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Judge Napolitano: NSA Leaker Andrew Snowden "An American Hero" (Video at URL
Real Clear Politics ^ | 6/10/2013 | Ian Schwartz

Posted on 06/10/2013 4:36:24 PM PDT by Laissez-faire capitalist

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To: Uncle Miltie

It is odd how this very forum has had an abundance of posters over the last several years that have expressed the sentiment that only people of conscience on the “inside” could alert Americans to the abuses of the bam admin, and finally blow the lid off the dirty secrets and police state tactics used on their political adversaries, and when one finally does, he’s raked over the coals like Benedict Arnold.


51 posted on 06/10/2013 5:17:59 PM PDT by SpaceBar
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To: kitkat
You are very welcome.
52 posted on 06/10/2013 5:21:00 PM PDT by gov_bean_ counter (Romans 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,)
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To: Uncle Miltie
These Red Arm Bands relate to Red State options ~ remember, there's a war of wards going on parallel to the war of civilizations and armaments. I fully intend to co-opt ALL the words before we get to the stage where people who need killing get kilt.

Best way to disarm the enemy's lines of communication is to steal his language!

Leftwingtards beware ~ you are losing your tongues.

53 posted on 06/10/2013 5:21:55 PM PDT by muawiyah (Git yer Red Arm Bands here - $29.95 - NOT SOLD IN STORES - TAX FREE)
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To: Laissez-faire capitalist

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yB3n9fu-rM

Absolutely watch Snowden’s interview. It is a powerful 12 and a half minutes.


54 posted on 06/10/2013 5:22:12 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (Gone rogue, gone Galt, gone international, gone independent. Gone.)
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To: SpaceBar

It’s spooky how many crypto totalitarians there are here. Topics like this flush them into the open.

Tossing The Bill of Rights overboard is a big deal.


55 posted on 06/10/2013 5:22:36 PM PDT by Uncle Miltie (TSARNAEVs escaped PRISM. Can you?)
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To: Chaguito
Bolton is soft on gays and he talks about issues Conservatives don't think of as legitimate topics of discussion ~ but that's because he has to work with these pukes.

I think he needs to FILTER the cr*p out ~ he'd be more popular.

56 posted on 06/10/2013 5:23:30 PM PDT by muawiyah (Git yer Red Arm Bands here - $29.95 - NOT SOLD IN STORES - TAX FREE)
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To: rlmorel

“I view him the same way I view an enemy traitor in a time of war who provides my side with information. The traitor may have all kinds of reasons for his actions (I felt I wasn’t getting the appropriate recognition or promotion, I didn’t agree with the direction of the war, etc) but he still supports the basic beliefs of the side he betrays.”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5yB3n9fu-rM

After watching him, I find him to be authentic, committed to the rights of US citizens not to be infringed and a person of immense courage and authenticity. That is enough.

His sacrifice for the American people is immense and valuable.


57 posted on 06/10/2013 5:24:28 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (Gone rogue, gone Galt, gone international, gone independent. Gone.)
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To: SpaceBar

You err in imagining a Ron Paul donor can tell the truth. Very little that this guy said is believable at this point ~


58 posted on 06/10/2013 5:24:36 PM PDT by muawiyah (Git yer Red Arm Bands here - $29.95 - NOT SOLD IN STORES - TAX FREE)
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To: shalom aleichem

All I need to know to decide what side I’m on is to read who’s against Snowden.

Obama, Feinstein, most of the democrats: against the leaker... They believe he’s a traitor, an awful human, deserves to be extradited etc etc etc.

Don’t need to know anything else.

Way to be BRAVE Snowden — against the most devisive and dangerous administration this country has ever faced (and I firmly believe the Clintons still run it, with the Obamites mere soldiers to the Clinton machine).

Snowden refused to follow patently illegal orders from the Cabal.


59 posted on 06/10/2013 5:26:08 PM PDT by Husker8877
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
He didn't condemn ObamaKKKare and ran off to Big China.

Get real ~ this Snowden guy isn't on our side.

60 posted on 06/10/2013 5:26:11 PM PDT by muawiyah (Git yer Red Arm Bands here - $29.95 - NOT SOLD IN STORES - TAX FREE)
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To: wideawake

Yes. Here is an analogy:

This guy Snowden in 1912 would have gone all out to expose the White Star Line for negligence in designing the Titanic without having enough lifeboats to save the entirety of the passengers and the crew.

But in his non-lifeboat criticizing life, he would have been battling the ability of the shipwrights to construct ships that could withstand damage, openly undermining the readiness of any iceberg warning system, interfering with attempts to standardize and govern shipboard radio traffic and communication, and so on.

But he would have been right there for the lifeboat issue.


61 posted on 06/10/2013 5:26:36 PM PDT by rlmorel (Silence: The New Hate Speech)
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To: Gene Eric

Take the creep’s info and then throw him under the bus.


62 posted on 06/10/2013 5:27:12 PM PDT by miss marmelstein ( Richard Lives Yet!)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

I will disagree with you. I am glad he did what he did, but his kind will get no respect from me. As I said, even a blind squirrel can find a nut.


63 posted on 06/10/2013 5:28:56 PM PDT by rlmorel (Silence: The New Hate Speech)
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To: miss marmelstein

Yep. Leftists are no friends of this country.


64 posted on 06/10/2013 5:30:50 PM PDT by rlmorel (Silence: The New Hate Speech)
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To: Laissez-faire capitalist; All

65 posted on 06/10/2013 5:31:41 PM PDT by LyinLibs (If victims of islam were more "islamophobic," maybe they'd still be alive.)
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To: rlmorel

And being right about lifeboats when nobody else points that out makes you RIGHT, at that critical moment. Maybe never before, and never again. But liberty lovers owe this dude thanks for this one bit.


66 posted on 06/10/2013 5:33:09 PM PDT by Uncle Miltie (TSARNAEVs escaped PRISM. Can you?)
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To: muawiyah

If by your side, you mean the Constitution, I believe he is on the side of the Constitution.

This is bigger than Obamacare. He is in Hong Kong.

I admire his personal courage. He is making an immense sacrifice. I’m not only real, I’m appreciative.


67 posted on 06/10/2013 5:34:08 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (Gone rogue, gone Galt, gone international, gone independent. Gone.)
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To: Laissez-faire capitalist
"Anyone responsible for leaking classified information should be punished to the fullest extent of the law,"
- Republican Mike Rogers, chairman of the House of Representatives Intelligence Committee.

apparently this fella doesn't agree with the Judge

68 posted on 06/10/2013 5:34:49 PM PDT by LibFreeUSA
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To: rlmorel

We can disagree. I’m fine with that.

I’m also thankful for his courage in this front against tyranny. I can respect his courage and choice while disagreeing with his political views... just like I do with yours.


69 posted on 06/10/2013 5:35:18 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (Gone rogue, gone Galt, gone international, gone independent. Gone.)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

He does not trust the Constitution nor this country nor Americans. That’s why he’s in Big China ~ of which Hong Kong has been an integral part since 1997 ~ see: http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/july/1/newsid_2656000/2656973.stm ~


70 posted on 06/10/2013 5:37:31 PM PDT by muawiyah (Git yer Red Arm Bands here - $29.95 - NOT SOLD IN STORES - TAX FREE)
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To: Uncle Miltie

If he hadn’t been so hell-bent on destroying the ability to avoid icebergs, withstanding damage when hitting one and being able to call for help, then the lifeboats wouldn’t have been needed.

But, hey...it is just an analogy. An enemy may betray his cause, and the people he fights against may benefit, but that doesn’t buy respect.


71 posted on 06/10/2013 5:37:38 PM PDT by rlmorel (Silence: The New Hate Speech)
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To: Laissez-faire capitalist

I lived in the DC/Baltimore are for 10 years and worked among many high-tech government employees. The joke I heard about 25 years ago goes like this:

Q: How do tell if a NSA employee is an extrovert?

A: They look at your shoes, not theirs.

Seriously, the SigInt people run a meritocracy in the technical ranks. The fact he does not have a traditional college degree ADDS to his credibility. I knew of several “savants” who had Asperger’s or autism and had wonderful careers in the IC.


72 posted on 06/10/2013 5:37:58 PM PDT by Andy from Chapel Hill
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To: RB156

He exposed nothing. Plus there are ways to expose wrong doing than to do it the Daniel Elsberg way. He had several avenues to be a hero. He chose to go over seas. He’s not a hero in my book. And BTW I’d like nothing more than to see this phony bas*ard in WH exposed for what he is. We are seeing the rapid demise of this country right before our eyes.


73 posted on 06/10/2013 5:38:19 PM PDT by nikos1121
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To: Andy from Chapel Hill

They dumped him and he went to Booze Allen ~ like to know how that happened ~ could tell us why he turned ~ most likely for reasons similar to that of former FBI agent Robert Philip Hanssen


74 posted on 06/10/2013 5:42:08 PM PDT by muawiyah (Git yer Red Arm Bands here - $29.95 - NOT SOLD IN STORES - TAX FREE)
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To: Laissez-faire capitalist

When someone tries to stop unlawful behavior, especially if it’s being done by the highest office, he is doing what he should do. He has more guts than congress. He sees the destruction in action and knows it’s wrong. Congress has had every chance to stop this mess and they have not. I don’t know what happens to them when they get to Washington, but I have given up on congress having the guts to do anything. Scared of the media and by now, do not know what illegal is.
I hope the guy is ok... for he has risked life and limb to expose this crap.


75 posted on 06/10/2013 5:42:40 PM PDT by frnewsjunkie
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To: nikos1121

The Paulistas want us to worship Snowden as proof of our antipathy to Obamugabe. Actually, neither one of these guys should have been given a position of trust.


76 posted on 06/10/2013 5:43:26 PM PDT by muawiyah (Git yer Red Arm Bands here - $29.95 - NOT SOLD IN STORES - TAX FREE)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

I believe that we may be seeing a ‘transformational’ moment in history here. No, not the type that Obama wanted.

No, this moment now, as a result of the IRS, NSA disclosures is when the old meaning of “Left” vs. “Right” will no longer be meaningful to describe the new battle lines.

From this moment forward we will have a new more pressing re-alignment of battle lines between...

1. STATISTS - those who support giving up their right to privacy, freedom of expression, and constitutional liberties in support of a STATIST DICTATORSHIP BY THE RULING CLASS (lawmakers and bureaucrats)

vs

2. PATRIOTS - those who their right to privacy, freedom of expression, and constitutional liberties in support of a government (lawmakers and bureaucrats) that is held accountable to it’s citizens.


77 posted on 06/10/2013 5:44:12 PM PDT by LibFreeUSA
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To: rickmichaels

ok


78 posted on 06/10/2013 5:44:13 PM PDT by savedbygrace (But God.)
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To: muawiyah

Did you even watch the 12.5 minute video interview with Snowden?

Hong Kong is a great place to live, has tremendous freedom of expression and a high standard of living, is one of two leading financial capitals in the world, has an uncensored internet, amazing infrastructure and is currently reviewing it’s extradition policies and has put all cases on hold until decisions are made. It is also a worldwide hub for travel.

I wish him well.

It’s great to have an opinion, but yours seems particularly uninformed on this issue.


79 posted on 06/10/2013 5:44:55 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (Gone rogue, gone Galt, gone international, gone independent. Gone.)
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To: LibFreeUSA

Thank you for your post. I agree wholeheartedly.


80 posted on 06/10/2013 5:46:08 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (Gone rogue, gone Galt, gone international, gone independent. Gone.)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion
Hong Kong is a piece of Big China and in the near future it could be turned into a bloodbath at the whim of a leading faction in the politboro.

Seriously, don't try to fool people with that tale.

81 posted on 06/10/2013 5:46:49 PM PDT by muawiyah (Git yer Red Arm Bands here - $29.95 - NOT SOLD IN STORES - TAX FREE)
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To: Christie at the beach
The people on Fox (The Five) really proves their loyalty to the government. Very alarming to hear most of the panel except Beckel think the leaker was being so bad to defame their precious government.

I'm glad somebody else noticed. I heard a lot of fallacious arguments on that show today.

82 posted on 06/10/2013 5:47:36 PM PDT by jiggyboy (Ten percent of poll respondents are either lying or insane)
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To: muawiyah

Muawiyah, I think you might be interested in this demonstration of the power of metadata. I didn’t want to start a thread, but your kind of thinking made me think of you as I read this:

http://kieranhealy.org//blog/archives/2013/06/09/using-metadata-to-find-paul-revere/


83 posted on 06/10/2013 5:49:11 PM PDT by Chaguito
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To: Husker8877

amen brother


84 posted on 06/10/2013 5:49:16 PM PDT by shalom aleichem
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

It is a funny day to see FREEPERS agreeing with Janet Reno and not John Bolton. Oh well that is America!


85 posted on 06/10/2013 5:50:18 PM PDT by napscoordinator (Santorum-Bachmann 2016 for the future of the Country!)
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To: nikos1121

So you support the feds breaking the law to spy on Americans? Using laws they claim to “protect us” when in fact the Boston Bombers were never caught using this technology.

It’s about CONTROL, not about keeping you safe.

Please get a clue.


86 posted on 06/10/2013 5:54:11 PM PDT by Red in Blue PA (When Injustice becomes Law, Resistance Becomes Duty.-Thomas Jefferson)
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To: muawiyah

I doubt you have even been to Hong Kong recently. It sounds as if you are 20 years behind the times. Freedom in Hong Kong serves the financial interests of China. There are street protests that are unregulated. Internet is unfiltered.

Communism has its days numbered in the mainland. Christianity is growing like wildfire - over 130 million and spreading.

In any case, my job isn’t to teach you. I can open doors for you to inform yourself, but you have to walk through them. Or not, as you wish. Better yet, hop on a plane and experience what is occurring yourself. I won’t have to say a word.

Still, I wish you blessings.


87 posted on 06/10/2013 5:55:47 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (Gone rogue, gone Galt, gone international, gone independent. Gone.)
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To: nikos1121
He exposed nothing.

BS.

The Patriot Act was NEVER meant to gather up all domestic information. In fact, that was specifically precluded unless one was in contact with Al Qaeda. The feds were breaking the law.
88 posted on 06/10/2013 5:57:13 PM PDT by Red in Blue PA (When Injustice becomes Law, Resistance Becomes Duty.-Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Red in Blue PA; All

from c-span (From June 9, 2013),
“Chicago Tribune Printers Row Lit Fest”

Fighting For The Press: The Inside Story Of The Pentagon Papers And Other Battles! James Goodale

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kCqS8gx2Z4c

Daniel Ellsberg “I Think They Have Everything And That Is The Recipe For A TYRANNY In This Country!”

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n7wXVWjVfSY

From zerohedge- open the link “Ellsberg opinion in today’s Guardian”

Pentagon Papers’ Ellsberg Says Snowden Saves Us From The ‘United Stasi Of America’

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-06-10/pentagon-papers-ellsberg-says-snowden-saves-us-united-stasi-america

It is perhaps too early to judge the impact of Edward Snowden’s confirmation of conspiracy fact, but in Pentagon Papers’ Daniel Ellsberg opinion in today’s Guardian, there has not been a more important leak in American history.


89 posted on 06/10/2013 5:57:41 PM PDT by Whenifhow
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To: aMorePerfectUnion

Sure ~ eliminate the Chicom cadre that oversees Hong Kong first.


90 posted on 06/10/2013 5:58:49 PM PDT by muawiyah (Git yer Red Arm Bands here - $29.95 - NOT SOLD IN STORES - TAX FREE)
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To: aMorePerfectUnion; muawiyah
"Hong Kong is a great place to live, has tremendous freedom of expression and a high standard of living, is one of two leading financial capitals in the world, has an uncensored internet, amazing infrastructure and is currently reviewing it’s extradition policies and has put all cases on hold until decisions are made. It is also a worldwide hub for travel."

I agree with you on the description, but you also forgot its very expensive. I've read muawiyah's posts long enough that muawiyah has a story and sticks to it, counter points be da**ed.

91 posted on 06/10/2013 5:59:35 PM PDT by Tench_Coxe
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To: Christie at the beach
The people on Fox (The Five) really proves their loyalty to the government. Very alarming to hear most of the panel except Beckel think the leaker was being so bad to defame their precious government.. The law was not intended for snooping on all of the citizens.

I had to turn that show off today for the first time ever.

Guilfoyle is an idiot who would have fit right in Nazi Germany. Tow that line.....even if it is criminal, illegal, and immoral.
92 posted on 06/10/2013 5:59:40 PM PDT by Red in Blue PA (When Injustice becomes Law, Resistance Becomes Duty.-Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Red in Blue PA

And shame on Fox News for misrepresenting the current state of the program.


93 posted on 06/10/2013 6:00:25 PM PDT by gov_bean_ counter (Romans 1:22 Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,)
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To: LibFreeUSA

Well, sure.

But how do you handle that wonderful compartmentalization when someone who ostensibly falls into category #2 because they do a single thing that supports that category, but also simultaneously:

1.) Supports someone who despises capitalism and property rights and is doing all they can to destroy them

2.) Supports someone who believes in the government as the source of largesse for redistribution of wealth

3.) Supports someone who believes the right to keep and bear arms is archaic and should be taken away

4.) Supports someone who believes unions are wonderful and should have the weight of the government thrown behind them

5.) Supports someone who believes that industry is evil and should be crushed in favor of governmental programs?

Because even though this guy was a Ron Paul supporter (odious enough in my eyes, as anyone who garners the support of the putrid Code Pinkos is fatally flawed) in his exact words he said: “...I believed in Obama’s promises...”

Just how do we have a nice, neat categorization for that? I think the basic premise of the redefinition as you describe it is flawed. I think it is a good try at a transformational explanation (or prediction) but I don’t think it works.


94 posted on 06/10/2013 6:01:23 PM PDT by rlmorel (Silence: The New Hate Speech)
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To: Tench_Coxe

“I agree with you on the description, but you also forgot its very expensive. I’ve read muawiyah’s posts long enough that muawiyah has a story and sticks to it, counter points be da**ed.”

Yes very expensive. They are not making any more land, and little housing, etc., and high density.

I’ve come to dislike knee-jerk conservatives as much as knee-jerk liberals. Neither is reasonable. Neither reasons.


95 posted on 06/10/2013 6:01:29 PM PDT by aMorePerfectUnion (Gone rogue, gone Galt, gone international, gone independent. Gone.)
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To: SpaceBar

I agree completely. I also find it somewhat odd that some of the Constitutional Conservatives here keep throwing around the words Treason and Traitor, apparently without knowing what these word mean as defined IN THE CONSTITUTION.


96 posted on 06/10/2013 6:02:11 PM PDT by Hugh the Scot
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To: DoughtyOne

Bolton is wrong on this one.

The government should not be collecting my numbers, emails, phone calls, surfing, and their contents.

But they are. There is no justification for it. I have done nothing wrong.

The only possible explanation is that they are keeping records against people for the day when any particular person might be a threat.


97 posted on 06/10/2013 6:02:43 PM PDT by xzins (Retired Army Chaplain and Proud of It! True supporters of our troops pray for their victory!)
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To: muawiyah

Your acid statements come off making you appear to be a snot-nosed fool.

I side with the man who told me my government has betrayed us all. If you are willing to trade a portion of liberty in exchange for so-called security you deserve neither. Go butt heads with Ben Franklin.


98 posted on 06/10/2013 6:03:54 PM PDT by steerpike100
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To: LibFreeUSA

I do think that this type of situation does provide fodder for the “redefinition”, and the number of posts here and elsewhere are proof of that.

I simply don’t think that redefinition can take place in this context, and the way you cleave the two.

I am sincere when I say “nice try” though, because it is thought provoking.


99 posted on 06/10/2013 6:04:13 PM PDT by rlmorel (Silence: The New Hate Speech)
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To: nikos1121

As a group, we aren’t absolutists like the leftists are. There’s room and time for “spirited” but collegial debate. Recall any number of discussions re Supreme Court nominee Harriet Miers, the per-house fire company fee, legalizing marijuana, and beat-cop excesses, just to name a few that come to mind immediately.


100 posted on 06/10/2013 6:05:31 PM PDT by jiggyboy (Ten percent of poll respondents are either lying or insane)
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