspector regarding the incident.

Reads the letter: "Your failure to comply with flight attendant instructions during a critical phase of flight and an aircraft emergency could have affected the safe outcome of the flight... We have given consideration to all of the facts. In lieu of legal enforcement action (a civil penalty), we are issuing this letter which will be made a matter of record for a period of two years, after which, the record will be expunged."

"I don't think I'm above the law or anyone should be," said Cardone. "I've flown over 3 million miles, a million of them with Delta, and to think that a device — a phone or this iPad... to think that any of these devices could take down a plane is ridiculous... "If truly these devices are that dangerous, then the FAA has the responsibility to ban them."

He didn't exactly respond to host Soledad O'Brien's point that, regardless of whether or not phones present a danger to the flight, Cardone did disregard the instructions of the flight attendants. But he did express concern that the FAA letter is overly vague about the implications of having this scolding on file for the next two years

"What I'm concerned about is what watch list am I on... Am I now a terrorist?" Cardone asked. "Am I going to get double-screened? They just need to clarify what the deal is."


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: birdstrike; faa; ipad; troublemaker

1 posted on 05/03/2012 6:45:12 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Breitbart had his vid up for a while, but they pulled it. Now I know why.


2 posted on 05/03/2012 6:47:33 PM PDT by Excellence (9/11 was an act of faith.)
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To: Excellence

You think the FAA told Breitbart to pull it?


3 posted on 05/03/2012 6:49:23 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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They just need to clarify what the deal is."

Grab your ankles, chump.

4 posted on 05/03/2012 6:52:39 PM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Yep, they have video cameras all over the place filming US, but don’t ever, EVER film them. You have been properly warned.


5 posted on 05/03/2012 6:52:39 PM PDT by rovenstinez
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To: Excellence
He didn't exactly respond to host Soledad O'Brien's point that, regardless of whether or not phones present a danger to the flight, Cardone did disregard the instructions of the flight attendants. But he did express concern that the FAA letter is overly vague about the implications of having this scolding on file for the next two years

I travel 45 weeks a year, and there's always one of these a-holes in near proximity to me, who thinks they're above the law simply because they don't believe their device poses a danger.

YOUR OPINION DOESN'T MATTER! FOLLOW THE %/&#@ RULES!!!

6 posted on 05/03/2012 6:55:22 PM PDT by onehipdad (A great deal of intelligence can be invested in ignorance when the need for illusion is deep.)
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To: onehipdad

If they pose a danger why doesn’t the FAA just ban their use outright?


7 posted on 05/03/2012 6:57:37 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

I don’t know, but it was pulled.I wouldn’t be surprized.


8 posted on 05/03/2012 6:57:40 PM PDT by Excellence (9/11 was an act of faith.)
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To: onehipdad
Enlighten me, please. What danger is posed by a camera used inside a flying aircraft?



Nos genuflectitur ad non princeps sed Princeps Pacem!

Listen, O isles, unto me; and hearken, ye people, from far; The LORD hath called me from the womb; from the bowels of my mother hath he made mention of my name. (Isaiah 49:1 KJV)

9 posted on 05/03/2012 6:59:54 PM PDT by ConorMacNessa (HM/2 USN, 3/5 Marines RVN 1969 - St. Michael the Archangel defend us in Battle!)
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To: Jack Hydrazine
If they pose a danger why doesn’t the FAA just ban their use outright?

According to a friend of mine that is an aerospace engineer the devices are of no danger to the operations of the aircraft. Just a stupid rules to keep the paying passengers in line.

10 posted on 05/03/2012 7:02:06 PM PDT by A_Tradition_Continues (formerly known as Politicalwit ...05/28/98 Class of '98)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

The KING is angry.


11 posted on 05/03/2012 7:02:36 PM PDT by YHAOS (you betcha!)
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To: Excellence
I truly hope his reply to the FAA was "Do the letters FO mean anything to you"?.
12 posted on 05/03/2012 7:02:39 PM PDT by ImJustAnotherOkie (zerogottago)
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To: onehipdad
Here is the simple reason there are restrictions below 10k. How many electronic devices are there on the market today? 1000, 10,000? I don't know. When you put electronics on a plane strange things can happen. That threat is low, but the FAA doesn't want to have to test all that equipment so they came up with the 10k rule. It also limits the amount of potential objects flying around the cabin if something bad happens on takeoff or landing.

This threat is really minuscule, but it does exist.

13 posted on 05/03/2012 7:02:55 PM PDT by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: onehipdad

Phones don’t impose any danger in fact the rule of not using them from an aircraft was issued from the FCC!

From altitude the wipe out many cell towers all trying to connect to the strongest signal and being at altitude that phone is the strongest (line of sight) signal to as many as 50 of them.

Everyone that owned an aircraft and had an FCC license for their radios got the notice in the early 80s and that included me.


14 posted on 05/03/2012 7:03:31 PM PDT by dalereed
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To: A_Tradition_Continues

Of course they aren’t dangerous. Think of the logic.

Before bird strike: iPad and other electronics not dangerous are allowed on board and be in use.
After bird strike: Electronics are dangerous and should be shut off!

Will the flight attendants start confiscating them?


15 posted on 05/03/2012 7:05:56 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: onehipdad
But iPads don't have phones. How do they interfere? Well, I guess they are radio devices.
16 posted on 05/03/2012 7:06:10 PM PDT by Excellence (9/11 was an act of faith.)
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To: onehipdad

Agree 1000%.


17 posted on 05/03/2012 7:06:26 PM PDT by Kirkwood (It's not a lie. It's a composite.)
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To: ConorMacNessa

The problem Conor, is a non compliant citizen.
“Did you really think that we want those laws to be observed?” said Dr. Ferris. “We want them broken. You’d better get it straight that it’s not a bunch of boy scouts you’re up against—then you’ll know that this is not the age for beautiful gestures. We’re after power and we mean it. You fellows were pikers, but we know the real trick, and you’d better get wise to it. There’s no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren’t enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What’s there it that for anyone? But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced nor objectively interpreted—and you create a nation of lawbreakers—and then you cash in on guilt. Now that’s the system, Mr. Rearden, that’s the game, and once you understand it, you’ll be much easier to deal with.”


18 posted on 05/03/2012 7:07:22 PM PDT by DariusBane (People are like sheep and have two speeds: grazing and stampede)
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To: ImJustAnotherOkie
Or how about CZAR B.O.s: WTF
19 posted on 05/03/2012 7:09:48 PM PDT by leprechaun9
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To: Jack Hydrazine

What about regular video cameras? I have shot scenes from planes with my video camera in the past (prior to 2005) and no one said a word.


20 posted on 05/03/2012 7:09:48 PM PDT by Inyo-Mono (My greatest fear is that when I'm gone my wife will sell my guns for what I told her I paid for them)
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To: USNBandit
When you put electronics on a plane strange things can happen.

Such as what?

21 posted on 05/03/2012 7:13:01 PM PDT by Lady Lucky (Fleece, tallow, and get out to be weighed.)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

As I said to another federal bureaucrat who was insisting on giving me an answer that contradicted with reality: I accept your authority to give me an answer that has zero credibility.


22 posted on 05/03/2012 7:13:07 PM PDT by theBuckwheat
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To: theBuckwheat

iPad Electronic Flight Bag Replaces Paper for Alaska Airlines, FAA Approved
Tuesday, May 31, 2011
By OP Editor

Alaska Airlines is the latest billion dollar corporation to replace paper with iPad. Their goal: “to enhance flight safety, improve efficiency and protect the environment.”

http://obamapacman.com/2011/05/ipad-electronic-flight-bag-replaces-paper-for-alaska-airlines-faa-approved/


23 posted on 05/03/2012 7:14:48 PM PDT by theBuckwheat
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To: Jack Hydrazine
I responded to the Breitbart post saying I'd toured the facility that tested the engine on the 757. They threw frozen chickens through those engines. They did everything to kill those engines, then took them apart to diagnose every possible problem. I'd trust those engines, but still I wouldn't fly on a 757. The engines are good, but the skin...It's kinda like the unibody construction on cars. Flaky.
24 posted on 05/03/2012 7:15:52 PM PDT by Excellence (9/11 was an act of faith.)
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To: Jack Hydrazine
The trouble maker list is real...

Their is a fairly famous aviation writer who in essence told the FAA what to do and the horse they rode in on, and now he gets the full shaboygan, but I am not sure about the cavity search.

It is true, piss them off and they will squish you like a bug.

Can you even run a laptop and do work while you fly?

I so hate flying now, and if you knew my background, and how I was part of the industry it breaks my heart to see what has happened. It was on purpose IMHO, it is all about demoralizing us and making us feel like we have no say or liberty, do as I say.

25 posted on 05/03/2012 7:16:50 PM PDT by taildragger (( Palin / Mulally 2012 ))
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To: Jack Hydrazine
Seems that pilots aren't too worried about using phones in flight.

Landing aborted as Australian pilot was busy texting

26 posted on 05/03/2012 7:17:50 PM PDT by Doe Eyes
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To: Excellence
But iPads don't have phones. How do they interfere? Well, I guess they are radio devices.

My iPad has 3G wireless fom AT&T. Uses cell towers just like a cellphone. When I fly, I enable airplane mode. It turns off any radio signals. So there is no interference with a plane. Regardless, I also shut my iPad down when instructed to do so. Not worth arguing with clerk mentality drones.

27 posted on 05/03/2012 7:41:32 PM PDT by roadcat
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To: taildragger
Good observations. It is all about "control".

There are many nations which do not have hijackings, yet take a different approach to airport security at their airports. I could name specific countries, but I think most people know whom I refer to. Unfortunately (for US officials), these approaches overseas present two, stubborn, uncomfortable and inconvenient things: a) they are successful; be) they place basic human respect of the flying customer or citizen as a key element--and still achieve the goal and get the job done.

Back in the United States, though, the US federal government can have none of this. I wish it were otherwise. It is all a mind game, intimidation, control and government statism.

Not to wax early 2012 here and get too political, however, Santorum did have it right when he said the issue, over and above economics in 2012, was one clearly of "freedom". So true. We have lost so much and we will continue to lose even more it seems. Sadly, people will willingly surrender it. The are scared to death of being pulled out of line and "crucified" (EPA-speak for "made a public example for challenging the state.") Nobody wants to hang separately. People are cattle in their intimidated mindset at times. What would The Founders and other early patriots who grabbed their muskets against government excess, think of today?

28 posted on 05/03/2012 7:45:27 PM PDT by AmericanInTokyo (Study closely socialist Hugo Chavez' usage of 'popular masses' in the streets to thwart 1992 coup)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

I have been ordered to turn off my wireless mouse and keyboard twice recently while we were in the above 10,000 feet all clear zone. Since is clearly absurd but their position is screw you. It would inconvenience us to spend the time to prove that a wireless mouse is not a danger.

On the other hand airline-provided-for-a-fee WI-FI is just fine, supposedly.


29 posted on 05/03/2012 7:47:19 PM PDT by Neanderthal
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To: taildragger

The FAA’s double secret probation is no laughing matter. On my last vacation trip I drove almost 2,000 miles each way just so I wouldn’t have to get on an airplane. That’s how much I like flying now.


30 posted on 05/03/2012 7:56:18 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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To: onehipdad
YOUR OPINION DOESN'T MATTER! FOLLOW THE %/&#@ RULES!!!

Belsen? Buchenwald? The US Armed Forces guidelines on following illegal orders? As a famous man once said, "Any fool can make a rule, and any fool can mind it." You mind away, Sunshine.

31 posted on 05/03/2012 8:04:59 PM PDT by SandwicheGuy (*The butter acts as a lubricant and speeds up the CPU*ou)
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To: Jack Hydrazine
"Your failure to comply with flight attendant instructions during a critical phase of flight and an aircraft emergency could have affected the safe outcome of the flight"

Uh, no, the Ipad couldn't.

Not in a million years.

All these schmucks are doing with this heavy handed nonsense is breeding contempt.

32 posted on 05/03/2012 8:16:31 PM PDT by Rome2000 (Rick Santorum -Mission Accomplished)
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To: Jack Hydrazine
I don't remember the details or the solution, but about 30-40 years ago, a few military Huey helicopters crashed for no apparent reason. It was later determined that a new radio was causing the rotors to fold back (like they are designed to do for storage).
33 posted on 05/03/2012 8:25:32 PM PDT by fini
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To: Lady Lucky
Here are a couple specific things I know about.

The Beech King Air, a very popular short haul corporate turboprop has a warning regarding the Instrument Landing System. If you run the prop speed at 1800 rpm on an ILS approach the information provided by the ILS system won't be accurate.

Another instance I know of is a multi band radio used quite commonly in the helicopter industry that if you broadcast in one of the available bands also can effect ILS signals.

Those are both known issues that have been tested, confirmed and mitigated through warnings made available to aircrew. None of the electronic gear in the back of a commercial airliner have been tested for electronic interference. Even if the FAA did test all the gear out there today, there would be 100 new devices tomorrow, and the day after that etc.

I would also add that despite the small percentage chance of a mishap in commercial aviation, takeoffs and landings are still critical phases of flight . The risk is higher and the staff on those airplanes would like to have immediate capability to give instructions. Imagine being on the US Air flight that landed in the Hudson, trying to give emergency instructions if half the flight was grooving on their iPods.

34 posted on 05/03/2012 8:39:20 PM PDT by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Before I read the posts, let me say that those absurd electronics rules are AIRLINE rules, not government regulations.

(If any device were capable of harming navigation is left on, it would and should be contraband on board. (I’d estimate that 10% of all such devices are on at all prohibited times).


35 posted on 05/03/2012 8:56:09 PM PDT by Atlas Sneezed (Hold My Beer and Watch This!)
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To: USNBandit

When you put electronics on a plane strange things can happen.


Except for one itty-bitty thing:

THEY NEVER HAVE!!!!

No harm to navigation has ever come from a consumer device on an aircraft!

And if there is a minuscule risk, then well, FREEDOM IS WORTH IT!!!


36 posted on 05/03/2012 9:00:09 PM PDT by Atlas Sneezed (Hold My Beer and Watch This!)
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To: onehipdad

“who thinks they’re above the law simply because they don’t believe their device poses a danger.”

So how does this affect you; and why is your dander up about it?


37 posted on 05/03/2012 9:06:18 PM PDT by HereInTheHeartland (We are the 53%. 47% of Americans pay no taxes; end the free ride...)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

This whole thing is stoopit.

1st off. Cables are shielded to protect against EMF. Why? because there are a million miles packed into that thong you are flying and they all bleed EMF so the insulation contains the electronic waves are contained in the sheathing.

2nd. I know it total BS because I have private for the last 10 years and they never so much as wiser a word about turning off our cell phones, which are contained constantly clicking as we text friends about our, the fun we had on the trip or making transportation will be at the end of the wing when we land.

I have been in full on conversations conducting business as the plane soars down the runway or while landing.

Gameboboys, IPad’s, IPod’s, etc all stay on use and no one says boo.

So why is this rule still an issue for commercial? Control and superstition

Oh’ my qualifications are:

I have been in telecom for 30 years and installed structured cable in campus environments, data centers and even a battleship..


38 posted on 05/03/2012 10:00:48 PM PDT by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live through it anyway)
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To: USNBandit

Nonsense and illogical. An iPad weighs less than a lot of books and so the rational is that lighter objects like iPads pose more of a threat than a heavier object like a book?

Think about it.


39 posted on 05/03/2012 10:04:50 PM PDT by Psycho_Runner (I never voted for change, I prefer folding money.)
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To: USNBandit

Nonsense and illogical. An iPad weighs less than a lot of books and so the rational is that lighter objects like iPads pose more of a threat than a heavier object like a book?

Think about it.


40 posted on 05/03/2012 10:05:04 PM PDT by Psycho_Runner (I never voted for change, I prefer folding money.)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

Time to run up the BS flag.


41 posted on 05/03/2012 10:18:03 PM PDT by Hoosier-Daddy ( "It does no good to be a super power if you have to worry what the neighbors think." BuffaloJack)
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To: Jack Hydrazine
What utter bullshit.
42 posted on 05/04/2012 6:42:01 AM PDT by starlifter (Pullum sapit)
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To: USNBandit
Please. There is no evidence whatsoever that cell phones or other devices have any impact on the safe operation of the airplane. None. Nada. Zip-point-squat.

I stopped turning off my cellphone and reader years ago. I promise you the crews don't turn theirs off. How many times (if you fly) have you watched a stewardess texting after they take their seats for landing?

43 posted on 05/04/2012 6:48:58 AM PDT by starlifter (Pullum sapit)
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To: Hoosier-Daddy

http://www.myfoxdfw.com/story/18044260/north-korea-gps-jamming-is-affecting-civilian-flights-seoul-official-says

North Korea is actively jamming GPS navigation signals. Have airlines suspended flights to South Korea? No. I’d say that’s more hazardous than the theoretical problems associated with relatively low-powered personal electronic devices in the cabin. But since North Korean actions are outside the reach of the airlines, the FAA or... (you get the idea!)


44 posted on 05/04/2012 9:23:09 AM PDT by Tallguy (It's all 'Fun and Games' until somebody loses an eye!)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

FAA is forgetting for whom they work....


45 posted on 05/04/2012 9:25:39 AM PDT by mo (If you understand, no explanation is needed. If you don't understand, no explanation is possible.)
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To: onehipdad

...thinks they’re above the law simply because they don’t believe their device poses a danger.


It’s not a law, it’s an airline rule.


46 posted on 05/04/2012 9:57:04 AM PDT by Atlas Sneezed (Hold My Beer and Watch This!)
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To: Jack Hydrazine

New York Air Controllers Slept, Watched Movies, U.S. Says

Alan Levin, ©2012 Bloomberg News

Tuesday, May 8, 2012

(Updates with New York data starting in second paragraph.)

May 8 (Bloomberg) — Air-traffic controllers in the New York area slept on the job, watched movies, left work early and repeatedly violated safety rules, a U.S. investigative agency told the White House and Congress.

Controllers at the facility that monitors traffic around New York, the busiest U.S. metropolitan flight corridor, also used “careless and casual language” with pilots, leading to at least one serious incident of planes getting too close, the U.S. Office of Special Counsel, which investigates whistle-blower complaints, said today in a letter.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2012/05/08/bloomberg_articlesM3ODHH6TTDSE01-M3Q39.DTL&type=printable


47 posted on 05/09/2012 2:19:44 PM PDT by KeyLargo
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To: KeyLargo

If you want your luggage to get stolen fly into NYC. If you want to lax operating conditions in the tower or at a TRACON that might lead to an inflight collision or near miss just fly into or near the NYC area.


48 posted on 05/09/2012 2:40:53 PM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
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