Mistrust of Government Is a Beautiful Thing

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvaZwPPd7m0 ^ | June 10, 2011 | Penn Jillette

[grundle]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvaZwPPd7m0

[SWAMPSNIPER]

“Government is not reason; it is not eloquent; it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master”.
George Washington

[Zeneta]

As a Conservative, as an American Patriot, we need to stop preaching to the choir, and exploit the fundamental insecurities of Libertarians and, sorry to say, the Anarchists.

[bicyclerepair]

He’s dead to me.

[Orangedog]

As a Conservative,as an American Patriot,we need to stop preaching to the choir,and exploit the fundamental insecurities of Libertarians...

Funny...we've been saying the same thing about you guys, too! :)

[Zeneta]

You guys ?

[OneWingedShark]

Penn or Washington?

[TiaS]

Well Said. I don’t have the exact quote in front of me, but I do recall that George Washington also warned us against getting involved in foreign entanglements. It seems, that during my lifetime, we have focused on doing just the opposite.

[Zeneta]

Welcome

My son

Welcome to the Machine.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=foCzlvXKWTA

Welcome my son, welcome to the machine.
Where have you been? It’s alright we know where you’ve been.
You’ve been in the pipeline, filling in time,
provided with toys and Scouting for Boys.
You bought a guitar to punish your ma,
And you didn’t like school, and you know you’re nobody’s fool,
So welcome to the machine.
Welcome my son, welcome to the machine.
What did you dream? It’s alright we told you what to dream.
You dreamed of a big star, he played a mean guitar,
He always ate in the Steak Bar. He loved to drive in his Jaguar.
So welcome to the machine.

[SWAMPSNIPER]

That was in his farewell address.

[adorno]

Libertarians lack compassion? I'm not a libertarian, but I find such a statement to be highly foolish, when it implies that, it's the function of government to enact compassion through policies.

Compassion is not what government should be tasked to perform, and that function belongs with people, who are the exact opposite of government, and government's main job is to insure the security of the people against outside forces, and to insure that, the people are protected from within, with justice systems and court systems.

One of the biggest problems with government is that, it's become too big while trying to be compassionate. That compassion has the country on the verge of ruin, and also have way too many people that have become dependent on that "compassion". Compassion has been converted into the myriad of social policies and programs which have virtually destroyed what was already the most compassionate country ever conceived. People wanted what the U.S. had to offer, and what it had to offer did not include social programs, which have converted a large portion of the citizenry into the "dependent society". Compassion is okay, when it's not mandated by government.

[Zeneta]

I’m sorry, but what I think you are describing, when it comes to compassion, is the neo-liberals definition of democracy.

Democracy, to them, means the balancing of power and more importantly, results. After all, what’s more democratic than everyone being equal?

This, of course, is a perversion of our Republic.

Political power will be voted on.

The mass of the body will move toward the least resistance.

The vote will come down on “WHO” do you trust.

If libertarians are honest, the should reject Gov’t, but I don’t think they give these things much thought.

We, as conservatives, would be better off aligning ourselves with anarchists.

[adorno]

How the heck did you arrive at the conclusion that, my comments are anywhere close to the democrats’ definition of democracy?

And then, you end your comments with conservatives needing to align ourselves with anarchists?

Anarchy is nowhere close to what conservatives believe.

And, what the heck is a “neo-liberal”? There is no such thing when it comes to anybody aligned with democrats/liberals/progressives/communists/socialists. They all work towards he same goals, and a liberal by any other name is just as dangerous, “neo” or not.

[Zeneta]

Awesome !!

Got someones attention.

Last thing first.

A Neo-Liberal is someone that has redefined the concepts of freedom/liberty and fundamentally accepts the higher power to be man. This of course is an elitist position.

It’s not your comments, but an effort to understand how the opposition views the world.

The Neo-Liberal is one that sees democracy as the equalization of outcomes, as opposed to the process.

The language has changed.

I got what you where saying, and I meant no disrespect. However the issue you raise has no meaning with those that have a completely different concept of what is Liberty.

As far as anarchy:

I can’t imagine an anarchist that supports any Gov’t control or influence.

That’s all.

Our republic is basically “anarchy with guard rails”. As it should be.

The guard rails are virtue, peer pressure if you will.

Please, understand that the nature of the debate has changed with a generational indoctrination of truth.

When we talk to the liberals of today, it’s as if we live in two separate worlds. Why is that?

There is and has been an expectation that when folks do what is inherent in human nature, they will find truth as a matter of logical conclusion.

And when they have come to base all of what they know on either random events or determinism, all individualism is lost.

See, it’s the definitions of concepts that have created this dichotomy. We are not speaking the same language.

[adorno]

Awesome !!

Got someones attention.

So, basically, your previous post was meant as bait, in order to gain an audience, so you could expand on your remarks?

BTW, most of your remarks are confusing. When trying to make a point, it's best to be short and to the point.

Most of the wording in your comments, could've been avoided. Leave that kind of stuff for your first novel.

[Zeneta]

Well, I just saw my bobber bob.

Confusing?

What’s confusing to me is that some folks refuse to accept the fact that we are dealing with people that live in alternate realities.

We are dealing with people whose worldview is based on things that are untenable upon any logical examination.

My point.

My point is in order to effect any meaningful change you must first understand where they are coming from and undermine any and all confidence they seem to possess.

It starts with knowing the basis of their worldviews.

They see and define concepts like democracy completely different than you and I.

[Zeneta]

Just to be clear.

The Neo-liberals definition of “Democracy” is exactly what you describe as their “compassion”.

The Neo-Liberal is someone that has perverted the concepts of freedom. Freedom not from Gov’t, but freedom “OF” Gov’t.

Gov’t FOR the PEOPLE.

They have turned the constitution on its head, and in the process found a boat load of willing serfs.

There is no faith in man other than to control other men.

The single most defining line in our exceptionalism is that our rights, are not bestowed on us by man, but that we are endowed by our Creator.

This is what is at stake.

[adorno]

They see and define concepts like democracy completely different than you and I.

I'll make my comments, brief and to the point.

You are preaching to the choir here.

The people you need to reach, don't read FR, and they don't want to read FR, and wont even bother to read anything you or I might want to them to read, in order to inform them. Most of the people, don't care about getting informed, and, with how the country has turned in the last 4 years, all hey care about is voting for he people who will give them the most "free" stuff from government.

I keep trying to make the same point here and elsewhere, where, if we stay on our own "island", we wont be able to reach those who need to get informed and need to make the changes needed in order to "right" the country.