Posted on 04/22/2015 7:07:01 PM PDT by NetAddicted
1John4 describes how we can tell antichrist deceivers....the simply deny that Jesus was the Christ come in the flesh....they deny that he is man and God and the only way to Salvation. Eziekiel 37-38 speaks of Israel’s secularism being reversed on account of God moving supernaturally to save them. Ezekiel 7 describes Israel as a valley of dry bones.
You mention Romans 11....yes it was true that these “olive branches were taken out to allow the gentiles to be grafted in. Butr you need to take the chapter as a whole. Paul said they were taken out because of unbelief an he warned the gentiles that the same could happen to them as well. You failed to mention the versus after verse 26 which does speak of an actual redemption of Jews and Israel proper...
“25 I do not want you to be ignorant of this mystery, brothers and sisters, so that you may not be conceited: Israel has experienced a hardening in part until the full number of the Gentiles has come in, 26 and in this way[e] all Israel will be saved. As it is written:
“The deliverer will come from Zion;
he will turn godlessness away from Jacob.
27
And this is[f] my covenant with them
when I take away their sins.”[g]
28 As far as the gospel is concerned, they are enemies for your sake; but as far as election is concerned, they are loved on account of the patriarchs, 29 for God’s gifts and his call are irrevocable. 30 Just as you who were at one time disobedient to God have now received mercy as a result of their disobedience, 31 so they too have now become disobedient in order that they too may now[h] receive mercy as a result of God’s mercy to you. 32 For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.”
Do you think any nation is created without the express will of the Father? God manipulated the evil Heart of Pharoah, do you not think NWO types are not similarly being “worked around”? The God of Deep Heaven has cast his nets and the fish will be caught up and left flapping on the rocks in stunned surprise! Is it so impossible that God should declare, Israel will be a nation forever, and have the ability make it so?
All Israel will be saved, the nation restored, and the Messiah will rule out of Jerusalem in the millennial reign!
It is cool and popular to say you are anti-religious amongst Israel's elite but that does not mean they do not believe, it means that Jews are skeptics and are wary of extremism, just as they always have been.
Ask any Jew in LA or Tel Aviv if they are religious and just on a that, they will say G-d does not exist but in their hearts, well, that is a different story.
As a Noachide regarding the Jews, my sentiments exactly.
From NJ Jewish News:
(excerpt, read more at link):
“2. Belief in God is not required
Enough with Jews opting out of Judaism because they “don’t believe in God.” You do not need to believe in God — whatever that even means — to be a good Jew. Meaningful Judaism can be about values, tradition, culture, and community.”
If you peruse the comments after the article, you’ll find 7; 5 positive, 2 negative.
Of the 2 negatives, 1 was unhappy about the first “commandment” about being able to have Jewish grandchildren, the other bemoaned the idea of isolationism.
None of the comments specifically refuted “commandment” #2, that belief in God was “optional”.
There is a huge influence in modern-day Judaism, which could arguably be called a secular Judaism, where being a Jew is primarily about ethnicity, culture, tradition, etc.
Seinfeld even made light of it in the episode where the dentist converts to Judaism and Jerry suspects the guy just converted so he could tell Jewish jokes without anyone being able to say he was being anti-Semitic.
I invite the reader to read the article I excerpted and do their own research into support amongst the secular Jewish community, especially those who are of considerable means and societal influence, for things like the homosexual agenda.
Evangelicals really seem to live in a fantasy world when it comes to modern Judaism; in the evangelical’s mind too often it seems they view all Jews as though they are characters from the Bible, whereas modern Jews are much more typically in line with secular humanism than they are in line with any Biblical doctrine.
I mean, “belief in God is optional” ? The whole article is a parody on the Ten Commandments ? On a Jewish news website ? And no one even responds to it ?
It’s like there’s this groundwell of Christian support for the modern state of Israel, yet Jews the world over appear to have turned their back on true belief in God, other than going through the motions of traditions and “sticking together” as a societal group.
Israel may presently be regathered as a nation by in large in unbelief; but the wonderful news is there is coming a day when "they will look upon Him whom they have pierced"; "mourn for Him as one mourns for his only son" and as a nation, the remnant that is left after 3 1/2 years of unprecedented, world-wide persecution ("the time of Jacob's trouble") will individually and collectively as a nation believe on the Lord Jesus Christ to the saving of their souls and thus "ALL ISRAEL WILL BE SAVED".
As a believing gentile, I thank God for the Jews and for Israel; ALL that I have in Christ I humbly owe to them! They alone were given "the oracles of God"; They alone are "the apple of God's eye"; as a nation, they alone are God's "chosen people" and most important of all; in His perfect humanity, my Savior is a Jew: "the seed of David"; "the Lion of Judah", the descendant of Abraham through whom "all the world will be blessed".
Along with the Apostle Paul; my prayer and burning heart's desire for Israel is that Israel may believe on Yeshua; their promised Messiah (Isaiah 53; Psalm 22), and be saved.
My beloved friend, if you are a Jew (or gentile) and you are reading this: God loves you. He loves you so much that He sent His sinless son into this sinful, lost and dying world; born of a virgin, born under the Law in order to fulfill the entire law so that He, the sinless, spotless "Lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world", would be sacrificed "outside the camp", crucified on a cruel cross; be cursed of God in order to shed His precious blood to make atonement for all of your sins and mine so that we may believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and be saved; delivered from the power and penalty of our sins; given eternal life and made sons and heirs of God through faith in Yeshua and His finished work on Calvary. Not only this; but God the Father demonstrated that He is completely satisfied with Yeshua's ONE, perfect, all sufficient, sacrifice by bodily, physically raising Yeshua from the dead on the third day, just as Yeshua had said He would!
"What must I do to be saved?" "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and you shall be saved". "For whosoever calls upon the name of the Lord SHALL BE SAVED"!
Is God in control or not? Is the Holy Spirit so much “chopped liver” to you?
Yes, of course he is.
If you’d like to be on or off, please FR mail me.
..................
This would be at odds with polls over the years which show that upwards of 70% of Israel's Jews fast on Yom Kippur, celebrate the holidays, around half observing Kashrut and Shabbos. But perhaps not in complete compliance. To an Israeli the term religious would likely connote what is referred to by non-Israelis as ultra Orthodox or Orthodox. And 20% of the population is Muslim. How did they answer. Was their an implication in the question that the religion was Judaism. It's hard to think many Muslims acknowledged to a poll they don't believe in their faith.
http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/45132/jewish/What-Makes-a-Jew-Jewish.htm
...The Torah itself proclaims (Leviticus 16:16) that G-d “dwells amongst them in the midst of their impurities” — that His relationship with His people remains unaffected regardless of their behavior. In the words of the Talmud (Sanhedrin 44a), “A Jew, although he has transgressed, is a Jew.”
According to Torah law, a person’s Jewishness is not a matter of life-style or self-perception: one may be totally unaware of one’s Jewishness and still be a Jew, or one may consider himself Jewish and observe all the precepts of the Torah and still not be a Jew.
In other words, it is the relationship between the Jew and his Creator that defines his Jewishness — not his acknowledgment of this relationship or his actualization of it in his daily life. It is not the observance of Torah’s mitzvot (Divine “commandments”) that makes him a Jew, but the commitment that the mitzvot represent...
I don't just doubt your arrogant viewpoint. I know that you are completely and utterly wrong.
The end times are all about Israel---completely centered around the apple of God's eye. God made an eternal covenant with Israel, and though they haven't lived up to their part of it, He will never abandon them, and in fact, will bring them back into the land He gave them in order that they will be saved.
Instead of mistakenly believing that Christians have replaced the Jews as the chosen people, you need to get back to what the Bible says. We Christians are God's adopted children---the Jews are His first and true chosen, the ones Jesus came for initially. When they didn't listen, the Gospel was given to the Gentiles, but only through God's grace. Don't make the arrogant mistake of believing we have somehow taken the place of the Jews. He is far from done with them.
As Paul said, we are the wild shoots that have been grafted onto the olive tree (Israel). And Jesus said that salvation comes through the Jews.
Christians should be thankful for the privilege of being allowed to share in God's covenant with Israel.
Catherine, just keep in mind that there is only personal salvation through Jesus Christ; those who reject Christ are destined for eternal damnation.
Also, a civil government of a nation, when it rejects Jesus Christ, is a nation obstinately opposed to God.
Oh, I agree completely, Pieter. Everyone has a decision to make regarding Jesus-—acceptance or rejection. He IS the Way, the Truth, and the Life.
I was only repeating what the Bible says about salvation coming through the Jews. It’s true that Israel, as a nation, has rejected Jesus, but according to Scripture, all of the Jews who are alive at the end will be saved.
It’s true that they’re an obstinate (”stiff-necked”)people, but so are we all. That’s the nature of sinners.
I agree. Where did I claim otherwise?
" Why do people even question that."
I'm not. Why do you say so?
"Any Jew hindu,moslem or mormon can Believe in Jesus and are then saved . Never until that moment. John 3:16-17-18."
Absolutely agree.
"I am amazed at the deniers of Christ as the ONLY way"
Again, I haven't, so why do you keep on with this?
Read my post again. You know John 3 well, but there are some other things you missed, apparently. For instance, the eternal nature of God's covenant with the Jews. Does that mean they go to heaven without Jesus? Of course not. But it DOES mean, and again, Scripture is clear, that WE are grafted onto the olive branch. We're the adopted kids. And that happened because the Jews rejected the Gospel.
So instead of getting all full of ourselves and thinking we've replaced Israel in God's heart, we should be grateful for the opportunity.
Also according to Scripture, at the end all of the Jews alive will recognize Christ as their Messiah, and be saved. Do you see that God has never stopped loving them?
Everything revolves around Jerusalem---when it comes to the end times, that is. And there's a reason for it.
Tithing is a moral command, not a ceremonial one; it is simply about financially supporting the Christ’s Church, which of course continued in the New Testament. That’s why years ago it was expected. The difference is that in the New Testament we see it more clearly revealed that tithing does not merit salvation in any way.
What Christ found so wrong in the Temple practices regarding money and sacrifices is that the system had been grossly corrupted, taking advantage of the opportunity available to the priesthood. Since part of the priesthood’s purview was determining whether an animal was fit for sacrifice, and since everyone travelling a distance bringing their own animals with them would be much more challenging than buying one in the city once they arrived, a system of “inside” vendors developed, “conviently” right inside the Temple, however they gave in to temptation and began reaping significant profits from this “trade”. It was taking a “cut” for themselves out of the Temple sacrificial system that was instituted by God.
Note carefully how “some” denominations have what could be argued is essentially the same category of offence today, and that there have been similar corruptions over the years.
There are many actions that the Bible exhorts and commands the believer, moral laws, but here’s the New Testament clarification of understanding (which actually can be construed from the Old Testament but it was not accurately understood and had been perverted) - things that are offered to God but not out of willing, joyful obedience - are sin !
We are not to give to God begrudgingly - it is sin.
Only those things offered to God that are given willingly, joyfully - only those things God finds pleasing. We see in the New Testament a much simpler, clearer understanding, with the benefit of hindsight and all that is revealed by the New Testament. For example, if we are completely broke, and earning little or no money - we can’t at that moment tithe. But in no way does that lack of tithe mean that we are destined for hell because of that lack of tithe. We should realize - we ARE at that point the poor. We need help ourselves lol ! Now, if we’re earning enough to get along if we are wise with our money (so not that much) - God knows our decisions with our money. Even though we may not be earning a ton of money, just getting by, people used to be very frugal - and we can be. We have to ask ourselves if we had a person we really, really loved, cared about, thought the world of - would we find the money to care for that person if they needed food and a place to live ? Of course. So we can scrimp and make room in our budget; we can forgo eating out, cut down on new clothes, etc., etc., since God should be the most important of ALL to us. Remember how Jesus said that the small amount of money the poor woman tithed was much more than the amount the wealthy tithe ? Since the wealthy can easily provide for their needs and wants and have plenty left over, their tithes don’t cause them financial pain. They’re not debating whether to pay the electric bill or tithe. They don’t have to sacrifice anything difficult to sacrifice in order to come up with the tenth part to tithe.
Our motivation for tithing under the NT should be coming from our hearts - not from being told by pastors that our tithing can possibly “make or break” our salvation. It’s logically the cart before the horse; it’s really the other way around. Those who ARE saved WILL have the desire to support their Church in their heart. They will be driven to listen to the Word of God to find out how much God wants; when they find out he wants the tenth part, they will steadfastly make it their business to set that aside FIRST, according to the Scriptural model. God wants the first fruits - not our leftovers after we get done buying our necessities and then all our fun things, and then say, gee, here’s the change, I’ll tithe that. This idea of first fruits of course is a consistent model throughout the Bible.
Also very important is that if we are in a state of sin we need to repent first before offering anything to God. This is consistent in OT and NT. For OT, see Isaiah 1, for example. NT the concept is all over, the first thing we need to do is repent. This includes admitting that we sin - and turning away from our sin as we ask God to forgive us we are covenanting with God that we have turned away from that particular sin and that we will not any more defile ourselves with that sin. We must never take such repentance lightly, of course. If we never examine ourselves, that is, our words, thoughts and deeds, we would never see our own sins. We should know that the Bible exhorts us to be mindful of what we say, do and think. Also, to be open when our brothers in Christ come to us privately, in Christian love and compassion, and point out what they see as sin in our lives, to respond to them truthfully (perhaps they are correct, perhaps not, but the truth needs to be discerned, as we should be thankful of knowing that we have sinned so that we can repent and get right with God).
In any case, I think it is important for Christians to realize that, as you say, the only path to salvation is in Christ Jesus; the Bible is clear, there is no other way. And it is also clear that those who do not accept Christ as their Lord and Savior are haters of God. It’s hard for people to see that with all the misleading preaching that goes on and the heretical doctrines that are taught.
It would be wise to remember that though we all can be obstinate, “we” as Christians profess faith in Christ. If others do not profess faith in Christ, they are not saved at that point, they have not been born again in Christ, and they thus are destined for a lake of fire.
We do them no favor by not testifying of the Gospel to them, and harboring any delusion that they will not spend eternity in hell based solely on the merits of their ethnicity or adherence to abrogated ceremonial law, which, of course, are all vanity.
We correct those we love.
Remember John the Baptist’s words:
Matthew 3
“1 In those days came John the Baptist, preaching in the wilderness of Judaea,
2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.
3 For this is he that was spoken of by the prophet Esaias, saying, The voice of one crying in the wilderness, Prepare ye the way of the Lord, make his paths straight.”
We do them no favor by not testifying of the Gospel to them, and harboring any delusion that they will not spend eternity in hell based solely on the merits of their ethnicity or adherence to abrogated ceremonial law, which, of course, are all vanity."
Pieter, is there something in the water?
I suggest you go back and read my posts in this thread. Or, maybe just re-read the one I posted directly to you. And read it slowly this time so you understand it. It's pretty clear, really.
We’re saying very much of the same things, but we are still debating a point that is very subtle, yet significant.
I need to step away for a while; perhaps you can figure out my next point by going over Romans 11 and Romans 8 in detail, and perhaps searching Scripture for the world believe; Matthew Henry’s commentary on Isaiah 50 is useful.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.