Skip to comments.EDITORIAL: The Civil War of 2016: U.S. military officers are told to plan to fight Americans
Posted on 08/08/2012 4:50:24 PM PDT by EveningStar
Imagine Tea Party extremists seizing control of a South Carolina town and the Army being sent in to crush the rebellion. This farcical vision is now part of the discussion in professional military circles.
At issue is an article in the respected Small Wars Journal titled Full Spectrum Operations in the Homeland: A Vision of the Future.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...
You are sooo there!
Ummmmmm, welcome to the list? Friend. Buddy. Pal...
The original article itself is PsyOps. Poke the nest ... see how riled up the hornets get.
Thanks for the laugh! It’s already been a long week.
I just spent three days traveling in my RV, for a one day trip.
First diagnosis: fuel filter. Tow to RV park (it’s Sunday and all the service truckers must have been watching NASCAR, so I had to spend a night.) - $230.
Second diagnosis: external fuel pump. Towed to repair shop. Idled for two hours (460 Ford burning lots of $3.559!), then said, “It must be your fuel pump!”. - $285
Third diagnosis: Spent the night parked next to Waffle House, across street from newly opened mechanic shop. Drove over at 6:30 and waited for 8:00 open. Guy shows up at 7:00, tells me “we open at 8”!
Me: “need help, now!!!”.
He “ Fix or Repair Daily” (chuckle). Common Ford problem, internal FP overheats and low flows. Wait a while and drive another. 60-80 miles at 70 mph. After ‘rinse and repeating’ three times, finally I made it to Cherokee, where I can get it fixed priorly, with some recourse.......
Third fix: INTERNAL FUEL PUMP!!! -$385. (had to drop the tank.)
I’m not a mechanic (never even played one on TV!). BUT, I wish I had gotten to the third guy first, as he IMMEDIATELY knew the problem as it is common knowledge to knowledgeable mechanics!!!!
Thanks to Good Sam Club for their Roadside services and THREE TOWS on one trip! Best $ 120 a year I’ve spent...
Glad you enjoyed it, Jim. That email actually made it into a thread here yesterday. A whole bunch of ex-military guys chimed in.
We'll see about that. I've already got my report to upper management written and ready to push the button if you so much as hiccup. Do you get my drift, soldier???
Sir, yes sir!
Are you so sure of that? No one thought the Germans would attack their own either, but, they did.
Thanks for the laughs, Nully. You really did bring a grin to my face tonight. I needed that.
The ROE in Afghanistan and Iraq were very tight. I don't ask this next question idly; this is a very serious element of this article's miscalculation.
Do you know why our ROEs were that tight?
Assuming that you know the reason for that, you'll understand that in the event of counterinsurgency operations within CONUS, the ROE would be tighter than ever before seen. It may seem counter-intuitive, but the closer the fighting gets to our vital interests, the less direct force the government will be able to bring to bear. The overlapping political and social concerns about using the uniformed U.S. security apparatus to unleash lethal force would intensify immensely if the fighting were local and not several thousand miles away.
(And yes, I'm aware of the historical background of military/LEO crackdowns in the U.S., but this is 2012, not 1912. Even Waco, the last large scale example, is still bitterly criticized today, and the Branch Dividians were isolated whackos with zero political pull or constituency outside of their compound walls. The TEA Party has sitting congressmen and tens of millions of supporters.)
The idea that the fundamental political mechanics behind tight ROEs would lessen once the contributing factors to tightening it increase astronomically is simply a non-starter. Many of our most potent capabilities would become as politically unusable as nuclear weapons. Using even comparatively gentle measures could create backlashes in public opinion that (1) would be unpopular among people on the fence, (2) ferociously energize the people opposed, and (3) weaken the resolve of supporters of the crackdown.
How many videos of helicopters (allegedly accidentally) gunning down unarmed civilians in the street would it take for public opinion to swing an additional 30% against the government? Losing control of the 'white hat/black hat' narrative is nothing less than the difference between victory and defeat. Remember, a few pictures of Abu Ghraib led to Fallujah. What would a Fallujah uprising look like in a nation of 350 million people, not 25 million?
This article was written in such a way as to ignore or minimize the social and political ramifications of stateside counterinsurgency in favor of looking at the doctrinal minutia of it, but avoiding the I/O topic isn't the same as having a plan for it.
At best, what the authors did by engineering the overt racism theme into the scenario was a bit of wishful thinking that won the I/O fight for them before it started. "These people are neo-Confederate Klansmen meanies, and nobody likes them." That's, at best, lazy writing and and lazier thinking that lets them deus ex machina their way to the fun doctrinal stuff at the end. At worst, it indicates that they don't have a blessed idea of what they're up against. Talking about an I/O plan that headlines Shows of Force (fighter jet flybys, etc) against the insurgents indicates an adequate understanding of counterinsurgency tactics, and a tragically flawed understanding of the strategies.
When dead bodies from gunfights at hospitals and schools start rolling onto CNN prime time, it's going to take a lot more than sending Jay Carney out to tapdance for the cameras and hope your presence patrols scare the insurgents into throwing down their weapons and begging for mercy.
*That's* the real danger; that the radicals on the far side of the spectrum who think they want this fight don't realize that you can't simply bomb Pearl Harbor, sail home and declare victory. You kick that dog and it's going to bite you and keep on biting you until one of your are dead.
Excellent intelligent analysis.
A cogent, and spot-on analytical analysis, Steel Wolf. Very well done.
“And if it doesnt happen naturally, they might give it some help.
Somewhere I heard a breakdown of all the “terrorist” arrests since 9/11.
There were two (count em 2!) terror attempts thwarted by American Citizens.
Something like 27 or so others that were instigated in some way by FBI/CIA. (Somebody please correct me or provide sources)
If there is another civil war it will be instigated by “them” not “us”.
It's something that would need to be wargamed out using historical knowledge (presence of U.S. Colored Troops -- always a morale-raiser for the Confederates, as at Palmitto Springs near Brownsville, Texas, in May, 1865, when Gen. Nathaniel Banks, in a display of hubris and contempt for the Texans who'd beaten him twice, landed with his Colored Troops regiments up front, enraging the Texans -- U.S. control of waterways, the sub rosa cotton-trade networks => scalawags and carpetbaggers, etc., viz., co-optation of certain RiNOid Southerners) and modern wargaming artistry. Several times (to compensate for enthusiastic Southerners, e.g., refloating their aircraft carriers like Adm. Nagumo did when he war-gamed Midway).
Gen. Lee, a few months before his death, no doubt of heart failure, did make a comment privately to a former Texas Confederate lieutenant-governor (statement sourced and cached on media) to the effect that, had he known the purposes to which the North intended to put their victory, would not have surrendered at Appomattox, but sought by any means to disperse his army, reach Bragg in Tennessee, and continue the war as a guerrilla contest.
Thus Marse Robert. I respect his judgment, while noting that heart disease does produce a certain melancholia and pessimism in sufferers.
You do not credit the blood thirst of Obama's circle. These people are ideologues and Communists. They're middle-class armchair executioners who seriously want Middle America to Go Away (the 25,000,000 remark, which has been bid up in the meantime to God knows how many).
Middle-class Communists are the worst, the most bloody-minded. Check your hole card; it might not be worth as much as you think.
NB, have you been following this thread?
“I can imagine the military encircling DC and frog marching Reid,Pelosi,Odungo and about 42 Czars to prison”
And after reading the article and thinking about it, I am becoming more and more convinced that something like this will take place.
The reason is this:
What does the government do with the Army/military?
By that I mean if there was somehow a growing populist movement that in some way tried to “Hold DC accountable”, that obviously tends to be a threat to the power base in DC.
Any possibility that the military could sympathize with the movement MUST (from DC’s perspective) be avoided.
The way to do that is through propaganda/false flag operations demonizing some people/part/cultural institutions in America, to change the focus of military thought away from DC and towards some poor sucker who in essence didn’t do a single dam thing to cause problems.
Many peoples comments in the article call it an unrealistic scenario.
I see it as a VERY realistic scenario!!!
How much/many of our servicemen/women would fall for it is an important question.
But one thing is certain - if you wake up in the morning and the internet is down and all you see on the tv is the Emergency Broadcast Signal, then it’s time to hunker down bigtime!
While they legitimately point out some really radical groups, they also sweep in many others which do not constitute a threat to legitimate government.
This is also a measure of the decreasing Constitutional legitimacy of Government, that such blatant paranoia should abound.
For those knowledgeable about the TEA party movement, this is a serious flag, showing the TEA party groups have only skimmed the surface of the festering rot at all levels of government.
The sad effect, apparently lost on the writers of the scenario, is that they are alienating one of the greatest groups of people who support the military, simply by declaring us their enemy, even hypothetically.
Surely they don't think the donations to the USO, the DAV, The VFW, The Wounded Warrior Project, The BVA, and a host of other organizations which support veterans, wounded and otherwise, come from the OWS Obamite types?
Talk about crapping in your mess kit...
IOW, "shock and awe", misapplied against the owners of same, would degenerate to "awk! and pshaw!"
Hope you're right.
Actually, the Army has no place in a political fight. They are not the "guarantors/saviors of the Constitution", the doctrine that lies at the heart of so many South American golpes de estado, juntas, and revolutions.
This is a matter between the People and their disobedient servants, and between the Taxpayers and the "Tax-Eaters and Takers", between the Solution and the Problem, people-to-people. The Army has no posse comitatus role unless a governor or legislature declares insurrection.
Did someone pay the authors to write the study/paper?
If so, then who? The federal government? The people? The military?
You can call it hypothetical all you want, but obviously SOMEONE is interested enough in it to produce serious results...
Bracketing. Black-propaganda technique. Thoroughly explained by adman Hunter Madsen, writing with psychologist Marshall Kirk, in After the Ball, about homosexual psywar against public mores and American sources of moral authority.
That's what I pointed out to my Dem friend, who was an Obama delegate to the state 'Rat convention four years ago, when I sent him a link and threw down.
In the end, all those 'Rat activists are responsible for this crap. They put that Kenyan Klown in office.
That is a very good point. But I have looked at modern civil wars, and they don’t stay limited for long.
Tight ROE may be used at first, but as things esculate the State will start getting more and more bloody. If you look at Finland, Spain, the Balkans, and Greece (granted only the Balkan wars happened post WWII era), things get very bloody very quickly. Once everyone is forced to choose a side, the ROE will end.
What does your son have to say about Article II and the natural born Citizen clause of our Constitution?
Lol...so all military service members now have to pass your personal loyalty test? Some people on this site are unbelievable.
“The original article itself is PsyOps. Poke the nest ... see how riled up the hornets get.”
I agree. Psyops, plus meme planting.
in case you guys missed it, the small wars journal article and a most excellent review by Travis @ 23... http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2916269/posts?page=23#23
How can you uphold your sworn oath to defend the Constitution and also serve in the Usurper's army? Col. Lakin upheld his sworn oath. Know any others?
If they believe that they can simply announce ROE such as “Anybody outside carrying a firearm can be killed as a hostile,” they have just outlawed hunting. In hard times especially, a lot of folks hunt to put meat in the freezer.
I see this scenario repeated a few times. “Uncle Cletus was out turkey hunting, like every year. A drone dropped a missile on him and blew him to pieces!”
Word (and photos) of such incidents would spread by wildfire on the internet, all over the country. If they try to squelch the internet, it will just lead to disbelief in any govt pronouncements. After “collateral” strikes on innocent civilians, even the non-political will burn with hate against the fedgov.
As it's been mentioned, a few hundred active IRA tied down much of the British military on a small island for decades. Nobody has studied a modern dirty civil war in a nation where millions shoot scoped rifles for sport, among other things.
Once begun, CW2 might become Argentina's Dirty War X The Balkan Wars X Rwanda etc. It would be impossible to contain to a county in South Carolina. The Colonel's female sidekick “the Civil War expert” is tossing lit matches into dry tinder with this deliberately provocative race-baiting scenario. I question her motives.
The horrors of guerrilla warfare were well known and studied even in that era. I have read post-war comments by Marse Lee to the effect that guerrilla warfare always devolves to reprisals and atrocities, with “women and priests hiding bombs in their skirts.” Spain and the Peninsular Wars being the recent example they studied.
They knew that GW makes direct targets of noncombatants, leading to massacres of civilians, concentration camps etc. Lee felt an honorable defeat and national reconciliation was preferable to decades of dirty war, atrocities, and the much deeper national hatreds that would be developed. It’s been a few years since I read that in a CW1 history, don’t quote me!
Just yesterday I finished the book, “Patton”, by Martin Blumenson. All his life, even from early childhood, he studied warfare and strategy.
The fear at the time was the cities within range of the missiles would have to be evacuated, and the only place for people to go on a temporary basis, would be the small towns around the cities.
In fact they even intended to use our property as one of the refugee camps.
The mass panic and shear number of people involved would have overwhelmed the govt. ability to take care of people.
That's what the Russians were after, the nut Castro actually wanted to fire the missiles which would have resulted in a nuke response from the US.
I believe the idea of creating mass panic causing the people in cities into a mass exodus is what the left has in mind with orchestrated race riots in every major city along with terrorists attacks with IED’s, possibly even some type of dirty bomb.
People can kid themselves all they want.
American troops will do what is necessary to restore order.
Once again, a Lib wet dream that they’ve been wanking-off over for a while, which would give their shoeshine boy the chance to declare martial law.
They love to push the buttons, don’t they...
The idea that the Tea Party would attempt to militarily occupy municipalities as an effort at insurrection is ridiculous.
That is not how insurgency is conducted. The premise is as silly as saying that a platoon of Olympic boxers would occupy City Hall... “here’s our counterplan.”
Insurrection in the United States would take a different form. It involves nutritional augmentation to the raw produce of the bacon industry.
Lakin is in jail. What good did it do anyone? Is Obama ousted? It sure is easy to demand others give up everything to make a statement, but I seriously doubt you would do it. And here you are ready to pounce on a FReeper because his Soldier son hasn’t thrown his career away for your pet issue.
This officer seems to think things would be all neat and tidy, with clear targets, in a small town.
He prefers not to consider millions of American’s across the country rebelling against the tyranny we see on the horizon.
He is also mistaken about the willingness of the military to fight their families and friends, on behalf of tyranny.
This officer seems to think things would be all neat and tidy, with clear targets, in a small town.
He prefers not to consider millions of Americans across the country rebelling against the tyranny we see on the horizon.
He is also mistaken about the willingness of the military to fight their families and friends, on behalf of tyranny.
To me, one of the most intense wars against the people would involve getting tax payments because without them the fed starves. Even to get foreign credit the fed must show control of some kind of revenue. I would expect a large portion of the fed to be concentrated on obtaining wealth payments. They might not give a damn about food riots or who controls what territory when they are concentrated on getting tax revenues just to stay alive.
Strange as this seems it has always held true: People don’t enlist in the army even in just wars they beleive in if they are not going to get paid. We can debate who in the army might be loyal to whom but if they are not getting paid they will leave.
“This is what happens when the likes of the SPLC set the bar for “radical” and “terrorist”, “
One of the unintended consequences of proclaiming someone to be violent then acting on that proclamation is that the only practical defense might actually be violence.
If We the People are labeled “Domestic Terrorist” long enough and those labels take the form of actions against us, well, we will have nothing to lose but to defend ourselves against those actions and no further labeling can harm us.
It is like the label “white racist”. Since the idiots that use the label have been demanding actions against whites it will come a time very shortly when being racist is the only defense, a sort of, “You wanted it, you got it, do you REALLY want us to BE racist? Careful what you wish for.”
It won’t be “a few.”
You know, if you combine this with information on large numbers of gangsters joining the military, it looks pretty interesting.
As a veteran, a taxpayer and a Citizen, I don't think I'm out of line to ask that you DO YOUR DUTY!
Photos at link here:
US Army Preparing for Martial Law Scenario in US?
Civil Disturbance and Mock Riot Drills In Washington
The Intel Hub
April 9, 2012
For years the alternative media has warned about the US military possibly being used against the American people in a time of economic collapse or any sort of martial law scenario.
Drills such as Vigilant Guard 2010 have brought widespread attention to the fact that portions of our own military are training to take on crowds of American citizens demanding food and Constitutional rights in a time of crisis.
Now, a new release by the website Public Intelligence, once again confirms that as recently as February and March of 2012, US troops at Joint Base Lewis-McChord in Washington were conducting training scenarios for a civil disturbance domestic quick reaction force....
“I question her motives.”
As someone else already said: To gauge our reaction.
Kent State was a riot with rocks the size of bricks being thrown at folks & some seriously poor understanding of riot control tactics & techniques. It was not a TEA party rally .
There have been ZERO arrests for violence of any kind at any TEA party rally of TEA party members because they do not engage in mindless vandalism/violence/arson etc.
“How can you uphold your sworn oath to defend the Constitution and also serve in the Usurper’s army?”
Obama is anti-Constitutional, but is the Army at large? No. It operates on whole within the confines of the Constitution. So, no soldier must excuse himself from the military least be called a “usurper”. I wouldn’t label the entire military based on a label applied to the CIC.
Will have to use Capt. Obvious Majik Ring Decoder on that one.
"The chair is on the wall, The chair is on the wall,
John has a long mustache, John has a long mustache."
There is a lot of talk on this thread about armed conflict. The reality is that an Army travels on its belly, and the Nation’s Food belly can be measured in weeks.
For example, if the Obama-commies shut down the US Electrical Power Grid, and the US Airports, there will be a run on the food stores that will part the hair on even bald men.
Without electricity and food, the USA will be reduced to the horse and buggy days of the good ol’ 1800’s. It will be a slow go for any Army.
All this war chest-beating avoids the reality of how fragile a Republic we really are stewards of.
Public Enemy Number One is the US Federal Government, and has been so for so many decades that we have forgotten that we are a Republic and NOT a Democracy.
The Free Lunch Bunch have chosen the wrong track for 80 years. When serious sales to privatize the bankrupt Free Lunch Federal Programs begins, then we can put away our fear of the continuous bankrupting of America by Free Lunch Politicians.
The time is fast approaching when we, the tax-burdened, need to take over the Republican Party and name it the Republic Party, choose our own political leaders, and hold State Constitutional Conventions to abolish the wrong track Free Lunch Federal Programs, Ponzi Schemes, and other encrustations of the Feudal European Dependency Culture.
This take over is inevitable, as underlined by the total National Debt. If we, the tax-burdened, do not do this, the Financial Markets of the World will do it for us.
If Romney loses to Obama, the take over of the Republican Party will be complete by November, 2014.
If Romney wins, the eventual take over will take a little longer.
Thanks for the thought provoking ping.
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