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Sponging boomers
The Economist ^ | 29 September 2012

Posted on 10/14/2012 8:53:42 PM PDT by Lorianne

The economic legacy left by the baby-boomers is leading to a battle between the generations ___ ANOTHER economic mess looms on the horizon—one with a great wrinkled visage. The struggle to digest the swollen generation of ageing baby-boomers threatens to strangle economic growth. As the nature and scale of the problem become clear, a showdown between the generations may be inevitable.

After the end of the second world war births surged across the rich world. Britain, Germany and Japan all enjoyed a baby boom, although it peaked in different years. America’s was most pronounced. By 1964 individuals born after the war accounted for 41% of the total population, forming a generation large enough to exert its own political and economic gravity.

These boomers have lived a charmed life, easily topping previous generations in income earned at every age. The sheer heft of the generation created a demographic dividend: a rise in labour supply, reinforced by a surge in the number of working women. Social change favoured it too. Households became smaller, populated with more earners and fewer children. And boomers enjoyed the distinction of being among the best-educated of American generations at a time when the return on education was soaring.

(Excerpt) Read more at economist.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government
KEYWORDS:
Getting all set for generational warfare?
1 posted on 10/14/2012 8:53:42 PM PDT by Lorianne
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To: Lorianne

No kidding! What is it with all the Boomer bashing? We are the ones left holding the empty bag. We are the ones paying exorbitant taxes to support the current crop of retirees while trying to raise our own children. Not having many kids? Well, the government made sure it would be expensive to have children.

It was not Boomers who voted for FDR, and it is the young voters today who most support Obama.

Enough of this crap! It’s time to lay the blame where it belongs - on government programs that rob us all and pit us against each other. Americans should look in the mirror if they want to see whose at fault. If we did not have a majority voting for politicians who promise to give them other people’s money, we wouldn’t be in this mess.


2 posted on 10/14/2012 8:59:15 PM PDT by Pining_4_TX ( The state is the great fiction by which everybody seeks to live at the expense of everybody else. ~)
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To: Pining_4_TX

Oops, “who is” not “whose”

I was on a roll there. ;-)


3 posted on 10/14/2012 9:00:05 PM PDT by Pining_4_TX ( The state is the great fiction by which everybody seeks to live at the expense of everybody else. ~)
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To: Lorianne

Boomer economic ping


4 posted on 10/14/2012 9:01:56 PM PDT by gleeaikin
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To: Lorianne
We need to get out of the "blame" game.

But we do need to get into the "fiscal reality" game. There are government programs which were promised to people, and which we cannot afford. We need to take a step back and ask ourselves "What should government really be doing?" and I'd say that the answer is: "helping people a lot less".

5 posted on 10/14/2012 9:10:00 PM PDT by ClearCase_guy (ua)
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To: Lorianne
Well, just drag us out of our wheelchairs and shoot us.

I'm sick of these attacks on boomers. Most of us have paid our dues to society all along. Most of us attended schools with class sizes that no one today would think plausible because there were so many of us. Then when we hit the job market, since there were so many of us, getting a good job wasn't easy.

What are we supposed to do? We DIDN'T vote in the Great Society fiascos--that belongs to the previous generations--but we've been paying for those unwise programs all our lives.

Most of us weren't hippie malcontents.
6 posted on 10/14/2012 9:10:17 PM PDT by Nepeta
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To: Lorianne

Or it could be laying the emotional and social groundwork for death panels, denial of care and euthanasia. It’s easier to get rid of people after they’ve been dehumanized. By screaming the horrors of old people on government healthcare and pensions, people who supposedly take more than they paid in, it could then be easier to justify denial of medical care, poor quality nursing homes or outright murder of the elderly who are on government benefits of any type.


7 posted on 10/14/2012 9:18:08 PM PDT by tbw2
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To: ClearCase_guy

Social Security is a TRUST, not an entitlement program like other government programs. There is a difference. We have the IOUs to prove it. Instead, supposed conservatives join the Democrats in calling for boomer heads.


8 posted on 10/14/2012 9:19:03 PM PDT by stilloftyhenight
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To: Lorianne

Another hate the boomers article. Haven’t read much of this one, but I bet it’s like most: filled with blame for the boomers for government programs and policies passed into law when the boomers didn’t have enough political power to pass a local school board resolution, let alone huge programs such as the welfare and poverty programs passed in the ‘60s, let along SS from the Roosevelt years, before boomers were even born.


9 posted on 10/14/2012 9:25:35 PM PDT by Will88
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To: Pining_4_TX
Whose on first.

Good points. The lifelong politicians never fail to feather their own nests, but somehow the blame is always on the ordinary citizens. Boomers have been paying into Social Security for 30 or 40 years in most cases, and very few of them have drawn out a dime so far.

10 posted on 10/14/2012 9:26:06 PM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: tbw2

You’re on the right track. The Boomer generation is being set up for the kind of abuse that we have never seen here in America.


11 posted on 10/14/2012 9:28:01 PM PDT by LongWayHome
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To: Lorianne

Let the “Gray Wave” roll.


12 posted on 10/14/2012 9:30:24 PM PDT by Mike Darancette (Take two Aspirin and call me in November - Obama for Hindmost.)
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To: LongWayHome

Some of the new limitations have already kicked in. Later age of first mammogram (from 35 to 40 or higher) and the government stating not to do it in very old age, though the risk of cancer increases with age. Age is now considered in organ transplants. The mandate to discuss your plans for death and denial of care with Medicare doctors periodically. The financial punishment of hospitals with readmissions, which will lead to hospitals refusing to readmit patients; more people then die. I can’t say to what the degree the push for legalizing assisted suicide is part of this, or simply a reflection of the anti-human movement.


13 posted on 10/14/2012 9:34:42 PM PDT by tbw2
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To: tbw2

Look at England. They are killing their old people. Outright murder. The sickness is coming ths way.


14 posted on 10/14/2012 9:37:04 PM PDT by LongWayHome
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To: Lorianne

BS. They knew this.


15 posted on 10/14/2012 9:59:07 PM PDT by freekitty (Give me back my conservative vote; then find me a real conservative to vote for)
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To: stilloftyhenight

“We have the IOUs to prove it. Instead, supposed conservatives join the Democrats in calling for boomer heads.”

An IOU is better than a paycheck deduction we’re told is to pay current retirees, for a program from which we will never benefit.

I guess they should just stop telling us that.

I have no beef with boomers; I feel bad that their children are fighting for the right to euthanize them (seriously).


16 posted on 10/14/2012 10:01:52 PM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic war against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: tbw2

“it could then be easier to justify denial of medical care, poor quality nursing homes or outright murder of the elderly who are on government benefits of any type.”

I thought that Obama was very up-front when he took money from Medicare for a national healthcare program that would NOT deny benefits to illegal alines (Joe Wilson was right - HE LIED!). Amazingly enough, AARP along with many seniors will still support Obama - and I will shed no tears for any of THEM that are euthanized.

They had every warning, directly from the source - no work, no use for you.


17 posted on 10/14/2012 10:16:12 PM PDT by kearnyirish2 (Affirmative action is economic war against white males (and therefore white families).)
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To: Lorianne
as a country ages, its tolerance for inflation falls. Its authors theorise that a central bank could use inflation to achieve some generational redistribution. Yet pressure on the Fed to cease its expansionary actions has been intense, and led by a Republican Party increasingly driven by boomer preferences.

As boomers retire, they spend money, which supports occupations from the pharmacist to the sporting goods stores to the pet groomer and lawn boy. that should be 'generational redistribution' enough.

18 posted on 10/14/2012 10:22:27 PM PDT by blueplum
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To: LongWayHome

they’re killing them here, too.

my 91yo neighbor and dear friend was asked by a cardiologist, at an appointment to see about getting a pacemaker, “just how long do you want to live anyway”?

this is a woman who walks without a walker, has a mind as clear as a bell, and still flys to Hawaii once a year to visit her great grands. It’s a good thing I wasn’t at her appointment with her


19 posted on 10/14/2012 10:28:56 PM PDT by blueplum
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To: Lorianne
Generational war may be on the way, but it will have nothing to with age.

It will have everything to do with race.

Blacks, Hispanics, and new immigrant citizens are the spinal cord of the Democrat Party and the Socialist Left.

When their voter participation rate equals white voter participation rate - and that will happen - sooner, not later - America will turn into South Africa.

Non-whites have been taught since birth to blame every problem on whites.

Does anyone believe that non-white Americans are going to willingly hand over 30% of their income to pay for white pensions and white health care?

Does anyone believe that non-white Americans will create wealth or display generosity at the same level white Americans have done?

It's not going to happen.

There will be a war, a political war, and the aging white Boomers are going to lose.

20 posted on 10/14/2012 10:42:38 PM PDT by zeestephen
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To: Nepeta

“Most of us have paid our dues to society all along”

No. That’s the problem boomers DIDN’T fully pay for the services that they expect to receive today.

How do you expect to get the services, particularly Medicare, when there isn’t the money to pay for them, becase boomers expect a free ride on their health care costs?

Medicare users are a primary cause of soaring healthcare costs of younger folks, through cost-shifting onto private health insurance that younger folks increasingly can no longer afford due to rapidly escalating premiums.

Just be honest about that before whining about someone trying to “drag (you) out of (your) wheelchair”


21 posted on 10/14/2012 10:48:10 PM PDT by RFEngineer
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To: Pining_4_TX

“Enough of this crap! It’s time to lay the blame where it belongs - on government programs that rob us all and pit us against each other. Americans should look in the mirror if they want to see whose at fault. “

Indeed. There is no “fair” way to end government programs that rob us all. So they will continue until they suddenly stop.

This is something no politician of any stripe is willing to tell Americans.

The “third rail” in politics has become any and all government programs.


22 posted on 10/14/2012 10:52:38 PM PDT by RFEngineer
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To: Verginius Rufus
And don't forget the deal with Tip O’neal where the rates were raised so that boomers would pay more, and the projections were that with a little delay in age for retirement, they would be able to enjoy full benefits.

After working for more than 40 years,I took care of my Dad, and kept him out of a nursing home. I could have been working and socking away additional money for my retirement - Dad would have qualified for Medicaid, but I was raised to believe that family helps family and the government teat is the last resort.

I am still helping my children with financial aid when they are out of work, and free babysitting etc. When I get older, it appears that the government will hang a sign on me: Usless eater, and help hasten my demise so there is plenty of money to give to cronies like Solyndra, studies of cow poop and global-warming, and redistribution to third world cronies in places like Kenya and also places like Egypt.

A pox on all the greedy, dishonest politicians. There are only a handful that are worth anything.

23 posted on 10/14/2012 10:55:12 PM PDT by greeneyes (Moderation in defense of your country is NO virtue. Let Freedom Ring.)
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To: Lorianne

Do you know what the government calls a non sponging Boomer? A cash cow.


24 posted on 10/14/2012 11:02:47 PM PDT by Mike Darancette (Take two Aspirin and call me in November - Obama for Hindmost.)
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To: blueplum
Its authors theorise that a central bank could use inflation to achieve some generational redistribution. Yet pressure

**********************************************************

This is pure old BS. Inflation doesn't redistribute anything to the younger generations. Inflation is a huge tax that hurts all Americans, especially the lower and middle income people.

Wages and colas usually don't keep pace with inflation. I am soooo sick of all the lying as if everyone in the USA is so stupid they will believe anything.

Well we may have a lot of stupid people, but there's a lot of us out here that are a whole lot smarter than a bunch of dumb butt elitist bureaucrats, Congress Critters, and Journalists trying to keep us busy fighting each other, so they can use our money to enslave, control, and dictate to us how we can live, eat, and pray.

25 posted on 10/14/2012 11:11:22 PM PDT by greeneyes (Moderation in defense of your country is NO virtue. Let Freedom Ring.)
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To: stilloftyhenight

Social Security is nothing more or less than a social insurance scheme.

This has been ruled on by the Supreme Court as of 1960 in the case Flemming v. Nestor. No one who pays social security taxes has any property right interest in any future benefits that might be paid out. Also, the Congress can alter (increase or decrease) the payouts or eliminate them entirely.

The case arose out of a communist who was being deported back to eastern Europe. He claimed that since he paid into Social Security, he was due a payout on his way out of the country because it was money held in trust for him later on. The SCOTUS said “Sorry, no, Social Security is just a social insurance scheme.”

And that’s the real truth of Social Security.


26 posted on 10/15/2012 12:45:27 AM PDT by NVDave
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To: NVDave

So is auto insurance. Do you share the same opinion on that?


27 posted on 10/15/2012 1:45:23 AM PDT by stilloftyhenight
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To: Nepeta

“Most of us weren’t hippie malcontents.”

Right; and we worked hard, kept our noses clean, and paid taxes to upkeep the grannies and grampas of these people who are now bashing us - for years, and through the nose.

Was this LBJ’s dream? Is it Obama’s dream? CLASS WARFARE and hatred? What a nightmare! - God, please grant me, at 66, to continue to be able to work and hard scrabble enough so my husband (69) and I, can survive. I know how to hard scrabble; but have seen how cross kids get when they don’t have “pizza” every day or have enough money to afford their silly “tats” and cell phones.


28 posted on 10/15/2012 3:19:27 AM PDT by Twinkie (HUSSEIN OBAMA GOTTA GO!!!)
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To: LongWayHome

Many Boomers are armed and wouldn’t give a crap bout blowing you away if you fk with their future.


29 posted on 10/15/2012 3:26:47 AM PDT by Renegade
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To: Pining_4_TX; Lorianne
It is pointless to argue about "who's to blame".

The reality is that Medicare is on the verge of complete insolvency, because the government has paid out far, far more for the care of elderly Americans than was paid in to the program by their payroll deductions.

Social Security has a while longer to go but will eventually take the same path.

There is no way to put the toothpaste back in the tube, to unmake the mistakes of the last forty years.

What we have to do now is (1) raise taxes on younger generations, (2) cut benefits for retirees, or (3) reduce payments to doctors and hospitals, which will of course result in fewer services being offered.

Or a combination of all three.

30 posted on 10/15/2012 4:57:49 AM PDT by Eric Pode of Croydon
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To: Lorianne

It looks like “they” are polishing up the excuses to wipe out another generation of “parasites”.

And to be fair, just because of the size of the Boomer generation means that we produced more and more and worked our butts off to do it, aka “productive citizens”, also means that the number of parasitical “hippie” types were also more quantitatively.

So what happens to America when the build-up of “grief and denial” occurs to the Generation X, Y and the millenials after they see their parents, grand-parents and other associated relatives “Medically Terminated” when they are no longer considered to be “productive” citizens?


31 posted on 10/15/2012 5:09:34 AM PDT by The Working Man
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To: Lorianne

Their analysis is off a bit. Blame the economic problems on LBJ’s great experiment. Generations on the dole. Massive dole, including but not limited to the Obama phone.


32 posted on 10/15/2012 5:12:07 AM PDT by RGSpincich
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To: blueplum

Nasty thing to say to her for sure.


33 posted on 10/15/2012 5:16:30 AM PDT by LongWayHome
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To: blueplum

The cardiologist for my 95 YO mother in law recommended a pacemaker. She had the surgery and died 6 months later from massive infection thought to have been introduced by a catheter.


34 posted on 10/15/2012 5:20:58 AM PDT by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 ..... Present failure and impending death yield irrational action))
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To: stilloftyhenight

Yep. Just because you paid into it for years doesn’t mean that you get anything back. That’s in the terms of the auto insurance policy.

This isn’t my opinion. This is the opinion of the US Supreme Court. So what I have to say about it really doesn’t amount to anything in the grand scheme of things.

My point is that this issue has been decided a LONG time ago, and BOTH parties have been lying to the public as to what Social Security is and isn’t. There is no property right. It isn’t a pension. It isn’t like a whole life insurance policy. The money you might (NB, “MIGHT”) receive isn’t “yours” - there is no “lockbox,” there is no “personal account.” All of that is a pile of lies. The decision in 1960 settled for once and all what Social Security is - a social insurance scheme, which Congress may modify at any time they see fit.

That last part, BTW, comes about because in the enabling legislation for Social Security, the Congress reserved to themselves in 1935 the power to do so. Says right there in the law that Congress may make changes at any time. So if the Congress decided to install means-testing tomorrow, they could.

Flemming v. Nestor is one of those cases which, when you bring it up, causes politicians to scatter like leaves in front of an autumn wind. They’ve heard of it - they’re not stupid. I’m sure in some closed-door session, the case law has been explained to them. But they also know that the overwhelming majority of people in the US have never heard of the case, even tho it is explained on the Social Security Administration web site. The SSA themselves know of Flemming v. Nestor and they explain what it means on their web site. And still.... people think that the money they’ve paid in is ‘theirs.’

http://www.ssa.gov/history/nestor.html

BTW, I have to laugh at the turn of the phrase: “This is often expressed in the idea that Social Security benefits are “an earned right.” This is true enough in a moral and political sense.”

Political hacks have no morals. There’s only the political. Until now, they’ve peddled the lie, because it served their political ends. Now that we’re truly out of money, they’re going to start peddling a different tune... just you watch.


35 posted on 10/15/2012 6:52:37 AM PDT by NVDave
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To: Lorianne

Yep. They are trying to set up the culture of death to desire Obama’s death care rationing system to kill old people and to confiscate middle class boomer retirement funds and benefits. They just need one shot to get it all done in a 3,000 page economic “emergency” leglislation that no one reads and can oppose.

Liberal race hate plays into generational economic warfare, too. They want “redistribution” of life and property (from a racist and inferior whitey generation) to the “younger generation” (a superior, more deserving majority minority generation).

They want to protray old people as greedy, ugly, racist and undeserving of dignity, life and property rights. The TSA show of pulling down old people’s pants while ignoring their distress as goon agents invade their surgical wounds and naked scan them, etc. is conditioning. No generation of Americans would tolerate agents of the government abusing the elderly like this before.

As they condition the American idol, abortion herd to hate and disrespect handicapped, old and vulnerable white people, imagine how diversity racist elderly care workers and government health care agents will deal with the liberalism’s creation of the ugly, elderly animals.

Democrats will grab hold of this because it is the desire of globalists who have embraced environmentalism to kill off large human populations. The American old hold the memory of National constitutional freedom, ethics, morality and idenity and that gets in the way of globalism’s goals.

The old are useless eaters to them. There is no value in human life beyond what it can produce for the government and globalists, economically. It’s going to get ugly and they are betting that boomers will be too suicidal, disorganized, stupid and weak to stop them. AARP is for deathcare and many boomers see AARP as their political organizer/representatives.


36 posted on 10/15/2012 7:51:49 AM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: Pining_4_TX; Lorianne

By the time my friends and I were in our mid-40’s, our children were grown, generally employed and contributing to the social security fund. That left us with another 20 years to add to our own retirement fund.

OTOH, when my kiddos and their friends were in their late 30’s and early 40’s, they were just beginning to have children. By the time those children (my grandchildren) are contributing to the social security fund, their parents will be almost ready to retire. We could conceivably end up with a 15-20 year gap of decreased payments into the fund with disastrous financial results.


37 posted on 10/15/2012 9:12:35 AM PDT by Grams A (The Sun will rise in the East in the morning and God is still on his throne.)
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To: Lorianne

Sadly, the Economist has veered left for so long it cannot even think straight anymore. After reading article and ignoring the silliness here’s the big error - it lists only three possible solutions:

1.Faster growth.

2. Austerity - a 35% cut in all transfer payments and a 35% rise in all taxes

3. Inflation. (5% per annum is the suggested amount)

Yet, nowhere in the article is a free market solution. All the above solutions originate from and are imposed by government. How about simply removing all the regulations restricting interstate trade in healthcare?

Why can’t you buy insurance from anywhere in America?

Is an Indiana doctor, nurse or pharmacist so poorly vetted and trained that this same licensed professional becomes a menace in Illinois?

The beautiful and under appreciated Commerce and General Welfare Clauses exist to remedy the natural abuse of one state preferring its citizens to the next and using licensing to restrict free trade internal to America.

Why not use the Constitution to benefit America for a change?


38 posted on 10/16/2012 4:28:13 AM PDT by 1010RD (First, Do No Harm)
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To: 1010RD

Excellent summation.


39 posted on 10/16/2012 6:29:56 AM PDT by Lorianne (fedgov, taxporkmoney)
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To: Renegade

“Many Boomers are armed and wouldn’t give a crap bout blowing you away if you fk with their future.”

Yep. Boomers (as a group) have had no problem with electing people that destroy this country, drastically infringe on freedom and the liberty of their fellow patriots. Selling out the very things our forefathers spilled their blood for

Now in Boomerville, according to you, the only thing worth spilling blood for is the check that the government promises to give them that is taken by force from other Americans who actually earn it.

You sir, have your head way up your posterior orifice.

I’m technically a boomer, by the way.


40 posted on 10/16/2012 6:39:53 AM PDT by RFEngineer
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To: RFEngineer

You sir are IMHO an idiot!


41 posted on 10/16/2012 6:51:03 PM PDT by Renegade
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To: Renegade

“You sir are IMHO an idiot!”

This could be true, but defend your position, man! It’s insanity!


42 posted on 10/17/2012 3:23:28 AM PDT by RFEngineer
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To: RFEngineer

This administration is not supporting class warfare it is promoting generational warfare. Boomers sadly elected Carter, Kennedy and the Brown Clown.The Demorat party is the party that is destroying the country incrementally.By the way, Obummer stated he wanted to reinstate the Assault Weapons Ban and in his mind semi-auto is classified as an “assault” classification.If this joker is reelected and appoints two liberal judges to the Supreme Court, this country is fkd for the next 40 years at the least.
I AM a Boomer, not technically, being born in 1947. The only thing I get from the government is a SS check from the money they confiscated from me without any choice( and I pay taxes on 85% of it again) and Medicare that I have to pay for and don’t need.Under Obamacare it doesn’t cover $hit anyway.Really pisses me off to see my tax money buying Obama phones for the likes of that retard on TV and supporting people who do nothing but spit out babies,get more Obama cash from Obama’s stash for each additional, and sit on their asses all day.
From the movie, a lot of us “ Are mad as hell and we aren’t gonna take it anymore!”
I imagine if SHTH we’ll be right alongside each other


43 posted on 10/17/2012 3:48:52 AM PDT by Renegade
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To: Renegade

All of the stuff you mention, SS, medicare, Obamaphones, welfare mamas.....all the money for that has to come from people who earn it TODAY, or failing to cover the whole bill, it has to be borrowed.

The checks for all of those things will stop coming, or be so diluted as to be meaningless in the future, staying on the same path.

You’re getting entitlements that come from people who earn it today, and borrowed from taxpayers of tomorrow not from any savings. The money you paid has long been squandered.

You’re saying that entitlement recipients will wreak violence against those that threaten their survival, which presumably is tied to the checks they receive.

I can’t side with you on that point. It’s the folks TODAY and the folks TOMORROW that are the victims, not you, not any present entitlement. Yes, you were lied to, and ripped off in the past, but not to the same extent as present and future taxpayers will be.

If we stick to the same path (and no sign of change is apparent), only a tyrannical government can extract enough property, liberty, and freedom from freedom-loving patriots to service the debts we are incurring. Actually paying it back would require even worse tyranny - enslavement of Americans.

As we say in Virginia, “Sic Semper Tyrannis”. In that struggle, I believe we would, indeed stand side-by-side with other freedom loving American Patriots against tyranny.

I think your anger is misplaced. You should be (and perhaps are) angered at a government that would force dependency on redistribution of others property, and act to take others property.


44 posted on 10/17/2012 4:15:21 AM PDT by RFEngineer
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To: Lorianne

In the big and large picture.....from its inception is Social Security in 1935 by FDR...the only concern and interest of the Feds in ‘safety nets” and “welfare programs”has been to circumvent its obligations to secure the freedoms of the individual required by the US Constitution.

They have had each of us provide them the rope with which to hang ourselves.


45 posted on 10/17/2012 4:21:40 AM PDT by mo (If you understand, no explanation is needed. If you don't understand, no explanation is possible.)
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To: RFEngineer

Hope you people in Virginia realize the BIG mistake you made in the last presidential election and rectify it this year.


46 posted on 10/17/2012 10:54:34 AM PDT by Renegade
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To: Renegade

“Hope you people in Virginia realize the BIG mistake you made in the last presidential election and rectify it this year.”

You and me both. If Northern Virginia prefers the unsustainable status quo, and I’m sure they do, it will be a crapshoot.


47 posted on 10/17/2012 11:22:17 AM PDT by RFEngineer
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