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McChrystal: Time to bring back the draft
Foreign Policy ^ | July 3, 2012 | Josh Rogin

Posted on 07/05/2012 11:51:33 AM PDT by Timber Rattler

Gen. Stanley McChrystal, the former top commander of international forces in Afghanistan, said this week that the United States should bring back the draft if it ever goes to war again.

"I think we ought to have a draft. I think if a nation goes to war, it shouldn't be solely be represented by a professional force, because it gets to be unrepresentative of the population," McChrystal said at a late-night event June 29 at the 2012 Aspen Ideas Festival. "I think if a nation goes to war, every town, every city needs to be at risk. You make that decision and everybody has skin in the game."

He argued that the burdens of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan haven't been properly shared across the U.S. population, and emphasized that the U.S. military could train draftees so that there wouldn't be a loss of effectiveness in the war effort.

"I've enjoyed the benefits of a professional service, but I think we'd be better if we actually went to a draft these days," he said. "There would some loss of professionalism, but for the nation it would be a better course."

(Excerpt) Read more at thecable.foreignpolicy.com ...


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Government; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: 2012; conscription; draft; iran; mcchrystal; military; politicalmotives
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I strongly disagree with McChrystal. In 1991, we had plenty of high-quality volunteers in the million-strong U.S. military, but then Bush 41 and Clinton did their New World Order/Peace Dividend downsizing and gutted it. The BRACs of the time then slashed our military infrastructure, leaving it a shadow of its former self.

And I guess McChrystal has forgotten how dysfunctional the draft system was during the Vietnam War, which led to the volunteer military in the first place.

So I suggest that the problem is not a volunteer military, but the lack of will of our political leaders to WIN, and the crippling rules of engagement that they impose on our service people, thereby extending the GWOT and stressing the force.

1 posted on 07/05/2012 11:51:44 AM PDT by Timber Rattler
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To: Timber Rattler
"I think if a nation goes to war, it shouldn't be solely be represented by a professional force, because it gets to be unrepresentative of the population"

What an asinine statement!

2 posted on 07/05/2012 11:53:03 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: Timber Rattler

Undependable draftees get good soldiers killed.


3 posted on 07/05/2012 11:53:53 AM PDT by The_Victor (If all I want is a warm feeling, I should just wet my pants.)
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To: Timber Rattler

Translation: Not enough rich, white boys dying in battle.


4 posted on 07/05/2012 11:54:18 AM PDT by nhoward14
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To: BenLurkin

I think he’s complaining about the over representation of blacks and Hispanics in the armed forces. He’s not explicitly wrong.


5 posted on 07/05/2012 11:54:49 AM PDT by rarestia (It's time to water the Tree of Liberty.)
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To: Timber Rattler
McChrystal and Charley Rangel, one and the same. oonly Rangle wants to bring back the draft and blame it on republicans. Democrats can do that since they follow no rules of logic or intelligence.
6 posted on 07/05/2012 11:55:52 AM PDT by Graybeard58
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To: rarestia

Why would it be right to complain about blacks and Hispanics in the armed forces?


7 posted on 07/05/2012 11:56:28 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both)
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To: Timber Rattler
Pure voluntary enlistment has, despite incredible malfeasance and misfeasance at the highest levels, produced the most devastating military establishment in the history of mankind.

Let's do everything we can to screw it up.

Diversity uber alles!!!

8 posted on 07/05/2012 11:56:48 AM PDT by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilization is Aborting, Buggering, and Contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: Timber Rattler

Next time you are in line at Walmart, think about that McChrystal as you survey the young guys with the tatooed arms and legs, nose rings, Mohawk haircuts, eyebrow jewelry and tongue pins.

They might fit in pretty well with an army of Huns or Goths based on appearance, but when the chips are down, they Huns or Goths would kick their sorry butts out of the camp or cut their heads off.


9 posted on 07/05/2012 11:56:48 AM PDT by ZULU (See: http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=D9vQt6IXXaM&hd)
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To: Timber Rattler

I believe you are absolutely correct. Don’t need a draft.


10 posted on 07/05/2012 11:57:07 AM PDT by ops33 (Senior Master Sergeant, USAF (Retired))
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To: Timber Rattler

Will women be included in such a draft, I wonder? If they are not the feminist lobby would go berserk.


11 posted on 07/05/2012 11:57:41 AM PDT by Conservaliberty (25 and conservative. I guess I have no heart, Oh, well, makes shooting the bad guys easier.)
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To: Timber Rattler

“I think we ought to have a draft. I think if a nation goes to war, it shouldn’t be solely be represented by a professional force, because it gets to be unrepresentative of the population,”

This clown was in charge of anything more than a fry vat?


12 posted on 07/05/2012 11:58:36 AM PDT by Psycho_Bunny (Future generations will curse what we've done to them.)
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To: Timber Rattler
I am going to be a war protester next time around.

We no longer enter wars to win.

We enter wars to apologize and waste lives and treasure.

13 posted on 07/05/2012 11:59:20 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Government is the religion of the sociopath.)
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To: Timber Rattler

I think when you graduate from high school everyone should enter the military and spend at least two years. I also thing that all officers should have to serve time as and enlisted person


14 posted on 07/05/2012 12:01:26 PM PDT by jrd (DO AWAY WITH THE EPA)
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To: rarestia

Blacks/Hispanics around 33%. Too many? Too few? Whitey still around 67%. Since it all volunteer, he is wrong. Draftees suck, not universally but enough to lower efficiency. Two year enlistments are a recipe for disaster.


15 posted on 07/05/2012 12:03:08 PM PDT by xone
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To: BenLurkin
Why would it be right to complain about blacks and Hispanics in the armed forces?

Would you be a little nervous if someone like Obama or Holder were elected president and the military was all black?

16 posted on 07/05/2012 12:05:11 PM PDT by oldbrowser (Your character is your fate.....fortune cookie)
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To: jrd
Two years, everyone? It isn't a jobs program.

I also thing that all officers should have to serve time as and enlisted person

Why?

17 posted on 07/05/2012 12:05:47 PM PDT by xone
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To: nhoward14

Alternate translation: We were hamstrung by a lack of infantry.

In Iraq they were using artillery battalions to do foot patrols.


18 posted on 07/05/2012 12:06:13 PM PDT by Tallguy (It's all 'Fun and Games' until somebody loses an eye!)
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To: Timber Rattler

And of course, men should be forced to bunk with open homosexuals... < /sarc >

How about if Barack Hussein Obama were to go through basic training at least ONCE in his life since he HAS ZERO MILITARY EXPERIENCE and became Commander in Chief.


19 posted on 07/05/2012 12:06:13 PM PDT by a fool in paradise (Fools.Damn fools.Welcome to the USSA. Socialism is slavery to the State and the Supreme Court did it)
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To: rarestia
I think he’s complaining about the over representation of blacks and Hispanics in the armed forces. He’s not explicitly wrong.

You are incorrect.

A heritage Foundation study, via DoD data, shows Whites are slightly over represented in the US Military, as are Negroes.

Whites are much more over represented in the combat arms jobs while Negroes and others are under represented.

So-called "Hispanic" people are under represented in all categories of the military.

The demographic study also points out that lower income people are under represented in the military, thus shooting down the fallacy poor people join to get the benefits.

20 posted on 07/05/2012 12:06:52 PM PDT by OldMissileer
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To: BenLurkin
What an asinine statement!

I tend to agree with that. I want the smartest strategists, the bravest commanders, the best technicians, and the most effective killers. Screw representing the population. Draft should only be undertaken when you don't already have enough of the above, and you need millions more. Even then, asking for volunteers would be better. It would also have to be a war backed by an overwhelming portion of the country. Soldiers that would never be there without a draft, would be a hindrance and prolong the effort. Drafting for the sake of population representation is really stupid. IMHO.
21 posted on 07/05/2012 12:07:34 PM PDT by ZX12R (FUBO GTFO 2012 !)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum
I am going to be a war protester next time around. We no longer enter wars to win.

Based on the number of liberals who stepped forward this week to say that the world would've been better off if America had NOT won its independence, they isn't much left to fight for.

Those in charge are against this nation and do not cherish it.

22 posted on 07/05/2012 12:08:47 PM PDT by a fool in paradise (Fools.Damn fools.Welcome to the USSA. Socialism is slavery to the State and the Supreme Court did it)
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To: rarestia

Blacks and Hispanics are underrepresented in the combat arms, especially in the special forces units and always have been.


23 posted on 07/05/2012 12:09:56 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet (In honor of my late father, GunnerySgt/Commo Chief, USMC 1943-65)
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To: Timber Rattler

I agree with all yo u said but think you far to kind and easy on the General. The idea a military oughtn’t to be the finast it can be and able to win, ALWAYS, is about the stupidest thing I have ever heard. This speech was written by Obama for McCrystal.

You will recall Rangle not long ago called for a return of the draft. The reason was obvious. It will give the liberals yet another talking point and a club to beat the anti fight for anything drums. They will as they did before cite the draft as “unfair” having far more minorities then is represented in the general population and on and on.

You don’t fix it if it ain’t broke unless you are looking for an issue to poltiticize and that’s what we see here.


24 posted on 07/05/2012 12:11:42 PM PDT by scram2
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To: Timber Rattler

No.


25 posted on 07/05/2012 12:14:43 PM PDT by RIghtwardHo
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To: Timber Rattler

Vietnam is not the only yard stick by which we can measure the combat effectiveness of conscripts. We can also look at Korea and WW2 and draw a much different conclusion. We all know that Vietnam era warfighting was plagued by much more than just unmotivated draftees. It’s political suicide to even discuss it of course but the fact is, any major war waged against a credible threat(s) will require a draft like it or not. If we’re unwilling or unable to even bring it up, we have no business entering such a war and should just rely on bombs and ICBMs.


26 posted on 07/05/2012 12:15:30 PM PDT by RC one (this space intentionally left blank)
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To: jrd

Interesting thought - my take on this is a little different and disregards the diversity argument: I have been pondering whether one of the reasons we’ve declined as a nation is that EVERYBODY isn’t required to serve when they reach adulthood - no deferrals, no exemptions except for physical or mental inability. It seems to me that when, in McChrystal’s words (though not with his agenda), people have “skin in the game”, they tend to think harder about whether to go to war.

Comments?

Colonel, USAFR


27 posted on 07/05/2012 12:15:30 PM PDT by jagusafr ("Write in Palin and prepare for war...")
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To: 2ndDivisionVet; rarestia
Blacks and Hispanics are underrepresented in the combat arms, especially in the special forces units and always have been.

My understanding is that this is true for blacks, but that Special Forces are heavily White Southerner and Hispanic.

28 posted on 07/05/2012 12:15:49 PM PDT by Jeff Chandler (I miss Harriet Miers.)
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To: Timber Rattler

He’s probably worried about the gays in the military.


29 posted on 07/05/2012 12:17:13 PM PDT by HarleyD
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To: 2ndDivisionVet; rarestia
My source:

30 posted on 07/05/2012 12:17:27 PM PDT by Jeff Chandler (I miss Harriet Miers.)
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To: Timber Rattler

The draft is a way for government to steal the labor and lives of citizens. At most its use is justified in the case of an existential threat to the nation, which is not the case today.

The left used to scold the rest of us that we were “not paying the full price of the oil we imported”. A draft allows government to put a large part of the cost of our defense off on to others. In order to make rational public policy decisions we must force government to pay the full market price for everything that it presses into its service.

Moreover, having nearly free manpower for its armed forces allows government to think going to war costs far less than it does. The Vietnam war cost the lives of tens of thousands of people who would not otherwise have been in a position to die. Had Johnson been forced to pay the full cost in blood for that war, he would have conducted it far more differently. And this is not accounting for the blood shed by the Communists or the civilians who died as a consequence.

My opinion is that a draft FOR ANY REASON (even to be a civilian Obama brownshirt corps assigned to building solar powered wildlife shelters), apart from a substantial DECLARED war is a gross “taking” of the lives and time of citizens.


31 posted on 07/05/2012 12:17:45 PM PDT by theBuckwheat
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To: scram2
OK......then they BETTER DRAFT GIRLS TOO!!! Let's see how THAT goes over!

They ONLY reason we would need a DRAFT is because the HOMOSEXUALS have taken over and no decent straight person wants to go near the military!! I think that time will come very quickly.

32 posted on 07/05/2012 12:19:58 PM PDT by Ann Archy ( ABORTION...the HUMAN Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
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To: RC one

Good points, and note that even Korea was arguably not entered into with a view toward defeating the enemy. I think we do better when we seek complete victory, THEN talk about assistance with reconstruction (if at all).


33 posted on 07/05/2012 12:20:37 PM PDT by jagusafr ("Write in Palin and prepare for war...")
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To: rarestia

Which is ridiculous - the last time the idiot Rangle brought it up it was proven that the other minorities where under-represented in the military. In other words - it’s those middle class white-boys that make up the largest percentage of the military.

I agree with the sentiment that going back to the Vietnam era setup is just DUMB! As a side note - this idiot NEVER served when the draft existed! He entered Westpoint just a year before it ended!


34 posted on 07/05/2012 12:20:46 PM PDT by fremont_steve
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To: Timber Rattler

Why General?

So you can have the inferior catch the bullets while the professional force drops in behind lines?


35 posted on 07/05/2012 12:21:14 PM PDT by Vendome (Don't take life so seriously, you won't live thnrough it anyway)
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To: Timber Rattler

That’ll go over well... forcing young Americans to “join up” with the new, politically correct, homo-friendly military.


36 posted on 07/05/2012 12:23:27 PM PDT by ScottinVA (Buying Drain-O requires photo I.D... yet voting doesn't???)
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To: Timber Rattler
it shouldn't be solely be represented by a professional force, because it gets to be unrepresentative of the population

Huh? We need to fill the military with crackheads, bath-salt zombies and moochers? Yea, that should really make things so much better.

37 posted on 07/05/2012 12:23:49 PM PDT by Cementjungle
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To: jagusafr

I agree with your sentiment, and am a Navy veteran.

The draftees could fit in a forces category of serving only two years. They would be specifically trained to hold combat positions, on land, on the seas, or in the air.

This would eliminate expensive, long term training in technical schools unless the draftees option to volunteer and sign up for an additional 6-years of active duty.


38 posted on 07/05/2012 12:23:55 PM PDT by SatinDoll
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To: Tallguy
Alternate translation: We were hamstrung by a lack of infantry.

In Iraq they were using artillery battalions to do foot patrols.

And of course that gets right back at the "Peace Dividend" nonsense of the 1990s, when infantrymen were separated from the service in the thousands and Fort Ord was closed.

Remember at the time all the DoD rhetoric about how "boots on the ground" wouldn't be needed since technology was the end all-be all of future warfighting.

39 posted on 07/05/2012 12:24:36 PM PDT by Timber Rattler (Just say NO! to RINOS and the GOP-E)
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To: Timber Rattler
it shouldn't be solely be represented by a professional force, because it gets to be unrepresentative of the population

Do you really want a fighting force representative of the population? Careful what you wish for.

40 posted on 07/05/2012 12:24:53 PM PDT by paul51 (11 September 2001 - Never forget)
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To: ScottinVA
That’ll go over well... forcing young Americans to “join up” with the new, politically correct, homo-friendly military.

Very rare I rebut my own statement... but on second thought... that may just be the medicine needed to focus civilian minds onto the fallacies of the notion the military has been "improved" with the repeal of DADT.

41 posted on 07/05/2012 12:25:23 PM PDT by ScottinVA (Buying Drain-O requires photo I.D... yet voting doesn't???)
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To: Timber Rattler

...or is someone planning to get us into a conflict demanding large numbers of conscripts?


42 posted on 07/05/2012 12:26:54 PM PDT by ctdonath2 ($1 meals: http://abuckaplate.blogspot.com)
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To: jagusafr
For the vast majority of our history, universal service wasn't required, so the failure to have that can't be the cause of our decline.

Further, universal service would either require the expansion of the military far beyond the size necessary to do it's mission, or a dramatic shortening of enlistments. The latter would be terrible in terms of troops quality, training, etc..

And finally, I don't think the state has the right to take a couple year of your life absent a true national emergency. The idea that we all inherently owe something to the government is very distateful to me.

I served in the Marine Corps, and am extremely happy that the Marines I commanded were all volunteers.

43 posted on 07/05/2012 12:27:24 PM PDT by Bruce Campbells Chin
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To: Graybeard58
Rangle wants to bring back the draft and blame it on republicans.

Exactly... Charlie proposes legislation for a military draft... then promptly votes against it. Must be his meds kicking in.

44 posted on 07/05/2012 12:27:52 PM PDT by ScottinVA (Buying Drain-O requires photo I.D... yet voting doesn't???)
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To: nhoward14

I’d hazard to guess, ‘white boys’ throughout American Military History, are the ones who have been dispropotionately dying.

I once ran across a PDF of a typewritten report done at the end of WWII that detailed with some specificity the exact casualties, deaths, MIAs, etc. of ALL of our military. My recollection is that whites were far and above the major affected group. I have since searched for this report, but cannot find it where I once did. I suspect Clinton had it erased.


45 posted on 07/05/2012 12:28:22 PM PDT by Gaffer (NOVEMBER !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
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To: Timber Rattler

If you’re going to do this, then no exceptions or waivers. No college exceptions, no religious exceptions - you can be a chaplain or a medic - and absolutely NO exceptions for the sons and daughters of politicians or corporate captains. - in fact, they get issued the low draft numbers.


46 posted on 07/05/2012 12:30:51 PM PDT by Sirius Lee (Goode over evil. Voting for mitt or obie is like throwing your country away.)
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To: Timber Rattler

I think a universal draft is a great idea.

The fact that most people no longer serve is one of the main reasons we have a red state/blue state, elites vs. everyone else mentality in this country.

If every entitled darling spent three years as a soldier before Harvard, it would do a lot to end the pernicious classism that has infected our country in recent years.

Women should serve, too, doing the kind of administrative work the WACs and WAVs used to do.


47 posted on 07/05/2012 12:31:08 PM PDT by Blue Ink
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To: jagusafr

exactly. our willingness to go to war without a total commitment to victory is a gaping hole in our suit of armor and our enemies are becoming increasingly aware of that vulnerability as well as our others.


48 posted on 07/05/2012 12:31:58 PM PDT by RC one (this space intentionally left blank)
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To: Blue Ink

spelling — “classicism”


49 posted on 07/05/2012 12:32:21 PM PDT by Blue Ink
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To: Timber Rattler
Remember at the time all the DoD rhetoric about how "boots on the ground" wouldn't be needed since technology was the end all-be all of future warfighting.

That has never worked out as we have seen and you just pointed out.

The only time boots on the ground doesn't work is when you are going to drop a nuke.

50 posted on 07/05/2012 12:35:18 PM PDT by OldMissileer
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