Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

US SCOTUS Decision (10am) Open thread for Thursday June 21st, 2012

Posted on 06/21/2012 2:58:37 AM PDT by Perdogg

Original thread



Today the court is handing down decisions, possibly in the Arizona Immigration Law case.

Make your Prediction on:

1. Az Immigration law

2a. Heathcare Mandate

2b. Heathcare Servability

3. Stolen Valor Act


TOPICS: Breaking News; Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: notbreakingnews; scotus; scotuslivewatch; scotusobamacare; scotuswatch; vanity
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-150151-194 last
To: ari-freedom

and the entitlement drones who are living in their mother’s basement, sitting on the couch watching TV with oatmeal dribbling down their chins...waiting for their unemployment check to arrive.


151 posted on 06/21/2012 8:32:32 AM PDT by Mountain Mary
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 65 | View Replies]

To: TomGuy
NO DECISION TODAY on Immigration or Healthcare. Decisions may become Monday.

Didn't think we would see controversial decisions today. They may want to hold them for the last session (next Thurs?) so they can be out of DC when heads start exploding.

152 posted on 06/21/2012 8:34:51 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (If I can't be persuasive, I at least hope to be fun.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 116 | View Replies]

To: Perdogg

They didn’t announce Monday was the last day, that was speculation. As it’s not announced, that implies there may be decisions released beyond Monday.


153 posted on 06/21/2012 8:38:48 AM PDT by newzjunkey
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 138 | View Replies]

To: Gaffer

I can see Kagan now.. Dangling her pearls and winking at Kennedy. Ewwwwwww... Don’t fall for it, Kennedy! She’s Obama’s ‘psy ops queen’! Here’s a portion of her ‘ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS’ in her college thesis, “TO THE FINAL CONFLICT: SOCIALISM IN NEW YORK CITY, 1900-1933”:

“Finally, I would like to thank my brother Marc, whose involvement lin radical causes led me to explore the history of American radicalism in the hope of clarifying my own political ideas.”


154 posted on 06/21/2012 8:45:01 AM PDT by GeorgeWashingtonsGhost
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: Perdogg
in the meantime, an Indonesian air force plane crashed into a housing complex in the eastern part of Jakarta killing some meaningless human beings ;-)
155 posted on 06/21/2012 8:45:06 AM PDT by Brown Deer (Pray for 0bama. Psalm 109:8)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Perdogg

I think next Thursday is the last day. I could be wrong.


156 posted on 06/21/2012 9:20:11 AM PDT by murron (Proud Mom of a Marine Vet)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: aces

That would require passing a budget.


157 posted on 06/21/2012 9:20:11 AM PDT by RainMan (2016 is a lonnng ways away. Support your local conservatives)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

This whole thing is getting silly now. The only people that dont know anything are we the people. Skip the fanfare, and make the announcement how you ruled. Why all the BS, send a fax and lets get on with it..


158 posted on 06/21/2012 9:23:46 AM PDT by cardinal4 (Do I really need a /s tag?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 151 | View Replies]

To: newgeezer

Is that like ATM machine and PIN number?


159 posted on 06/21/2012 9:24:57 AM PDT by murron (Proud Mom of a Marine Vet)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 87 | View Replies]

To: cardinal4

I’m getting tired of this as well. I’ve been on pins and needles all week. I was hoping they would give their opinion today so I could enjoy the weekend. Even if the decision goes against us, at least the waiting would be over. I feel like what it must feel like to be a defendent in a criminal trial who is waiting and waiting for the jury to come in and they just keep making me wait.

The SCOTUS knows their decision. Why are they making us wait? I can’t stand it!!!!!


160 posted on 06/21/2012 9:33:51 AM PDT by murron (Proud Mom of a Marine Vet)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 158 | View Replies]

To: cardinal4
Agree completely with your post.
This is beyond absurd and is a pattern of how our whole government operates, the heck with the little people, let them wait.
161 posted on 06/21/2012 9:39:27 AM PDT by The Cajun (Sarah Palin, Mark Levin......Nuff said.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 158 | View Replies]

To: kevkrom

We’re in agreement.


162 posted on 06/21/2012 9:49:30 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (Steampunk- Yesterday's Tomorrow, Today)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 149 | View Replies]

To: Cheerio
...stunned...breathtaking...

All very descriptive words of the times in which we live. "ASTONISHING" is the word that most comes to my mind lately especially after an apparent imposter from Kenya with a congressional voting record to the left of the Socialist congressman was elected for no apparent, cogent reason other than it was cool and he is black.

163 posted on 06/21/2012 9:51:09 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 106 | View Replies]

To: NeverEVERKerry

Great job live-blogging the live-blog :-) The Knox opinion will be a good read.


164 posted on 06/21/2012 9:51:41 AM PDT by zeugma (Those of us who work for a living are outnumbered by those who vote for a living.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 120 | View Replies]

To: STARWISE; Perdogg
The opinion is by Breyer.

Usually not a good sign.

Justice Scalia dissents, joined by the Chief and Alito and Thomas.

Also almost always a bad sign. Scalia and Thomas are the good guys.

What are/were the issues and ramifications of this case?

165 posted on 06/21/2012 9:57:17 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 105 | View Replies]

To: NonValueAdded
A slapdown of SEIU...is something to savor

I'm not so sure.

The opinion is by Breyer.

Usually not a good sign.

Justice Scalia dissents, joined by the Chief and Alito and Thomas.

Also almost always a bad sign. Scalia and Thomas are the good guys.

What are/were the issues and ramifications of this case that caused our freedom-loving, Constitution-loving justices to dissent?

166 posted on 06/21/2012 10:03:00 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 89 | View Replies]

To: tcrlaf
Knox VS. SEIU:

The opinion is by Breyer.

Usually not a good sign.

Justice Scalia dissents, joined by the Chief and Alito and Thomas.

Also almost always a bad sign. Scalia and Thomas are the good guys.

What are/were the issues and ramifications of this case that caused our freedom-loving, Constitution-loving justices to dissent?

167 posted on 06/21/2012 10:10:49 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 82 | View Replies]

To: CottonBall

“Excellent point. The dumbing down of the population, purposely done in our public schools since the unions took hold, is having its desired outcome. Politicians have to pare down their message to be understood by the simpleminded. So it becomes less a matter of character and policy. And the liberal media encourages it with their constant polls that ask which candidate you like better (nothing to do with ability or integrity or policies).”

It doesn’t even matter to liberals if some of them think that “Obama is a Keynesian” is a birther slogan. Liberal ideology is just a means to the end, which is government control.


168 posted on 06/21/2012 10:27:17 AM PDT by ari-freedom
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 144 | View Replies]

To: erod
negative nabobs

Don't forget they are also nattering nabobs of negativity...

Individual Mandate Struck down
Obamacare Law Struck down

Got a breakdown by justice?

4 FOR BOTH: All four socialist justices

2 AGAINST BOTH: Scalia and Thomas

NEEDS ANALYSIS: Roberts - a conservative but has a reputation of being loathe to go against the legislature.

NEEDS ANALYSIS: Kennedy - which side of the bed did/will he get up on when the decision was/is made?

The decision which may have already been made was/is teetering between 6-2 for Individual Mandate/ObamaCare and 5-4 against Individual Mandate/ObamaCare.

169 posted on 06/21/2012 10:31:21 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 68 | View Replies]

To: katieanna
Mandate: 5-4 overturned Severability: Not sever able 6-3

Although this is a prediction, all but two justices seem fairly known/reliable. Got a breakdown by justice?

4 FOR BOTH: All four socialist justices

2 AGAINST BOTH: Scalia and Thomas

UNKNOWN: Roberts - a conservative but has a reputation of being loathe to go against the legislature.

UNKNOWN: Kennedy - which side of the bed did/will he get up on when the decision was/is made?

The decision which may have already been made was/is teetering between 6-2 for Individual Mandate/ObamaCare and 5-4 against Individual Mandate/ObamaCare. What is you take on the two unknowns?

170 posted on 06/21/2012 10:36:47 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: ne1410s
Obamacare will be knocked down

Although this is a prediction, all but two justices seem fairly known/reliable. Got a breakdown by justice?

4 FOR BOTH: All four socialist justices

2 AGAINST BOTH: Scalia and Thomas

UNKNOWN: Roberts - a conservative but has a reputation of being loathe to go against the legislature.

UNKNOWN: Kennedy - which side of the bed did/will he get up on when the decision was/is made?

The decision which may have already been made was/is teetering between 6-2 for Individual Mandate/ObamaCare and 5-4 against Individual Mandate/ObamaCare. What is your take and why on the two unknowns?

171 posted on 06/21/2012 10:41:16 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: PapaNew
I think you have a different case in mind ... I was referring to Knox:
ALITO, J., delivered the opinion of the Court, in which ROBERTS, C. J., and SCALIA, KENNEDY, and THOMAS, JJ., joined. SOTOMAYOR, J., filed an opinion concurring in the judgment, in which GINSBURG, J., joined. BREYER, J., filed a dissenting opinion, in which KAGAN, J., joined.

172 posted on 06/21/2012 10:44:06 AM PDT by NonValueAdded (Steyn: "One can argue about whose fault it is, but not ... whose responsibility it is: it's his")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 166 | View Replies]

To: xzins
5-4.....2a. Heathcare Mandate 5-4.....2b. Heathcare Servability

Assuming you mean 5-4 against both, why do you think both Roberts who is loathe to overturn the legislature and Kennedy will/have vote(d) against?

173 posted on 06/21/2012 10:45:28 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: PapaNew
Knox opinion: http://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/11pdf/10-1121c4d6.pdf. Breyer was the dissent (along with Kagan)
174 posted on 06/21/2012 10:46:31 AM PDT by NonValueAdded (Steyn: "One can argue about whose fault it is, but not ... whose responsibility it is: it's his")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 167 | View Replies]

To: bjcoop; buckalfa
...the mandate and law...are both gone.

Might as well ask you what I've been asking others...

Got a breakdown by justice?

4 FOR BOTH: All four socialist justices

2 AGAINST BOTH: Scalia and Thomas

UNKNOWN: Roberts - a conservative but has a reputation of being loathe to go against the legislature.

UNKNOWN: Kennedy - which side of the bed did/will he get up on when the decision was/is made?

The decision which may have already been made was/is teetering between 6-2 for Individual Mandate/ObamaCare and 5-4 against Individual Mandate/ObamaCare. What is your take and why on the two unknowns?

175 posted on 06/21/2012 10:49:39 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: Perdogg
Did you read his tagline? “Nabob of Negativity”

I guess he's not Nattering...

176 posted on 06/21/2012 10:51:02 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: Gaffer
My guess is that Kennedy is the deciding factor in a 5-4 decision on everything.

Roberts may also be an unknown here - reportedly loathe to overturn the legislature.

177 posted on 06/21/2012 10:55:17 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: PapaNew

Has Kagan recused herself in the health care case? She was an integral part of preparation for it in the runup to its passage as a high level principal.


178 posted on 06/21/2012 10:58:10 AM PDT by Gaffer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 177 | View Replies]

To: Gaffer
Has Kagan recused herself in the health care case?

I don't know - would that be for both the mandate and ObamaCare (MacabreCare) as a whole? Seems like a tie would be a very definite possibility in that case.

In that case, let all the states do what Idaho did - pass a law signed by the governor nullifying MacabreCare and proclaiming its citizens free from the healthcare mandates.

Unless overturned, that's what the states should do.

179 posted on 06/21/2012 11:06:12 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 178 | View Replies]

To: NonValueAdded
I was referring to Knox

Your post mentioned SEIU...

180 posted on 06/21/2012 11:09:45 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 172 | View Replies]

To: PapaNew

My understanding is that she, as a high-level DOJ employee help to vet (such as rabid Democrats would do) the proposed legislation before she was nominated for the seat. I could be wrong on this but this is what I remember hearing.

To my mind, her involvement then, would preclude her deciding on any portion of the law.

Lastly, I am fully for STATE nullification of Federal Laws that are not specifically traced to a CLEAR WRITTEN reading of the US Consitution. As far as I’m concerned, this Federal Government is our enemy and not to be trusted or supported.


181 posted on 06/21/2012 11:11:29 AM PDT by Gaffer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 179 | View Replies]

To: PapaNew

Mandate is 5-4 due to unconstitutionality, but libs will vote lib.

Non-Severability is, in the long run, made necessary by the lack of funding when the mandate disappears. Political decision again = 5-4.


182 posted on 06/21/2012 11:32:51 AM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! Those who truly support our troops pray for their victory!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 173 | View Replies]

To: Gaffer
As far as I’m concerned, this Federal Government is our enemy and not to be trusted or supported.

A fox (gov't) to guard the hen house (America). The fox must also be guarded by the owners (us) who put it there because the fox is capable of chewing through his restraints and killing the hens. Well the owners have done a lousy job of checking the fox and the hens are in mortal danger.

183 posted on 06/21/2012 11:39:36 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 181 | View Replies]

To: PapaNew

From your lips to Gods ears!


184 posted on 06/21/2012 12:50:38 PM PDT by erod (This Chicagoan will crawl over broken glass to vote the fake Chicagoan Obama out!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 169 | View Replies]

To: STARWISE

Amen!


185 posted on 06/21/2012 5:07:53 PM PDT by RedMDer (https://support.woundedwarriorproject.org/default.aspx?tsid=93)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 90 | View Replies]

To: PapaNew

Roberts
Scalia
Kennedy
Thomas
Alito

Ginsburg
Breyer
Sotomayor
Kagan

Is this how you are breaking it down?


186 posted on 06/21/2012 5:16:04 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 175 | View Replies]

To: murron

Days and how they are spent:

http://www.supremecourt.gov/


187 posted on 06/21/2012 5:19:56 PM PDT by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 156 | View Replies]

To: GeorgeWashingtonsGhost

“I can see Kagan now.. Dangling her pearls and winking at Kennedy.”

Ugh! That does it....I’ll have nightmares for weeks now...


188 posted on 06/21/2012 6:00:41 PM PDT by Forty-Niner (The barely bare, berry bear formerly known as..........Ursus Arctos Horribilis.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 154 | View Replies]

To: Salvation
Same breakdown as yours except for Roberts and Kennedy - I see them as wild cards here: Kennedy, because, well, he's always the wild card, and Roberts because he has a reputation of avoiding overturning the legislature.

Could be 6-3 or 5-4 for Mandate/Obamacare or could be 5-4 against depending on Kennedy and Roberts.

The four socialist justices need ONLY ONE OF THEM to win either or both. We need BOTH OF THEM.

189 posted on 06/21/2012 7:04:39 PM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 186 | View Replies]

To: PapaNew

The Knox case was the case where the court ruled against the SEIU. Breyer wrote the dissent, not the opinion of the court.


190 posted on 06/21/2012 10:08:49 PM PDT by Republican Wildcat
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 180 | View Replies]

To: PapaNew; bjcoop; newzjunkey
Apology for the late response.

It is obvious there is a solid four for upholding the law.
In my opinion though only Thomas is certain to vote to strike down the law. This mean the liberals only need to pick off one of Alito,Scalia,Roberts,or Kennedy to approve the law. Kennedy is always a swing vote, and the remainder have not always been in lock step with conservative principles. My gut says Kennedy and Roberts join the lib 4 to support the law 6-3. I pray that I am wrong.

191 posted on 06/23/2012 9:17:36 AM PDT by buckalfa (Nabob of Negativity)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 175 | View Replies]

To: buckalfa
It is obvious there is a solid four for upholding the law.

I know by "law" you mean Obamacare, but I had to do a double-take to get that. More on that below.

Unfortunately, as you point out, the four bad guys only need one of the remaining five to get their way. My take, as yours: most likely Kennedy - game, set, and match (but the tourney isn't over at that point - if SCOTUS blows it, the states must do as Idaho did: nullify Obamacare and exempt its citizens from its mandates). If for some reason, Kennedy has risen up the right side of the bed the day of the decision, then we still may have a Roberts problem. Like you, I see Roberts, sadly, upholding the bill (at least on the Obamacare decision) because he is apparently loathe to overturn the legislature.

Back to what we call "law." The highest Law of the Land of course is the U.S. Constitution which trumps any other law that violates it. I'm sure you know this, but it's probably worth saying that in this sense, this "solid four" (or "socialist four") is for overturning the Law of the Land in favor of said "laws" like Obamacare that helps create a Socialist state. Because Obamacare is illegal (outside U.S. Constitutional bounds) and unjust (wrongly interfering with individual liberty) it is, therefore, as Augustine and Blackstone say below, NO LAW.

More on this below if interested from the Philosophy of Law:

The strongest form of the Overlap Thesis underlies the classical naturalism of Aquinas and Blackstone. As Blackstone describes the thesis, "This law of nature, being co-eval with mankind and dictated by God himself, is of course superior in obligation to any other. It is binding over all the globe, in all countries, and at all times: no human laws are of any validity, if contrary to this; and such of them as are valid derive all their force, and all their authority, mediately or immediately, from this original" (1979, p. 41). In this passage, Blackstone articulates the two claims that constitute the theoretical core of classical naturalism: 1) there can be no legally valid standards that conflict with the natural law; and 2) all valid laws derive what force and authority they have from the natural law. On this view, to paraphrase Augustine, an unjust law is no law at all. http://www.threes.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1409:philosophy-of-law&catid=75:philosophy&Itemid=60

192 posted on 06/23/2012 11:46:41 AM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 191 | View Replies]

To: PapaNew

I seriously doubt Roberts would vote to uphold the law. That will not happen.


193 posted on 06/24/2012 5:45:04 PM PDT by bjcoop
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 192 | View Replies]

To: bjcoop
I hope you're right.

Still leaves Kennedy - he's the game-breaker as usual.

194 posted on 06/24/2012 6:47:42 PM PDT by PapaNew
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 193 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-150151-194 last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson