Skip to comments.Frank discussion re our loss to Obama/Romney and the future direction of FR and tea party movement
Posted on 05/04/2012 6:31:27 AM PDT by Jim Robinson
My FRiends, we might as well face the reality that we the combined pro-life conservative movement and tea party coalition have lost this round (the presidential election) in the larger battle to reclaim our constitution and our inalienable rights. Rove, Romney and the GOP-e have successfully destroyed and driven off each and every pro-life conservative tea party candidate from the race and all have surrendered to the Romney camp. It is no secret that Romney is not one of us. There is absolutely no doubt that he has never accomplished a single conservative thing in his entire political career (one term as liberal governor of liberal Massachusetts and six years campaigning for president). In Massachusetts, he undeniably championed abortion, gay rights, global warming, gun control, big government statist mandated/socialized health care programs, liberal judges, TARP, bailouts, stimulus spending, debt limit increases, etc, and even though he's recently claimed a complete reversal in political beliefs and no longer despises pro-life conservatives or the time of Reagan-Bush, I still don't trust him. He still stubbornly holds on to some of his statist beliefs, like global warming, gays in the military, RomneyCare, stimulus spending, etc, so there is no way I can vote for him or join Cain, Perry, Bachmann, Newt or any others who are endorsing him. But I will not act on my prior promises that I would actively campaign against him if he wins the nomination. Our combined movement is already torn and splintered and is going to have to be mended if we're going to have any impact whatsoever against the liberal/progressives and statists after the election. To that end I propose a TRUCE among our conservative forces during the remainder of this election cycle.
We conservatives have already lost the presidency to either the Dems or the GOP-e, and if we tear the tea party apart, if we tear the pro-life movement apart, if we tear FR apart then we lose it all. It's far more important that we re-unite and live to fight another day. Even if we can't vote for a true conservative for the presidency, it's doubly important that we all turn out on election day or sooner and drag our friends, neighbors, relatives, co-workers, etc, to the polls to vote straight conservative for every slot on our ballots. The only way we can win our freedom back is to vote out the liberal progressives and vote in as many liberty loving conservatives as is humanly possible into every elected office at every level of government all across this great land. To prevent a total loss to the dems or GOP-e, we must continue the tea party rebellion into November and beyond. Whatever else you may do, you must turn out and vote straight tea party conservative down ticket!!
We must continue expanding our inroads into the state houses and into every elective office in the land. We must continue building on our majority in the house and we must retake the senate!! We must help the conservative governors and state legislatures to fully restore the ninth and tenth amendments and reclaim the real political power away from the federal usurpers and return it to the states and the people per the constitution!! This way, regardless of who wins the presidency, we can cut his unconstitutional expansionist movements off at the knees. And if any executive, civil officer or judge dares commit impeachable offenses, we must hold the majorities so we can impeach and remove them from office!!
And we must salvage and rebuild and continue strengthening our conservative pro-life, pro-family, pro-gun, pro-borders, pro-constitution, pro-small government, pro-defense, pro-liberty movements and our tea party coalition. And we must stop ripping each other apart!!
Therefore I hereby propose a general truce among our conservative forces!!
The Republic we save may be our own!!
As far as FR's finances go, we're in the same boat as the rest of the economy and will have to make do with what we can raise. Fortunately, the big debts we ran up a couple years ago have been paid off. We borrowed approx $20,000 a few years ago from two FReepers to fund our national convention, plus we ran up another $20,000 in legal fees during the last couple of years fighting off Righthaven. But those are now behind us and paid off. We also did quite a bit of traveling each year for the last three years on cross country tea party tours, but I think we can now cut that back and remove it from our budget requirements. If we're fortunate enough to not incur any additional legal costs or equipment costs (other than what we've already planned), and cut the travel and a few other areas, we should be able to tighten our belts enough to weather the storm even if we fail to reach our short term fundraising goals.
Whatever the outcome of the elections, we are prepared to roar into 2013 with the tea party chewing up liberal/progressives and RINOs and raising hell in our never ending fight for liberty!!
We are the resistance!!
Let's take the enemy head-on instead of fighting each other!!
Damn the torpedoes, full steam ahead!!
“Just as there are Christian academies that provide education based on a religious foundation for those parents who choose it for their kids, we need Western Acadamies that teach (for lack of a better phrase) true history from a Western perspective.”
Your Christian private schools, military academies, and home schools are largely already in your camp. Build on that foundation.
As it’s also possible for someone to overmark the ballot and void it too... but that’s an age old issue. The write in ballots I’ve seen on optical ballots have a bubble mark to fill in to indicate that you are using them. The optical tallyer would flag that there is something that needs to be looked at by hand.
‘What is Romney giving up? “
Honestly, I do think the public stands he has had to take will keep him at least somewhat in line if he wants re-election.
I don’t mean to be Pollyanna, and I’m not enthusiastic, but I do think conservatives and tea partiers have had their influence.
If public schools still taught kids to read, it might be possible to have supplemental books that parents could furnish to their kids, books which would “fill in the holes” left by lie-berals in school texts.
half the people Posting here are closeted Daily Kos Members.
There seemed to be a dust-up in Mitt’s campaign committee about that gay national security spokesman — the spokesman never complained about Mitt when he left. Someone with sense seems to still be in there.
But if Mitt seeks out yes-men, pure chaos will result.
“So my first question is, why aren’t we Freepers supporting him? I understand his foreign policy seems a bit odd. But even George Washington cautioned against getting involved with foreign wars. Some think he’s anti-mililtary, but he’s not. His record shows that he’s anti-waste in military spending and military use.”
Mr. Paul wants to close down all our military bases around the world. He wants homosexuals to serve openly in the military. He wants a defense-only, Swiss-type foreign policy. He supports the rights of states to do such things as legalize every drug, including the hard drugs such as heroin. He blames the U.S. for pushing Muslims into 9/11. He rejects political support of Israel. He is a proud member of a party that supports legalized prostitution, all forms of legalized gambling, and any and all types of public porn. This results in such marvels as him declaring Bradley Manning a “patriot.”
I’d rather have Obama. At least Obama has to keep up some appearance of sanity.
“Thanks to Lincoln the butcher and the statist Yankees who followed that goon, we are all slaves of the state and states rights is dead. “
I know this isn’t my argument, but I’d like to say I hold the South equally responsible for the loss of states’ rights (which I sorely wish we still had.) Their insistence on enslaving their fellow man lost all of us our freedoms.
Freedom is for a moral people. If it’s going to be abused like that, it gets lost.
Now maybe you never sold a child from his mama or beat a man until his flesh hung from his back. Perhaps you never hobbled an escapee or used a black teen girl as a brood mare.
But the South fought for its right to do these things and more, and it was evil, and if they had backed off, the Civil War, in my opinion, would not have happened.
I have often thought that perhaps in the future conservatives should consider onganizing better so that we dont have so many conservatives splitting up the conservative vote allowing a moderate republican to win the nomination. I dont know how that would be done.
“More importantly, we have the first election in decades where the Democrat is running as a self-acknowledged undiluted leftist.”
If anyone doubts this, check out the “Julia” Obama campaign website. It’s creepy and over-the-top PR for cradle-to-grave welfare-statism.
Alas, the genie of staying isolated, with two comfortably large oceans to separate from the chaos of the old world, has forever left the bottle. Modern transport and modern weapons and modern remote forces that hear from their homeland via modern communication eat up that space like nothing, and the Middle East might as well be our next door neighbor. Also with great trade comes great economic interdependence (even if China wasn’t an issue). A gaping hole in Paul’s take on libertarianism.
The drug issue, and many would disagree with me, is a tiger being held by the tail. Less drug-related ruin would have ensued to society had the traditional physician moderated prescription model been kept for all potent pharmaceuticals, even acetylmorphine (heroin).
I’m trying to figure out how to continue the battle too Jim. I think the war aginst Romney, the GOPe and the Left starts the day after the election. We just need to hunker down and get ourselves better financed while we bide our time.
There is literally no place to rub (trust me, I’ve looked) so we just have to understand this is long campaign. 40 years.
Julia is a joke that Obama has told on himself, and he doesn’t even know it yet.
If we cant say these things on this forum it will continue to decline in membership.
Brilliant post. Too bad you are probably going to get banned for it. And me too for agreeing. But it needed to be said.
I cannot describe how sad it is to watch FR decline as it has in the past year or so, and especially in the last few months. And to see so many earnest freepers get booted for stating the obvious just makes me ill. It's like a ghost town around here now.
While the perfect conservatives have insisted on a Ronald Reagan, Chairman ObamMao is making himself comfortable for four more years.
Our country will be unrecognizable after that. And FR will be long gone, probably by Executive Order.
“For them to not give Palin the time of day shows just how screwed up they are.”
She chose not to run. They didn’t prevent her.
There was no war. No-one really needs more than 5 bits to represent a character.
EBCDIC was good enough, even though it used 8 bits.
The slavery of the South wasn’t the slavery that was tolerated if not condoned by the New Testament, either (into which the slave entered voluntarily). It was chattel slavery, fed by internecine kidnapping in Africa, trafficked by Islamic Arabs, and enforced by a convenient but artificial distinction made towards Negro peoples. If you were a Negro in one of those states back then and didn’t have papers showing you were free, they assumed you were a slave. Absolutely despicable. Karma (figuratively speaking) was a St. Bernard sized bitch.
I've heard the exact same lament when Clinton was being re-elected because the GOP-E put up Dole.
Overstate things much?
A telling statistic for me is that in all the primaries, the GOP-e candidate never got 50% of the vote. Yet he is the nominee.
What does that tell you?
I think this situation has not been sufficiently appreciated by conservatives.
Since Mondale we've been forced to campaign on "No! Really! This guy is much more of a leftist than he's letting on!"
It made it easy for the commies to reply "Look how ideological they are! What is this, the McCarthy era? The Cold War is over already. There are no leftists anymore. We're forward-looking, post-partisan pragmatists and you're stuck in the past!"
This year we can run against big government, resentment of success, and identity politics like never before. We are the party of e pluribus unum, equality under the law, and not stealing from future generations. That is a much easier sell.
Jim, I think this is a well thought out stance and I applaud you for making it.
Im an ABO guy, not crazy about Romney but resigned to the fact that I dont feel like I can abstain, but I certainly understand where you are coming from along with the other folks who cant vote for him because of conscience.
I appreciate the olive branch and wholeheartedly agree with the idea that you have stated. We as conservatives need to unite and not tear each other apart, even if we have to “agree to disagree” on the best course of action in this Presidential election.
But one thing we certainly agree on, regardless of what any of us do with regards to the presidental election, is the need to vote conservative all the way down on every other race, without a doubt.
If you don't see a difference between Bill Clinton/1996 and Barack Obama/2012, you have some reading to do.
A P.S. about the slaves — it’s impossible that the situation could not have brought about God’s frown, going beyond New Testament norms as it did. And if that resulted in a deterioration of the society to the point of war, it was a divine chastisement. I don’t think it’s as simple as saying Abraham Lincoln went on a jihad to stop slavery, though.
“the socially liberal Ron Paul”
“I don’t believe Ron Paul is as socially liberal as Romney. “
Ron Paul supports the destruction of marriage in toto. This position is more radical and dangerous by far than ‘gay marriage’, and yet Romney is attacked on FR for not stopping gay marriage in Mass (even though he never supported what the Mass SCOTUS did to create it).
Ron Paul supports drug legalization. social liberal.
Romney and Ron Paul have the same positions on abortion/life, and neither have been leaders on that issue.
Ron Paul took earmarks, so this ‘principles’ stuff is good PR on his part but not his real record.
My rep voted to abdicate the national debt on 2 Aug 2011 to the President. How can I vote for him? NEVER!
It’s a thorny dilemma. The wiser thing may be to see if this person can be primaried out by a sterner competitor. But if that won’t work then get the nose clothespin out.
Is there an internal FR enemies list of the dissident rabble rousers? Do any of them go by the initials KC?
Inquiring minds want to know. LOL
Johnny - you are and remain one of my favorite posters on this forum.
Here is the Clinton comparison off-hand
Debt is 3 times worse now - economy in much worse shape
Government is much larger now too - can’t afford promises or pensions
Clinton had Newt to keep him in line and he was pragmatic enough to often veer to the center. We have Boehner and Obama is already veering further left and he won’t care if he wins a second term.
Clinton did not have radicals throughout his administration and he worked with congress. As an aside, I really do miss Jocelyn Elders. Rush has never been as funny as he was when that gal was around.
The Progressive movement was still behind the scenes with Clinton. They are large and in-charge with Obama.
We are in deep doo-doo FRiend. I don’t believe he is overstating the seriousness of our situation at all. I was not either. One vote difference on the 2nd Amendment. One vote.
The Progressives in charge today make the Clinton administration look tame and I remember it well.
The primary is over. Romney won the nomination, the rest is a formality to the already existing reality.
Im not exactly sure what JR did here today... I think that is still left to be determined...
What shouldn’t ever happen again is supporting another DH like Ahnold... And it wont happen again...
Sometimes you have to poison the entire body to kill the cancer... But the cancer must be killed.
If you try to coexist with it, you Die...
If you try to make deals with it, you die.
If you try to make some kind of truce with it, You die.
And sometimes... Even if you fight it with everything you have, you still die...
There are those times... That you fight it tooth and nail, and win... and live free of it.
Progressives/Rinos are the cancer and doing anything but fighting them tooth and nail ensures miserable defeat.
So sad Jim
It tells us that there is a possibility that the Conservative message doesn't resonate with the Public, even with the closest thing to Stalin living in the White House while wreaking havoc on the entire Country.
It also tells me that perhaps we at FR are preaching to the Choir and the Church Pews are empty.
Not until Romney gets enough uncontested delegates to clinch the nomination. I expect a floor fight.
You can say what you want, but unless the GOP cheats again and changes the rules, there are still states yet to vote, and delegates to get, and a convention.
And I'm pushing HARD against the Romney crowd until that fat lady sings.
And he DOESN'T have the delegates yet.
Mark for later, begin @ 51.
I am with you, no more. The party left me in 1998 when the Senate refused to do their duty and hold a real trial for the impeached Bill Clinton.
Republicrats/Demicans not a great difference between the two, for this citizen. And I am glad I am not alone in this thought. When enough come to this conclusion, perhaps things might change, but I am not holding my breath and besides I don't have that much time left.
No Sale. I’m not voting for a liberal. Obama or Romney.
It’s your vote FRiend. The irony is your vote nor mine will probably make a difference. Romney will carry your state and Obama will carry mine.
Strange times indeed. Makes me wonder if we will get bored saying the same stuff on every thread?
And you never will see that candidate until and unless YOU decide to run!
I have been disgusted with the hyena purity brigade for a long time. THEY know what a conservative is. THEY know what a RINO is. THEY know what the bible says. THEY are hypocrites.
The GOP never wins when they run a liberal or moderate. But they keep trying. And folks keep buying the fear thing.
Taxman Bravo Zulu Jim!
We conservatives have been fed a sh!t sandwich, and we must make the best of it, because to not work our a$$es off to ensure the defeat of Obongo Bozo and his LIEberal/Socialist/Marxist/Fascist hangers-on will mean the end of America as we know it.
So, we spend as much time, talent and treasure as we can afford to elect conservatives in the down ticket races.
We actively oppose Obongo Bozo at every turn — bumper stickers, yard signs, street theater — whatever we can do to inform Americans how terrible the USA will become if he wins again.
After Obongo Bozo is defeated, we then hold the US Government’s feet to the fire, and use whatever legal means we can to reclaim our Constitutional Republic.
To not do so would be to capitulate to the Forces of Evil, and I, for one, am not willing to do that!
Press on, Jim, and God Bless America!
Thanks for sharing your insights, dear boxlunch!
No... we wont get bored...
It will become a F’ing MANTRA...
We will chant it in our GD sleep...
When this disaster comes to fruition, WE will make sure EVERYONE knows it was the progressive GOP-e that caused it. We repeat it at every opportunity, every day, for as long as it takes to become common knowledge...
F the progressive gop-e
“Paul is in the campaign as a spoiler for Romney”
“This statement is illogical. Ron Paul has run for election to the office of the president at least three times.”
This statement is not illogical, it actually touches on a key and fundamental reason why RINOs were nominated in 2008 and 2012. Ron Paul is to blame, and what he has done is SPLIT THE CONSERVATIVE VOTE. It’s high time we call him out and put blame on him for his role - partly intended - in damaging conservative hopefuls.
By begin anti-war extremist and a libertarian and not a true conservative, Ron Paul is UNACCEPTABLE to real conservatives. However, his small Government views are good and appealling enough to some that he peels off their vote and support.
Ron Paul is not a Republican. He’s a libertarian who has decided - correctly - that 3rd party politics go nowhere (he knows, he was the libertarian party candidate in 1988) so he runs as a Republican - NOT TO WIN BUT TO DISRUPT. You can respect him for it, he wants to advance his ideals, BUT THE CONSEQUENCE OF HIS RUNS HAS BEEN THE DIVIDING AND CONQUERING OF THE CONSERVATIVE MOVEMENT AT THE HANDS OF RINOS.
Conservatives have since Reagan had the ‘three legged stool’ of
1. strong military and peace through strength
2. Free market and low taxes / low spending
3. Traditional family values and prolife
Ron Paul appeals to 1 1/2 of those, and not only that - he ATTACKS those who are true Reaganites - blasting those who like Reagan want a strong America as ‘neocons’, and attacking social conservatives with opposing views against traditional marriage. In doing so, he sows division, discord and disunity. His minions are a disruptive force in the party.
In the primaries, Ron Paul has gotten his 10%, sometimes more. What’s left of the conservative movement in the primaries?
A SoCon ‘wing’ that ends up supporting real social conservatives (Huckabee08/Santorum12) that also arent true reaganites (not being small government conservatives).
The fiscal/small-government conservative wing that ends up supporting someone who - BECAUSE RON PAUL BLED OFF VOTES - CANT WIN!!! Consider Fred Thompson / Newt Gingrich - the hopes that never were. If Ron Paul was not in the race, and thos votes went to Newt - Newt would have won in Iowa and Florida. If, further, that momentum encourage the social conservatives to join in.... the conservative wins.
that didnt happen. Why? WE WERE DIVIDED. Why? Ron Paul was there to attack REAL CONSERVATIVES (did you know he ran ATTACK ADS AGAINST RICK PERRY IN IOWA?!?) tear them down. He might as well have been on Romney’s payroll, he was that effective at stopping conservatives. As a result, real conservatives DONT HAVE A CHANCE.
In Reagan’s formula, we united libertarians, national security conservatives and social conservatives. With Ron Paul, they are divided.
BY DIVIDING CONSERVATIVES, RON PAUL HAS BECOME THE ENABLER OF RINO VICTORIES IN 2008 AND 2012.
This is not Ron Paul’s primary intention, but it might as well be - BECAUSE RON PAULS REAL GOAL IS JUST AS BAD: HE WANTS TO REPLACE REAGAN’S CONSERVATIVE AGENDA WITH A DIFFERENT, LIBERTARIAN ONE. It’s bad because where Ron Paul and Reagan part ways (and Ron Paul attacked Reagan enough to leave the party in 1988), Reagan was right and Paul is wrong.
Ron Paul will never ever be the Republican nominee.
Since his success leads to the failure of consrvatives, best thing is to never ever encourage him by giving him any support.
He is as good for conservatives as rat poison.
“He, like George Washington, believes in NO foreign entanglements.” - As newt would put it, that’s pious baloney. Ron Paul, like CODE PINK, has voted with the left on a number of foreign policy votes, undercut President Bush, blamed America for 9/11, and has for years been so soft on terrorists he’s attracted nutball conspiracy theory supporters. Palling around with Alex Jones will do that. The reality is Ron Paul is nutty on a number of issues that make him very unelectable.
Thanks for the encouragement! We must elect real conservatives to Congress to help keep this RINO in check!
AMEN Taxman! AMEN!
Thanks Jim. Best we can do for this cycle. Live to fight another day. Anyone (and I mean anyone is better than Obama).
The Buckley Rule on voting: Vote for the most conservative *electable* candidate. Sure it’s narrowly circumscribed - every President since Lincoln - that’s been 150 years now - has been Republican or Democrat.
If you want to influence the outcome, you choose D or R. Voting 3rd party is just a no-op protest vote.
The Constitution Party got under 1% of the vote in 2008, a year when a worse RINO than Romney headed the GOP ticket - McCain. Romney is more conservative than McCain, enough so that real conservatives like Marc Levin back in 2008 were grasping at Romney as that conservative alternative to McCain. If you could tell that the Pubbie was more conservative than Obama in 2008 you can tell certainly that in 2012.
If Obama werent a jobkilling socialist ready to circumvent the congress and constitution and presiding over the impending bankrupting of our nation, I’d say ‘go for it’ wrt 3rd party, but giving Obama 4 more years is playing with fire. I cannot in good conscience let that happen to my children, or for that matter any American family.
Anyone But Obama therefore requires voting Republican.