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New York paper sues county for pistol permit records
Associated Press ^ | October 04, 2013 | NA

Posted on 10/07/2013 7:28:55 AM PDT by neverdem

A suburban New York newspaper has sued Putnam County to compel it to release its pistol permit records.

The Journal News says it sued Thursday after the county denied two Freedom of Information requests and a subsequent appeal...

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Politics/Elections; US: New York
KEYWORDS: banglist; guncontrol; secondamendment
N.B. This is not concealed carry, just permits to keep.
1 posted on 10/07/2013 7:28:55 AM PDT by neverdem
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To: neverdem

I don’t need a “permit to keep.”

Perhaps we actually need a list of the names, home addresses and phone numbers of the staff of this newspaper.


2 posted on 10/07/2013 7:31:01 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks ("Say Not the Struggle Naught Availeth.")
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To: neverdem

I think the citizens should sue that newspaper for the names, addresses and telephone number of all its employees.

Start first the information about those individuals that submitted the FOIA request.


3 posted on 10/07/2013 7:31:24 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: neverdem

And just why does the newspaper need this information?


4 posted on 10/07/2013 7:31:26 AM PDT by DJ Frisat ((optional, printed after my name on post))
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To: DJ Frisat
And just why does the newspaper need this information?

Some good gubmint nitwits got laws passed that public information should be publicized regardless of subject.

5 posted on 10/07/2013 7:37:32 AM PDT by neverdem (Register pressure cookers! /s)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

http://www.newrochelletalk.com/content/map-where-are-journal-news-employees-your-neighborhood


6 posted on 10/07/2013 7:39:32 AM PDT by Doogle (USAF.68-73..8th TFW Ubon Thailand..never store a threat you should have eliminated))
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To: Gaffer

see post #6


7 posted on 10/07/2013 7:40:24 AM PDT by Doogle (USAF.68-73..8th TFW Ubon Thailand..never store a threat you should have eliminated))
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To: neverdem

Why doesn’t a gun group sue the NY DMV for the addresses of all employees of the Journal News. We’ll be careful with them, no need to worry.


8 posted on 10/07/2013 7:42:22 AM PDT by 1010RD (First, Do No Harm)
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To: neverdem

They want the info so they can advertise where it’s safe to live? Next to a gun owner. Suck to be the guy that got on the “I don’t have a gun” list. /sarc


9 posted on 10/07/2013 7:43:01 AM PDT by showme_the_Glory (ILLEGAL: prohibited by law. ALIEN: Owing political allegiance to another country or government)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
Perhaps we actually need a list of the names, home addresses and phone numbers of the staff of this newspaper.

Yep--then they could be cross-matched against the permit information to create a database of people highly unlikely to have weapons. It would be like the well-known actions of ant-2A folks who, when asked, always decline to place a "gun-free zone" poster on their home.

10 posted on 10/07/2013 7:44:59 AM PDT by Pearls Before Swine
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
The idiots that posted the CCW permit holders in Westchester and Rockland counties, The Journal News, did not like it at all when the major players at the paper had their personal information posted on the Internet. What really p.o.’ed people was over half the information was wrong.

The Journal News then compounded the problem by hiring armed guards to protect its staff (that went well) as a rival paper wrote about the blatant hypocrisy. Eventually, the paper issued a policy and retraction and the editor was discharged.

The Journal News didn't learn its lesson in 2012, so it has to be schooled again. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result. Gannett owns the Journal News.

11 posted on 10/07/2013 7:47:27 AM PDT by MasterGunner01
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To: MasterGunner01

“The Journal News didn’t learn its lesson in 2012, so it has to be schooled again. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over again expecting a different result.”

The Left never gives up, we can’t either. They fail, they wait, they try again when the timing seems right. Its a strategy that they have used to dismantle our society.


12 posted on 10/07/2013 8:09:27 AM PDT by Brooklyn Attitude (Things are only going to get worse.)
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To: MasterGunner01

This is NOT CCW. It’s just a permit to keep at home!


13 posted on 10/07/2013 8:13:38 AM PDT by neverdem (Register pressure cookers! /s)
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To: neverdem

The owners, editors, and key staff names are available.

How about somebody posting their addresses along with their opposition to 2A?!?!?!


14 posted on 10/07/2013 8:17:34 AM PDT by G Larry (Let his days be few; and let another take his office. Psalms 109:8)
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To: Eric in the Ozarks
I don’t need a “permit to keep.”

You don't live in NY. The second amendment was found null and void in NY long ago.

15 posted on 10/07/2013 8:24:03 AM PDT by from occupied ga (Your government is your most dangerous enemy)
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To: neverdem

Do you have any idea what you are talking about?

The JN is suing for CCW permit holders information. There is no “Permit to keep at home” outside of NYC.

Thankfully, our County Exec and County Clerk have told the paper to pound sand (again)


16 posted on 10/07/2013 8:34:46 AM PDT by NY.SS-Bar9 (Those that vote for a living outnumber those that work for one.)
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To: cyborg; Clemenza; Cacique; NYCVirago; The Mayor; Darksheare; hellinahandcart; Chode; ...
Biker thug caught prison break from soft judge

FReepmail me if you want on or off my New York ping list.

17 posted on 10/07/2013 8:37:44 AM PDT by neverdem (Register pressure cookers! /s)
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To: neverdem
Didn't they already do this in Rockland & Westchester counties?

Didn't turn out so well for editor Caryn McBride.

But not learning from the experience of others is a liberal trait.

18 posted on 10/07/2013 8:38:47 AM PDT by Trailerpark Badass (There should be a whole lot more going on than throwing bleach, said one woman.)
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To: neverdem
I understand that, but the same kinds of concerns apply that surfaced when the benighted morons at The Journal News “outed” CCW permit holders. (BTW, why does NY require a permit to keep a gun in your home? The only purpose for that is confiscation.)

1. It is an invasion of privacy.
2. It sets up the homeowners for burglars.
3. The Journal News has no legitimate right to this information.
4. It opens The Journal News to lawsuits if the home owner is robbed or injured or killed in a burglary attempt.
5. By targeting firearms permit holder's homes, you've also told the burglars that the neighbor's homes are ripe for the taking.

The Journal News needs to be sued into oblivion so that Gannett will close it as unprofitable.

19 posted on 10/07/2013 9:07:57 AM PDT by MasterGunner01
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To: NY.SS-Bar9
Do you have any idea what you are talking about?

Yes. I just reread the story.

The JN is suing for CCW permit holders information.

The AP story says "pistol permit records." There's no mention of CCW or concealed anything.

There is no “Permit to keep at home” outside of NYC.

The NRA disagrees.

A synopsis of New York state laws on purchase, possession and carrying of firearms.

POSSESSION—HANDGUNS

A license is needed to possess a handgun. Application is made to the licensing officer of the city or county where the applicant resides, is principally employed, or where his principal place of business as a merchant or storekeeper is located. An alien may obtain a pistol license if he or she meets these requirements.

The determination whether to grant the license is completely within the discretion of the licensing officer. However, the licensing officer must state specifically and concisely in writing the reasons for a denial. A denial can only be overturned in court if the denial is shown to be arbitrary and capricious.

Westchester County may require the applicant to successfully complete a firearms safety course and test in addition to meeting the other requirements. Other counties may also require a safety course for license issuance.

A license may be granted to an applicant who is of good moral character, who is over 21 years of age, who has not been convicted of a serious offense, who states if and when he has ever been treated for mental illness, who is not subject to a protective court order and to whom no good cause exists for the denial of the license. The age requirement shall not apply to persons honorably discharged from the military.

Persons between age 18 and 21 may possess a handgun at an indoor or outdoor pistol range located in or on premises owned or occupied by a duly incorporated organization organized for conservation purposes or to foster proficiency in small arms. A person between the ages of 18 and 21 may also possess a handgun at a target pistol shooting competition under the auspices of or approved by the NRA and while under immediate supervision of a person designated in NY Penal Law Section 265.20 (7)).

An investigation will be conducted regarding all statements required in the application. This includes taking the fingerprints and physical descriptive data of the applicant. One copy of the fingerprints will be forwarded to the FBI for a search of the applicant’s criminal records. The failure or refusal of the FBI to make the fingerprint check shall not constitute the sole basis for refusal to issue a permit.

The licensing officer may, in his discretion, add restrictions to the license, limiting the places where the handgun may be kept or carried. No demonstration of need to possess is required to obtain an “on premises only,” license valid for one’s home or place of business.

An “on premises only” license authorizes the possession of a handgun only at the location written on the license. It does not authorize the holder to take such handgun to any other place. (It should be noted further that an “on premises only” license technically does not authorize the holder even to transport the handgun from its place of purchase to the location stated on the license.)

Applications for licenses must be acted upon within 6 months after presentment. If there is a delay, there must be written notice to the applicant stating the reasons. Such delay may be excused for good cause only.

If issued, a license is valid until revoked, except in New York City. A license fee is fixed by the board of supervisors in each county. The Division of Criminal Justice Services sets the fingerprinting fee. A fee is charged fee for each amendment to the license. In New York City and Nassau County, the City Council and Board of Supervisors, respectively, set the license fees without regard to the state law limitation.

Each handgun possessed must be listed on the license by make, model, caliber and serial number. The only exception is possession of a properly licensed handgun by another licensee or license applicant at a target range.

The name and address submitted by an applicant to obtain the license becomes a matter of public record.

A licensee who moves his residence to another licensing jurisdiction within the state shall provide notification of the change in writing within ten days after such change occurs, and a record of such change shall be inscribed by such licensee on the reverse side of his license. Failure to notify of the change of residence may result in an inability to obtain amendments, and possible revocation of the license.


20 posted on 10/07/2013 9:16:12 AM PDT by neverdem (Register pressure cookers! /s)
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To: Gaffer
I think the citizens should sue that newspaper for the names, addresses and telephone number of all its employees. Start first the information about those individuals that submitted the FOIA request.

Nice sentiment, but FOIL only applies to government records. While the mainstream media might be firmly up the White House's butt that doesn't mean they are a branch of government and FOIL is inapplicable.

21 posted on 10/07/2013 9:20:37 AM PDT by Behind Liberal Lines
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To: neverdem
The AP story says "pistol permit records." There's no mention of CCW or concealed anything.

And how often do you use the AP as a reliable source of information on anything, much less firearms related stories?

"Permits to keep" are non-existent in Putnam. You either get a permit to carry that is limited to "target shooting and hunting", "present employment", or "unrestricted". The JN is suing for all pistol permits regardless of limitations.

The NRA information covers the entire state, which has wildly different laws and procedures from one county to the next. As a NY resident, I'm sure you are aware of that fact so why post a dozen paragraphs of irrelevant information?

22 posted on 10/07/2013 9:44:15 AM PDT by NY.SS-Bar9 (Those that vote for a living outnumber those that work for one.)
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To: Behind Liberal Lines

“Nice sentiment, but FOIL only applies to government records. While the mainstream media might be firmly up the White House’s butt that doesn’t mean they are a branch of government and FOIL is inapplicable.”

You don’t need FOIL. In this day and age of the internet, I am sure such information is easily accessable from public sources. It could be just as simple as collecting and publishing the information.


23 posted on 10/07/2013 9:56:24 AM PDT by Londo Molari
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To: NY.SS-Bar9
And how often do you use the AP as a reliable source of information on anything, much less firearms related stories?

When it's the source for the story in question.

"Permits to keep" are non-existent in Putnam. You either get a permit to carry that is limited to "target shooting and hunting", "present employment", or "unrestricted". The JN is suing for all pistol permits regardless of limitations.

You wrote that bolded part.

The NRA information covers the entire state, which has wildly different laws and procedures from one county to the next. As a NY resident, I'm sure you are aware of that fact so why post a dozen paragraphs of irrelevant information?

It showed that Nassau and Westchester counties have permit/licensing schemes beyond NYC.

24 posted on 10/07/2013 10:46:10 AM PDT by neverdem (Register pressure cookers! /s)
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To: neverdem

This is the paper that published the interactive map of all the homes where a registered legal, licensed firearm owner lived in Westchester County, also (IIRC) Rockland and Nassau/Suffolk ... basically all the NYC suburban counties in the state of NY.

When NRA (or similar) published online the home addresses of the paper’s owner and employees,they had a fit!


25 posted on 10/07/2013 12:44:11 PM PDT by EDINVA
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To: Eric in the Ozarks

Journal News, eh? Another enemy agent identified, for termination when TSHTF.


26 posted on 10/07/2013 2:41:36 PM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed & water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: neverdem
However, the licensing officer must state specifically and concisely in writing the reasons for a denial. A denial can only be overturned in court if the denial is shown to be arbitrary and capricious.

The standard denial tactic is that the applicant failed to show a need, at least here in New Jersey.

27 posted on 10/07/2013 2:48:44 PM PDT by JimRed (Excise the cancer before it kills us; feed & water the Tree of Liberty! TERM LIMITS NOW & FOREVER!)
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To: Londo Molari
You don’t need FOIL. In this day and age of the internet, I am sure such information is easily accessable from public sources. It could be just as simple as collecting and publishing the information.

Which may or may not be the case.

However, the post I was responding to was suggesting a lawsuit like the one filed. Such a lawsuit is generally only available under FOIL which, as you appear to concede, does not apply.

Where FOIL might come in would be to get the reporters' names and then submit requests for their voter registration, property addresses, etc.

28 posted on 10/07/2013 4:28:33 PM PDT by Behind Liberal Lines
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To: JimRed
The standard denial tactic is that the applicant failed to show a need, at least here in New Jersey.

NY requires no showing of need.

29 posted on 10/07/2013 4:29:03 PM PDT by Behind Liberal Lines
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To: neverdem

Thanks for the ping!


30 posted on 10/07/2013 6:20:50 PM PDT by Alamo-Girl
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To: DJ Frisat

Because it is a left-wing, liberal dying rag of a newspaper. And they hate liberty.


31 posted on 10/08/2013 6:24:40 PM PDT by NoKoolAidforMe (I'm clinging to my God and my guns. You can keep the change.)
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To: neverdem

New York only has concealed carry permits. There is no open carry. The permits are issued by the county and are for hunting/target shooting, employment or full-carry.

New York City is a whole other ballgame. They make it so prohibitive, expensive and time-consuming that people give up or just don’t bother.


32 posted on 10/08/2013 6:28:18 PM PDT by NoKoolAidforMe (I'm clinging to my God and my guns. You can keep the change.)
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To: Behind Liberal Lines

The fascist gun control law that was enacted in NY this year allows for permit holders to protect their information by filing a non-disclosure form with the issuing county. This little cookie was tossed in by a republican state senator. If you are a permit holder and did not file a non-disclose form with the county, your permit info can be FOILed.

The Urinal News’ lawsuit against Putnam County is BS as it violates the fascist law.


33 posted on 10/08/2013 6:31:22 PM PDT by NoKoolAidforMe (I'm clinging to my God and my guns. You can keep the change.)
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To: neverdem

This would be the same type of newspaper which would support abortion right?

Well the only way the USSC found to legalize abortion was a...wait for it.....RIGHT TO PRIVACY.

Now if a right to privacy is so important that we can kill innocent children then certainly a right which is actually spelled out as “SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED” should certainly be covered under a right to privacy!

Unfortunately for any of this to make sense you have to have honest lawyers and judges and politicians and seeing as they are almost exclusively lawyers we find ourselves in this mess.

NEVER vote for another lawyer FOR ANTHING.


34 posted on 10/16/2013 1:03:47 PM PDT by Wurlitzer (Nothing says "ignorance" like Islam! 969)
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