Posted on 09/28/2015 8:58:19 AM PDT by SeekAndFind
American intelligence analysts have been pressured into giving a more positive assessment of the progress of the war against ISIS, it has been reported, confirming what was obvious to everyone not subject to influence from the White House: the anti-ISIS campaign is failing.
To devise an effective strategy involves understanding where ISIS came from, and that involves examining the Saddam Hussein regime.
Saddam is commonly regarded as the quintessential secularist, and he was initially. But the Saddam regime Islamized over its last 15 years, effectively creating a religious movement under Saddam's leadership, giving additional space and power to the non-governmental Salafi trend, and hardening the sectarian differences in Iraq — paving the way for something like ISIS in its aftermath.
After the Ba'ath Party seized power in Iraq in 1968 it was never able to wholly separate religion from politics because to do so would have provoked a popular backlash and probably the party's downfall. But especially in the first half of the 1970s, buoyed with confidence by increased oil revenue, the Ba'ath was able to show its secularism more clearly, and there were even hints of atheism, especially in the party's more high-brow magazines.
The unveiling of a giant statue of the Abbasid-era poet Abu Nuwas, best known for his wine-laden and homoerotic poetry, can only have been intended to tweak the sensibilities of the traditionalists.
In the late 1970s, the Iraqi Ba'ath regime had held firm against the "return of Islam," notably with Saddam's series of programmatic lectures in 1977, saying that while the Ba'ath were good Muslims they would not compete on the Islamists’ turf in terms of governance; the Sharia was "ancient jurisprudence," Saddam said, and no basis for a modern regime. Saddam's regime rode out the internal upheaval caused by the Iranian Revolution,
(Excerpt) Read more at businessinsider.com ...
ISIS didn’t start in Iraq. ISIS emerged from the shadows of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, the same Muslim Brotherhood that Obama supported when they tossed Mubarek in jail.
The fighters were forced to leave Egypt after they killed Anwar Sadat and moved to other areas including Iraq (to fight in the Iran-Iraq war) and Afghanistan (to fight the Russians).
Al Qaeda, Taliban, ISIS/ISIL all have roots from Egyptian Islamists supported by Saudi money.
How foolish it seems, in retrospect, to have expected “Arab Democracy” to have sprung from this nest of vipers.
Excellent history of Saddam’s program of Islamization as a means to preserve his standing, and how the regime’s security elements formulated the insurgency and enabled to formation of ISIS.
Also interesting to note that ISIS “caliphate” went to Saddam’s Islamic university. This was the same guy released by Obama following the success of the surge.
Its important to understand all of this, especially when the Left in the country tries to manipulate the history of the Iraq conflict.
The USA armed the forerunners of ISIS.
Ask this question:
Would the mid-east be such a basket case if Iraq had not been invaded and Saddam Hussein had not been removed from power?
That was supposedly done in response to the 9/11 terrorist attacks on the US.
Don’t forget that 15 of the 19 terrorists on 9/11 were Saudi Arabian, one was Egyptian, one was Lebanese and two were from the UAE.
None were Iraqi.
My name is Kyle Orton. I did a degree in zoology but found that my interests shifted from biology to politics and history, and especially to the Greater Middle East and the world of Islam. I have just finished a social science Masters in Humanitarian Studies at the Liverpool School of Tropical Medicine that comprises elements of geopolitics, history, and practical skills in running a humanitarian program, the logical end-point of which would be work with a non-governmental organisation.
I have traveled quite widely, especially in Eastern Europe, and in the Balkans. I have also worked in Lebanon for my Masters on the healthcare system for the Syrian refugees.
https://kyleorton1991.wordpress.com/author/kyleworton/
In 1982, Syria severed diplomatic relations with Iraq because of Saddam’s support for the Muslim Brotherhood that was trying to overthrow Assad.
“How foolish it seems, in retrospect, to have expected “Arab Democracy” to have sprung from this nest of vipers.”
No, I don’t think so. I think it was entirely predictable. If you listen to Mark Levin (or are familiar with some of his “classics” [for want of a better word]) then you know Democracy relies upon a common, widespread morality and other elements that comprise the underpinning of a “civil society”.
I’ll not pretend to lecture you or anyone else to what those elements are. Suffice it to say, the notion of going into Iraq 2003 with the hope that Democracy would spring from the innate desires and aspirations of the people was very much a long shot. Very. And I believe any competent Arab scholar could have predicted to the GWBush admin why such an effort was doomed to failure. The fact of the matter is, there’s nothing harder than getting people to change their religion. And their religion says Mohammed is the supreme being/power. So now, you want to go in there and have them respect a set of laws, a Constitution of whatever form, if you will, is now the highest power. Was never going to happen. Would never happen even if the subject country was a petri dish, isolated from its neighbors. In this case, the idea that any given city, once captured or freed of rebels, would just sit there and gladly accept US influence without outside interference of many types....was naive.
“The USA armed the forerunners of ISIS.”
Cite Source
“Ask this question:
Would the mid-east be such a basket case if Iraq had not been invaded and Saddam Hussein had not been removed from power?”
Saddam’s chambers of horrors
Margaret Wente
Saturday, Nov. 23, 2002
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/saddams-chambers-of-horrors/article758101/?page=all
Inside Saddam’s Reign Of Terror
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubLJSc6iIx4
You are of course aware of what Iraq was like when we pulled out right?
Cite Source
Source?
Just Google: "How The USA Armed ISIS"
Everyone knows that Obama was so eager to force Assad out that he engineered the gift of many hundreds of millions of US dollars and tons upon tons of US weapons to anyone who claimed they would fight Assad.
Remember those "moderate Syrian rebels" that Obama equipped and supported?
It trurns out that the people who received this bounty from the USA and USA allies were al Nusra and al Qaeda and jihadi extremists from all over the world.
And of course, al Qaeda morhed into ISIS (or ISIL if you are Obama)
So in other words you can’t cite a credible source.
So in other words you don't know what has been going on with our government and the mid-east since Obama took office.
Riiiight! Buddy I’ve forgotten more about this stuff than most people know.
I missed the part of your reply where you cited a credible source.
Not the forerunners. The "forerunners" of ISIS were the folks we were fighting before and during the surge - Zarqawi's palestinian group in Jordan, his three cells in Iraq [including 1 in Baghdad which was largely Egyptian] [Zarqawi, the first formal leader of ISIS, also had operatives on the Iran-Afghan border who controlled the smuggling routes there], and Mullah Krekar's group of Kurds and Iraq intel which operated in Europe, Syria and Iraq prior to and during the US invasion... and Iraqi Gen. al Dhouri's Nashqbani Baath followers and former Iraqi intel personnel [JRTN]. You'd be hard pressed to find the US arming any of them- in those days their weapons of choice were Russian or Russian knockoffs, most likely. Years AFTER the forerunners merged into AQinIraq and later renamed themselves ISIS and after the Obama drawdown they were able to capture US arms when they reinvaded from the North and overran Iraqi troops and police. And more recently in Syria there's no telling what was given vs what was taken because I'm pretty sure Obama's not on our side.
“How foolish it seems, in retrospect, to have expected “Arab Democracy” to have sprung from this nest of vipers.”
There was no nonsense too foolish for the geniuses guiding the Dubya administration.
They live in a fantasy world where religion and culture are insignificant. Where Islam is “a religion of peace” and is just as likely to foster a democracy as the Christian West.
Over the years there have been countless books discussing how America’s culture and its Christian roots allowed for the creation of a democratic republic. You could hardly find a book by Russell Kirk that didn’t touch on this theme.
Of course the only thing needed to hide that wisdom from the Bushies was to put it into a book.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.