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Urban Sprawl Is Literally Stranding the Poor (Paul Krugman)
Newser ^ | 07/28/2013 | Kevin Spak

Posted on 07/29/2013 11:51:33 AM PDT by Responsibility2nd

(Newser) – Detroit spent the last decade spiraling into bankruptcy, while Atlanta spent it growing like mad. But the two cities have something in common: "Both are places where the American dream seems to be dying," writes Paul Krugman at the New York Times. Social mobility is low in both cities—meaning the poor are staying poor. Why? Well, a new study suggests that it might be because they're just too spread out. "Sprawl may be killing Horatio Alger."

The study found that social mobility was correlated with how far apart various classes lived from each other. "In Atlanta, poor and rich neighborhoods are far apart because, basically, everything is far apart; Atlanta is the Sultan of Sprawl," Krugman writes. "Disadvantaged workers often find themselves stranded; there may be jobs available somewhere, but they literally can't get there." We need to build smarter, more compact population centers that let families get by without multiple cars. Click for Krugman's full column.

 

 


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: agenda21; atlanta; detroit; urbansprawl
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So. Urban Sprawl is to blame for Society's problems? All Righty Then.
1 posted on 07/29/2013 11:51:33 AM PDT by Responsibility2nd
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To: Responsibility2nd

If only the peasants would let us put them in 100 story ant farms so they could be more easily controlled...


2 posted on 07/29/2013 11:53:09 AM PDT by Black Agnes
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To: Responsibility2nd

Government barracks should do it - you’ll have to force the wealthy to live in them at gunpoint, but hey, it’s for the Greater Good.


3 posted on 07/29/2013 11:53:22 AM PDT by Billthedrill
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To: Responsibility2nd
Well, isn't that special.

I'm sure that Mr. Krugman will be the first to volunteer to move some of these "disadvantaged" folks right in next door to him.

4 posted on 07/29/2013 11:53:37 AM PDT by wbill
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To: Responsibility2nd

Gotta agree that Atlanta is reaallly spread out.

Hardly compares with the NYC or LA metroplexes, though.


5 posted on 07/29/2013 11:53:46 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Responsibility2nd
The purpose of Section 8 housing is to disperse the Eric Holder underclass into all the other strata of neighborhoods.

Either Section 8 is a good idea, or it's not.

You can't have it both ways Paul, even if you are schizophrenic.

6 posted on 07/29/2013 11:55:11 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Who knew that one day professional wrestling would be less fake than professional journalism?)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Central planners like to think they have all the answers, yet they always fail.


7 posted on 07/29/2013 11:55:16 AM PDT by Jim Robinson (Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God!!)
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To: Responsibility2nd

translation: There is not enough of us piled up like rats in mega-cities to support the subsidies mega-cities cannot survive without.


8 posted on 07/29/2013 11:55:29 AM PDT by Wuli (uir)
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To: Responsibility2nd

So, let’s gentrify all the cities and push the poor out into the suburbs. Retake the cities, if you can stand it.


9 posted on 07/29/2013 11:55:44 AM PDT by Eva (B Obama is to Trayvon Martin as Al Sharpton is to Tawana Brawley)
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To: Responsibility2nd; All


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10 posted on 07/29/2013 11:56:18 AM PDT by musicman (Until I see the REAL Long Form Vault BC, he's just "PRES__ENT" Obama = Without "ID")
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To: Black Agnes

That is the premise of the 1971 novel by Robert Silverberg......only the buildings were a mile high and held millions of people........

11 posted on 07/29/2013 11:57:32 AM PDT by Red Badger (Want to be surprised? Google your own name......Want to have fun? Google your friend's names........)
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To: wbill
I'm sure that Mr. Krugman will be the first to volunteer to move some of these "disadvantaged" folks right in next door to him.

I'm pretty sure some of his mansions have plenty of room to house several dozen families right under his roof.

12 posted on 07/29/2013 11:57:38 AM PDT by Cementjungle
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To: Responsibility2nd
Yeah, it's sprawl's fault. /sarcasm.

All those people that moved to the townships caused Detroit to fubar itself with bad schools, high costs, bad services, and crime everywhere.

13 posted on 07/29/2013 11:58:01 AM PDT by Darren McCarty (Abortion - legalized murder for convenience)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Poor is a CHOICE, Paul. You want to deprive them of their CHOICE, don’t you?


14 posted on 07/29/2013 11:58:11 AM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed &water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS, NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Oh, there’s plenty of American Dream just outside Atlanta. I’m living it.


15 posted on 07/29/2013 11:58:14 AM PDT by ctdonath2 (Making good people helpless doesn't make bad people harmless.)
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To: Responsibility2nd
Sorry, Mr. Krugman, it won't work. The reason people left the dense warrens of the inner city was to get away from the crime, trash, and civic disorder. Giving the criminals and drug addicts more mobility will only push them farther away. The answer is to fix the problems in the culture, not to try to make them unavoidable.
16 posted on 07/29/2013 11:58:34 AM PDT by Old North State
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To: Responsibility2nd

Krugman gets it all wrong. An executive living in wealthy Lower Merion Township in the Philly burbs has much more in common with a contemporary in Singapore, Frankfurt or Dubai than he does with minimum-wage schmoos living just five miles away from him in West Philly.


17 posted on 07/29/2013 11:58:58 AM PDT by dirtboy
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To: Old North State

bump!


18 posted on 07/29/2013 11:59:15 AM PDT by GeronL
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To: Black Agnes

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_World_Inside


19 posted on 07/29/2013 11:59:38 AM PDT by Red Badger (Want to be surprised? Google your own name......Want to have fun? Google your friend's names........)
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To: Responsibility2nd
Speaking of sprawl...


20 posted on 07/29/2013 11:59:44 AM PDT by maggief
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To: Responsibility2nd
LOL, "urban sprawl" makes it difficult for the elites to use the threat of black violence to threaten whitey.

I'm just out of reach of the ATL thugs.

21 posted on 07/29/2013 12:00:26 PM PDT by Trailerpark Badass (There should be a whole lot more going on than throwing bleach, said one woman.)
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To: Responsibility2nd

The left actually does have a plan to solve some of this. They want to build multi-modal transportation corridors that link population centers, moving people out of the dying inner cities to suburban hubs for the jobs and take them back to their homes at night. The problem is that once they get out of the slums and find a job in the suburbs, they don’t want to go back to the city, either.

By the way, these multi-modal transportation corridors are called, “Gateways.” There are all kinds of “Gateways” and they all have a connection to the Agenda 21.


22 posted on 07/29/2013 12:00:28 PM PDT by Eva (B Obama is to Trayvon Martin as Al Sharpton is to Tawana Brawley)
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To: Old North State

If they push “the poor” out to the suburbs, those who don’t want to live next to them will move elsewhere, and if that’s back in the city, they’ll do it.

Indeed, fix their anti-culture, and we can all get along.


23 posted on 07/29/2013 12:00:44 PM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter admits whom he's working for)
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To: Responsibility2nd

One wonders why manufacturing companies aren’t fighting each other for the chance to locate factories in the midst of this abundant, stranded labor pool.

</sarcasm>


24 posted on 07/29/2013 12:01:20 PM PDT by Oberon (Big Brutha Be Watchin'.)
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To: Sherman Logan

It is spread out due to the lack of topographical barriers to development.


25 posted on 07/29/2013 12:01:27 PM PDT by Trailerpark Badass (There should be a whole lot more going on than throwing bleach, said one woman.)
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To: Red Badger

I might have to put that one on my reading list.

Think about the terror targets those would represent if built today.


26 posted on 07/29/2013 12:01:36 PM PDT by Black Agnes
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To: Responsibility2nd
This might explain it better . . .

In Atlanta, African-Americans are 54 percent of the population, but are responsible for 100 percent of homicide, 95 percent of rape, 94 percent of robbery, 84 percent of aggravated assault, and 93 percent of burglary. Source: APD Uniform Crime Reports, Apr 2011 to Apr 2012

27 posted on 07/29/2013 12:01:50 PM PDT by Sgt_Schultze (A half-truth is a complete lie)
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To: Eva
So, let’s gentrify all the cities and push the poor out into the suburbs. Retake the cities, if you can stand it.

That's what happened in France.

28 posted on 07/29/2013 12:01:56 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Responsibility2nd
Social mobility is low in both cities—meaning the poor are staying poor. Why?

Because social welfare programs are keeping the poor anchored to the government teat.

Exactly where the Progressives want them.

The poor have no reason to go where the jobs are they can stay in the neighborhoods where they grew up with their friends and the government will supply everything they need.

And the government also makes sure that there is a grave price to pay for leaving the plantation. If they get a job that does not pay enough to supply all of their needs but pays just a little too much they loose all of the benefits that they are currently getting.

These people are not total idiots. They will stay where they are and keep collecting their welfare checks and keep voting Democrat.

29 posted on 07/29/2013 12:02:34 PM PDT by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: Oberon

One wonders why manufacturing companies aren’t fighting each other for the chance to locate factories in the midst of this abundant, stranded labor pool.

</sarcasm>

LOL, best comment all day!


30 posted on 07/29/2013 12:02:49 PM PDT by GraceG
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To: Responsibility2nd
Krugman writes, "We need to build smarter, more compact population centers."

LOL!
This simple assclown Krugman would have been right at home in the Soviet Union writing up the next "Five Year Plan".

31 posted on 07/29/2013 12:03:44 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: Responsibility2nd
...Paul Krugman at the New York Times. Social mobility is low in both cities—meaning the poor are staying poor. Why? Well, a new study suggests that it might be because they're just too spread out. "Sprawl may be killing Horatio Alger."

LOL - yeah, and global warming... Liberals are shameless in the ways they use blacks.

32 posted on 07/29/2013 12:04:02 PM PDT by GOPJ (Sob stories should not be running public policy...)
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To: Eva

The thing about cities is that they’re more economically efficient at the macro level. Sprawl adds transportation and distribution costs, infrastructure costs, etc. Plus the cost of converting land into residential uses, probably forever preempting it’s use for any other economic activity.


33 posted on 07/29/2013 12:04:06 PM PDT by Bubba Ho-Tep ("More weight!"--Giles Corey)
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To: MrB

Any culture that doesn’t excpect more from their children than their own generation is a degenerate culture and doomed to certain failure...

Contemporary Black Culture was killed by LBJ....


34 posted on 07/29/2013 12:06:19 PM PDT by GraceG
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To: Lancey Howard

He would have loved living in one of these luxurious apartments.

35 posted on 07/29/2013 12:06:39 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Black Agnes

Just remember that with an 100 story ‘ant farm’ it’s real easy to introduce some ‘pesticide’ to clear out those pesty ‘ants’.


36 posted on 07/29/2013 12:06:47 PM PDT by The Working Man
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To: Responsibility2nd

Paul Krugman is a genius.....ask any libtard....


37 posted on 07/29/2013 12:07:41 PM PDT by Popman
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To: E. Pluribus Unum
Either Section 8 is a good idea, or it's not.

I'll go with "Not", in this case.

Apartment complex that I lived in went Section 8. It went from a decent, college-student and blue-collar clientele, to completely unlivable in a matter of weeks. I broke my lease to get out.

38 posted on 07/29/2013 12:08:30 PM PDT by wbill
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To: Responsibility2nd

The RAT solution is forcing affordable housing into every neighborhood. There is a battle going on in Westchester, New York right now. The county executive, a Republican, is fighting HUD on the level of Section 8 housing being foisted on one of the most upscale bedroom communities in the US.


39 posted on 07/29/2013 12:09:45 PM PDT by SC_Pete
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To: The Working Man

Which is why the elites crave them so.

Just cut off the water, or food, or even air circulation.

They could easily become the Warsaw Ghetto.

And you KNOW that weapons of any kind, even largish kitchen knives, would be verboten.

(except of course for a select few and the politically protected groups like gang bangers)


40 posted on 07/29/2013 12:09:48 PM PDT by Black Agnes
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To: dfwgator

No. That scumbag Krugman would be on the other side of town in the chateaus, nose in the air with the rest of the elite political class.
Their planning is strictly for the proletariat, not for themselves.


41 posted on 07/29/2013 12:10:54 PM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: Lancey Howard

True, I’m sure he thinks he’d have his own “dacha.”


42 posted on 07/29/2013 12:11:49 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Responsibility2nd

I thought the aim of government planners was to separate residential and commercial areas.

Mission accomplished, right?

And now from the central planners comes “but we didn’t mean THAT!”


43 posted on 07/29/2013 12:12:02 PM PDT by freerepublicchat
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To: Responsibility2nd

Every single thing this guy says is stupid. I think even other lefties know that.


44 posted on 07/29/2013 12:12:08 PM PDT by ozzymandus
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To: Black Agnes

Atlanta has affluent Black suburbs that are so desirable that Whites move in and don’t mind being the minority. MLK was right about character.


45 posted on 07/29/2013 12:12:55 PM PDT by massgopguy (I owe everything to George Bailey)
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To: ozzymandus

He is ALWAYS wrong


46 posted on 07/29/2013 12:12:56 PM PDT by GeronL
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To: wbill
That was my point.

Raising Hell in Subsidized Housing

As Program Moves Poor to Suburbs, Tensions Follow

American Murder Mystery

The Unspeakable Blackness of Section 8 and Crime

47 posted on 07/29/2013 12:13:55 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Who knew that one day professional wrestling would be less fake than professional journalism?)
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To: Responsibility2nd
there may be jobs available somewhere, but they literally can't get there.

And I suppose that transit systems that have to spend 70% or more of their budget on retired union members who sit home on their arses has NOTHING to do with that, eh, Kruggy?


48 posted on 07/29/2013 12:13:56 PM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: Sgt_Schultze
In Atlanta, African-Americans are 54 percent of the population, but are responsible for 100 percent of homicide, 95 percent of rape, 94 percent of robbery, 84 percent of aggravated assault, and 93 percent of burglary. Source: APD Uniform Crime Reports, Apr 2011 to Apr 2012

It might be a tipping point phenomenon... when blacks are more than 30% of the population, white producers leave ...

49 posted on 07/29/2013 12:14:30 PM PDT by GOPJ (Sob stories should not be running public policy...)
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To: Responsibility2nd

Nope. Just covert support for Agenda 21. Populations need to be locked up in urban areas and arcologies. Even if they don’t want to be...


50 posted on 07/29/2013 12:14:48 PM PDT by Little Ray (How did I end up in this hand-basket, and why is it getting so hot?)
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