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Queer by Choice, Not by Chance: Against Being 'Born This Way' [A Lesbian's Perspective]
The Atlantic ^ | 09/12/2011 | LINDSAY MILLER

Posted on 04/21/2015 10:08:53 AM PDT by SeekAndFind

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To: mrsmel

As a Christian I struggle with the instruction not to judge. If one is born with a predetermined orientation, as I believe, and they live a moral life within that context, I want to leave the issue to God.

That being said, personally I am against gay marriage but have no problem with gay civil unions.

I know many gays (and plenty of straights)live wildly immoral lives. They will have to be accountable for this one day I believe, and I know you do too.


21 posted on 04/21/2015 10:53:07 AM PDT by Calpublican (No Comprendo)
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To: blueunicorn6

HT to one of the talk radio guys:

Libtards favor abortion on demand. “Right to choose” blah blah blah.

Tards also insist that being gay is a born trait
One assumes that soon there will be a way to test for it.

At that point the tards would support straight parents aborting their gay babies, out of preference for having straight kids.

Right?

ha ha ha ha ha ha


22 posted on 04/21/2015 10:55:48 AM PDT by Jack Black ( Disarmament of a targeted group is one of the surest early warning signs of future genocide.)
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To: bigbob

My workplace is increasingly “diverse and tolerant”, publishing coming out stories of several men as well as LGBTA propaganda.

In several cases, men reported that they came out after having a wife and children. Then they decided that they were gay and started living that life.
It clearly was a choice - otherwise, none of these men would have been able to marry and make children. One guy, 4 in ten years, another 5.


23 posted on 04/21/2015 10:56:15 AM PDT by tbw2
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To: riverdawg
I cannot put my finger on the large study I posted at the moment, and I'm working right now.

Here is one study https://books.google.com/books?id=dASsUFtN57sC&pg=PA247&lpg=PA247&dq=lesbian+identical+twins&source=bl&ots=b4eksQB3Jj&sig=DBDb7CyPLP7A7m7h3N26vZH7iV4&hl=en&sa=X&ei=CY82VeeBPPiKsQTu4YGAAg&ved=0CD8Q6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=lesbian%20identical%20twins&f=false which supports the results, but note that except for ONE small sample, these are cases of twins raised together, not apart. So the environmental influence is not factored out. Nevertheless, even in these studies, you will see that twins are not invariably homosexual, even when raised in the same environment.

The small sample size lesbian study with identical twins raised separately again confirms: ABSOLUTELY 0 correlation. I am not aware of any study that has ever found a correlation.

In my own experience [which admittedly has a very small sample size] all six lesbians I've known personally arrived there after abusive relationships with men; and one of them subsequently even married a man after a 15 year lesbian "partnership."

24 posted on 04/21/2015 11:01:27 AM PDT by FredZarguna (It looks just like a Telefunken U-47 -- with leather.)
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To: tbw2

This gives credence to Romans chapter 1 where the godless are “given over” to homosexuality as a consequence of their rejection of God:

21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened.
22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools
23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like a mortal human being and birds and animals and reptiles.

24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another.
25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.

26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones.
27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.


25 posted on 04/21/2015 11:02:52 AM PDT by jonno (Having an opinion is not the same as having the answer...)
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To: SeekAndFind

Most lesbian movies are bad? Oh, the horror!


26 posted on 04/21/2015 11:03:51 AM PDT by Rummyfan (Let us now try liberty)
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To: Calpublican

You might also be interested in the story of this “gay” Catholic who struggled with wanting to live a moral life. This is a long article about his journey to chastity:
http://www.virtueonline.org/portal/modules/news/article.php?storyid=3650#.UWB7zEpxboY


27 posted on 04/21/2015 11:06:51 AM PDT by jonno (Having an opinion is not the same as having the answer...)
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To: FredZarguna
Thanks. Anecdotally, a non-trivial number of young women experiment with same-sex sexual relations and then go on to have opposite-sex relationships and marriages for the rest of their lives. I'm told this type of experimentation is much less common among young men.
28 posted on 04/21/2015 11:07:16 AM PDT by riverdawg
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To: SeekAndFind

What I don’t understand is why everyone just doesn’t “turn gay” to claim the benefits, which would cause the present preference system to collapse.

I know at least one person in my office who claims to be gay, but I’m sure he’s not. He’s got other issues going on, and uses his gay claim to get sympathy and attention and as an excuse when he doesn’t do what he’s supposed to do.


29 posted on 04/21/2015 11:10:25 AM PDT by kaehurowing
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To: SeekAndFind

I am tired of hearing how ‘tough’ it is to be a homosexual. You want to try tough - try being a heterosexual.


30 posted on 04/21/2015 11:12:08 AM PDT by olepap (Your old Pappy)
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To: kaehurowing

RE: uses his gay claim to get sympathy and attention and as an excuse when he doesn’t do what he’s supposed to do.

Is he an ethnic minority? If not, that could explain wht he’s doing it ...


31 posted on 04/21/2015 11:18:43 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
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To: riverdawg
RE: Thanks. Anecdotally, a non-trivial number of young women experiment with same-sex sexual relations and then go on to have opposite-sex relationships and marriages for the rest of their lives

Case in point -- Chirlane De Blasio...


32 posted on 04/21/2015 11:20:13 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
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To: riverdawg

riverdog; Here’s a place to start: How the APA “finding” that it’s all genetic is a “finding” that is not in any way “scientific.”

http://josephnicolosi.com/who-were-the-apa-task-force-me/


33 posted on 04/21/2015 11:22:22 AM PDT by cookcounty ("Random Citizen:" ...ObamaSpeak for "Christian.")
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To: SeekAndFind

He’s white. I think it’s a combination of personal insecurity issues and knowing that claiming you’re gay gives you substantial protection against being fired. He shows absolutely no evidence of being gay, but he’s very quick to let you know he is.


34 posted on 04/21/2015 11:26:57 AM PDT by kaehurowing
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To: SeekAndFind
I know a lot of wonderful straight men who have done the work of breaking down their internalized sexism and developing a more nuanced way of relating to women

Their "internalized sexism"? Wow. So, as with racism, we're all mysogynists and/or sexists too, right? Listen honey, don't sit there and say you have nothing against men, when you so obviously do. According to you, all men are sexist, apparently from birth.

35 posted on 04/21/2015 11:27:55 AM PDT by Sicon ("All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others." - G. Orwell)
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To: Jack Black

Libs want us to believe sexual atraction, particularly homosexuality, is something you are born with but gender is something one can choose. sheesh...


36 posted on 04/21/2015 11:31:20 AM PDT by outofsalt ( If history teaches us anything it's that history rarely teaches us anything.)
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To: Jack Black

Homosexuality is a difficult subject.

Inherently, EVERYONE knows that it’s wrong. There are two genders for a reason.

The families that have homosexuals in them know that homosexuality is a shallow and empty life. They just want the pain to end. They give up and just want their family member to not be troubled by others.

All people know that homosexuality is wrong, but they have a hard time explaining their feelings. So, they shame homosexuals. It is a quick way of letting someone know that you feel homosexuality is wrong. The person is right, homosexuality is wrong, but the use of shame is seen as harsh and uncaring. That’s not right. An uncaring person would say nothing.

So, we must go for these long explanations of why we are against homosexuality. We want the person to enjoy the fullness and richness of life that is only found through marriage to a person of the opposite gender. We don’t hate your family members. We understand that it is hard for the family. But, marriage is between a male and a female. We understand that there are legal considerations, but there are ways to address them that don’t involve changing marriage.

Harming marriage does not help end the emptiness and sadness of a homosexual life.

“Well, cousin Diane could never attract a man.”

Yes. That is sad. But is it really true? Or is homosexuality just easier?

Homosexuality means that a person defines themself by their sexual activities. It’s like meeting someone and they say, “I’m a philanderer.”. It’s empty.

Yes, I realize that homosexuality and abortion are supported by Liberals and that that dichotomy is going to eventually come to a head and shake them to the core.

Our culture is weary with fighting. Many want to just let the homosexuals and their families and supporters encourage the empty, sad life of homosexuality.

I want every homosexual to be loved. I want them to know the richness and fullness of marriage to a person of the opposite gender. I want them to know the love of family and friends. I want them to know the fullness of love from our Lord Jesus Christ. I don’t want anyone to “settle” for pain and emptiness.


37 posted on 04/21/2015 11:38:57 AM PDT by blueunicorn6 ("A crack shot and a good dancer")
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To: Calpublican

I fear the real reason is sexual child abuse at esp. younger and alarming ages where the memories get buried deep. The memories get buried b/c the child feels guilt and assumes they did something wrong rather than assigning it to the true guilty party. It becomes a catch-22 where each succeeding generation has more abuse, guilt and wrong assumptions eventually leading to a society like Sodom where not even ‘5 good men were found’.


38 posted on 04/21/2015 11:50:47 AM PDT by BrandtMichaels
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To: BrandtMichaels

I often wonder about the folks who want to sexualize young children by introducing them to masturbation and/or the “normalcy” of homosexual relationships.

Your post explains who these people are. They are exposed at an early age - so they expose their own children at an early age. “Why inhibit our children? It’s only natural...”


39 posted on 04/21/2015 12:00:16 PM PDT by jonno (Having an opinion is not the same as having the answer...)
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To: jonno
For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him...

I love the way the late Dr. A.E. Wilder-Smith explained this phrase.

To paraphrase: Upon knowing God, their response is either "I refuse accept it" or "I don't care."

40 posted on 04/21/2015 12:19:24 PM PDT by papertyger (Those who don't fight evil hate those who do)
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