Skip to comments.Dave Grossman: First-Person Shooter Videogames Should be Banned
Posted on 01/04/2013 5:43:51 PM PST by Katechon
click here to read article
What about the FACT that millions of people play them daily and do not kill anyone?
You DO realize FR has a sizable gamer contingent do you not?
Are we all killers in training waiting to snap?
Yes or no because you cannot have it both ways.
Comment on Grossman from an online forum:
Again, I salute you all for your extensive knowledge. This has been a big help for me. Not to nitpick, but in Grossman’s introduction he suggested a reliance in his approach to Freud and then even mentioned Alfred Kinsey both of whom to a greater or lesser degree, have been discredited. He relied a great deal on Freud throughout the book. In addition he aruges that we have been a sexually repressed society which leads to the problems associated and described in his book. I thought his argument when have been tighter if he had left out Freud, Kinsely, and discussions on sexual repression (something I don’t think any era has successfully suppressed). And, of course, he relies heavily on Marshall which, if discredited, all of the above would call into question his work. As an aside, a gun-rights activist gave me the book because Grossman teaches some sort of self defense seminar, but, in the conclusions to Grossman’s book, he makes a pitch for what could be described as gun-control through disarmament. I thought that was strange unless I misread it.
This is the second complainant who seems to believe young children got hold of guns and shot each other ~ Menino is the other one, and he said he talked it over with Biden?
Not that there was some sort of conspiracy afoot or that Lanza didn't do the shooting, but was he supposed to be the shooter, or was he supposed to give the kids several firearms and turn them loose on each other?
I understand the value problems, the denying of Our Lord Jesus Christ, the hatred against the Chosen People, the invasion of islam, the pervasion of socialism.
Nonetheless, Grossman’s point might still stand, and be quite important.
It is not mutually exclusive.
What is Ann Barnhardt saying should be the first step to resistance: TURNING OFF THE TV.
Grossman says: don’t let your kids play those games — if it’s not for training, accompanied by DISCIPLINE. Of course, those games could be awesome for the training of the warriors of the coming Civil War Deux againt the tyrannical oligarchy!!
I’ve experienced, first-hand, the combat conditioning that LTC Grossman refers to. However, I take issue with his extrapolation to FPS games. I made a series of very conscious decisions to get myself into the position where I finally used that “autopilot”. Once the shooting started, yes, the conditioning was there, and I was very aware of it later. It’s entirely possible he’s right regarding the conditioning effect from the FPS games, but the series of decisions that place these psychos in that very situation still have to be made. It was obvious that the Newtown shooting was planned. Aurora, CO, was planned. Columbine was planned. Most (all?) of these mass shootings are planned. Conditioning only kicks in when the lead starts flying, in my experience. Does the conditioning lead to higher body counts than would normally occur? I doubt it, but I’m sure LTC Grossman doesn’t know either.
I also like video games, even FPS. I see it just as a game,
which I enjoy.
Biographers sought to explain McCarty's [Bonney's] subsequent descent into lawlessness by focusing on his habit of reading dime novels that romanticized crime.
And we all know dime novels are the predecessor all of FPS games, and should have been burned on the courthouse steps.
I was raised on Doom and Quake and I turned out fine.
There is no such native resistance. It's all cultural conditioning coupled with deterrence created by state-imposed punishments. Animals have been killing other animals over resources and for recreation since before they emerged from the primordial soup.
Most of the Roman fighting was not made by individual fighters on their own, was it? indivudals were mostly integrated into mechanisms.
This stats Grossman is referring here is about riflemen, acting on their own.
Grossman clearly says, that a shooting machine operated by more than 1 individual WILL AIM FOR THE KILL AND PULL THE TRIGGER.
Not the individual on his own, the lone rifleman.
Perhaps it would be more effective to Ban Mass Murderers?
We've got this little thing called a Constitution.
In it, the Founders recognized that God Almighty Himself had given men certain rights that even governments couldn't ban.
One of those is freedom of speech and press, which today, includes video games.
The next, funny enough, is to own and bear firearms, to keep us free.
So, take your crap and shove off.
I’m for banning people at this point.
Especially the really stupid ones...which is almost all of them.
First person shooters never did anything to anyone.
One thing I am learning through all of this is that people are demonstrating with great clarity what their greatest weakness and fear is.
Expect more attacks in the future and expect them to be better planned.
One thing people are not demostrating at all is what their strengths are.
Mankinds only defense in nature was his intelligence, and he obviously no longer has that defense.
False. Not with their own species. They are being gentle with each others in their mating and territorial rituals, competitions.
You are a troll. That comment proved it.
I understand what you are saying, sir. And I fully agree.
However, Grossman ain’t talking about you as an individual. but about a trans-individual phenomenon. He says those FPS games should be deactivated because they act as very strong force in our society — by producing POTENTIAL killers.
It’s (para)military training without the discipline, the context, the organization.
Can you act on the future?
You don't get out into the wild much, do you, banner?
Obviously even the Romans suffered casualties, and the phalanx formation had limits. When it broke down everybody was on the front, and they did sword chopping to who tied it then!
I don't think only 15% of the guys in a phalanx were burdened with all the combat!
Well then, his argument fails on multiple levels.
First, these sorts of shootings are extremely rare, so even if they have increased in frequency, they are not being driven by video games, because we haven't seen an increase anywhere near proportionate to the vast increase in video game popularity.
Second, millions of young men have gone through the same "operant conditioning" as one supposedly gets in a video game when Uncle Sam taught them to be soldiers and Marines, plus many of them play First Person Shooters, yet they don't go on murder sprees.
Third, a large number of mass shootings are carried out by adults who are well past the "juvenile" age.
Fourth, the description of these games as "mass murder simulators" is sort of like saying that Battleship or Axis & Allies is a mass murder simulator. Most FPS games deal with war, and in "mass murder" shootings, nobody is shooting back. It's difficult to trust the conclusions of someone who can't even describe the medium as it actually is.
Fifth, even if we say the argument is that the games are not making the murders any more likely but simply make the murderer more effective, that's a theory, not a conclusion supported by evidence, and certainly not a reason to ban a product when millions of people will use it and never harm another human being.
It's time for us to stop blaming the actions of occult freaks and mentally ill people on people and products that had nothing to do with the crime. It's morally repugnant, and is just the 21st Century version of the whole "Dungeons & Dragons causes suicide" stupidity.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.