Posted on 06/20/2015 9:41:46 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
it takes 2 seconds to reload a Glock magazine...i have one...its easy.
Of course you are correct. Had this delusional twerp gone after Bloods or Crips he wouldn’t be news. Just another stupid kid with a toe tag.
Oh, OK then, just stand around or hide and wait to be shot to death then.
Who brings a gun to church?
Every parishioner should. The Church is like an extended family. They deserve your protection.
Is that what he used? Please show the citation. Since he "reloaded several times" I was thinking he used a revolver...
I'm wondering the same. And did they run? Is it possible they all were wounded after the first shots and so were unable to do anything? Or could they have been shocked and frightened, and maybe they tried talking him out of it, instead?
Who knows how we all might react in that situation.
Rest in peace.
I will guess that at least half of the members in our church are armed every Sunday.
We can only speculate regarding the details of this event, because not much has been reported. I have wondered where the parishioners were when the psycho was shooting. Did he shoot the pastor first and then turn and make every line up at the altar. Where were they all when this was going down? In the front of the church, at the altar, the back of the church? So few details have been given, that it’s difficult to ascertain what those poor, unfortunate souls could or couldn’t do. Heck, if someone was behind him, one of the ladies could have smacked him in the head with a heavy purse. This is why I am waiting for details on how this all came down. If anyone has any - please post.
If you saw the pics of him at home, he was holding the Glock in several of the pictures. Also a .45acp revolver is somewhat rare. I can think of a couple of manufacturers, but you just don’t see many out there.
Absolutely! I'll even take it a step further ....I will rush someone armed with a Kalashnikov.
Why?
Because I am Kenyan, and I have seen what terrorists do to their victims. Compliance simply means they kill you at their leasure. They will not negotiate, they have no mercy, and their plan is to kill as many people as possible before they're taken out. Which means one simple thing ...there is nothing to lose in rushing them! Since they plan on killing you anyway, you might as well give yourself an iota of a chance. After all, compliance only means death. The last couple of attacks, in particular the university attack, has absolutely changed the way such scenarios as perceived. Before it was compliance. Now it is fighting back, even if the tools are teeth and knuckles. If they plan on killing you anyway you might as well try something.
Fortunately I am one of the few armed Kenyans (a Glock 19 that cost 2,500 bucks due to the local market), but the important shift has been mindset.
For this chap the same mindset should have applied, and should apply in the future. Whether the terrorist is a Jihadi or a black gangbanger or a white skinhead ....same application. This person or people, are out to kill you! There is nothing at all to lose in fighting back, and fighting back hard.
The passengers on Flight 93 didn't die without a fight.
Does it matter that it is a Glock vs a Sig, Smith & Wesson, Beretta, H&K, Colt, or Taurus shooting a .45 ACP vs. a 9mm parabellum?
Prior to that, everyone threw rocks and chucked spears at bad guys.
Seriously, this is not a Glock: https://youtu.be/Ls4Uq1aCiTA
.
Or a SIG...
.
(Pistol newbs are seldom aware of any other manufacturer or platform other than Glock.)
Exactly! When the only option left is death then the choice to rush the attackers is an obvious one. Flight 93 is a great example of a group of heroes who had to do what had to be done, and even though it did not turn out the way they may have hoped for, I still strongly believe that they saved many lives. When facing terrorists, no matter their specific ideology or geography, people should always be prepared to turn the attackers into victims. Even when not successful it will at least make the next iteration of terrorist realize that things will not be as simple as before. For example, it would be ludicrous for Jihadi to plan to hijack an American plane ...even the aged would attack them and even toddlers may be gnawing at their ankles!
My thoughts too - of course it's a lot easier to say it from our position of safety than to gather oneself and do it in the face of what was happening. I'd like to think I would have rushed him but until the situation actually arises, none of us can do better than to to imagine ourselves doing what we consider to be the right thing.
Even worse, the law actually provides that the “appropriate church official or governing body” can give permission for CC license holders to carry in any given church. Tragically, such permission was not given here and pastor Pinckney, as a state legislator, ardently opposed shall issue CC legislation.
Here is his gun. It appears to be a G41 with a laser sight. If he got it new he got one spare mag with it. He may have bought more at time of purchase. Its about half way down the page.
“Who brings a gun to church?”
The Sheepdogs.
I do, and I know many others that do. I am a part of my Church’s volunteer security detail. Most are former or serving military/peace officers and have concealed carry permits, though those are not needed in Arizona.
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