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Need Help Buying Gun
4-17-02 | PaulJ

Posted on 04/17/2002 1:32:29 PM PDT by PaulJ

My fellow Freepers have always been able to help me and I need your help again.
I have an 11 year old who is in the Boy Scouts and had his first experience with target shooting (air rifle)about 3 years ago. Two years ago we bought him his own air rifle and he saved up and bought a CO2 pistol.He loves it and seems to be a natural and is a great shot. I am now considering buying him a 22 but know nothing about them. I looked around the internet but couldn't find any helpful information.
I have never owned a gun but think it would be a great father & son thing to get into. He has only done target shooting but has shown some interest in hunting small game.
Here's where I need your help. What should I look for in a rifle? How much should I plan on spending? Are there any good web sites that are informative? What else do I need to know?
Any information you can give me will be greatly appreciated. Thanks.


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KEYWORDS: guns
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1 posted on 04/17/2002 1:32:29 PM PDT by PaulJ
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To: PaulJ
I have a boy the same age, and he loves my Ruger 10/22. Lightweight and easy to shoot. Fired thousands of rounds in mine without a hitch.

http://www.ruger-firearms.com/rfrimfire_auto.html

Ignore the prices on the website, you can get one at Wal-Mart for about $150.

2 posted on 04/17/2002 1:41:25 PM PDT by Pern
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To: PaulJ
I'll chime in- I would suggest a single shot, bolt action .22. Ruger, Marlin, Winchester are all good brands, don't know if any particular one makes a single shot.

advantage of a single shot is it teaches concentration, and lends itself to focusing on each shot. Wait until you both have some experience before going to a semi-auto and hsoing down the tin cans. Also, make sure and get some training in gun safety from an NRA certified trainer.

have fun!

3 posted on 04/17/2002 1:41:59 PM PDT by fourdeuce82d
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To: PaulJ
Various gun stores in your locale, may have on hand, a fine, used bolt action Marlin; such rifles were the standard at summer camp, "way back when."
4 posted on 04/17/2002 1:44:11 PM PDT by First_Salute
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To: fourdeuce82d
I'll chime in- I would suggest a single shot, bolt action .22. Ruger, Marlin, Winchester are all good brands, don't know if any particular one makes a single shot.

Well, I like you're idea of a single shot for the concentration aspect over a semi-auto, but I would still make it a repeater. My first .22 was a Marlin lever action model for .22 short/long.

You still get the concentration aspect of a single shot, but not the hassels of having to reload all the time. Such a rifle is longer than the Ruger 10/22 of which I also have one, and a little heavier. Still, it was a good first firearm for me.

5 posted on 04/17/2002 1:48:44 PM PDT by AFreeBird
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To: PaulJ
www.ruger-firearms.com or www.marlinfirearms.com are good sites for information. I still have a Mossberg 342K bought 44 years ago - my first rifle. I don't believe Mossberg is in that market anymore. A shame.
6 posted on 04/17/2002 1:54:50 PM PDT by sharpaxe
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To: fourdeuce82d
Dittos on the single shot bolt action and the NRA training. Shooting with a single shot will teach the shooter to make the first shot count.

I remember many times of going out to the junkyard to shoot rats. I killed many more rats with my single shot than I ever did with my semi automatic. It's all about the discipline of picking your shot carefully to make it count.

Speaking of first rifles, my 4 month old daughter already has her first rifle in the safe at home, a single shot Remington 22.

Semper Fi!

7 posted on 04/17/2002 2:00:44 PM PDT by dd5339
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To: PaulJ
There was a good thread about this back in December. It started as a posting of a (barf) anti-gun piece, but then it turned into a shopping list for junior's .22!

Gunmakers Urge That Children Get Guns For Christmas

8 posted on 04/17/2002 2:01:01 PM PDT by the
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To: PaulJ
A Model 52 Winchester, either in the standard light barrel, or a match version with a heavier barrel. Bolt action, has to be cocked by a pull-out plunger for every shot.

Many a charging rat fell, stopped in the very nick as they attacked, with their blood-chilling squeals, as they burst out of the undergrowth...

9 posted on 04/17/2002 2:07:53 PM PDT by jonascord
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To: PaulJ
PJ, You are right it is a very good Father/Son activity and a good Father/Daughter activity and an all around great family activity. My wife and our three children and I shoot together often.

We got our youngest a Keystone Cricket single shot when he was six. It is a small framed .22 and still fits him at nine years old (a big nine). The Ruger 10/22 is the best .22 for the money, and if the reach to the trigger is too long you can find a youth sized, after-market stock for it in the Shotgun News (a periodical which can be picked up at your local WalMart or gun shop).

The only disadvantage that I would see with starting your son or any child off with 10/22 is that it is a semiauto. I like the disciplined procedure that a single-shot forces a kid to go through.

Just my two centavos on the subject. I hope you find a good deal on a firearm and that you and your son enjoy many hours of safe shooting.

10 posted on 04/17/2002 2:09:39 PM PDT by ExpatGator
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To: PaulJ; fourdeuce82d; AFreeBird
...I would suggest a single shot, bolt action .22. Ruger, Marlin, Winchester are all good brands,...

I'm with these guys - the discipline of a single shot is very important to learn as young as possible. Otherwise a young shooter gets the idea that "If I miss the first shot - no big deal, I've got plenty more."

He'll "grow into" a semi-auto soon enough!

11 posted on 04/17/2002 2:09:46 PM PDT by facedown
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To: PaulJ
I agree with several of the responders who recommended the Ruger 10/22. I bought one thirty years ago and have fired more than 10,000 rounds through it without a problem. I taught both of my children to shoot using it.

You can load one round at a time and use it like a single shot if you want or load it with 10 rounds and fire it semi-auto.

12 posted on 04/17/2002 2:13:12 PM PDT by mbynack
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To: PaulJ
Here is an old thred from back in '99. A lot of great information. Some of it may not pertain to your need, but still a good read.

So You Want To Buy A Gun

13 posted on 04/17/2002 2:15:33 PM PDT by Lanman
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To: PaulJ
What the heck, I'll add my 2 cents also.

The Ruger 10-22 is tough to beat and will be something he'll never outgrow. Used bolt action .22's about and are cheap.

Also, consider a handgun in .22 as well. The Ruger Mark II is another reasonably priced .22 that will last a lifetime. With either of the two, buy extra magazines so that when you go shooting someone can be loading while waiting their turn to shoot. I've got 4 mags for the 10-22 and 5 for the Mark II and that keeps everyone occupied when we go out shooting.

This may be one of the few threads where people aren't shouting out recommendations for Kimbers.

14 posted on 04/17/2002 2:19:19 PM PDT by Eagle Eye
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To: PaulJ
Why play games?

Get him a cannon.

Tight budget? Try a bazooka.

15 posted on 04/17/2002 2:23:39 PM PDT by SGCOS
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To: Pern
Gotta agree, a Ruger 10/22 makes an excellent first rifle.
16 posted on 04/17/2002 2:26:49 PM PDT by PatrioticAmerican
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To: PaulJ
Put me in the Ruger 10/22 crowd. Inexpensive, high quality, FUN, durable.....could go on all day. Best $150.00 I have ever invested in a firearm.
17 posted on 04/17/2002 2:27:49 PM PDT by AdA$tra
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To: PaulJ
P.S. Many stores offer a free 4x scope when buying a Ruger 10/22! About $150-$200 total.
18 posted on 04/17/2002 2:28:27 PM PDT by PatrioticAmerican
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To: PaulJ
My suggestion....

A bolt action, either single shot or repeater (I personally like a repeater, but my first was a single shot). Depending on the size of the kid, you should consider a "youth" model. If the kid is large for his age, then a standard model would be logical.

Would be a good starter rifle. I have developed an affection for Savage rifles. My most recent aquisition is a model 93 in .22 Magnum. The thing shoots so well, I really want a .22 LR.

Save the Ruger 10/22 for after you both have gained experience. Although a reliable (and fun to customize) gun, it is not for beginners.......

Also, big dittos for the safety course (NRA does some really great courses).

19 posted on 04/17/2002 2:28:36 PM PDT by TheBattman
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To: PatrioticAmerican
Ditto the Ruger 10/22. Last I checked it was around $159.99 at WalMart.
20 posted on 04/17/2002 2:29:57 PM PDT by Rebelbase
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To: Pern
Is he right handed? If he is, bolt or lever action is fine but if he's left handed like me a bolt action is clumsy and I prefer a lever action.
21 posted on 04/17/2002 2:30:57 PM PDT by Arkie2
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To: SGCOS
I didn't let my kid have a bazooka until he was smart enough to build it himself with only a little coaching. Now there's a great father/son project.

Loads of fun for kids from eight to eighty!

22 posted on 04/17/2002 2:33:24 PM PDT by the gillman@blacklagoon.com
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To: PaulJ
I'd say that one of the best values out there is the Ruger 10/22 for semi-autos. A terrific little gun, right out of the box. There are lots of accessories available for it.

My personal favorite is a Remington 571 (I think) pump action, that my grandfather gave me when I was 16. Terrific rifle, and quite accurate. It's got a tube magazine and can fire .22 short, long, and long rifle. If you like pumps, you might also check out the little pump action 22 Taurus, which I believe is based on the old Browning arcade .22.

Mark

23 posted on 04/17/2002 2:39:45 PM PDT by MarkL
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To: PaulJ
The Ruger 10/22's are a great rifle for all around use for a .22. I've been looking at rifles from Henry Repeating Arms Company. They have a complete line of .22 rifles in different models. The Golden Boy is nice but pricey. The .22 Lever Magnum model is real nice. I have my eye on the compact U.S. Survival Rifle. Can be broken down with parts to be stored in the waterproof stock, and comes with two 8-round mags. Very cheaply priced and very handy. Cache and BLOAT with these babies.
24 posted on 04/17/2002 2:40:44 PM PDT by BigBlueJon
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To: PaulJ
Ditto the 10/22, however if your budget permits, start with a single-shot bolt action and pick up the 10/22 when he's a little older.
Nix the .22 handgun for the kid, he's too young. (Or any other cannon somebody might jokingly suggest.)
Especially if inexperienced with the rifle.
Take it one step at a time as he gains experience and continues to exhibit maturity and safe handling.
(Now if Dad wants a .22 pistol to enhance his own target-plinking pleasure -- that's a different matter.)
But teach the kid responsibly on the rifle first.
25 posted on 04/17/2002 2:42:42 PM PDT by Willie Green
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To: PaulJ
The Ruger 10/22, as a number of people have already suggested, is a reasonable choice if you're looking for a semi-auto, although for a first plinker I would concur with those who favor a single shot bolt, for the reasons outlined, to learn fire discipline...

the infowarrior

26 posted on 04/17/2002 2:44:20 PM PDT by infowarrior
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To: Eagle Eye
I just saw a book called "Ruger 10/22 Exotic Weapons System".
I suppose the kid could buy this if he got bored with the rifle as is... :)
27 posted on 04/17/2002 2:44:55 PM PDT by MrB
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Comment #28 Removed by Moderator

To: Pern
Ruger 10//22 Is my vote - I love mine and can shoot it all day for 10 bucks!
29 posted on 04/17/2002 2:46:34 PM PDT by ezo44
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To: MrB
Is that the one with 4 mounted 10-22's and a crank device on the trigger? No FFL required, either.
30 posted on 04/17/2002 2:48:53 PM PDT by Eagle Eye
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To: Eagle Eye
The only thing I saw was the book cover. The picture looked like a cross between an Uzi and an HK.
Big banana like magazine, bullpup stock, short barrel.
The description of the book said that it would go up to 1000 rpm.
31 posted on 04/17/2002 2:52:07 PM PDT by MrB
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To: PaulJ
I owned a 10/22, and i was one of the unfortunate few that bought on that jammed all the time. Never could figure out why. Replaced the extractor, didn't help. I have a 77/22 now, a very solid rifle that shoots 1/2" groups at 50 yards. Caveat: did a trigger job on it, polished the hammer and sear, put a Timney trigger kit in it, glass-bedded the action. From what I've been reading lately, check out the Thompson Center .22 Classic. Looks real solid, and from the reviews, you'll get a semi-auto that shoots 1/2" group right out of the box. Hard to beat that. Fairly reasonable price also, for a precision piece that will last a lifetime.
32 posted on 04/17/2002 2:54:58 PM PDT by FlyVet
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To: Willie Green
My daughters can handle the Mark II and enjoy it. I seriously think that an 11 year old boy, with proper supervision of course, can handle one and it makes a great companion to a .22 rifle.

If someone wanted to argue that a revolver would be better, I'd not argue that, but I put guns in my kids' hands as soon as I could do so safely, and 11 is certainly old enough.

33 posted on 04/17/2002 2:55:14 PM PDT by Eagle Eye
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To: PaulJ
May I suggest a Winchester 9422? It is a tube-fed, lever action capable of good, medium range accuracy. The advantage over the Ruger 10/22 is that there is no detatchable magazine to lose / miss place. Also, the 10/22 will fire nothing but long-rifle cartridges.

A Wincheter 9422 [or other tube fed, bolt action] will fire all .22 cartridges, save the .22 magnum. .22 CB shorts, and .22 CB longs are inexpensive and very...........quiet.

34 posted on 04/17/2002 2:57:06 PM PDT by Res Nullius
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To: PaulJ
F.Y.I. - Ruger also carries the model 96/22. It's your basic 10/22, only lever action. I've never fired it, but if it shoots anything like the 10/22, it should be nice.

Punch this for nice pics

35 posted on 04/17/2002 2:57:58 PM PDT by BigBlueJon
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Comment #36 Removed by Moderator

To: MrB
I knew a guy that had a 10-22 with a bi-pod, scope, and drum magazine. He had other goodies as well. A 10-22 is like an old Chev 327 in that there's a lot that you can do to it.
37 posted on 04/17/2002 2:59:01 PM PDT by Eagle Eye
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To: MarkL
If you like pumps, you might also check out the little pump action 22 Taurus

Don't have one, but have shot one and they are a lot of fun.

38 posted on 04/17/2002 3:02:03 PM PDT by Eagle Eye
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To: PaulJ
For starts, bolt action rifles are the most accurate. I would concur that single-shot nakes the most sense for an 11 y.o. At a mininum, I would definitely avoid getting him an auto-loader. Any bolt-action rifle requires that some thought be given before a new round is chambered.

Now, as to brands, Ruger makes excellent .22's. There is a political issue with Ruger, however, that you may want to take into account. Bill Ruger testified before Congress in favor of the 1994 Federal Firearms Act (the "assault weapons ban"). To this day, many gun enthusiasts refuse to buy Ruger products for that reason. At least, to buy new ones. Me included. That legislation didn't affect the bad guys in the least; it simply made life more difficult for the rest of us.

I would not hesitate to go with Marlin, Remington, or Winchester. All have websites that are easily located.

If you find yourself considering a pump-action rifle, Taurus recently started manufacturing a replica of the venerable Winchester model 62. They call it their model 62. External hammer. This is a seriously cool rifle that neither he nor you will ever outgrow. Get the stainless carbine. It goes new-in-box for about $235 on discount (I saw one for that last weekend at a local gunshow).

Involve your son in the shopping process. Take him to a show or two. Shopping / anticipation is part of the fun, and an important part of the interaction between the two of you.

Don't forget to get him a cleaning kit and to show him how to use it. Any dealer will help you with that. There are also websites. Caring for, cleaning the rifle is an integral part of the responsibility of owning one. "Look after it. it will look after you."

For a ton of more information, you might do a Google search on ".22" and "rifle" on the rec.guns newsgroup. If you don't know how do do that, I'd be happy to help.

Do not forget the hunter's safety class. You go too. Make sure he understands that if he uses the rifle carelessly or irresponsibly, you will take it away for him. He needs to get the idea that a weapon is to always be treated as if it's loaded, even when he is absolutely, positively certain that is not loaded. .22's may be small in terms of their bore, but they can kill.

Be real careful when his friends are around. Us boys do love to show off our toys -- and that's when the sh*t typically happens.

The above rants, by the way, are one or the reasons to stick with a rifle that is either bolt-, pump-, or lever-action. The action can easily be opened to insure the rifle is clear and inoperable. This is always done when it is passed from one person to another. At other times also.

Teach him never, ever to put his finger on the trigger unless and until he intends to fire it at whatever he's pointing it at.

The list goes on...

Good luck! Have fun!! Be careful!!!

Harry

39 posted on 04/17/2002 3:04:51 PM PDT by The Other Harry
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To: fourdeuce82d
I agree with the single shot theory. About ten years ago, I purchased a single shot .22 from WalMart that was made by Daisy. Very small (kid sized) , seems like it was designed as a first gun for a kid. Only cost $35.00 then.
40 posted on 04/17/2002 3:05:45 PM PDT by JavaTheHutt
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Comment #41 Removed by Moderator

To: Eagle Eye
My 10/22 wasn't all that accurate, maybe 1 1/2" groups at 50 yards at best. It's definitely a good value, though. You can't wear out a Ruger. Guess you can slap on a precision after-market barrel too, and make it shoot better. The T/C Classic looks intriguing to me. Anybody out there have experience with it? If as accurate as some of the reviews say, it'd be a good "no excuses" rifle, if you can pop a squirrel in the head at 50-75 yards with it.
42 posted on 04/17/2002 3:09:44 PM PDT by FlyVet
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To: Bruce Leroy
.50 Desert Eagle would be a good first gun.

Think that would be better than the Armalite AR-50?

43 posted on 04/17/2002 3:10:10 PM PDT by The Other Harry
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To: PaulJ
Ruger 10/22 all the way!!
44 posted on 04/17/2002 3:10:23 PM PDT by Travis McGee
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To: PaulJ
.22 bolt action. When you give young boys semi auto .22's they never learn marksmanship IME. Just pop, pop, pop and back to the store for another brick of ammo.
45 posted on 04/17/2002 3:12:11 PM PDT by SSN558
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To: Eagle Eye
I seriously think that an 11 year old boy, with proper supervision of course, can handle one and it makes a great companion to a .22 rifle.

With proper supervision.

IMHO, the longer barrel of a rifle is not only more accurate for target shooting, it helps reinforce the concept of always being sure the weapon is pointed in a safe direction. That is a little more difficult to monitor with a handgun, especially when held by a young child who could become easily distracted.

Parents need to objectively evaluate the maturity of their own children, of course. But I'll stick with my advice to start-off with a rifle and master safe handling one weapon at a time. There's plenty of time to graduate to pistols as the child grows older and displays maturity, competence and responsibility.

46 posted on 04/17/2002 3:13:22 PM PDT by Willie Green
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To: SSN558
When you give young boys semi auto .22's they never learn marksmanship IME.

Respectfully, I'd say that depends on the training they receive. Why bother with racking the bolt if you can have a semi-auto with pinpoint accuracy? Although I agree with you at the top of the sport, you won't see a semi-auto winning the accuracy championships when it gets down to it. 6mm PPC, 1 hole at 200 yards.

47 posted on 04/17/2002 3:19:58 PM PDT by FlyVet
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To: PaulJ
I'd stay away from any semi-auto. It's better to teach kids to be patient and make good accurate shots.

This link should take you to Savage Arms' -Stevens Favorite
http://www.savagearms.com/rimfire/single_shot_series/30gm.htm
Very nice gun for target shooting, plinking, and hunting. Not heavy and well balanced.

We've had one of these in my family before I was hatched, and it'll be here long after I'm gone.

48 posted on 04/17/2002 3:20:44 PM PDT by Gun142
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To: PaulJ
Dittos on the bolt action Ruger.
49 posted on 04/17/2002 3:24:38 PM PDT by OK
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To: Willie Green
With proper supervision.

There was a time when that meant that I simply alerted the neighbors that I was going to be shooting in our basement. I shot modified .38 rounds indoors as a teen home alone. But those days are gone, aren't they?

There is soundness to your advice, but it isn't the only approach to teaching kids to shoot.

50 posted on 04/17/2002 3:26:11 PM PDT by Eagle Eye
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