Skip to comments.EDITORIAL: The Civil War of 2016: U.S. military officers are told to plan to fight Americans
Posted on 08/08/2012 4:50:24 PM PDT by EveningStar
Imagine Tea Party extremists seizing control of a South Carolina town and the Army being sent in to crush the rebellion. This farcical vision is now part of the discussion in professional military circles.
At issue is an article in the respected Small Wars Journal titled Full Spectrum Operations in the Homeland: A Vision of the Future.
(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...
That's why the anti gun BS didn't work. An overwhelming majority of people have a gut feeling something is coming.
That many people can't be wrong.
The left simply cannot hold on to power without violence.
I too have known COL (Ret) Benson for s number of years. You are right on target with your assessment of where the real problem lies.
” In case you havent noticed, the GOP is nearly as nasty toward the tea party as the democrats.”
My guess would be in the event of major systemic collapse, 30 to 60 million people surviving in ConUS.
Think of five people you know.
Four are now dead. Possibly all five.
Doesn’t have anything to do with politics or race or even hair color.
This is the simple example of how easy it would be to return the USA back to the 1800’s: “ - - - For example, if the Obama-commies shut down the US Electrical Power Grid, and the US Airports, - - - “
Nothing “collapsed,” no “skills” were lost, etc. as you injected into what I had written.
We, due to the mechanical turn of switches by the Obamanation commies, would be without anything that requires electricity; cash/credit registers, air conditioners, furnace fans, street and building lights, electric elevators, trains and the Chevy Volt.
The airports, in control by the Obama-commies, would shut down air transport of food and fuel, relegating us to transportation by ship and train transport a la’ the 1800’s.
Visit any US area today hit by a major storm, and you will see a population living as we did in the 1800’s. The World may run on Oil, but without electricity, we will have to live as or ancestors did in the 1800’s.
BTW, keep on brewing your beer, as the more CO2 that your carbonated beer releases, the more plants can grow to be strong and healthy.
Maybe it will be time to patent a coal-fired ice making machine to keep your beer cool? The coming Global Warming could be brutal.
” I can only hope that the COL (ret) is a drunk, or suffers dementia, and somehow allowed the lady to hijack his half-byline.”
Don’t rule out just plain stupid.
I may be wrong, but didn’t southerners do guerilla tactics against Sherman? Didn’t he (and his army) go through them like bulldozer?
I didn’t inject anything, I’m just telling you that it is fantasy to think we could go back to living an 1800’s style world.
We DO NOT have the skills it took to live then and without the grid and modern communications and manufacturing, most of our modern skills would be worthless.
We won’t go back to living like they did in the 1800’s, we might go back to how they lived in the year 18
EveningStar, my apologies for posting the flying saucer image. Yours was a good post.
Travis, having reviewed some information, I see a serious and deleterious economic and information situation developing mostly from the middle and top (yes, allusion to the fomenting of further physical class war from people gorged with debt and increasingly hysterical disseminations of information). The accredited, approved, etc. class is rather delusional in its planning scenarios, of course, and not only in their narrow regards of projected strength here and there, labels, and so on.
First, many of us will become much poorer, speaking of material items. That includes a very large portion of those who consider themselves to be well to do.
Second, an investigation into economic depressions tells as to which class will get its way on social issues (the “progressive” business, where it all started). See our own Great Depression and the effects that it had on the designs and so-called progress of the effete folks of the time (neo-romantics, social deviants,...). The social inclinations of the effete were hushed within a very short time.
Dire necessities lead to re-institutions of necessary social paradigms (what romanticists would call regression, etc.). Tangents of social ease toward anti-family practices are again outlawed, and such leisure class groups are deposed with market crashes, bond collapses, investment/pension “haircuts,” etc.
We’ll see as to how far the pathologies go. Looks like they have further popular academic, political and business momentum. It’s an awesome public affairs challenge.
My general point from guesswork: hard times with such descendents and culture, on average, as in our USA, tend to cause a fall of many unproductive/counterproductive folks in leadership and a return to more traditional moral opinions.
We’re different from some of the other populations (Russia, China and the like), in that we desire freedoms more than they, generally speaking. Always have. Even most of the duped working class Democrat voters. They (other nations, cultures) have only known hard and thorough monarchy/communism/fascism all through their histories.
Example: the czars of Russia also censored speech. Another: same with emperors of china. Even now, Chinese leadership tries to keep all eyes on the Yellow River flowing out to the ocean (the world). Same to great extends south of our southern border (Jefe, always Jefe, nothing changes) and in other cultures.
IMO, economic slide + incremental eliminations of freedoms = a bad mix for the ever more pathological comfy, vain and lazy. Huge public affairs problem—too much. We are not a third world population. We are not the world and are not in agreement with the romantic worldly: those pampered and “educated” in the illusions of tourist reservations.
In the possible event of any great insurrections, I’m still staying as far out of the way as possible, just as you and many others of us will. Too many potential mouthy, delusional chiefs in the most likely scenarios—nearly all of them gorged too much on television, junk food, leisure, higher education (see sexual confusions, illusions about tea parties and the like) etc. Let ‘em fight it out, while we enjoy peace and quiet. We’ll rebuild afterward.
Oh, and many politicos are screeching that we’ll see communism. Well, even if, that would be rule by “thugs” not to include contemporary personalities in leadership. The political/regulator socialists still lose to resurgent “patriarchy” and all. Whole lot of fancy folks (see tourist reservations, not old marketplaces and neighborhoods on the outside of those) only think they know things about the more dictatorial countries. They’re not respected the morning after.
Patton, Eisenhower..etc...led American Soldiers against other American's.......
Look up the Bonus Army...........
Geesh dude....two morons wrecked havoc on a community...a few years ago.
Witness also, the decreasing respect and attention of the population for socially consolidated, contemporary politics. Many more are irked and are beginning to see a decades-long class war perpetrated against them (mostly inadvertent by those in trade and offices), while the shrinking political class begins to shriek generalizing projections against the rest of the general population.
Most people will work hard if allowed to do so. Thing is, it’s illegal (e.g., rural zoning against one-horse manufacturing shops). Most people are flamed by politicos as being nothing more than uber-populating, trash, stinking up the scenery.
There’s also more ingenuity out there than I previously assumed. I looked around at quite a bit of it.
I've no doubt your quote is good; I've seen similar. But my point was, he was quoted as having changed his mind privately by 1870, when he unbosomed himself of his private thoughts to a visiting ex-Confederate from Texas. That man confided in a minister and seminary dean he knew, who in turn published the recollection in his memoirs, near the end of the century.
The confidential conversation with Lee took place at the close of a meeting called by the U.S. Army of the surviving senior Confederate generals. General Rosecrans presided, and was charged with reporting back what the Confederate generals were thinking. This was at the time the Force Acts were under active consideration.
That's "The chair is against the wall", just for the record. You don't want to be confusing the Maquisards out there (who were Communists, by the way).
Y’all are discussing this scenario of a “civil war”. Perhaps you should read some history to see what that means.
During the Revolutionary war, it meant Loyalists in towns dominated by Revolutionaries were were harassed and their houses were burned (and vice versa - look at the history of those who signed the Declaration of Independence). This occurred far from the battlefields.
During the War between the States, the war wasn’t just between the northern and southern armies - it was ‘Bleeding Kansas’ and the atrocities of the raiders in Missouri (both sides).
In Argentina, both sides had “death squads”.
We appear to be building towards a civil war, but the next civil war will not be limited to a militarized force surrounding a geographic area (e.g., town, city, State) — it will be nation wide, neighbor against neighbor. It will be between those who believe that the purpose of the Constitution is to limit the power of the FedGov, and those who believe it interferes with building a FedGov that will ensure Social Justice (and Environmental Justice, and ...).
After some instigating incident where the FedGov steps over the line and cracks down, all restraints will be discarded -— targets will not be limited to the militarized forces doing the cracking — it will include “soft targets” [there are more of them, and they are softer].
Liberals publicly advocating a crackdown on the right with armed forces, whether politicians, legislators, newspaper editors, columnists, TV News anchors, will become targets of retribution [you want a war, here it is]; and then the target list will grow to include bureaucrats enforcing liberal policies.
Consider - if a militarized FBI or EPA or IRS force stormed your friend’s farm, what would be more effective resistance - retribution against the individual members of that militarized force, or against the EPA/IRS bureaucrat that ordered it? It wouldn’t be a militia that did it (with their FBI infiltrators), it would be a harder to find lone individual.
It will be very bloody.
Or let's say you're RA, and ordered to arrest mobilized Guard units and officers mustering at the (totally legal, totally constitutional) command of the governor of their State.
That's the Merriman scenario all over again, and it's also the Missouri Militia Volunteers, who were overreached in their own camp and ordered to surrender by a RA officer leading a whomped up force of regulars and Missouri Wide Awakes (think ACORN, think Sturmabteilungen, think New Black Panther Party). The Wide Awakes were secretly armed by the governor of Illinois illicitly, at the order of Abraham Lincoln, two months before he was sworn into office.
Think about that a while.
I agree with you 100%. Posts and threads get deleted that shouldn’t be and others that are shameful are allowed to remain. Up is down, black is white, crazy sh*t around here lately but it’s his forum, he runs the show.
Precisely. There are two competing versions of the future that are becoming of a size unable to share the same geographic space. This town just won't be big enough for the both of us.
You're exactly right that the next civil war won't be neat matches of tank divisions grappling for terrain, all set up according to respected rules and utilizing classic order of battle. They make it sound as though it would be a gentleman's duel that will be fought according to established doctrine and will end once one side is outmaneuvered and forced to concede defeat.
What they don't tell you is that in a real civil war, people will take power tools to each other, drill holes in their heads and leave the bodies hanging from bridges and power lines.
It will be everywhere, and not just where people assume it will be. The educated, urban Iraqis were far crueler to their captured enemies than the illiterate, warlike Afghans. The people least accustomed to fighting will be the ones most eager to push the limits once the fight arrives. Liberals may not make great warriors or organized opponents, but God help you if wind up caught up in one of their mobs once things start going sideways. What they'll lack in skill they'll make up for in viciousness. Many liberals will be shocked at just how far they've been conditioned to hate their opponents, and what that hate will make them capable of.
Certainly, the right won't be playing with kid gloves either. Once the tit-for-tat starts it will get very messy, and no one, be they man or woman, elderly or child, will be safe.
. “Col. Benson and Ms. Weber contend, Army officers are professionally obligated to consider the conduct of operations on U.S. soil. “
“Professionally”?Interesting inherint limitation in the rational.Are they not Americans? Since the Army is openly discussing fighting The People may The People beging discussing and contemplationg fighting the “professionals”?
“A constitutional loop-hole that an unscrupulous president could drive an M1A1 through.”
After that Romney killed my wife thing I lost any doubt that such a thing will be tried. Previously I thought the “suspend the elections” fears were wayyyy overheated.