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Scientists planted hairs from lynx in 3rd forest
Washington Times ^ | 01/04/2002 | Audrey Hudson

Posted on 01/03/2002 10:25:56 PM PST by Pokey78

Edited on 07/12/2004 3:50:24 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

Government scientists planted samples of lynx hairs in a third national forest, according to documents obtained by The Washington Times.

"A preliminary investigation by the U.S. Forest Service said planted samples were submitted from the Mount Baker/Snoqualmie National Forest in Washington state, but the report did not say how many additional samples were submitted from that region.


(Excerpt) Read more at washtimes.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: enviralists; klamathbasincrisis
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To: willyone
Would you please explain to Bush that the decisions made by Federal District Court and upheld in the 9th Circuit do not carry the force of law.

What does jumop mean, Mr. Intellectual Midget.

101 posted on 01/04/2002 10:43:12 AM PST by Ben Ficklin
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To: anniegetyourgun
Ok, Annie, how would *you* have punished Gorton for his pro-perjury stance? If the GOP committee or convention or whatever wouldn't?
102 posted on 01/04/2002 10:44:01 AM PST by Virginia-American
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To: zog
How does it feel to walk around all the time with a bad case of the Red-Ass?
103 posted on 01/04/2002 10:45:48 AM PST by Ben Ficklin
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To: willyone
Another one who has opted out...
104 posted on 01/04/2002 10:48:45 AM PST by anniegetyourgun
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To: Pokey78
I demand that thes so called "Scientists" resign or be fired!!!!!
105 posted on 01/04/2002 10:54:20 AM PST by CPT Clay
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To: MarkWar
If he ever gets a hole drilled through that lamp post, it will forever be protected as a habitat for retarded woodpeckers. Pray he wears his pecker out before the hole in the pole, becomes a reality and an environmental site.
106 posted on 01/04/2002 11:02:23 AM PST by F.J. Mitchell
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To: Howlin
Check out #100 & #102 on this thread. Both are a clear indication of the brilliant plan by some on FR to "punish" Republicans by putting DEMS in control.
107 posted on 01/04/2002 11:02:27 AM PST by anniegetyourgun
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To: willyone
The more conservatives that stay home the better for the Dems. and their buddies.

So, you're admitting you're playing right into their hands? Who is the Democrat here? Could it possibly be YOU?

I doubt the dimwit George will ever figure that out

And you've been elected to which offices?

108 posted on 01/04/2002 11:06:01 AM PST by Howlin
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To: cake_crumb
Jus wisten at wus an we wunder why our wesponses get no wespect. I'm 69 going on twee, whas your excwuse?
109 posted on 01/04/2002 11:07:04 AM PST by F.J. Mitchell
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To: packrat01; 1Old Pro; 68-69TonkinGulfYatchClub; a_federalist; abner; Angus_Day; AnnaZ...
"e-s, for your ping list."

OK, but there are going to be som double hits here :-)

110 posted on 01/04/2002 11:36:05 AM PST by editor-surveyor
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To: zog
Whack...outta the ballpark.
111 posted on 01/04/2002 11:44:01 AM PST by Sandy
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To: Pokey78
This is the kind of crap the EnviroNAZI Gestapo is pulling all the time to steal farmers' and property owners' land and property rights.

But usually the government is completely on their side and won't investigate and prosecute this kind of criminal behavior.

112 posted on 01/04/2002 11:46:40 AM PST by t-shirt
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To: copycat
"How much more of what we think is "environmental science" is total bullsquat?"

100%

113 posted on 01/04/2002 11:47:57 AM PST by editor-surveyor
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To: pad 34
"If you find the "list", put me on it."

Yer on it now!

114 posted on 01/04/2002 12:00:43 PM PST by editor-surveyor
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To: farmfriend
HI farmfriend. Good to see you. I always appreciate pings from you.
115 posted on 01/04/2002 12:03:54 PM PST by Snow Bunny
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To: Pokey78
In Albany, New York the Pine Bush reserve has grown larger
because of the Karner Blue butterfly achieving endangered
species status.

Recently, another wooded area 30 miles away achieved
similar status nearby. How difficult would it be to
move some butterfly eggs by car to some lupine plants
to achieve more protected areas, grants, and enviro jobs?

116 posted on 01/04/2002 12:20:30 PM PST by rector seal
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To: zog
Hey Numby, there are no victims, there are only volunteers !!
117 posted on 01/04/2002 12:39:51 PM PST by blackie
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To: farmfriend
Stop wacko enviro-nazis terrorist's, now !!

Freedom Is Worth Fighting For !!

The Right Of The People To Keep And Bear Arms Shall Not Be Infringed !!

An Armed Citizen, Is A Safe Citizen !!

No Guns, No Rights !!

Molon Labe !!

118 posted on 01/04/2002 12:41:32 PM PST by blackie
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To: cake_crumb
>The woodpecker you saw is called a flicka.

Thanks for the birder knowledge!

This has been an interestsing summer & fall for me. Not only have I seen this woodpecker, but during the summer, I walked out of an alley and walked straight into a scene with a hawk of some type standing on the ground (well, it was standing on the pigeon as it ate it) eating a pigeon! I got a _real_ closeup look at the hawk and tried to look it up in a birder book. I believe it was a juvenile northern harrier -- it had a breast pattern that I didn't see on any pictures, but the book said that young northern harriers have the patterned chest that disappears as they get older. Just about a week ago, I saw a _very_ similar looking hawk on the fence next to my garage that had a plain chest, so I'm thinking I may have seen the same hawk as a youngster, and then as a grown up.

I'm a Chicago guy, and my idea of wild life is basically sparrows and pigeons. These hawks and woodpeckers are extra treats for me...

Mark W.

119 posted on 01/04/2002 12:43:51 PM PST by MarkWar
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To: jennyp
If they were trying to test lab capabilities they would have memos going back and forth to eachother detailing their plans to cover their backsides.

If you don't have such memos it is because you DIDN'T want a paper trail. And if you are hiding something then you knew it was wrong and that implies you were not doing it for the good of the science, but to try and pull the wool over the community's eyes.

120 posted on 01/04/2002 1:19:41 PM PST by TheErnFormerlyKnownAsBig
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To: willyone
*Sigh*...you don't keep up on current events much do you...the info on Bush vs. Environmentalists can be found at the following website...

Sierra Club

When the facts on that website are presented, we find that the only reason your nose is out of joint is because you have shoved your head in the sand. Bush is doing everything he can to limit the influence of the envirowhackos on policy, he doesn't need to kiss anyone's ass for votes.

121 posted on 01/04/2002 1:19:48 PM PST by ravingnutter
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To: editor-surveyor
Thanks for the bump and article.
122 posted on 01/04/2002 1:36:37 PM PST by E.G.C.
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To: MarkWar
Why is anyone surprised ? The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service under the sainted liar Rachel Carson supported her and her bogus " research" and gave her awards and rewards even after she admitted lying, making up data, misinterpretind real data, forging data and drawing illogical and extraneous conclusions. She admitted all this and said " (my) agenda is more important than the truth..." . Why is anyone surprised that the Commies are still in control and lying still in the same service ??? Besides I've been wondering where all these endangered shit flies buzzin' around D.C. came from. Now we know. Rachel Carson , the leftist liar , is still believed and revered by 99.99% of all Americans who are typically uninformed and a product of their revisionist textbooks from a corrupt educational racket.
123 posted on 01/04/2002 1:39:11 PM PST by chemainus
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To: CPT Clay
Hell, 75% of them would have to go.... lets don't go into using federal grants to screen research for venture capital companies to get fat on while the U.S. taxpayer just pays and pays and pays and puts the "scientists" up a little higher in the ivory tower..... lets stay away from criticising the venerable " scientists' .... who the hell do you think pays them ??? Who controls the purse strings...
124 posted on 01/04/2002 1:43:27 PM PST by chemainus
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To: All
This is no earth shaking event in my eyes! These envirals are NOT, repeat NOT, scientists. The very best they could be called is investigators (and now we see what kind of investigations they do). They never have to prove sensitivity or specificity to their "data", most of the time they don't even have to prove their data! I would hazard an intelligent "guess" (this is based on all the enviral trash papers that I have read, and that's a lot) that is data is sooooo exstrapalated and manipulated that it losses all accuracy at the end of thier study.

Real, honest to goodness scientists, like myself, work long and hard on a project. We must produce volumes upon volumes of statistical data before we go to the next research step. That next step requires controlled testing and impecable record keeping, along with strict scientific analysis. All the way through the process the data must be kept "clean" and it must be analyzed by several different teams for absolute accuracy. Anybody gets caught "fudging", or presents falsified data they get canned (never to work in research again) and the entire project goes back to the beginning, do not pass "go", do not collect $200. Millions of dollars are wasted when this happens. Sometimes the project is dumped all together. Many of you that don't work in medical research don't realize that this has happened, and happens to this day. The people responsible for this are thrown out of the medical research community, they are branded, and they are never permitted to do ANY research activities again. The scientific community does not allow these breaches of protocol, they can't afford to.

Now, one might argue that this doesn't compare with medical research. Afterall, medicine deals with human life, and it should be held to a higher standard.......RIGHT? Well, are the lives of the farmers and ranchers in these areas any less important than a sick patient with a certain disease? Are the incomes and families of the people that live there any more important than that of those same sick people? Is the premise of the Constitution that accorded private property RIGHTS to the citizens of these here United States less important than the sick people with some terrible illness? Should environmental "science" be held to the same strict standards that medicial research is held to?

Those are a bunch of questions to answer, I know. I see it every day. Remember when the einvirals got their underwear in a bunch about alligators? They made all these "factoids" about the alligator is an endangered species. Stop killing the poor, innocent alligator. They came up with a statistic that supported their claim that the alligator was disappearing in north america. We believed it, and we stopped killing alligators for shoes, suitcases, and handbags. But, the Cajuns in the swamps of Louisiana didn't! Where they live they don't really get much "government intervention". Now we have an over proliferation of alligator populations in FLA (they were liberal enough to believe the "cooked" numbers of the envirals). They eat dogs, cats, potbellied pigs, and (sadly) little kids. When this debacle hits the envirals proclaim that they have saved the species and the harvesting of alligators can go ahead (regulated, of course). Here's the payoff----Louisiana never had this problem. They never stopped the hunt. Consequently, Louisiana never had to play catch-up with the rest of the south on this manure! Thank God for those defiant Cajuns in those southern Louisiana swamps. It turns out they were much better "conservationalists" than your average, run of the mill, ivy league educated, yankee, enviral, sommitch! How do you count alligators? You live with them, you hunt 'em, you eat 'em, that how! Believe me, those Cajuns, in those swamps are more of a scientist that 300 of those arrogant bastards that claim a degree!

125 posted on 01/04/2002 1:48:23 PM PST by timydnuc
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To: anniegetyourgun
From This 1999 article:
Impeachment isn't the only narrow issue on disaffected constituents' minds. Social and fiscal conservatives have plenty of disappointments to choose from: Sen. Gorton was AWOL during last year's debate on banning race and gender preferences in state government. He is an unabashed supporter of corporate welfare for professional sports teams and timber companies. He co-authored an op-ed article last year with state Attorney General Christine Gregoire, a protege and potential opponent, in support of monstrous tobacco legislation that would have hiked cigarette taxes and given unprecedented regulatory powers to the Food and Drug Administration.
He and his ilk are what you think we should all vote for, because they "have a chance of winning"? No thanks.
126 posted on 01/04/2002 2:00:03 PM PST by MadameAxe
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To: MadameAxe
Oops, it would help if I put in the link. Here's the article: Soft-'n'-cuddly Slade isn't fooling anybody
127 posted on 01/04/2002 2:01:58 PM PST by MadameAxe
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To: Pokey78
This sort of thing is what has been going on in all areas,parks,environment,guns and etc.for the last 30 to 35 years.All the claims we have been hearing and the resulting unjust laws came about because of all of this fraud.
128 posted on 01/04/2002 2:06:44 PM PST by INSENSITIVE GUY
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To: timydnuc
The best reply on this entire thread. Spot-on!
129 posted on 01/04/2002 2:26:11 PM PST by SW6906
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To: SW6906
Thanks---somebody is listening!
130 posted on 01/04/2002 2:35:24 PM PST by timydnuc
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To: MadameAxe
You're right - he wasn't perfect by any means. Of course, he would have been on the issue of this post with a vengance. But, of course, if you prefer Maria....
131 posted on 01/04/2002 2:46:43 PM PST by anniegetyourgun
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To: anniegetyourgun
Of course I don't. The point is, *neither* of them represented my views, and there was a candidate in the race who I did prefer, so that is who I voted for.

Instant runoff voting would allow people to vote positively, for those who best represent their views, instead of the "lesser of two evils", and end up with a candidate who most of the electorate agreed on even if it wasn't everyone's first choice. I urge you to look into it, if you are really interested in the best candidates being elected, and seeing that there are no "wasted" votes.

132 posted on 01/04/2002 3:04:48 PM PST by MadameAxe
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To: MadameAxe
"...there was a candidate in the race who I did prefer, so that is who I voted for. "

And in the absence of "instant runoff" you elected Maria.

133 posted on 01/04/2002 3:07:03 PM PST by anniegetyourgun
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To: timydnuc
--I liked it, too, by the way. would actually like to go gator huntin one day! hehehehe, how about underwater, with a speargun?
134 posted on 01/04/2002 3:12:55 PM PST by zog
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To: editor-surveyor
Thank You!

You never know when they'll fire up a "cat survey" in my neighborhood.. whoops, they already have (Northern MN).

135 posted on 01/04/2002 3:22:57 PM PST by pad 34
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To: anniegetyourgun
No, the people who voted for her did. Sorry you can't or won't see that.
136 posted on 01/04/2002 3:26:57 PM PST by MadameAxe
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To: MadameAxe
In many ways, you are right - the majority of Washingtonians who voted chose her. But so did those who stayed home or otherwise wasted their influence.
137 posted on 01/04/2002 3:33:06 PM PST by anniegetyourgun
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To: anniegetyourgun
This story is the perfect example of why the Endangered Species Act MUST be reformed! Call your congressmen!
138 posted on 01/04/2002 3:35:31 PM PST by Beamer
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To: anniegetyourgun
Senator Cantwell...she's a flaming lib who replaced Senator Gorton...he was ousted by folks like you who opted out, so now I have to deal with a senator who has been bought and paid for by Hillary Clinton.

There was so little difference between the R and D candidates as to be negligible. This is usually the case. Two big-government candidates from the two halves of the Incumbent party arguing over who has the best government programs. When Republicans start offering real small-government candidates who will stand their ground and not cowtow and pander like a political whore to every special interest group who promises campaign contributions, and who will actually deliver on their endless promises to reduce government, then maybe they'll start winning back people like me. Until then they will continue losing elections.

139 posted on 01/04/2002 3:45:08 PM PST by Alan Chapman
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To: anniegetyourgun
But so did those who stayed home or otherwise wasted their influence.

Perhaps if the "R"s in WA want the votes of libertarians in the next election, they should field a candidate who pays more than lip service (or no service at all!) to his supposed commitment to smaller, less intrusive government.

Meanwhile, I will promote IRV to everyone I run across as a fair and reasonable alternative to current election procedures. I guess it must not seem as attractive to major party people as it does to me, since, if implemented, it might shatter the myth that 3rd party candidates are "unelectable".

In any case, I see no value in beating people over the head with a past election whose results were dissatisfactory, if one is interested in those same people supporting one's candidates in a future election. Seems almost counterproductive.

140 posted on 01/04/2002 3:45:56 PM PST by MadameAxe
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To: anniegetyourgun
...the brilliant plan by some on FR to "punish" Republicans by putting DEMS in control.

Republicans put Dems in control all by themselves with no help from anyone by not offering a viable alternative to the Dems. Then people like you ensure further exodus from the Republican party by simply opening your mouth.

141 posted on 01/04/2002 3:49:28 PM PST by Alan Chapman
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To: Alan Chapman
We've been down this path before AC and will never agree. I know that Senator Gorton would not be standing in the way of judicial nominees. I know that Senator Gorton would be joining this Coloradoan in an effort to expose the issuIe of this post. I also acknowledge that he would vote correctly only about 75% of the time. But Maria Cantwell votes correctly less than 20% of the time. I see that as more than negligible.

I just don't have any time to devote to those who have opted out.

142 posted on 01/04/2002 3:53:44 PM PST by anniegetyourgun
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To: Joe Boucher
Pathetic. Anyone know any good manatee recepies??? Maybe know how to attract spotted owls for dinner?

Hey, you're on to something there. Maybe if we start killing off all the endangered species, they won't be around anymore to make our lives miserable.

143 posted on 01/04/2002 3:55:23 PM PST by AAABEST
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To: MadameAxe
Thank You Madam. It is because of people like you that we have a Democratic Senate. By the way, did you ever see the Red/Blue map of that election?

If you are on this thread one would conclude the these type issues are of importance to you. Are you aware that Sen. Gorton used his Chair of thr Interior Dept Appropriations sub-committee to stop CARA in 2000?

144 posted on 01/04/2002 4:10:20 PM PST by Ben Ficklin
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To: AAABEST
a joke, it's just a joke.
145 posted on 01/04/2002 4:16:33 PM PST by Joe Boucher
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To: Ben Ficklin
He did a lot of other things too (some, but not all, of them are documented in the article I linked above).

But, by all means, keep attacking. I'm sure that will make me much more likely to vote for the lackluster candidates the GOP shoves before me next time as a "lesser evil". Not.

146 posted on 01/04/2002 4:20:39 PM PST by MadameAxe
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To: Joe Boucher
a joke, it's just a joke.

Heh, not too far from what's going on though. I live near the Glades and the enviro-kooks have a lot of leverage 'round these parts. I'm sure many even kill them without admiting it. After all, one of those could cost a person tens of thousands of dollars. People have been killed for less.

You know what landowners and contractors do when they find gopher tortoises on their property? They put them in a bag and cart them far off, nobody wants them within miles of their property.

I was talking to a "environmental consultant" because we're thinking of building our next place. See, where I live, everyone has to spend several hundred dollars doing "environmental studies" on prospective property (that's before you even buy anything) because if you don't you can really get screwed if the property has this type of soil, or that type of plant. You could incur huge fees (money grab for the compassionate animal loving government), or not be able to build at all. Some people spend lots of money on these surveys before they even find something worth building on.

Anyway, I was talking to this guy at his house when I heard a bird call. He told me what type of bird it was (some sort of crane) and then said "If I found one of those on your property, you'd have a big problem". Even though these stupid birds fly miles each day not seeming to care where houses, cars or anything else man -made is located.

My first thought was that this friggin' joker is not getting one dime of my business. My second thought was what size shot would be good to use for a crane.

Sorry for the long post, but most good jokes (like yours) have basis in reality.

147 posted on 01/04/2002 4:37:07 PM PST by AAABEST
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To: Joe Boucher
I'm sure many even kill them without admiting it. After all, one of those could cost a person tens of thousands of dollars. People have been killed for less.

ACK! The above sentence was meant to be added at the end of the gopher tortoise paragraph!

Talk about a fraudian slip! I hope that didn't trigger a "visit". Or yet monitoring under the "Patriot Act".

148 posted on 01/04/2002 4:41:26 PM PST by AAABEST
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To: flamefront
These are not 'scientists,' they are only POLITICAL activists with an agenda. The whole notion of planting evidence or faking your data to support an agenda is anti-science.

You are correct. It does appear that sound scientific methods may be being perverted.

149 posted on 01/04/2002 5:09:01 PM PST by sistergoldenhair
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To: brat
Not in the bureaucratic system, they get promoted. Unless enough of us complain, nothing will be done. Just look at that pilot, even the pres is against him for safeguarding his passengers. Morons all and much worse!!!!!!!!!!
150 posted on 01/04/2002 5:13:23 PM PST by poet
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