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Who Does The Government Intend To Shoot?
Daily Caller ^ | 8/17/2012 | Major General Jerry Curry, USA (Ret.)

Posted on 08/20/2012 12:14:50 PM PDT by IbJensen

The Social Security Administration (SSA) confirms that it is purchasing 174 thousand rounds of hollow point bullets to be delivered to 41 locations in major cities across the U.S. No one has yet said what the purpose of these purchases is, though we are led to believe that they will be used only in an emergency to counteract and control civil unrest. Those against whom the hollow point bullets are to be used — those causing the civil unrest — must be American citizens; since the SSA has never been used overseas to help foreign countries maintain control of their citizens.

What would be the target of these 174, 000 rounds of hollow point bullets? It can’t simply be to control demonstrators or rioters. Hollow point bullets are so lethal that the Geneva Convention does not allow their use on the battle field in time of war. Hollow point bullets don’t just stop or hurt people, they penetrate the body, spread out, fragment and cause maximum damage to the body’s organs. Death often follows.

Potentially each hollow nose bullet represents a dead American. If so, why would the U.S. government want the SSA to kill 174,000 of our citizens, even during a time of civil unrest? Or is the purpose to kill 174,000 of the nation’s military and replace them with Department of Homeland Security (DHS) special security forces, forces loyal to the Administration, not to the Constitution?

All my life I’ve handled firearms. When a young boy growing up on my father’s farm in Pennsylvania Dad’s first rule of firearms training was, “Never point a gun at someone, in fun or otherwise, unless you intend to shoot them. If you shoot someone, shoot to kill.” I’ve never forgotten his admonition. It stayed with me through my Boy Scout training, when I enlisted in the army as a Private to fight in the Korea War, during my days as a Ranger and Paratrooper and throughout my thirty-four year military career.

If this were only a one time order of ammunition, it could easily be dismissed. But there is a pattern here. The National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA) has ordered 46,000 rounds of hollow point ammunition. Notice that all of these purchases are for the lethal hollow nose bullets. These bullets are not being purchased and stored for squirrel or coyote hunting. This is serious ammunition manufactured to be used for serious purposes.

In the war in Iraq, our military forces expended approximately 70 million rounds per year. In March DHS ordered 750 million rounds of hollow point ammunition. It then turned around and ordered an additional 750 million rounds of miscellaneous bullets including some that are capable of penetrating walls. This is enough ammunition to empty five rounds into the body of every living American citizen. Is this something we and the Congress should be concerned about? What’s the plan that requires so many dead Americans, even during times of civil unrest? Has Congress and the Administration vetted the plan in public.

I fear that Congress won’t take these ammunition purchases seriously until they are all led from Capitol Hill in handcuffs. Why buy all this ammunition unless you plan to use it. Unknown to Congress, Does DHS plan to declare war on some country? Shouldn’t Congress hold hearings on why the Administration is stockpiling this ammunition all across the nation? How will it be used; what are the Administration’s plans?

Obama is a deadly serious, persistent man. Once he focuses on an object, he pursues it to the end. What is his focus here? All of these rounds of ammunition can only be used to kill American citizens, though there is enough ammunition being ordered to kill, in addition to every American citizen, also every Iranian, Syrian or Mexican. There is simply too much of it. And this much ammunition can’t be just for training, there aren’t that many weapons and “shooters” in the U.S. to fire it. Perhaps it is to be used to arm illegal immigrants?

We have enough military forces to maintain law and order in the U.S. even during times of civil unrest.

We have local police, backed up by each state’s National Guard, backed up by the Department of Defense. So in addition to all these forces why does DHS need its own private army? Why do the SSA, NOAA and other government agencies need to create their own civilian security forces armed with hollow nose bullets?

Were I the JCS, and if I wasn’t already fully briefed on this matter, I’d stop the purchase of hollow point bullets, ask the secretary of Defense why all this ammunition is being purchased and spread around the country? If I got answers like the ones Congress got during the investigation of Operation Fast and Furious – I’d start tracking all ammunition deliveries nationwide to find out what organizations and units are using them, for what purpose and, if it is not constitutional, prepare to counteract whatever it is that they are doing.

This is a deadly serious business. I hope I’m wrong, but something smells rotten. And If the Congress isn’t going to do its duty and investigate this matter fully, the military will have to protect the Constitution, the nation, and our citizens.

Jerry Curry is a decorated combat veteran, Army Aviator, Paratrooper, and Ranger, who for nearly forty years has served his country both in the military and as a Presidential political appointee.

TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: ammo; ammotokillamericans; banglist; bhossa; evilobamaregime; gencurry; govtammo; jerrycurry; ssa
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To: IbJensen

This illustrates what’s wrong with security, homeland security,parks dept, interior, environmental, capital, state and local, FBI, courts, corrections, and on and on. Some of these law enforcement outfits could be done away and their duties be absorbed by other agencies,which would save billions.

21 posted on 08/20/2012 12:52:24 PM PDT by kenmcg (t)
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To: squarebarb

I don’t know if DOE has — or why they would need — a SWAT Team. My expertise on agency responsibilities falling under the DOE is limited.

SSA only ordered 174K rounds. That’s less than 600 per agent. Assuming they practice at all, that’s not excessive. They’re obviously not getting in all that many gunfights. Like I said ... this is more about waste than oppression.

Not sure your complaint about regulatory procedure has anything to do with bullet purchases. They’re unelected. Even if they weren’t ... the law would still need to be enforced — probably backed by bullets. If the law sucks ... change it.


22 posted on 08/20/2012 12:52:24 PM PDT by SnakeDoctor ("I've shot people I like more for less." -- Raylan Givens, Justified)
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To: chrisser
Are these lead bullets? ‘Cause I thought the EPA said lead bullets were bad.

Good question. I'm not aware of any soft metal that would work as well as lead in a hollow point round. I've heard that a lot of military rounds are going away from lead due to EPA requirments. My own local outdoor shooting range was 'down' for like a month while they literaly excavated the impact area to cleanup all the lead rounds. Took their sweet old time about it, too.

23 posted on 08/20/2012 12:53:08 PM PDT by Tallguy (It's all 'Fun and Games' until somebody loses an eye!)
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To: IbJensen
Is this loaded ammo? Chambered for 5.56, 7.62, .45? this is not good info. 500trillion hollow point bullets are useless. They need powder and brass, primers and a loading press to be useful.
24 posted on 08/20/2012 12:54:36 PM PDT by exnavy (The time is upon us, fish or cut bait, may God guide your heart.)
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To: Hugin

No kidding. If an SSA agent comes shooting, they’ll run out of ammo way before many of us. Haha.


25 posted on 08/20/2012 12:55:07 PM PDT by SnakeDoctor ("I've shot people I like more for less." -- Raylan Givens, Justified)
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To: MrB
Talk to any lefty, and they’ll tell you:

There’s a lot of things that are OK for the gov’t or the [leftist] “elite” to do that you cannot be allowed to do.

I have had a similar conversation on similar terms. They actually believe that the people who elect to "serve" in the public sector are somehow nobler and more trustworthy than the average person. Likewise they believe that those in the private sector are corrupt and evil. Even worse, they believe this, somehow, "just happens" since there's no mechanism to insure it, yet it must be true because they believe it to be so.
26 posted on 08/20/2012 12:57:41 PM PDT by chrisser (Starve the Monkeys!)
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To: Hugin

Frankly, I think the recent rush to buy ammo is just a way for these agencies to ‘fill out’ their they can request more money the next year. Its a common goverment trick...and one I was an unwilling participant in many years ago, as I was ordered to burn through several hundred rounds of blanks at the end of a training exercise. So, I’m pretty sure I know why all these requests are coming now.

But lets talk about the ‘hoopla’ about them being hollow points. Somebody has taken it upon themselves to find all these ammo solicitations, and publicize them for the first time...exposing the large scale purchases of ammo by the government. The government reponse “don’t worry your pretty little self, this is just for qualifying at the range.” Well, I’d like to bring on the hoopla....because its government waste on top of government waste, if they are using premium ammunition at the range. Since we the people are paying for this, maybe these federal agencies should be forced to do what we do....and for me that means firing unjacketed crap for practice.

I view these ammo stories as a crack in the window, giving us a small view of what the federal government employees really think of the rest of us. I worked with DA civilians my last year in the Army, so I have a little bit of perspective. They view their day to day jobs in terms of how they can circumvent the law, and violate your liberties...and they treat your money as if it were water flowing from an endless spring. These ammo buy stories expose both of those attitudes.

27 posted on 08/20/2012 1:01:31 PM PDT by lacrew (Mr. Soetoro, we regret to inform you that your race card is over the credit limit.)
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To: kenmcg

I think a few of them could easily be consolidated. I don’t see why Justice or Homeland couldn’t supply armed escorts when necessary for some of the agencies where armed agents don’t make as much sense (like the IRS, SSA, NOAA, DOE, etc.). Shooting at a federal agent is a federal crime ... it seems logical that agents that anticipate being shot at could bring a Marshal or Fed along with them.

But, I still hold that this is a case of waste and redundancy, not conspiracy.


28 posted on 08/20/2012 1:03:33 PM PDT by SnakeDoctor ("I've shot people I like more for less." -- Raylan Givens, Justified)
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To: chrisser

Yes, I’ve point-blank asked a lib-in-law if she believed that elected politicians are inherently more moral and intelligent than the general population.

The answer was an unequivocal “yes - otherwise they wouldn’t be there.”


29 posted on 08/20/2012 1:05:42 PM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter knows whom he's working fors)
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To: exnavy

Apply for the newly created job of gunnery sergeant. They need help if they’re going to kill any of us.

30 posted on 08/20/2012 1:06:45 PM PDT by IbJensen (Since light travels faster than sound, some people appear bright until you hear them speak.)
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To: IbJensen
My conspiracy theory to explain all the Gubmint ammo purchases is that the Obama administration is trying to over burden the ammo manufacturers. That way, the Gubmint gets the ammo they want for stockpiling and can create another shortage such as the one that happened right after his election.

With little or no ammo on store shelves, We The People will be hard pressed to continue stockpiling and once inventories are depleted, he'll move to raise the tax on ammo to something like 500% so We The People cannot afford it when the shelves are restocked....and probably putting the ammo manufacturers out of business in the process.

It's a Win-Win-Win for him and his minions.

31 posted on 08/20/2012 1:06:55 PM PDT by Bloody Sam Roberts (Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit; Wisdom is not putting it in a fruit salad.)
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To: Hugin

The article goes on to document that DHS purchased 750 million hollow point rounds in March and another 750 million of other types of bullets including some that are to penetrate walls. Friendly forces consumed roughly 70 million rounds a year in Iraq.

Even NOAA is buying 46,000 hollow points.

Every Tom, Dick and Harry in regulatory agencies are being armed including ‘environmental compliance’.

Be careful how you dispose of those AAA cell batteries. It might appear threatening to those so equipped.

32 posted on 08/20/2012 1:09:36 PM PDT by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: IbJensen
Hollow point? I believe that the intent is to arm the government employees with frangible rounds..

the Obama Administration is afraid that ordinary rounds would penetrate the target and get one of their dwindling supporters. However, they may get splattered with what's left of us.

33 posted on 08/20/2012 1:10:36 PM PDT by WilliamofCarmichael (If modern America's Man on Horseback is out there, Get on the damn horse already!)
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To: Bloody Sam Roberts

I’m with you on your theory...

When it was clear that 0bama was going to be elected (when McCain got the nomination), ammo supplies got real short for a while, but then they caught up, and you could actually find some pistol rounds at Walmart.

I’m thinking that the PTB are trying to make it scarce again, because people are steadily buying 2-3 where they would usually buy 1 and putting it back “just in case”.

34 posted on 08/20/2012 1:11:28 PM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter knows whom he's working fors)
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To: IbJensen

Except I wouldn’t want to work for the Gubmint.

35 posted on 08/20/2012 1:17:29 PM PDT by exnavy (The time is upon us, fish or cut bait, may God guide your heart.)
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To: lacrew

One more thought regarding the Dept. of Agriculture—don’t they run the National Forest Service? Given that National Forests are being overrun by armed drug cartels, it may not be unreasonable for them to have a SWAT team or two.

36 posted on 08/20/2012 1:17:29 PM PDT by Hugin ("Most times a man'll tell you his bad intentions, if you listen and let yourself hear."---Open Range)
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To: Hugin

The Geneva convention prohibits the use of hollow tipped bullets in warfare. There is absolutely no reason U.S. government agencies like the Social Security Administration or the NOAH should have them AT ALL. If this doesn’t disturb you perhaps you should check your pulse to make sure you have one.

37 posted on 08/20/2012 1:41:51 PM PDT by Juliathemechanic (No One Ever Expects the Spanish Inquisition)
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To: IbJensen
I looked at this guy's record and it's pretty embarrassing - if his website is accurate, and he was an Army Ranger, an adviser in South Vietnam, and a whole slew of other assignments, he of all people should know that you need a few hundred rounds (minimum) per year per person who is carrying a firearm.

The math comes out to around 500 - 600 rounds per agent. You know what I call 500-600 rounds? A good weekend. A lot of agencies that have law enforcement personnel call 500-600 rounds a normal amount of training/ yearly qualifications.

This guy has bigger fish to fry. Much bigger fish. Getting hung up on an ammo purchase, the majority of which will be expended in training/qualification makes him look pretty damned foolish.

Roughly 75% of his writing is focused on the ammo itself and the rest about why some agencies have agents or don't rely on normal law enforcement agencies.

He needs to be 100% focused on why those agencies have armed agents, and not getting hung up on the small things.
38 posted on 08/20/2012 1:43:14 PM PDT by af_vet_rr
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To: IbJensen

What about all the .40 hollow points the DHS has purchased?

39 posted on 08/20/2012 2:00:09 PM PDT by nomad
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To: Cvengr
The article goes on to document that DHS purchased 750 million hollow point rounds in March and another 750 million of other types of bullets including some that are to penetrate walls. Friendly forces consumed roughly 70 million rounds a year in Iraq.

I'm not defending DHS - I was against its creation under Bush and the Republicans in Congress, and I'm still against it. However, step back for a moment and run the numbers.

DHS has over 200,000 employees. That's less than 4,000 rounds per employee. Obviously not every employee is carrying a firearm, however DHS contains the Border Patrol, TSA, the US Coast Guard, and the Secret Service. They also operate the larger federal law enforcement training facilities, FLETC (established in the 1960s or 1970s), which burn through an enormous amount of ammo - a friend of my son's worked at a FLETC facility for a few years and for somebody who likes firearms, it was almost a dream come true. I don't know how it is now, but he indicated they burned through a lot more than civilian law enforcement agencies.

I would hope that the TSA, Border Patrol, Secret Service, and quite a few members of the Coast Guard are using up a lot more than 500 or 600 rounds for training and qualification, and are getting into the thousands of rounds per year range.

And lest we forget, it's a federal bureaucracy, don't believe for one moment that everybody involved in the contract process is 100% law-abiding and clean-cut. Lot of favors exchange hands, people get promised jobs if they can get extra things added to contract. Far too many federal contractors try and milk the system for all it's worth, and they even offer "discounts" to get the feds to purchase more of something.

I can picture a scenario where the requirements were down to under half a billion rounds and somebody promised somebody something or threw in some things if they drove it up by a few hundred million.
40 posted on 08/20/2012 2:01:25 PM PDT by af_vet_rr
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