Posted on 04/20/2002 5:56:22 AM PDT by heyheyhey
I think you hit on the key concept, and one which has been ignored by the American seminaries: that is, that there should be absolutely ZERO toleration of any kind of homosexual practice by the priests. I've read that there are at least 2 seminaries where teachers and seminarians alike flaunt their gayness, dress in drag, and go down to gay bars together (I believe I read this from a snippet from "Goodbye Good Men"). I'm not entirely certain that you can also say that a person who would otherwise be homosexually inclined, but has worked through prayer and devotion to Jesus to control those urges and aberrant appetite so as not to either act on it or indulge in the thoughts, should be declared ipso facto to be unfit for the priesthood; after all, on the other side of the coin, heterosexually-inclined priests aren't automatically adulterers just because they're heterosexual. However, if they cavalierly flaunt and exhibit the attitude that they think it's OK to break their vows of celibacy, then they too should meet with an immediate dismissal from the priesthood.
That was my original belief before all of this mess started (that any form of sexually deviant behavior should be automatic grounds for dismissal from seminaries; and that the seminaries should be tightly controlled to be on the lookout for anyone exhibiting suspicious behavior -- hetero or homo); however, I recently was aware of a still-standing Church decree that any seminarian who is found to be homosexual-inclined is automatically unfit for the priesthood (I'm sure a knowledgeable Catholic can cite it here: it was from the Congregation on Divine something or other, circa 1960-something).
If that's the case, then maybe it's just better, as a rule, to just bar all homosexually-inclined men from the priesthood, even if they are able to control their thoughts and actions, just because of the potential danger of just one of them slipping up.
Of course, even as I say this, it seems incongruous in that would it be any less damaging for a heterosexually-inclined priest to molest a young girl, or to indulge in a sexual affair? My viceral reaction though, even though I know it's absent any logic, is to say a homosexual molestation is worse. I don't know why; it just feels worse.
In light of Mike Fieschko's post #73, would you care to amend this statement? (Assuming you actually read what you linked us to.) Do you agree that you were incorrect in your statement, at least according to the source you cited?
If you do agree that you were incorrect, did you just not read the entire passages where you linked to?
Well said. Amazing how even a place of refuge such as FR has sunk so low. Very Sad.
Yes, and the news media and the entertainment culture are the biggest child abusers of all because while they abhore bad priests they preach the doctrine of anything goes as far as sex and morals. In this secualr world they teach that immoral behavior,(if it is politically correct) is not immoral unless they say it is.
That's actually standard practice among some antiCatholics. Most of the groups claim to have "former priests" on staff, whom they quote as sources for their distortions. When one objects that it is impossible for even the most poorly educated of priests to believe what they publish, they reply that there is really a secret conspiracy to keep the "real" (i.e., demonic) Catholic teachings from the laity, and that any published documents are merely for public consumption. What "really" goes on in the Vatican is known only to a select few, among whom is the "priest" they have on a leash, so to speak.
It's standard conspiracy-theory kookery, of course, but that's an inherent part of antiCatholic bigotry. You may recall the rumors these people were propagating around JFK's candidacy (and Al Smith's, but he was before my time) that the Pope would push a button, and the secret Vatican decoder-rings which all Catholics receive at their antiBiblical confirmation would glow Marian blue, the signal to mobilize an army to subvert the sovereignty of the United States.
Some of this stuff can be partially penetrated by asking one's interlocutor to submit to a little quiz. I usually ask one who expresses outrage at an out-of-context passage from the Catechism how many Biblical citations, roughly, say order of magnitude, are to be found in that document. They're never anywhere close to a correct answer, because they don't actually read the full 700 pages or so; instead they get passages exerpted and distorted through the lens of one bigoted organization or another.
It helps to know a bit about the tactics you're up against.
Astute observation...like their revisionist histories they can't prove because "the Catholics destroyed all evidence that the baptists existed from the time of the Apostles and were the only true Church." Its kinda like historical gnosticism..."only us fundamentalists know the Real history of Christianity...come join us and we'll fill you in..."
I saw a journalist on TV the other night who was spinning this whole thing in the direction of - "the Church will lose its credibility with its members" - (on sexual and reproductive issues was the implication). There definitely seems to be a slightly demonic scenario going on which is to extend and expand the scandal as a wider assault on the Church and its teachings. The sins, mistakes, errors, or crimes of SOME clergymen in no way justify an assault on the moral or spiritual teachings of the Church. Why liberals in the media see an opening for this leap is beyond logic. They reveal their own bias. Cardinal Law, for instance, even if he is to blame in any way, did not invent the Church's teachings. Mike Barnicle is one who has tried to imply that the scandals should justify questioning other Church teachings. This does not make much sense. If anything the scandals support Church teachings by showing that sin and evil remain serious problems.
LOL! I apologize, but that is just ludicrous. As any Catholic knows, the Marian (spiritual) weapon of choice is the Rosary. I just read Our Lady of Fatima's Peace Plan from Heaven (Tan Books, ISBN 0-89555-217-5) and will try to improve my efforts.
The moral authority of the Church hasn't and will never change because she derives that authority from the Son of God. The fact that there are sinful people in the Church who hurt other people doesn't decrease the teaching authority of the Church. Those people have to be dealt with and do penance for their sins, but the Church carries on, no matter how many of her members turn away from God from time to time.
I noticed you posted a perfectly newsworthy article about a CATHOLIC WATCHDOG GROUP which was pushed "out of the way." I think your "marketing" theory is correct.
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