Skip to comments.What seceding from the U.S. will cost you
Posted on 11/17/2012 11:02:27 AM PST by SeekAndFind
Your state wants to secede from the union. What will this mean for your taxes?
I have good news and bad news. The good news is really good. But the bad news is really, really bad.
Well get to them in a moment.
Talk of secession is in the air. The White House this week confirmed that residents in all fifty states had submitted petitions asking to leave the union. Will the last one left please turn out the lights?
Residents in seven states, all in the former Confederacy, submitted more than 30,000 signatures each enough that some hapless bureaucrat or intern will now have to take a look at their petitions.
The news comes 150 years after the Civil War, and just in time for Steve Spielbergs biopic of Abraham Lincoln, the man whom we have to thank if thats the word I want for the continued forcible marriage of the once-independent states.
Its only a couple of years since Texas governor Rick Perry hoisted a rhetorical secessionist flag in response to Obamacare. In the last few years, anti-federal 10th Amendment resolutions, emphasizing the primacy of states rights versus those of the union, have passed the legislatures of 12 states in the South and West. In five states, the governors signed them, too. (The 10th Amendment to the Constitution says states rights come before those of the federal government. The last time anyone in Washington actually paid attention to it, the ink was still wet.)
But what would any of this actually mean for your taxes?
The upside is you will be liberated from the sheer living hell of the federal tax code.
I dont care where you live, and how badly run your local state government is. Nothing could be worse than this monstrosity.
(Excerpt) Read more at marketwatch.com ...
You’d see defections from red-state active duty military en masse. That plus the state National Guards that would be the cadres for a future military. But there wouldn’t be a shooting war. Would make for bad TV in this instant video age.
I know it would be awful, all these states with economies like 1945-1970.
Exactly! If secession ever happened the leaches would be the first to leave. Without them TX would be in a much better position to flourish.
I don’t have a quibble with any of your positions or reasons. Regarding SocSec etc. - get it while you can.
I don’t advocate secession as such either, but I do foresee dissolution and the demise of a corrupted, bankrupt and unpopular central government.
Many folks live in Mexico and other areas and are collecting their social security.
“1. Accept the status quo & eventual loss of all freedom;
2. Peaceful secession - mass relocations & parsing the Treasury; or
3. All out revolution with all the attendant horrors”
Number 1 is not an option.
Number 2 won’t happen. Do you really think they are going to let their source of free money just walk out?
Number 3 is not treason no more than when our founding fathers did it. One man’s treason is another man’s revolution to throw off the chains of tyranny.
It all comes down to enforcement. If those hiring illegals had to pay a sufficient penalty, the illegals would be unemployed, and they would self-deport. If the Free State of Texas had sensible laws for legal immigration that allowed guest workers to enter legally as needed, there would be even less demand for illegals. Like most who support secession, I don't object to legal immigrants, or to legal guest workers, just to criminals.
When I secede, I will not pay any taxes and the only government "service" I want is to be left alone.
Sure there will, but that's another subject entirely.
The fact is, once a portion of a country has broken away from its former political union, it becomes a sovereign nation - not under the control of that political union it has left.
The remaining portion of that political union has no authority or rights whatsoever over the new nation. Whatever treaties, payments, etcetera that need to be worked out, will be done at the bargaining table as equals.
If anyone had a problem, they went to school, principal was always available...problems worked out, none of the sensitivity training going on now was even thought of! plus, we all tried to live UP to the standards, not down so no one would get their feelings hurt.
By the way, I blame a lot of our school problems on the lack of PTAs - and that came from the people - not government.
What makes you so sure all those "armed citizens" want the same thing?
Well of course, they don't, but we both know that the vast majority of armed US citizens would resist overt oppression, attack, or subjugation by the military.
Though many libs are so solidly indoctrinated, they'd bear arms against their fellow countrymen in support of such treason, they (and that portion of the military who would obey such orders) would be far outnumbered by Americans of every stripe.
In the 70’s several ranchers wives brought the wives of their Mexican hired help to our shop. We visited while they shopped - except when she had to go read the cards to them - and according to her, they had to go to the border to pick up their workers, with proper documentation, and after the period they were hired for, return the families to the border for return to Mexico. They were also responsible for the workers and their families, while they were in the United States.
Worked pretty darned good!
The more I think my way through the concept of secession, the more I like the idea. Here’s why:
If the regime pushes the people any harder than they’re now doing, or if the coming economic hardships and regulatory insanity cause even greater levels of anger, disillusionment, and resolve amongst the people to DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT, we may actually see one or more red state legislatures finally draft Acts of Secession, which would then be signed by all legally vested parties and presented to Washington.
Should Texas lead the way to the exits, I predict that at least half a dozen other states would follow in rapid succession, joining Texas in a new American Union. This would all be done without a single drop of blood shed between the rebellious states and the federals. This is the 21st century, not the 19th. No blood will be spilled over this purely political divorce.
Once several red states have disengaged themselves from the parasitic maw of Washington, the old union states will begin to falter, as the economic engine that feeds the Socialist system in this country will be too starved to meet its obligations. More red states will flee, as the days darken. Collapse and calamity in the blue states will ensue, as generationally crippled millions feed upon each other, then storm the gates of power, demanding to be fed.
Sheer bedlam will rule, and the statist infrastructure will crumble under the weight of too little real production, and too many takers to sustain.
When the old union reaches that level of failure, expect to see passionate entreaties to the former red states to reunite with the old union in a restored constitutional republic. Leftist ideals will be cast aside and burned, as reality proves what falsehoods they always were. Imagine an entire nation ‘mugged by reality.’
It’s at this point, that I see the re-unification of the country.
No, you're just doomed because you've already decided it.
I think you have accurately described the future.
It will effectively be a restoration of the 10th Amendment, provided that the new association of seceded states is a treaty organization of independent sovereign states. If the Free States try to merge into a new centralized federal Nation-State, it will lead to a repeat of the same corruption we have now.
Ummm, which side would have the aircraft, tanks, artillery, etc. etc.? Which side is a trained military? I'd bet on the federal troops if it came to that.
If the odds favor the federals so well, explain to me why they haven't already declared martial law and come for our guns?
You assume that most federal troops would obey the treasonous order to occupy their own country, and subjugate their fellow Americans by brute force.
Sorry to burst your bubble, but it wouldn't go down that way at all. An order like that would cause a meltdown of the military. Any traitor who obeyed such evil would likely be shot dead by loyal American troops. The good guys would lose some too, but not many, in comparison to the turncoats.
And you can bet that those troops who remained loyal to the Constitution, would have millions of armed American citizens ready to back them up at a moment's notice.
War game it out in your head, using some simple logic and reasoning. It wouldn't even be a contest, which is why it's never been (and never will be) tried.