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One Third of all Land in the United States Owned by the Federal Government
Off the Grid News ^ | Jul 10th, 2012 | Tim George

Posted on 07/10/2012 12:45:55 PM PDT by Sopater

In a nation that considers limited government one of its most cherished founding principles, nearly one third of all of its land is now owned by the federal government. And one state, Utah has had enough. That state has enacted a bill giving the federal government a deadline of December 2014 to relinquish control of all public lands.

In at least five states – Utah, Alaska, Nevada, Oregon, and Idaho – the federal government owns more than one half of all land. These states, beset with chronic unemployment and tight budgets, are fighting to get their lost land back. A protracted, ugly legal battle appears inevitable.

The movement to regain lost land from the federal government reaches far beyond Utah. The Arizona State Senate passed a bill in February to reclaim its lands as well. Other bills patterned after the ones in Utah and Arizona are expected to be filed next year in Idaho, Colorado, New Mexico, and Montana.

“It’s time we insisted they give us the lands that are rightfully ours,” said state Republican Ken Ivory (Utah). “That land includes a wealth of resources from clean coal or natural gas, and much more.”

Much of this territory was ceded to the federal government close to the end of the Revolutionary War. Congress then surveyed the land and eventually opened it up for settlement. Settlers from the East moved into some of the land but fast tracks in the western territories were considered unusable and remain under federal control.

More recently, the landholdings have become politicized. Environmentalists and preservationists have fought any attempt at development. The 10 states with the highest percentage of federal land ownership are all west of the Mississippi.

The federal government currently owns 620,000,000 acres of land, which is about 30% of all the land in the United States. This means the federal government owns more acreage than the landmasses of Germany, Spain, France, and Italy combined.

Ivory says that federal control was supposed to be merely temporary. “It was a solemn agreement that was supposed to be performed in a timely manner,” he said. But Congress had other ideas. In 1976, it passed a law directing the Bureau of Land Management to hold land “in perpetuity,” rather than systematically disposing of it.

Robert Gordon, a senior adviser for strategic outreach at the Heritage Foundation, says that federal land ownership is growing more controversial during this time of a weakened economy. He says people are “tired of federal bureaucracy and its agencies wasting America’s tax dollars. How can we possibly have a productive economy when the government is keeping all our resources from us? Federal government should not be in the land business. These lands need to be returned to the states.”

Percentage of lands owned by the Federal Government by state:

Compare the ownership percentages above with federally owned land in other states and you’ll see why these states are fighting for what is rightfully theirs:



TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS:
The Federal Government is becoming the majority stock holder in the states.
1 posted on 07/10/2012 12:45:59 PM PDT by Sopater
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To: Sopater

Obama view: 2/3 to go.


2 posted on 07/10/2012 12:50:06 PM PDT by Truth29
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To: Sopater

I would argue that it is more than a third....
http://standeyo.com/NEWS/10_USA/10_USA_pics/100528.federal.land.jpg


3 posted on 07/10/2012 12:50:44 PM PDT by cranked
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To: Sopater

And the states are grabbing up the rest of it.


4 posted on 07/10/2012 12:51:20 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Sopater

“A protracted, ugly legal battle appears inevitable”

These states should not bother wasting taxpayer dollars on lawsuits..the Roberts court will uphold the Feds...


5 posted on 07/10/2012 12:53:14 PM PDT by montanajoe
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To: Sopater

IOW - the people. Who specifically in the federal government owns anything?


6 posted on 07/10/2012 12:54:10 PM PDT by SkyDancer ("Ambition Without Talent Is Sad - Talent Without Ambition Is Worse")
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To: Sopater

I think one argument to be perpetuated will be that the states won’t know what to do with the land, and as such the federal government must maintain control.


7 posted on 07/10/2012 12:57:11 PM PDT by wastedyears ("God? I didn't know he was signed onto the system.")
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To: Sopater

Very ambitious, considering Fedzilla isn’t supposed to own anything.


8 posted on 07/10/2012 12:58:19 PM PDT by liberalh8ter (If Barack has a memory like a steel trap, why can't he remember what the Constitution says?)
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To: Sopater

Utah, Alaska, Nevada, Oregon, and Idaho...

Much of this territory was ceded to the federal government close to the end of the Revolutionary War.

????????

Someone has got their years wrong.


9 posted on 07/10/2012 1:00:45 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: cranked
and add in that 90% of mortgages are owned by the government.
10 posted on 07/10/2012 1:00:50 PM PDT by CJ Wolf
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To: CJ Wolf
and add in that 90% of mortgages are owned by the government.

Ouch.
11 posted on 07/10/2012 1:04:07 PM PDT by Sopater (...where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. - 2 COR 3:17b)
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To: SkyDancer

The government isn’t the people. Businesses are the people. I can start a business... I can’t start a government.


12 posted on 07/10/2012 1:08:05 PM PDT by MarineBrat (Better dead than red!)
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To: cripplecreek
And the states are grabbing up the rest of it.

Actually, ever since they could tax your land, they've owned it.

There is really no such thing as owning property.

The original DOI read Life, Liberty and the pursuit of property.

I wish they would have left the original wording.

13 posted on 07/10/2012 1:08:35 PM PDT by Las Vegas Ron (Medicine is the keystone in the arch of socialism)
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To: CJ Wolf
and add in that 90% of mortgages are owned by the government.

And they're trying to acquire more with their "reverse mortgage" scheme.

14 posted on 07/10/2012 1:10:53 PM PDT by Las Vegas Ron (Medicine is the keystone in the arch of socialism)
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To: Sopater
That land rightfully belongs to the United Nations.

I wish I was being sarcastic.

15 posted on 07/10/2012 1:12:31 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Government is the religion of the sociopath.)
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To: Las Vegas Ron
The original DOI read Life, Liberty and the pursuit of property.

Where did you read that?

Original Rough Draught of the Declaration of Independence
http://www.constitution.org/tj/tj-orddoi.htm

http://www.constitution.org/tj/ddi_01+.jpg

I read Thomas Jefferson's handwriting to say "life, liberty, & the pursuit of happiness;"

16 posted on 07/10/2012 1:15:25 PM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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17 posted on 07/10/2012 1:18:57 PM PDT by deoetdoctrinae (Gun free zones are playgrounds for felons.)
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To: Sopater
Don't worry. The feds will eventually sell, and sell at fire sale prices when TSHTF. Greece is selling islands and an Uncle Barak Jr will someday be forced to do the same. Just expect buyers such as Soros to be tough negotiators.
18 posted on 07/10/2012 1:22:27 PM PDT by Jacquerie (The American Revolution is dead.)
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To: SkyDancer

Walter Williams would tear you up over that.

If “the people”, including me, own all this land, can I sell you my part?


19 posted on 07/10/2012 1:24:13 PM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter knows whom he's working for)
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To: Sopater

That real estate is worth a lot. Sell it (over time, at a good price, on the market) with 100% going to debt reduction.


20 posted on 07/10/2012 1:32:59 PM PDT by jdsteel (Give me freedom, not more government.)
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To: SkyDancer
Who specifically in the federal government owns anything?

The people in the BLM sure as hell think they do. Whenever I hear them talk about it, it's "our property...".

That entire agency needs to be closed and the property they "manage" sold off in small parcels for maximum popular use.

21 posted on 07/10/2012 1:42:08 PM PDT by Regulator
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To: Sopater
I want my twenty acres and a Mule from Obamao's stash.


22 posted on 07/10/2012 1:55:35 PM PDT by crusty old prospector
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To: Sopater

The states should start charging the feds property taxes. Actually, make the taxes retroactive to revolutionary times.


23 posted on 07/10/2012 1:58:42 PM PDT by justa-hairyape
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To: Sopater

Since this is a “government of the people”, government owned means that we all own it. How dare they try to keep me off of my own land?


24 posted on 07/10/2012 2:15:52 PM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed &water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: MrB

It’s held in trust for the people, so they say.


25 posted on 07/10/2012 2:27:26 PM PDT by SkyDancer ("Ambition Without Talent Is Sad - Talent Without Ambition Is Worse")
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To: cripplecreek
I saw a map of the United States a few years back (I think it was on the internet) that showed all Federal land and state land shaded green. I was blown away of the little that was left to private ownership. And, that did not include county and city property. It was almost unbelievable.
26 posted on 07/10/2012 2:47:55 PM PDT by fish hawk (Religion: Man's attempt to gain salvation or the approbation of God by his own works)
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To: thackney
I read Thomas Jefferson's handwriting to say "life, liberty, & the pursuit of happiness;"

I think I might have been wrong when I posted it was the the original draft.

But I'm pretty sure when they were debating the issue, debate of happiness vs property was central....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life,_liberty_and_the_pursuit_of_happiness

27 posted on 07/10/2012 2:48:52 PM PDT by Las Vegas Ron (Medicine is the keystone in the arch of socialism)
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To: Sopater
But, but doesn't that mean it's the people's land? /sarc>
28 posted on 07/10/2012 3:31:54 PM PDT by BfloGuy (The final outcome of the credit expansion is general impoverishment.)
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To: Sopater

I’m sure a lot of people would like to see housing developments all over Yellowstone or a business park in the middle of White Sands missile range.


29 posted on 07/10/2012 4:42:39 PM PDT by Sarajevo (Don't think for a minute that this excuse for a President has America's best interest in mind.)
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To: jdsteel

China wants the real estate, and our fresh water.


30 posted on 07/10/2012 4:51:34 PM PDT by ntnychik
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To: Sopater
Ivory says that federal control was supposed to be merely temporary. “It was a solemn agreement that was supposed to be performed in a timely manner,” he said. But Congress had other ideas. In 1976, it passed a law directing the Bureau of Land Management to hold land “in perpetuity,” rather than systematically disposing of it.

I'm certain this will come as a "SHOCK" to y'all:

94th Congress in 1976:

Senate President: Nelson Rockefeller

Senate Pres. pro tem: James Eastland

House Speaker: Carl Albert

Senate Majority: Democratic Party

House Majority: Democratic Party

ADD to that the fact that we had as our President one of the BIGGEST, WUSS, RINO's EVER, Gerald Ford (AND HE WHO WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR MY HAVING LEFT THE REPUBLIC PARTY...FOREVER WHEN HE SAT BACK AND ALLOWED OUR ALLIES S. VIETNAM BE CONQUERED BY THE NORTH)and now we know how that "Bill" was able to become law.

31 posted on 07/10/2012 5:36:15 PM PDT by Conservative Vermont Vet
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To: Sopater

“One Third of all Land in the United States Owned by the Federal Government”

Proof or it ain’t true.


32 posted on 07/10/2012 9:24:53 PM PDT by KrisKrinkle (Blessed be those who know the depth and breadth of their ignorance. Cursed be those who don't.)
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To: Las Vegas Ron

Your link does not suggest the founders debated the pursuit of property at all. Locke was not a founding father. John Locke died in 1704.


33 posted on 07/11/2012 4:45:47 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: KrisKrinkle

The Federal Government owns nearly 650 million acres of land - almost 30 percent of the land area of the United States.

http://nationalatlas.gov/printable/fedlands.html

National Atlas is part of the Department of the Interior.


34 posted on 07/11/2012 4:48:55 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: Sarajevo
I’m sure a lot of people would like to see housing developments all over Yellowstone or a business park in the middle of White Sands missile range.

That's exactly the kind of response I expect from people who want to control land that they don't own.
35 posted on 07/11/2012 7:40:33 AM PDT by Sopater (...where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. - 2 COR 3:17b)
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To: KrisKrinkle
Proof or it ain’t true.

I don't know if this is "proof", but here's a map of Federal owned lands and indian reservations from 2005.


36 posted on 07/11/2012 7:48:02 AM PDT by Sopater (...where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. - 2 COR 3:17b)
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To: Sopater
That's exactly the kind of response I expect from people who want to control land that they don't own.

Care to expound on that statement? Who do you think owns National parklands?

37 posted on 07/11/2012 2:14:39 PM PDT by Sarajevo (Don't think for a minute that this excuse for a President has America's best interest in mind.)
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To: thackney
"National Atlas is part of the Department of the Interior."

I'm not certain the National Atlas is proof. On the other hand:

From Public Law 85-508, July 7, 1958 | [H. R. 7999] 72 Stat. 339, AN ACT To provide for the admission of the State of Alaska into the Union:

SEC. 5.

The State of Alaska and its political subdivisions, respectively, shall have and retain title to all property, real and personal, title to which is in the Territory of Alaska or any of the subdivisions. Except as provided in section 6 hereof, the United States shall retain title to all property, real and personal, to which it has title, including public lands.

Something like that is more like what I had in mind. Note that it says the United States shall retain title, not the Federal Government. The Federal Government should be an agent for the States, not the owner.

38 posted on 07/12/2012 9:36:08 AM PDT by KrisKrinkle (Blessed be those who know the depth and breadth of their ignorance. Cursed be those who don't.)
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To: KrisKrinkle
Note that it says the United States shall retain title, not the Federal Government.

I guess in terms of a legal document, I don't understand the difference. What United States entity would hold title if not the Federal Government? Each individual state have 1/50th with control over that?

39 posted on 07/12/2012 10:34:51 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: Sopater

“Land....land.....Land, see Snatch.”


40 posted on 07/12/2012 10:37:34 AM PDT by dfwgator (FUJR (not you, Jim))
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To: thackney

Think in terms of fifty people who own some land and hire a company to manage it for them. If they get a different manager, they still own the land.

Or think in terms of several states governing themselves as a Confederacy, who won some territory, say the Northwest Territory, in a war. If they change their form of government to a Federal form from a Confederacy, they still own the territory. If they change their form of government again to a Monarchy, they still own the territory unless they give it to the Monarch.

Of course they could have given ownership to the Federal Government, but I don’t know of any authoritative thing that says so.


41 posted on 07/12/2012 10:52:43 AM PDT by KrisKrinkle (Blessed be those who know the depth and breadth of their ignorance. Cursed be those who don't.)
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To: KrisKrinkle
Think in terms of fifty people who own some land and hire a company to manage it for them. If they get a different manager, they still own the land.

But it would be far worse than 50 people trying to reach an agreement in anything. It would be 50 different governments.

It might sound nice is the abstract, but the reality would be a bigger mess than today.

Think in terms of fifty people who own some land and hire a company to manage it for them. If they get a different manager, they still own the land.

Way different topic.

42 posted on 07/12/2012 11:02:00 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: KrisKrinkle
Think in terms of fifty people who own some land and hire a company to manage it for them. If they get a different manager, they still own the land.

But it would be far worse than 50 people trying to reach an agreement in anything. It would be 50 different governments.

It might sound nice is the abstract, but the reality would be a bigger mess than today.

Or think in terms of several states governing themselves as a Confederacy, who won some territory, say the Northwest Territory, in a war.

Way different topic.

43 posted on 07/12/2012 11:02:17 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: thackney

“Way different topic.”

We’ll have to disagree there. I think it’s the same topic.


44 posted on 07/12/2012 1:33:38 PM PDT by KrisKrinkle (Blessed be those who know the depth and breadth of their ignorance. Cursed be those who don't.)
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