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Ukrainian Government Refuses To Remove Troops From Crimea, Prepares For War
Kyiv Post ^ | March 17, 2014

Posted on 03/17/2014 11:17:11 AM PDT by Strategy

In the wake of a March 16 referendum in which Crimeans voted to join the Russian Federation, Ukrainian leaders refused to cede any part of the peninsula, calling on their troops to prepare for war.

"Crimea was, is, and will be our territory," said Defense Minister Ihor Tenyukh in a statement delivered at the Ukrainian Crisis Media Center on March 17.

Former heavyweight boxing champion and leader of the Ukrainian Democratic Alliance for Reform Vitali Klitschko announced that Ukrainian troops would remain at their bases, even after March 21, the end of a peace treaty signed by the interior ministries of Ukraine and Russia.

(Excerpt) Read more at kyivpost.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; Russia
KEYWORDS: coldwar2; communism; crimea; klitschko; obama; putin; putinsbuttboys; russia; sovietunion; surrendermonkeys; ukraine; viktoryanukovich; war; worldwariii; yuliatymoshenko
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To: Red White and Blue patriot

You mean Obama and the Democrats, right?


101 posted on 03/17/2014 3:20:13 PM PDT by FreedomNotSafety
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To: redgolum

.........”Don’t know how many will follow the orders.........Many Ukrainian troops are confused on who is running the show”.........

They know they do not have the military power by themselves to ward off Russian troops. They’ve been recruiting a volunteer army from the citizenery, which has very little military training to go to war.

They have a ‘false sense’ of strength since Euromaiden took the Government over. War with Russia would not be a matter of throwing fire bombs in Town Square.


102 posted on 03/17/2014 3:24:51 PM PDT by caww
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To: Red White and Blue patriot
Sorry to be the one to inform you but the soviet union ceased to exist back in 1991.

Next, I guess you'll say that Putin was in the KGB during the soviet years.

Well, I hate to be the one to inform you but George Washington served in the British Army before the American revolutionary war.

Oh .. and the French... you know the ones that supported us in the American Revolution and gave us the Statue of Liberty... we had been in a war against them just a few years prior called the French and Indian war.

So by your standards, he should have booted Washington out of the country and turned down Frances help?

The fact is, sides change in world affairs all the time. Don't get stuck in the 90’s. The Soviet Union WAS an evil empire, and was proven to be a failure. But times change and in the here and now America lead by our baby killer/sodomite in chief is a much MUCH greater evil in the world than Russia.

103 posted on 03/17/2014 3:29:01 PM PDT by TexasFreeper2009 (Obama lied .. the economy died.)
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To: Red White and Blue patriot

Knock it off Newbie....calling established Freepers “Boot-licking-Commie Morons” shows your level of ignorance of who this community is made of.


104 posted on 03/17/2014 3:32:54 PM PDT by caww
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To: Strategy

What is important here is whether the Ukrainian military has two specific weapons systems:

* ground to air shoulder fired missiles like a Strela or Stinger. If so, it’s a game changer re airborne assault and attacks.

* Serious anti-tank/armor missiles, either shoulder fired or vehicle mounted (for quick shoot and scoot operations).

* Also, if they have any Soviet Quad AA guns, the really serious stuff that is both used from stationary positions and from trucks.

*Some decent artillery wouldn’t hurt either, be it large-sized mortars or field artillery (105’s on up).

The Russians might win but at what cost in men, equipment, and even homefront public opinion. Many remember what happened in Afghanistan when the Stingers came into play. Lots of pilots and planed ended up buried in the valleys and hills there. Thoroughly cramped the assault style of the Spetsnaz troops.

* Their own Special Forces commando troops for harassment, ambushes, IEDs, etc.

A lot of Ifs but only time will tell. Since some former Israeli Defense Force soldiers are reportedly helping the Ukrainians, I suspect that the Russians will be in for a few painful surprises.

Also wouldn’t be surprised to find some Moslem jihadists getting a few shots in at the Russians. Memories of Afghanistan are long and hard.

Things are going to get very interesting very quickly.

And of course, John Kerry is going to bring his Swift Boat to bear on the Russian Navy in a show of “gunboat diplomacy”. Hope he brings his rubbery ducky with him for good luck.


105 posted on 03/17/2014 3:43:24 PM PDT by MadMax, the Grinning Reaper
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To: FreedomNotSafety

I don’t think this person lives in the today world. Red, Red, and Red is thinking like the cold war is imminent, meanwhile, the bad guys are in the White House. LOL

Hiding under a desk in an Obama school is as useless now as it was then.

The enemy is already in the gates. If we are going to stand for freedom, we need to start right here and now.

I have to admit, this attempt to restart the cold war was smart because many are very confused by it. What was, no longer applies to what is now.

Me myself, I am far more terrified of all the muzzies in our current regime. Does not bode well for Americans. But, many are all huffy over Crimea. Ugh


106 posted on 03/17/2014 4:00:06 PM PDT by dforest
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To: caww

I think that one upthread thinks that once we all run out and vote for the Rove RINO Regiment, all the ills will disappear.

Jeb or Christie are going to return us to days gone by. Yipee!

So depressing and so naive.


107 posted on 03/17/2014 4:13:15 PM PDT by dforest
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To: piytar

If Obama decides to send troops to fight the Russians I hope it’s the turning point for the military and they say “Not gonna’ happen, son.”


108 posted on 03/17/2014 4:25:41 PM PDT by VerySadAmerican (".....Barrack, and the horse Mohammed rode in on.")
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To: AmericanExceptionalist

Serious question: Repel the Russian invaders from where? They’re sitting in Crimea and Eastern Ukraine. The only repelling that would need to be done is if Putin moves to take all of the Ukraine. Otherwise, I don’t understand how they could “repel” the Russians from Crimea. All the could try to do is kick them out.


109 posted on 03/17/2014 4:28:52 PM PDT by VerySadAmerican (".....Barrack, and the horse Mohammed rode in on.")
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To: PaulCruz2016
"Why won't we stand up to Russia?"

Because investors would lose money faster.


110 posted on 03/17/2014 4:29:20 PM PDT by familyop (We Baby Boomers are croaking in an avalanche of corruption smelled around the planet.)
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To: TexasFreeper2009

BTTT on this one!


111 posted on 03/17/2014 4:32:01 PM PDT by VerySadAmerican (".....Barrack, and the horse Mohammed rode in on.")
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To: AmericanExceptionalist

Nah, Obama needs that leftover equipment to use on the streets of the US to get the Tea Party in line with the NWO!


112 posted on 03/17/2014 4:39:00 PM PDT by dforest
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To: Red White and Blue patriot

You’ve been here since 2009 and when someone disagrees with you but can’t win the argument, you’re called a “newbie”. I’ve asked and asked how long someone has to be here before they’re not a “newbie” and can’t get an answer.

And apparently you haven’t learned that if you are still a “newbie” people call you names. You’re not allowed to reciprocate.

And for those who want to call me a “newbie”, I’ve been here since 2000 under a different name.


113 posted on 03/17/2014 4:41:04 PM PDT by VerySadAmerican (".....Barrack, and the horse Mohammed rode in on.")
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To: piytar
Obamatard was too stupid to see this coming, though, and now with Russian troops on the ground, a proxy war is out of the question.

I would think the fact that Russian troops are on the ground makes a proxy war possible. Korea, Vietnam and Afghanistan were all about one superpower making the other superpower bleed by providing training and relatively small infusions of equipment to the proxy, which took the brunt of the casualties. If Ukrainians are willing to sacrifice hundreds of thousands of their young men, the Russians will run, not walk, to the border.

114 posted on 03/17/2014 4:48:15 PM PDT by Zhang Fei (Let us pray that peace be now restored to the world and that God will preserve it always.)
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To: formosa

I agree. Once they swallow The peninsula they go for the mainland.

The eighties are calling. They want an American president again.


115 posted on 03/17/2014 5:40:45 PM PDT by PA-RIVER
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To: Strategy

Ukraine should butch up, seal off the Crimea and close their borders. I’m afraid some blood must be spilled for this to become real.


116 posted on 03/17/2014 5:59:58 PM PDT by Mike Darancette (Do The Math)
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To: ken5050

True. But I have difficulty giving a damn as I munch popcorn.


117 posted on 03/17/2014 6:06:12 PM PDT by Eleutheria5 (End the occupation. Annex today.)
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To: ken5050

Putin sees the clock ticking and the only thing standing between him and what he wants is a stupid gay putz.

In three years he needs to grab as much as possible.

Reagan. Obama is busy undoing the progress Reagan made.
Deep in Obamas bones, he hates Reagan. Hes like any typical liberal jackass who hated Reagan. Wreck the economy and spread tyranny. Spread Islamo fascism.

A dumb arrogant jackass.


118 posted on 03/17/2014 6:16:38 PM PDT by PA-RIVER
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To: dforest
I agree. This is a European problem.

Think for one minute the EU would come to our aid if we chose to defend Taiwan or Japan from the Chi-coms?

Why in Sam hell do we feel the need to get involved in every damn pissin match around the globe.

Pssst...we're broke.

119 posted on 03/17/2014 6:40:21 PM PDT by servantboy777
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To: PGR88

What is it good for?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=01-2pNCZiNk


120 posted on 03/17/2014 7:33:28 PM PDT by Redcitizen (When a zombie apocalypse starts, Chuck Norris doesn't try to survive. The zombies do.)
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To: TexasFreeper2009; meatloaf
well since 90%+ of the population of Crimea wants nothing to do with the rioters that took over Kiev... I imagine the only ones holding guns behind every blade of grass will be those in Crimea fighting for their freedom from the terrorists in Kiev.

90 percent? The Ukrainian and Tatar population of Crimea is about 30 percent, and that doesn't count others who aren't communists or fascists of some kind who want back in with Russia. The 'Russian unity" party, that is now running things, was a fringe party with only 3 elected members until one of their members was made Prime Minister by a group of men carrying grenade launchers who escorted him into the Crimean Rada.

The vote itself was a farce, complete with photos of small children filling out votes, and ballots already filled out with a "yes" for Russia.

By the way, I've noticed your posts pimping for Putin before. This is the low end of propaganda. Are you Russian?

121 posted on 03/17/2014 8:05:51 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: TexasFreeper2009; redwhiteandblue
Well, I hate to be the one to inform you but George Washington served in the British Army before the American revolutionary war.

That reveals your ignorance. A lot of us aren't stupid and have done tons of study of communist disinformation and tactics. There's never been a more insidious and dangerous force for the United States and world peace than the KGB, and these soviet structures were never removed. In fact, these "structures" were merely renamed, and now, literally, represent the actual government of Russia itself.

Until communism and its crimes are formerly denounced on the world stage, and de-communization takes place in Russia, there will never be peace. That is why Putin, despite all his Orthodox Pretentions, is still aiding and abetting communist movements across the planet.

122 posted on 03/17/2014 8:13:40 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans; redwhiteandblue; Red White and Blue patriot

Oops, I pinged red white and blue, instead of red white and blue PATRIOT. See the above post Patriot.


123 posted on 03/17/2014 8:15:09 PM PDT by Greetings_Puny_Humans (I mostly come out at night... mostly.)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

That missing 30% proves the vote was bogus.


124 posted on 03/17/2014 8:35:19 PM PDT by meatloaf (Impeach Obama. That's my New Year's resolution.)
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To: piytar

End of Days kind of stuff. Even Obamatard does not want that — I hope...>>>>>>>>

Obamatard will do just about anything to declare martial law and permanently delay the presidential election of 2016.


125 posted on 03/18/2014 12:15:43 AM PDT by Candor7 (Obama fascism article:(http://www.americanthinker.com/2009/05/barack_obama_the_quintessentia_1.html))
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To: Red White and Blue patriot

enslave over 90% who want to be with Russia you mean, yea OK and if you want to fight then you go there as it’s a bit different then typing on a computer , over the internet .


126 posted on 03/18/2014 4:38:01 AM PDT by manc (Marriage =1 man + 1 woman,when they say marriage equality then they should support polygamy)
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To: meatloaf

er give the guns to who, the over 90% of people who want Mother Russia?


127 posted on 03/18/2014 4:39:29 AM PDT by manc (Marriage =1 man + 1 woman,when they say marriage equality then they should support polygamy)
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To: Red White and Blue patriot

your post has just confirmed to me how clueless you are, good bye and I doubt you will be long on here.


128 posted on 03/18/2014 4:42:21 AM PDT by manc (Marriage =1 man + 1 woman,when they say marriage equality then they should support polygamy)
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To: Greetings_Puny_Humans

I have no idea why it doesn’t occur to people like you that the people in Crimea actually DO want to join with Russia.

Here is an article on maybe WHY they might

http://www.thehindu.com/news/international/world/crimea-breaks-away-from-ukraine-asks-to-rejoin-russia/article5795696.ece

quote from article “The Russian government has promised to raise the salaries and pensions for Crimean residents to the average Russian level, which is two to three times higher.”

So ... maybe those voting in favor of joining Russia ... are just voting for up to THREE TIMES higher pensions...

Just something to think about, not everything is a KGB conspiracy.


129 posted on 03/18/2014 6:01:28 AM PDT by TexasFreeper2009 (Obama lied .. the economy died.)
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To: manc

Give them to the military to arm the new conscripts. So far the military including the units in the Crimea have stood by the new leadership. The military never intervened to put down the demonstrations. There’s quite a bit of anti-Russia emotion even among ethnic Russians. They don’t want to go back to living under Russia’s rule.


130 posted on 03/18/2014 6:22:59 AM PDT by meatloaf (Impeach Obama. That's my New Year's resolution.)
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To: dforest

Globalists are fools. They do not want America to fight for America but to pit Ukrainian and Russophile lobbyists for political donation, like it is somekind of World Soccer War. Eventually the biggest lobbyist is the one with money, nukes and what not.

Thus this globalist ploy aiming to ethnically manage the world ends up supporting the biggest thug in the end, not the represented of each US State.

Ie. Bubye illegal Mexicans, hello Moscow.


131 posted on 03/18/2014 8:00:40 AM PDT by lavaroise (A well regulated gun being necessary to the state, the rights of the militia shall not be infringed)
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To: lodi90
We are about 50 steps in escalation from arming the Ukrainians.

Oh, I quite agree. In fact, I even said as much (albeit not quite so colorfully).

President Obama has already rejected the Ukrainians' pleas for such aid. Instead, he has offered to supply them with MREs. (Whoopee!)

132 posted on 03/18/2014 10:24:13 AM PDT by AmericanExceptionalist (Democrats believe in discussing the full spectrum of ideas, all the way from far left to center-left)
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To: redgolum
Lets not start another land war in Asia till we find out a way to supply our guys currently there.

I certainly would not wish for the US to put boots on the ground in Crimea.

But that should not mean that we cannot supply the Ukrainian people with arms, with which to fight effectively, themselves.

133 posted on 03/18/2014 10:27:13 AM PDT by AmericanExceptionalist (Democrats believe in discussing the full spectrum of ideas, all the way from far left to center-left)
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To: VerySadAmerican
Serious question: Repel the Russian invaders from where? They’re sitting in Crimea and Eastern Ukraine. The only repelling that would need to be done is if Putin moves to take all of the Ukraine. Otherwise, I don’t understand how they could “repel” the Russians from Crimea. All the could try to do is kick them out.

Okay, then: The Ukrainian military could kick out the Russians.

I believe that is just a matter of semantics--the proverbial distinction without a difference--but I would certainly like to see the Ukrainian military be able to accomplish that.

134 posted on 03/18/2014 10:30:26 AM PDT by AmericanExceptionalist (Democrats believe in discussing the full spectrum of ideas, all the way from far left to center-left)
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To: AmericanExceptionalist
The Ukrainian military could kick out the Russians.

And monkeys could fly out of my butt.

135 posted on 03/18/2014 10:31:08 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: AmericanExceptionalist

Who is paying to supply them with arms? The US taxpayer? I am not for that. We are broke, or have you forgotten? In fact, Russia and China both own our debt. We owe them, that is why you see puny sanctions that mean nothing. You want it to be robust? Ain’t gonna happen with the current debt growing regime. Now why do you think Putin thinks we are a joke?

You believe in American exceptionaism. You have to vote it back. Our current RINOs are about as bad as the democrats.


136 posted on 03/18/2014 11:24:23 AM PDT by dforest
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To: dforest

This is absolutely an example of what George Washington warned us about - stay away from entangling alliances.

The USA people will get trapped into doing the bidding of others, not based upon our decisions or what is in our interest, but instead based upon the decisions of others. If the Ukranians decide to attack Russia then they have the ball not the USA.

I’m weary of the USA being used as a cash cow and world policeman by other nations. Let them sacrifice.


137 posted on 03/18/2014 11:37:22 AM PDT by apoliticalone
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To: dforest
Who is paying to supply them with arms?

Perhaps I should rephrase.

The US shouls sell sophisticated weaponry to Ukraine...

138 posted on 03/18/2014 11:51:21 AM PDT by AmericanExceptionalist (Democrats believe in discussing the full spectrum of ideas, all the way from far left to center-left)
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To: Strategy
I would like someone to tell me what Obama meant when he told Putin he would have more flexibility after the election.

Was it a promise not to do anything of import when Putin made his land grab?

139 posted on 03/18/2014 6:18:42 PM PDT by Gabrial (The nightmare will continue as long as the nightmare is in the Whitehouse.)
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To: AmericanExceptionalist

And what do we do when Russia starts supplying arms to insurgents here?

This is right next door to them, in a place that has been Russian far, far, longer than it was Ukrainian.


140 posted on 03/18/2014 7:57:11 PM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: AmericanExceptionalist

monumentally dumb for us to involve ourselves. you arm them and then you own the resulting mess. we already own a couple of messes. let Kerry and Biden blow smoke at Vladi all day but to get involved against the Russian nation like that is
tempting fate. Vlad has no CP Presidium checking his moves.
the State Duma is his instrument. he has the football.


141 posted on 03/18/2014 10:41:47 PM PDT by RitchieAprile
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To: RitchieAprile

I heard earlier today that this got Turkey involved. Turkey had been promised by Russia somehow that such a move would involve it.

Now with the “ugly winds” Barack Obama seeing something unfair being done to a Moslem brother, is he going to brook it? That it might be on behalf of Turkey, and not Crimea or Ukraine, that he will get the USA involved? It would be consistent, if probably tragic.


142 posted on 03/18/2014 10:45:08 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
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To: redgolum
And what do we do when Russia starts supplying arms to insurgents here?

I was not aware that either (a) there is a large-scale insurgency going on in the US (or one that is about to occur); or (b) those who would fight to hold onto that which is rightfully theirs (not Russia's) might be described as "insurgents."

This is right next door to them, in a place that has been Russian far, far, longer than it was Ukrainian.

But it is now a part of Ukraine. (At least, it was before Vladimir Putin decided to annex it.)

143 posted on 03/18/2014 11:28:50 PM PDT by AmericanExceptionalist (Democrats believe in discussing the full spectrum of ideas, all the way from far left to center-left)
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To: RitchieAprile
monumentally dumb for us to involve ourselves. you arm them and then you own the resulting mess.

What "mess," exactly, do you foresee, if we were to arm the Ukrainian military sufficiently that it could defeat--decisively and unequivocally--the Russian military?

144 posted on 03/18/2014 11:32:16 PM PDT by AmericanExceptionalist (Democrats believe in discussing the full spectrum of ideas, all the way from far left to center-left)
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To: AmericanExceptionalist

If they ever got a chance to use those arms before a Bear sits on them.


145 posted on 03/18/2014 11:38:24 PM PDT by HiTech RedNeck (Embrace the Lion of Judah and He will roar for you and teach you to roar too. See my page.)
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To: Vigilanteman

Russia can’t throw “everything” at Ukraine. Not even close. They have too many other spots just waiting to boil over. If Ukraine can accept a 10:1 kill ratio (in favor of Russia), interrupt the gas pipelines (best done in Western Ukraine), accept the loss of up to 1% of their population (they lost 19% in WW2 and gained NOTHING), and basically just “tarball” the Russkis, Putin is in big trouble, in the long run.

Unfortunately, in the rest of the world, in the next decade, given the vaccuum the US is creating, there will be a huge arms race including nukes in several cases, and no way does that end well.


146 posted on 03/19/2014 5:21:18 AM PDT by Paul R. (Leftists desire to control everything; In the end they invariably control nothing worth a damn.)
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To: MadMax, the Grinning Reaper

Funny thing about that Swift Boat. It could face intense enemy fire at point blank range (WELL!! Kerry said so!!), but the records show not one hole in the boat. I’ll bet the Ukrainians would really like some of those!


147 posted on 03/19/2014 5:26:45 AM PDT by Paul R. (Leftists desire to control everything; In the end they invariably control nothing worth a damn.)
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To: Zhang Fei

Correct. The Ukrainians can eventually force Putin’s forces out IF they (the Ukrainians) can accept a 10:1 kill ratio in favor of Russia.

One must recall that the Ukraine lost 19% of its population in WW2, only to return to subjugation by Stalin. We cannot really even begin to imagine the scale of the horrors, or the “national memory”.

Tymoshenko sounds like she would do it (have Ukraine fight), but needs to be more forceful about eventually winning, which she does seem to be, as she recovers from her back problem.

I’ve also seen some writings from protesters praising opposition leaders they did not really like previously, because said leaders were willing to stand in there as the bullets started taking out protesters. If the Ukraine’s leaders show courage under fire, Putin’s guys are (eventually) toast.

Also... If Ukrainians start dying in large numbers, pressure to send in assistance will build.


148 posted on 03/19/2014 5:43:04 AM PDT by Paul R. (Leftists desire to control everything; In the end they invariably control nothing worth a damn.)
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To: apoliticalone
This is absolutely an example of what George Washington warned us about - stay away from entangling alliances.

Oh. We were just supposed to let 5000 nukes drift to wherever...

I also suspect GW was glad the French did not have his viewpoint in years previous. I think his point was to be careful about entering alliances, not to avoid all.

149 posted on 03/19/2014 5:58:38 AM PDT by Paul R. (Leftists desire to control everything; In the end they invariably control nothing worth a damn.)
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To: AmericanExceptionalist

the mess would be the bloodbath that would result. do you really not see this?

there is no way the Ukrainians could defeat Russia.


150 posted on 03/19/2014 8:39:24 AM PDT by RitchieAprile
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