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THE MASSACRE THAT WASN'T
New York Post ^ | 4/17/02

Posted on 04/17/2002 2:34:36 AM PDT by kattracks

Edited on 05/26/2004 5:05:48 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

April 17, 2002 -- For days, Palestinian, U.N. and aid-group officials declared flatly that Israeli troops had perpetrated a horrendous massacre of innocent civilians at the Jenin refugee camp in the West Bank.

Once outside observers were allowed into the camp, they charged, it would be clear that Prime Minister Ariel Sharon's soldiers had committed a monstrous war crime that would eclipse the killing fields of Kosovo.


(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial; Israel
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1 posted on 04/17/2002 2:34:36 AM PDT by kattracks
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To: kattracks
Sharon didn't want the reporters there, because he knew they'd try to screw him. They did anyway. Oh well. The important thing is that the mission has been accomplished.
2 posted on 04/17/2002 2:48:46 AM PDT by xm177e2
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To: kattracks
I seem to recall that the Post was pretty happy to push the muslims' lies during our attack on Serbia. What goes around, comes around.
3 posted on 04/17/2002 2:50:44 AM PDT by The Great Satan
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To: xm177e2
Any time now, all those reporters and newspapers who printed and reported stories of 'massacres' will retract them, and apologize to the IDF, to Sharon, and the Israeli people. -- Not!
4 posted on 04/17/2002 2:54:29 AM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla
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To: kattracks
Sadly, the damage to Israel's image already has been done. Far too many people already believe the legend of the Jenin massacre, and international media reports - especially in Europe - refuse to acknowledge the truth.

Par for the course throughout history. Israel's "image" with Europeans hasn't changed at all; it's the same old same old. In fact, by historical standards, this is a walk in the park for the Israelis.

The people who repeatedly jump on the anti-Israel bandwagon, such as Kofi Annan and the various bellyachers of the EU, have developed an image of their own, and it's quite clear where their sentiments lie.

Bottom line: everyone knows it's a lie, and a great excuse for another glorious round of good old-fashioned Jew-bashing. Not to mention a fine chance to get into bed with terrorists and indulge their darker tastes. Hoo haw. Have fun boys.

But don't think you're actually fooling anyone with a functioning neuron in their head.

Imal

5 posted on 04/17/2002 2:55:04 AM PDT by Imal
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To: kattracks
Glad to see reports like this confirm what I suspected all along. Combat is tough. I think the Israelis conducted themselves as they should have. Bombing facilites were found. Houses were boobytraped. Combat ensued. Terrorists died. Good. I am sorry that Israeli soldiers had to die to accomplish this though.
6 posted on 04/17/2002 3:11:32 AM PDT by DoughtyOne
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To: kattracks
I noticed yesterday that the Arab apologists who plague talk radio were avoiding the "Camp of the Dead" talking point in favor of "Sharon's just a Murderer, Palestinians are Freedom Fighers, and All We have are Rocks versus Israeli Tanks" variant of spin. FWIW!
7 posted on 04/17/2002 3:16:34 AM PDT by backhoe
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To: kattracks
It isn't suprising that John Podhoretz would take this editorial position. After all his father (Norman), his mother (Midge Rosenthal Decter), and Irving Kristol are the "Founding Fathers" of the neo-conservative movement.

Something awful happened in Jenin and we'll discover the truth in due time.

The question for some on this forum is, can the truth be recognized and accepted?

8 posted on 04/17/2002 3:19:12 AM PDT by Jethro Tull
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To: Jethro Tull
The question for some on this forum is, can the truth be recognized and accepted?

The question has been answered, there was no massacre, the question is whether or not you will recognize the truth, Dr. Goebbels?

9 posted on 04/17/2002 3:26:17 AM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla
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To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla
Massacre? What massacre.

The only massacre I saw was to the truth in rags like The Guardian.

Be Seeing You,

Chris

10 posted on 04/17/2002 3:28:00 AM PDT by section9
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Comment #11 Removed by Moderator

Comment #12 Removed by Moderator

To: kattracks
Arafat's henchmen, confronted by the evidence, now claim that the Israelis secretly spirited away hundreds of bodies under cover of night.

"She turned me into a newt!"

A newt??

"I got better....."

13 posted on 04/17/2002 3:49:50 AM PDT by Cachelot
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To: AlexanderTheGreat
When debating an opponent who makes a salient point, be sure to discredit that opponent by making some allusion to Nazism.

There are forces in the world bombing Jews, not Israelis, burning synagogues, in Europe, not Israel. There are European leaders saying that Jews, not Israelis, can't have their lives saved in France. The doors of the gas chambers are wide open, and this story was planted to push the world's Jewry into them. The poster I responded to, by furthering this propaganda, is consciously or unconsciously part of this revived Nazi activity, which has already returned France to its days as the Vichy Republic.

Unfortunately for people like you, the forces of decency are aroused. If you try too hard to push the Jews into these chambers, you may find yourselves there.

14 posted on 04/17/2002 4:34:01 AM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla
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Comment #15 Removed by Moderator

Comment #16 Removed by Moderator

To: kattracks
One U.N. official told Moore, "Everybody was thinking mass graves in the way we think of Kosovo." But, he added, "I don't think we have seen that."

They haven't seen it in Kosovo either.

17 posted on 04/17/2002 4:47:45 AM PDT by MadelineZapeezda
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To: Jethro Tull
Something awful happened in Jenin and we'll discover the truth in due time.

No, we discovered the truth today! No massacre happened. You believe a group, the PLO, that been shown to spew lie after lie after lie. Constant, never ending, pathological lying! Only fools and idiots believe anything they say.

What does this say about YOU that YOU believe them? What a laughing stock@!

18 posted on 04/17/2002 4:55:26 AM PDT by AmericaUnited
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To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla
"The question has been answered, there was no massacre, the question is whether or not you will recognize the truth, Dr. Goebbels?"

It's always a delight exposing you neocon swine to the light of truth.

So, I question the partiality of John Podhoretz's editorial in the New York Post, and you call me a nazi.

The Middle East butchery has further "Kristolized" the neocon "Israel First" position.

And this is good....

19 posted on 04/17/2002 5:01:49 AM PDT by Jethro Tull
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To: AmericaUnited
#18:

"No, we discovered the truth today! No massacre happened."

Signed,
Ariel Sharon

20 posted on 04/17/2002 5:03:30 AM PDT by Jethro Tull
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To: kattracks
How sad!
21 posted on 04/17/2002 5:03:33 AM PDT by mickie
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To: AlexanderTheGreat
#11: "I find it curious that with all the reports of the heavy stench of death in the air that the IDF only found 40 or so bodies...."

***
*****

It's obvious to all but the most vile Jenin deniers that the IDF has a vested interest in keeping this 'discovery' to a minimum.

22 posted on 04/17/2002 5:08:12 AM PDT by Jethro Tull
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To: section9
#10: "The only massacre I saw was to the truth in rags like The Guardian."

Please name one country, other than America, who doesn't suspect a tragedy happened in Jenin.

23 posted on 04/17/2002 5:12:01 AM PDT by Jethro Tull
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To: Jethro Tull
Your right, those Jews in the media sure do stick together don't they?

Moron...

24 posted on 04/17/2002 5:13:25 AM PDT by Skip Ripley
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To: Jethro Tull
Please name one country, other than America,
who doesn't suspect a tragedy happened in Jenin.

Well here is a Canadian who thinks
that if there was a tragedy in Jenin,
it is that some of terrorists
may have got away.

Such 'tragedies' also have been occuring in Afghanistan.

25 posted on 04/17/2002 5:15:51 AM PDT by Nogbad
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To: Jethro Tull
Why do you believe a group that never, ever tells anthing other than lies? You remind me of the idiots who believed what they read in Pravda during the Cold War. Most sane people do not believe pathological liars. What is so hard for you to understand about this? Are you ok?
26 posted on 04/17/2002 5:15:52 AM PDT by AmericaUnited
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To: kattracks
Why the big surprise?
We're talking human debris who claim that we are treating the killers in Guantanamo brutally. Crimes against "humanity".
Right.

That's all I needed to know.

27 posted on 04/17/2002 5:17:39 AM PDT by Publius6961
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To: Jethro Tull
It's always a delight exposing you neocon swine to the light of truth.

Earlier in the week the PLO was screaming about "mass graves" containing thousands of civilians in Jenin.

Now, once reporters are allowed in the area, and find no mass graves, the PLO changes their story and say the bodies were taken away.

Next, when that story falls through, they'll have a different excuse, and you'll believe it.

WHERE ARE THE BODIES?

28 posted on 04/17/2002 5:17:46 AM PDT by TomB
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To: xm177e2
Sharon didn't want the reporters there, because he knew they'd try to screw him.

Oh yeah!
Objective reporters are allowed to roam freely in the "palestinian" areas.

It's common knowledge that if a reporter is not a muslim apologist, his life in the territories is measured in hours.
Funny thing, no reporter in any medium has mentioned that.

29 posted on 04/17/2002 5:20:31 AM PDT by Publius6961
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To: Jethro Tull
It's always a delight exposing you neocon swine to the light of truth.

Neocon, Ha!, when I joined YAF in 1962, the term had not been invented, or the philosophy! Nor had it been invented when I was on the Board of Directors of Youth for Goldwater in New York. I have been acquainted with about 40% of the people who founded YAF at Bill Buckley's house in Sharon in 1960, none of whom can be called a neo-con, and some of whom fought against your intellectual forebears in WWII. Believe me, when you are on trial for your participation in genocide, I will not shed a tear.

30 posted on 04/17/2002 5:21:22 AM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla
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To: Jethro Tull
You may question his credibility but the fact remains, no western news outlet has reported an actual body count anywhere near what the PLO claimed. On top of that the "women and children" reported is either zero or near zero.

So you can claim psychic skills (or worse believe the PLO) in determining "something awful happened" but you have zero facts to back up your claim. The only "massacre" so far has been the truth.

31 posted on 04/17/2002 5:21:40 AM PDT by DB
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To: Jethro Tull
The question for some on this forum is, can the truth be recognized and accepted?

Sure.
We had wars before.
You probably are blissfully unaware that during the Battle of Midway, the Japanese would interrogate American downed pilots, put them in a sack alive, weigh them down and throw them overboard?
War is a pain...
People die.

When the Israelis announced that they were about to enter a building and the occupants should come out, they could have.
I assume those who didn't wanted to die.

32 posted on 04/17/2002 5:26:12 AM PDT by Publius6961
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To: AlexanderTheGreat
I find it curious that with all the reports of the heavy stench of death in the air that the IDF only found 40 or so bodies....

Really, did they do measurements with their stenchometers to determine that it must have been more than 40?

33 posted on 04/17/2002 5:40:25 AM PDT by liberalism=failure
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To: TomB;JethroTull
Next, when that story falls through, they'll have a different excuse, and you'll believe it.

Jethro doesn't necessarily believe any of this, you know, and of course his pals in the PA don't either. Even Nazi sc*mbags don't usually have that capacity for stupidity.

Encountering a critter like Jethro I find it helpful to A: look up his posting history, and B: check if he is on any of the jihadist/nazi boards.

Here's a couple of his posts grabbed at random. Anyone can make up their minds as to wether Jethro is a credible fellow who should be debated, or a malignant pustule who should be elsewhere.

 
'Why are they killing children just like me?'(Bahrain) ^
      Posted by Jethro Tull to LarryLied
On News/Activism ^ Apr 16 1:31 AM #5 of 41 ^

The prevailing thought on the FR seems to be that anyone the Israeli's kill deserves it.

Therefore, your posting will soon be deemed the work of an anti-Semitic disruptor.

Sorry...


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Global government another step closer: Patrick Buchanan warns of sovereignty loss through new court ^
      Posted by Jethro Tull to JohnHuang2
On News/Activism ^ Apr 16 0:54 AM #7 of 14 ^

"The court's first big splash may be the trial in absentia of Ariel Sharon for alleged war crimes in Jenin."

Alleged war crimes?

Sharon is Satan drapped in pale blue and white...


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34 posted on 04/17/2002 5:42:14 AM PDT by Cachelot
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To: kattracks
And of course from now on all the reporters will realize that the PALIs are nothing but a big lying machine

Yeah right
35 posted on 04/17/2002 5:43:11 AM PDT by uncbob
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To: Jethro Tull
Please name one country, other than America, who doesn't suspect a tragedy happened in Jenin.

You're right a tragedy did happen. 15 IDF soldiers were killed by raghead pieces of crap.

36 posted on 04/17/2002 5:45:24 AM PDT by liberalism=failure
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To: kattracks
I am getting sick or reading these items that finish with..

"even though it is not the case..the lie has already taken hold across the world.."

So what? When will there be a leader who just does what he has to do, and tell the "polls" or "opinion-makers" to go and $hit in their hats?

If people do not have enough common sense to find the truth (and it is a tough search) through all of the bull$hit being pumped out by media outlets in this day and age, we should not care about their opinions.

37 posted on 04/17/2002 6:01:13 AM PDT by Fedupwithit
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To: kattracks
They could have used a few of these instead of going house to house.

155 mm - range over 25 miles. Designed and produced by Soltam - Israel's Artillery Manufacturer.

38 posted on 04/17/2002 6:10:01 AM PDT by anapikoros
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To: AmericaUnited, Jethro Tull
You know the amusing (and sickening) part of all this is, is that there are actually folks who have said that the footage of Palestinians celebrating on 9-11 is 'stock footage' of some sort. That it never happened. In their topsy-turvy world, the Palestinians celebrating on 9-11, of which there is ample evidence, didn't happen, but the "massacre" in Jenin, of which there is no proof, did happen. Not that I believe they really believe all that mind you.
39 posted on 04/17/2002 6:11:21 AM PDT by veronica
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To: kattracks
'One U.N. official told Moore, "Everybody was thinking mass graves in the way we think of Kosovo."

What mass graves? They got away with this lie, nice to see they didn't here....

40 posted on 04/17/2002 6:24:01 AM PDT by eureka!
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To: Jethro Tull
It's called WAR. I suggest you look it up in the dictionary. Is the towel on your head wrapped too tight today?
41 posted on 04/17/2002 6:45:11 AM PDT by ohioman
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To: Jethro Tull
It's always a delight exposing you neocon swine to the light of truth.

So no bodies in a mass grave, but there still was a mass murder right, and you call this truth? Have you always been an idiot or are you a product of generational inbreeding? The word "truth" means facts without distortional lies. Just thought you might like to know the meaning of the word before you make yourself look like a bigger jackass then you already appear to be! SHOW ME THE BODIES! SHOW ME THE BODIES!!

42 posted on 04/17/2002 6:48:33 AM PDT by Bommer
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To: Bommer
He is the product of the segment of the population I like to call Ignorant-American. Jew-hatred is becoming alarming around here.
43 posted on 04/17/2002 6:54:02 AM PDT by aristotleman
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To: kattracks
"Everybody was thinking mass graves in the way we think of Kosovo."
It's amazing how bad the truth was destroyed. What mass graves?
Racak is a hoax?

44 posted on 04/17/2002 7:24:39 AM PDT by Andy from Beaverton
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To: Jethro Tull
Yesterday, Martin Fletcher on MSNBC was saying he remembered the same thing was going on in 1973 in I think Lebanon when the Israelis were accused of killing 10,000 people. When reporters got in there, he said they found that there were hundreds killed, not 10,000.

Truth sits precariously on the shifting sands of their deserts. You can't believe the moslems. Why aren't more people waking up to that fact, that's the real question, instead of waiting for moslem "truths" to be proven true someday.

45 posted on 04/17/2002 7:43:12 AM PDT by texasbluebell
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To: Jethro Tull
Something awful happened in Jenin and we'll discover the truth in due time.

A little while back the local thugs from Children's Protective Services showed up at my door. Apparently someone told them that we were witholding food from our children. It was now up to me to prove that I never did. I showed them my healthy children. That wasn't good enough. They asked the children if we ever refused to give them food and the children categorically denied it. That wasn't good enough. We gave them access to medical records. That wasn't good enough. We had their doctor write a letter. That wasn't good enough. We got testimonial letters from their teachers (including a personal gym trainer). That wasn't good enough. It took additional blood work and a visit to a nutritionist to satisfy them - all because of a phone call by another suspicious (and probaby competitive) person set them on our tail and we had to prove a negative against no substantive evidence of a positive.

Forgive me if this sounds a little personal, but you sound just like those thugs. We don't know anything went on there but what the facts reveal. It isn't up to Israel to prove they never did anything just because some people are suspicious. It is up to the suspicious people to provide some proof.

Provide some proof, any proof, and I will be up in front with you demanding an investigation. But if all you have is "something must have happened" then I must politely ask you to, in the words of Katherine Hepburn, "get permanently lost".

Shalom.

46 posted on 04/17/2002 7:45:52 AM PDT by ArGee
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To: TomB
WHERE ARE THE BODIES?

Precisely. Show me any evidence and I will join in demanding an investigation. But give me an ominous "We all know something must have happened" and you can go suck eggs.

Excuse me if I sound a little frustrated.

Shalom.

47 posted on 04/17/2002 7:47:51 AM PDT by ArGee
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To: ArGee
A little while back the local thugs from Children's Protective Services showed up at my door. Apparently someone told them that we were witholding food from our children. It was now up to me to prove that I never did. I showed them my healthy children. That wasn't good enough. They asked the children if we ever refused to give them food and the children categorically denied it. That wasn't good enough. We gave them access to medical records. That wasn't good enough. We had their doctor write a letter. That wasn't good enough. We got testimonial letters from their teachers (including a personal gym trainer). That wasn't good enough. It took additional blood work and a visit to a nutritionist to satisfy them - all because of a phone call by another suspicious (and probaby competitive) person set them on our tail and we had to prove a negative against no substantive evidence of a positive.

You got off lucky. CPS routinely abducts such children and once in their custody they get them to say whatever CPS wants them to say. And even if that is the ONLY evidence, they'll use it to convict you (juvenile/family court does not follow due process/preponderance of the evidence/etc.) and permanently remove your children from your home into the abusive foster care system (50% of all child abuse deaths occur in foster care/a child is 10 times more likely to be abused in foster care than anywhere else). You are so lucky as are your children.

As for Jethro Tull, he and I have, in the past, been on the same sheet of music. The disonant chords he's striking here baffle me. He's lost it or something.

48 posted on 04/17/2002 7:59:08 AM PDT by Spiff
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To: Spiff
You are so lucky as are your children.

Lucky after having done my part to put my lawyers' children through college.

It's odd how often professional people like lawyers use the word "gestapo" when discussing this particular form of social "services." Once the dust has settled I'm thinking of starting an organization to try to improve the legal climate a little for those of us who are innocent. I understand the issues involved when the parent is actually a danger to their children (and I recognize you are only taking my word for my own situation) but there should be more due process than there is.

But that's another thread topic.

Shalom.

49 posted on 04/17/2002 8:30:02 AM PDT by ArGee
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To: Jethro Tull
Ya know something Jeth, I really don't have a dog in this fight. I guess I side with the jews out of historical research. After all, my Christianity grew out of their Judaism.

You're wrong here. You're not even CLOSE to being right.

As soon as I started to hear from 'unspecified' sources about a massacre in Jenin, the FIRST thing that leapt to my mind was, unspecified=palistinian.

Then yesterday when I read an article posted from "The Independent", one of the UK's main newspeaks, that there were 'war crimes' but it was 'ominous' that there were NO bodies laying around, I KNEW that we were being lied to.

You do yourself no service by being rabid over stories that are so easily disprovable. People simply turn you off after a while and treat you like a child.

Just my humble opinion.

Godspeed

50 posted on 04/17/2002 8:31:38 AM PDT by America's Resolve
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