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Opt-Out Obamacare Penalty Can't Be Enforced -- Unless You Get a Tax Refund
Rush Limbaugh ^ | 10-24-2013 | Rush Limbaugh

Posted on 10/24/2013 10:48:07 AM PDT by sheikdetailfeather

October 24, 2013 BEGIN TRANSCRIPT

RUSH: For those of us who take as long as we can to pay our taxes, October 15th was the extension filing date for 2012, and I dutifully was in there. My accountant, who is almost afraid to be my accountant because he thinks he's gonna get targeted, too, just 'cause his name's on my return, he said, "Look, you may not know this, but you keep talking about these Obamacare fines if you don't buy a policy. Do you know that under the law --" and I had to go look it up. Not that I didn't believe him, but he just never gets political with me. He stays over there. (interruption) No, no. He's not lib. It's a professional relationship.

Anyway, he said to me that according to the law, the only way that the government can collect the fine or penalty for you not buying insurance is if you are owed a tax refund. If you do not owe a tax refund, they cannot go into your bank account or anywhere else and get that money. Now, the sad thing is that most people file their taxes to get a refund 'cause they think they're screwing the government, and they're not. You're giving the government all that money all that year, but, no, look, what it means is that it can't work. The whole point of this is the individual mandate. The guts of this are the mandate that you buy, that young, healthy people get screwed price-wise by being forced to buy insurance. You've got to.

(Excerpt) Read more at rushlimbaugh.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: irsobamacare; obamacarepenalty; optoutobamacare; penalty; refund; rushlive; rushtranscript
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Works for me!
1 posted on 10/24/2013 10:48:07 AM PDT by sheikdetailfeather
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To: sheikdetailfeather

I don’t think he knows what he is talking about. YOu owe the IRS and that is that.


2 posted on 10/24/2013 10:49:12 AM PDT by Chickensoup (we didn't love freedom enough... Solzhenitsyn.)
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To: sheikdetailfeather

I always owe.


3 posted on 10/24/2013 10:50:54 AM PDT by boomop1 (term limits will only save this country.)
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To: Chickensoup

YOu owe the IRS and that is that.”

Actually, the IRS OWNS you and me and everyone that is gainfully employed and not living on government handouts and that is that.


4 posted on 10/24/2013 10:53:10 AM PDT by Grams A (The Sun will rise in the East in the morning and God is still on his throne.)
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To: Chickensoup

The point he’s making is true, that the IRS cannot compel people to pay the 0bamacare fine.

If everyone will adjust their W4 forms at the beginning of the year, it will (1) starve the beast a little... and (2) keep people from having that fine/tax/penalty held out of their refund due in April 2015.


5 posted on 10/24/2013 10:53:54 AM PDT by NEMDF
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To: sheikdetailfeather
Imagine how much money will be held back from the Gov if nobody overpaid
their taxes during the year. The fact is that if you're receiving a refund
you've paid to much tax during the year, and the Gov needs that money to keep
their handouts going. It would break the Government overspending to an extent
that a budget would be forced.

Obama/DemoRATs have not had a budget, EVER! And the Repubs will not enforce one either!


Kill their blank check and stop overpaying during the year.

6 posted on 10/24/2013 10:55:25 AM PDT by MaxMax (Pay Attention and you'll be pissed off too! FIRE BOEHNER, NOW!)
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To: sheikdetailfeather

If you believe that I want to show you one of my nicest bridges.


7 posted on 10/24/2013 10:55:26 AM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet (Ted Cruz/Sarah Palin 2016)
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To: boomop1

Me too! Someone called Rush later and said he could break the law and get it from your bank acct. and Rush said yes. If nobody goes after him for it he can. But as the lase stands, they cannot take it from your bank acct. nor take your property.


8 posted on 10/24/2013 10:55:45 AM PDT by sheikdetailfeather (Yuri Bezmenov (KGB Defector) - "Kick The Communists Out of Your Govt. & Don't Accept Their Goodies.")
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To: sheikdetailfeather

In our dictatorship with the insane King Obama they will take the fine from anywhere you have money. Bank accounts are at the same communists control empire that government is. The IRS is above the law and they make their own.


9 posted on 10/24/2013 10:56:32 AM PDT by Logical me
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To: Chickensoup
I don’t think he knows what he is talking about. YOu owe the IRS and that is that.

It appears to be you doesn't know what he's talking about.

Obamacare Penalties: 3 Things to Know Before 2014

Penalty, shmenalty?

You might also want to know about one other minor detail about the Obamacare penalties: The IRS can't go after taxpayers who don't pay up. That's right -- the Affordable Care Act didn't include any provisions for the tax agency to enforce collection of the penalties.

2014 tax returns, which aren't due until April 2015, will include a spot for taxpayers to provide information about health insurance. If any penalties apply, the IRS will subtract the penalty amount out of any refund owed. If you don't get a refund or the penalty is greater than your refund, the agency will want you to mail a check to them or send funds electronically.

What happens if you decide not to send the money? The IRS could take it out of any future tax refunds. If your taxes are withheld through your employer, the agency could also get the money through that route. However, it can't press criminal charges or assess further financial penalties for not paying. The IRS also can't place a lien on property as it can when seeking payment of overdue taxes.

10 posted on 10/24/2013 10:56:32 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Who knew that one day professional wrestling would be less fake than professional journalism?)
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To: sheikdetailfeather

woops! lase s/b law


11 posted on 10/24/2013 10:56:51 AM PDT by sheikdetailfeather (Yuri Bezmenov (KGB Defector) - "Kick The Communists Out of Your Govt. & Don't Accept Their Goodies.")
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

If you later in life file for SS could they take it out of that?


12 posted on 10/24/2013 11:01:43 AM PDT by sheikdetailfeather (Yuri Bezmenov (KGB Defector) - "Kick The Communists Out of Your Govt. & Don't Accept Their Goodies.")
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To: sheikdetailfeather

Nonsense. The IRS can garnish pay.


13 posted on 10/24/2013 11:03:26 AM PDT by cotton1706
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To: cotton1706

Think about this...the govt. can only tax something you buy. If you do not buy anything and it is not a penalty, they cannot tax nothing.


14 posted on 10/24/2013 11:05:18 AM PDT by sheikdetailfeather (Yuri Bezmenov (KGB Defector) - "Kick The Communists Out of Your Govt. & Don't Accept Their Goodies.")
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To: sheikdetailfeather
Rush's accountant is correct as long as the IRS follows the letter of the law. but what is likely to happen in reality is this;
You don't pay the fine
Your account is flagged
Audit shows some minor discrepancy and you are cited for the discrepancy (almost every return contains one.)
IRS say payment for discrepancy and ObamaCare fine is due
They collect by any means necessary unless you fight them.
Suffice it to say, if you have ever had to fight with the IRS you know what a nightmare that is.
15 posted on 10/24/2013 11:06:37 AM PDT by Old North State
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To: sheikdetailfeather

Works for me!


Me too. I have not gotten a refund for at least ten years.


16 posted on 10/24/2013 11:09:35 AM PDT by cuban leaf
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To: sheikdetailfeather

“Think about this...the govt. can only tax something you buy. If you do not buy anything and it is not a penalty, they cannot tax nothing.”

I understand. I still don’t buy it. They’ll find a way to get it, for example by denying you something until you pay, similar to suspending your license till you pay your parking tickets. You’ll have a trip to Italy planned and purchased and all of a sudden, your passport is suspended when you’re at the airport. Something along those lines.


17 posted on 10/24/2013 11:10:02 AM PDT by cotton1706
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To: sheikdetailfeather

Says nothing about that in the law.


18 posted on 10/24/2013 11:11:53 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Who knew that one day professional wrestling would be less fake than professional journalism?)
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To: boomop1

I always owe because my wife makes so much less than me that even when she claims no deductions there is very little withheld from her check. But since it is the money basically attached “on top” of what I make, it puts us in the hole every year. However, she’s quitting at the end of the year. Looks like I’ll add “1” to my number of dependents on my W-4 next year.


19 posted on 10/24/2013 11:12:12 AM PDT by cuban leaf
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To: sheikdetailfeather

Does Rushbo actually believe this? Does he honestly think the fascists are not coming after your bank accounts and everything else you own if you own fine money? Is he kidding? This is all a scam, a backdoor to communism, that’s the only reason they created Obamacare. They are going to make the rates for commiecare insanely high - if they aren’t already - and as a result Joe Middle class isn’t going to able to afford it and the fines will stack up and of course being that it is classified as a tax they will sock you with penalties and of course those fines will get higher every year and then *poof* the fascists then have an excuse for redistribution of wealth - “You owe $70k in fines which is a tax so say goodbye to the house, car, kids college fund, everything else you own” and Stalin Obama gets to practice financial collectivism, redistribution - You now work for the state slave.


20 posted on 10/24/2013 11:12:39 AM PDT by GrandJediMasterYoda (What do we want? Time travel. When do we want it? It's irrelevant.)
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To: cotton1706

I am hoping this goes through and gets rid of Obamacare:

H.Res.153 - Expressing the sense of the House of Representatives that the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act of 2009 violates article I, section 7, clause 1 of the United States Constitution because it was a ”Bill for raising Revenue’’ that did not originate in the House of Representatives.

http://beta.congress.gov/bill/113th-congress/house-resolution/153/cosponsors


21 posted on 10/24/2013 11:12:40 AM PDT by sheikdetailfeather (Yuri Bezmenov (KGB Defector) - "Kick The Communists Out of Your Govt. & Don't Accept Their Goodies.")
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To: cotton1706

They’ll find a way to get it...


I tend to agree. However, until they do, they can’t. ;)

That said, they need a law to be passed to do it. That depends on the makeup of the congress and the executive office holder. This brings up the possibility that it may be repealed before they get the chance.


22 posted on 10/24/2013 11:15:24 AM PDT by cuban leaf
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Thanks!


23 posted on 10/24/2013 11:15:48 AM PDT by sheikdetailfeather (Yuri Bezmenov (KGB Defector) - "Kick The Communists Out of Your Govt. & Don't Accept Their Goodies.")
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To: sheikdetailfeather
Anyway, he said to me that according to the law, the only way that the government can collect the fine or penalty for you not buying insurance is if you are owed a tax refund.

I'm sure this can be corrected by legislation. -tom

24 posted on 10/24/2013 11:17:36 AM PDT by Capt. Tom
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To: cuban leaf

I liked what Rush was saying about how Obama screwed up in managing the failure of Obamacare to get single payer. He said Obama wanted the public to blame the evil insurance companies or the Republicans, etc.. But the people are blaming government for screwing up and they are not begging for single payer after seeing how badly government messed up Obamacare. LOL!


25 posted on 10/24/2013 11:19:59 AM PDT by sheikdetailfeather (Yuri Bezmenov (KGB Defector) - "Kick The Communists Out of Your Govt. & Don't Accept Their Goodies.")
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To: sheikdetailfeather
This article ties in with your thread. Very complicated reasoning here, but worth a read: How Chief Justice Roberts Saved America in His Obamacare Ruling
26 posted on 10/24/2013 11:22:20 AM PDT by Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America (If Americans were as concerned for their country as Egyptians are, Obama would be ousted!)
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To: Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America

“If a tax can’t be ENFORCED, it’s NOT a tax”


27 posted on 10/24/2013 11:23:21 AM PDT by Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America (If Americans were as concerned for their country as Egyptians are, Obama would be ousted!)
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To: NEMDF

Yeah, that’ll work.

I had my withholding cut to a minimum for 5-6 years (each year either getting a miniscule refund or owing a hundred bucks or so) and my employer got a threatening letter in 2011 telling them that either my withholding was increased ‘or else’ (it was the tone; I saw the letter).

What would you do?


28 posted on 10/24/2013 11:24:30 AM PDT by logi_cal869
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To: Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America

Thanks!


29 posted on 10/24/2013 11:27:29 AM PDT by sheikdetailfeather (Yuri Bezmenov (KGB Defector) - "Kick The Communists Out of Your Govt. & Don't Accept Their Goodies.")
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To: sheikdetailfeather
I still cannot understand why so many Freepers keep calling this a penalty or a fine. It is neither...it is a TAX. The IRS can charge an additional penalty for underpayment of your taxes if you file quarterly. I run the numbers on this personally and always gladly pay the penalty for under payment. It just makes me feel good to keep as much of my money as long as I can. Of course the penalty is not very much but with me it is the principle that is important.

Obamacare cannot charge a penalty, the SOCOTUS said so. It will have to be some kind of additional TAX. How they do that on a case by case basis constitutionally is beyond me.

30 posted on 10/24/2013 11:28:03 AM PDT by mosaicwolf (Strength and Honor)
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To: sheikdetailfeather
Think about this...the govt. can only tax something you buy. If you do not buy anything and it is not a penalty, they cannot tax nothing.

The federal govt under the 16th amendment can only tax you if you have income, such as a refund. However, the weasel words regulations surrounding this law are X10 the size of the law and have not yet been fully examined. I'm certain they've moved the goal posts.

31 posted on 10/24/2013 11:30:35 AM PDT by USCG SimTech (Honored to serve since '71)
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To: NEMDF

“The point he’s making is true, that the IRS cannot compel people to pay the 0bamacare fine.”

Yea, but they can put a lien on your house ...


32 posted on 10/24/2013 11:30:40 AM PDT by TexasGator
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To: Obama_Is_Sabotaging_America

State Lotteries are taxes on stupid people.


33 posted on 10/24/2013 11:31:13 AM PDT by donmeaker (The lessons of Weimar will soon be repeated.)
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To: Old North State

...”as long as the IRS follows the letter of the law.”

Like the IRS targeting Obama’s political enemies?

Don’t forget folks, the IRS is charged with the enforcement of obamacare and they have a history of targeting political enemies.


34 posted on 10/24/2013 11:32:07 AM PDT by Texas resident
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To: sheikdetailfeather

WRONGO!
We have a post Constitutional government, they have the big guns, so the IRS can do whatever it pleases. Tax liens, passport revocation, wage garnishment, asset seizure.
If you’re an anti-government activist, probably a whole lot worse.


35 posted on 10/24/2013 11:42:15 AM PDT by grumpygresh (Democrats delenda est. New US economy: Fascism on top, Socialism on the bottom.)
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To: NEMDF
If everyone will adjust their W4 forms at the beginning of the year, it will (1) starve the beast a little... and (2) keep people from having that fine/tax/penalty held out of their refund due in April 2015.

When will people just stop paying taxes altogether? What? Are they going to shoot all of us? It's way beyond time... 3 TRILLION DOLLARS in "means-based" walfare entitlements needs to stop, now.

36 posted on 10/24/2013 11:49:29 AM PDT by Rodamala
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To: sheikdetailfeather

I USED TO claim 0 because I loved that huge refund

For the first time ever I maxed out every exemption I could


37 posted on 10/24/2013 11:49:44 AM PDT by Mr. K (Lies, Damned Lies, Statistics, and then Democrat Talking Points.)
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To: sheikdetailfeather

One little executive order should fix that oversight


38 posted on 10/24/2013 11:50:39 AM PDT by Mr. K (Lies, Damned Lies, Statistics, and then Democrat Talking Points.)
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To: sheikdetailfeather

Rush’s observation doe not apply to employees, whose withholding schedule guarantees an annual refund. There are some exceptions, such as those with much lower incomes than their spouse.


39 posted on 10/24/2013 11:50:49 AM PDT by Kennard
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To: donmeaker

“State Lotteries are taxes on stupid people.”

Yup. One of the very, very good things about my ole home turf od canada. Once you win any lottery, it’s completely yours, tax-free and the gubmint’ only wishes you’d spend the dough locally. Locally means strippers, booze etc. ;P


40 posted on 10/24/2013 11:54:10 AM PDT by max americana (fired liberals in our company last election, and I laughed while they cried (true story))
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To: sheikdetailfeather

Ping


41 posted on 10/24/2013 11:55:12 AM PDT by diamond6 (Behold this Heart which has so loved men!" Jesus to St. Margaret Mary)
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To: sheikdetailfeather; stephenjohnbanker; ding_dong_daddy_from_dumas; FourtySeven; Gilbo_3; Impy; ...
RE :”Opt-Out Obamacare Penalty Can't Be Enforced — Unless You Get a Tax Refund

Holy crap, thanks Rush, now I wont get yelled at here for posting written proof of it here, because many here believe whatever you say so now its OK. I beat ya to it Rush.

What the Obama-care law text REALLY says on IRS enforcement of the personal Mandate fine/tax
(posted here October 16, 2013 10:50:01 AM · by sickoflibs )

42 posted on 10/24/2013 11:55:29 AM PDT by sickoflibs (To GOP : Any path to US Citizenship IS putting them ahead in line. Stop lying about your position)
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43 posted on 10/24/2013 11:58:31 AM PDT by musicman (Until I see the REAL Long Form Vault BC, he's just "PRES__ENT" Obama = Without "ID")
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To: sheikdetailfeather

I don’t think that’s right. You over pay and they’ll reduce your refund. You under pay and they make you pay more if you don’t have healthcare. They’ll have access to all your bank accounts, so it won’t matter what you want.


44 posted on 10/24/2013 11:59:07 AM PDT by b4its2late (A Liberal is a person who will give away everything he doesn't own.)
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To: Chickensoup

I’m with you.

If you owe the money for the year 2014, then the money for 2015, then 2016 ... it’s going to add up. Eventually you will have to pay big time.

Even if he is right.


45 posted on 10/24/2013 12:01:52 PM PDT by BunnySlippers (I LOVE BULL MARKETS . . .)
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To: NEMDF

I would request he look a little further down the law. As I recall this fact has been discussed for some time now.

Further it applies the first year. at some point, may the second year, I don’t recall, there can be garnishments and liens.

Perhaps someone with real knowledge can expound on what happens after te first year of nonpayment.


46 posted on 10/24/2013 12:03:18 PM PDT by bert ((K.E. N.P. N.C. +12 ..... Travon... Felony assault and battery hate crime)
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To: sheikdetailfeather

You HAVE to buy, or pay a penalty. Forget the tax part. BUY or PENALTY.


47 posted on 10/24/2013 12:03:54 PM PDT by BunnySlippers (I LOVE BULL MARKETS . . .)
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To: sickoflibs

I saved that thread to my email. You did call it first.


48 posted on 10/24/2013 12:03:59 PM PDT by sheikdetailfeather (Yuri Bezmenov (KGB Defector) - "Kick The Communists Out of Your Govt. & Don't Accept Their Goodies.")
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To: Chickensoup

For goodness sake people, read the damn law. KNOW YOUR RIGHTS

Rush is right. These penalties are not subject to regular IRS collection. No garnishment a, no liens.

http://www.jonesday.com/affordable_care_act/

Look at the last paragraph under individual mandate.


49 posted on 10/24/2013 12:05:02 PM PDT by MaFreedom (Once more unto the breach!)
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To: NEMDF

But it adds up as a total you owe, year after year, after year.

You can’t let the amount you owe the government go beyond a certain point ... that’s why some people make periodic payments.


50 posted on 10/24/2013 12:05:36 PM PDT by BunnySlippers (I LOVE BULL MARKETS . . .)
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