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Prepare for Demise of California; Liberals Will Get All the Government (and Tax Hikes) They Want ^ | November 11, 2012 | Mike Shedlock

Posted on 11/11/2012 8:27:52 AM PST by Kaslin

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To: Alberta's Child
Sorry about that. "I read daily reports ..."
41 posted on 11/11/2012 9:25:16 AM PST by Alberta's Child ("I am the master of my fate ... I am the captain of my soul.")
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To: Mr Rogers
Californians fleeing California, please: Go to Texas. You can stop in Arizona long enough to get fuel and a bite to eat. If desperate, you can spend the night. Do NOT stay here for over 24 hours. We don't want you.

If you think about it, the people fleeing California are probably the people you would want to stop in your state...people from the interior, red as blood, getting out while they still can.

BTW: You're next, Arizona...have you looked at the colors of your counties after this election? You're bluer than California.

42 posted on 11/11/2012 9:25:43 AM PST by hattend (Firearms and ammunition...the only growing industries under the Obama regime.)
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To: Kaslin

Prepare to keep bailing them out over and over. Do you think Obama is going to let the poster child of Progressivism fail ? We will all fail at once. The demise will be blamed on Capitalism, like it was in 2008. The media will go right along and, well, at least we get to see the looks on the welfare crowd when they realize they’re not going to get as much stuff and they’re going to have to work for it for the good of the collective.

43 posted on 11/11/2012 9:26:01 AM PST by Bigjimslade
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To: Alberta's Child

That is smart politics. I would still take a look at the money coming out of California to Democrat causes and candidates. Plus, look at California’s Electoral College votes. You are looking at this from the viewpoint of a citizen of a state. I’m trying to look at it as a Democrat. Politics is a sham and a cover for Democrats to make money. The Democrat leaders are just grifters.

“Understand yourself and understand your opponent, and in one hundred battles, you will not be defeated.”

44 posted on 11/11/2012 9:26:23 AM PST by blueunicorn6 ("A crack shot and a good dancer")
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To: Kaslin

The Bigun”, the massive earthquake, will prove to be the trigger that results in total collapse and chaos.

45 posted on 11/11/2012 9:32:08 AM PST by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 ..... Present failure and impending death yield irrational action))
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To: who_would_fardels_bear

My take on that is that we better find a way.

Look, we have eleven states that have gone dark, the Democrats fully control them.

We either find a way to combat this, or it’s going to be 22 states in short order.

Our nation’s very survival depends on this.

Not trying to be insulting, but you’re like the employee who keeps coming back telling me he can’t get something done. I send another guy out and he finds a way to get it done.

We must find a way to get this done.

46 posted on 11/11/2012 9:33:53 AM PST by DoughtyOne (Hurricane Sandy..., a week later and 47 million Americans still didn't have power.)
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To: blueunicorn6

I’m a native Californian and I am out here visiting family now. This state has gone to hell. I can’t believe they voted in all these new taxes. It’s going to kill business! I wouldn’t blame them for moving to TX. However, I’m all for taking it back. There are plenty of hard working people still here.

47 posted on 11/11/2012 9:37:01 AM PST by The Right Stuff
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To: Vince Ferrer
They bought it, they own it.

No. That's the beauty of being a liberal. It's never your fault. They run the media and the educational system.

The history books will say that the decline of California was caused by climate change due to over commercialization of resources by greedy businessmen who raped the state and it's residents.

48 posted on 11/11/2012 9:38:25 AM PST by oldbrowser (Welcome to U.S.Zimbabwe)
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To: depressed in 06

Are you saying they will claim that, since Oregon, without a sales tax, borders California, they can postulate (deem) that a certain amount of goods were purchased by Californians in Oregon and no sales tax was paid at the time, therefore, Oregon owes California?

49 posted on 11/11/2012 9:39:37 AM PST by Anima Mundi (You can lead a brain to facts but you can't make it think.)
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To: hattend

Disagree. Anyone who has stayed in California this long is someone who is far too comfortable with big government. And no, Arizona is NOT bluer than California. West Tucson is very blue, but the rest of the state is far from being like California.

50 posted on 11/11/2012 9:40:19 AM PST by Mr Rogers (America is becoming California, and California is becoming Detroit. Detroit is already hell.)
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To: doug from upland
One of the reasons why there are still any businesses at all in California despite the high level of regulation, worker's comp, etc. is that California businesses probably pay far less on average than other businesses on property taxes.

Some fifteen years or so ago I read an article that claimed that 2/3rds of the tax benefits from Prop 13 are being accrued by businesses. It is probably even more now. This makes sense as businesses sell property less often than individuals.

However, some businesses have gotten more clever at avoiding taxes. They have come up with ways by which a property can be transferred from one company to another without it counting as a sale, thus avoiding a reassessment and property tax jump. I wouldn't doubt if 75-80% of the tax benefits from Prop 13 are now being accrued directly by businesses.

If Prop 13 went away, there is nothing that says that businesses will have to have their property taxes increased. When I was living in Colorado my property was reassessed every year. Even though my house value more than doubled over the time I owned it, my property taxes didn't. This is because I lived in a relatively conservative city. The board lowered the mill levy each year so that taxes went up at a rate far lower than my house's value.

I used to be a big supporter of Prop 13. Politicians, however, have completely undermined it. Money that is collected locally is now sent to the state. Money collected by state organizations is funneled back to cities and counties. Some people have to pay Mello-Roos fees which unlike property taxes are not deductible. Everyone has a hand in everyone else's pocket.

If Prop 13 were completely eliminated then each city could still set property taxes as it wished. Those cities that wanted to retain businesses could lower property taxes across the board or just on businesses in general, or on a case-by-case basis as is done throughout the country to attract companies.

For a long time the Democrats didn't have enough votes to increase taxes, but they had more than enough votes to pass hundreds and thousands of inane laws that increased the cost of California government without properly funding it.

I believe that the voters by-and-large were OK with this. I think that's why the Democrats never got the 2/3rds majority they needed: the voters wanted their cake without having to pay for it. Redistricting confused people and now we have enough Democrats to vote for taxing and spending. If they go too far out of line I believe that liberal voters in a few key districts will hold their noses and vote for just enough progressive "republicans" to keep the goodies flowing and the taxes from growing.

With or without Prop 13 we're going over the cliff.

If you've driven along Hwy 1 up near Monterey you know we can't have picked a more beautiful cliff to drive off of...

51 posted on 11/11/2012 9:47:48 AM PST by who_would_fardels_bear
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To: Kaslin
Voters approved Proposition 30 "temporarily" increasing the state sales tax and income tax on individuals making over $250,000.

'Temporarily' = FOREVER....

52 posted on 11/11/2012 9:54:50 AM PST by ExCTCitizen (More Republicans stayed home then the margin of victory of O's Win...)
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To: DoughtyOne
I have some decent ideas which I have shared on FreeRepublic, however, they have only gotten a little bit of traction.

For example, I believe that every conservative living in a solid blue state like California should support their local Green Party. If the Green Party becomes a truly viable party then leftist Democrats would feel more comfortable leaving their party to join the Greens. The Republicans could then retain a plurality for a bit longer.

Then conservatives could start a fourth conservative party to keep the Republicans honest without necessarily throwing the election to a weakened Democrat Party.

I also like the idea of trying to recruit Asians. I believe that Republicans won't have to cave on too many things to get Asians to join the party. Certainly far fewer caves than would be necessary to woo the Hispanic vote.

53 posted on 11/11/2012 10:00:52 AM PST by who_would_fardels_bear
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To: Kaslin

Hey Jim;
if you haven’t already got a plan ready to go, get one soon to move the FR operations out of Calif.

You better get while the getting is good.

54 posted on 11/11/2012 10:04:05 AM PST by CapnJack
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To: Kaslin
The problem is not that Kalifornia is already headed to become a shithole (it's already there, financially and socially), it's that the Fed's will take EVERYONES' earnings nationwide, to bail them out. Their Unions and Illegals are sucking the cash out of everyone there, producing NOTHING, and Amerika is following their lead.

Watch the same thing sweep the country as the Socialist Utopia is pursued to the ultimate end.

55 posted on 11/11/2012 10:08:50 AM PST by traditional1 (Don't gotsta worry 'bout no mo'gage, don't gotsta worry 'bout no gas; Obama gonna take care o' me!)
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To: Kaslin

California is a banana republic it went in the s**t hole years ago can’t be saved it’s more like Mexico.

56 posted on 11/11/2012 10:10:09 AM PST by Vaduz
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To: Vaduz

12-16 bill a year in services to,illegals and then we wonder why we have a deficit.

57 posted on 11/11/2012 10:16:10 AM PST by morphing libertarian
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To: Kaslin

First thing they will do is gut Prop 13.

They will eliminate the 1% Property Tax ceiling on businesses.

Then they will eliminate the 1% Property Tax ceiling on Rental Property. After all, that is a business too.

Finally they will get around to Homeowners and that will be that.

In order to insure that the Evil Landlords won’t up the Rent to pay for the increased Property Tax Bill, they will institute Rent Control.

Bank on it.

58 posted on 11/11/2012 10:26:57 AM PST by Kickass Conservative (Win or lose, Impeach Obama Ben Ghazi...)
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To: DoughtyOne

Nice thought. Mexicans already refer to California as Northern Mexico. They are not joking. We lost CA decades ago, now even the last red districts are becoming blue.

59 posted on 11/11/2012 10:33:01 AM PST by Conservative4Ever (I'm going Galt.)
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To: vette6387

I’m in CA too and I completely agree with you. Just let it collapse. The sooner the better. Do you live anywhere near San Bernardino? The downtown is a crumbling ghost town. Entitlements and union pensions. The rest of the state will follow.

60 posted on 11/11/2012 10:38:15 AM PST by Conservative4Ever (I'm going Galt.)
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