Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Sun Tzu - The Art of War
Personal archives | 05-04-02 | PsyOp

Posted on 05/04/2002 10:10:07 PM PDT by PsyOp

AMBASSADORS

When the enemy's envoy's speak in humble terms, but continues his preparations, he will advance. When their language is deceptive but the enemy pretentiously advances, he will retreat. When the envoys speak in apologetic terms, he wishes a respite. When without a previous understanding the enemy asks for a truce, he is plotting. When the enemy sees an advantage but does not advance to seize it, he is fatigued. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c. 400-320 b.c.


ARMIES

One who sets the entire army in motion to chase an advantage will not attain it. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.

To capture an enemies army is better than to destroy it. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


CHANGE As water has no constant form, there are in war no constant conditions. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.
DECEPTION

All warfare is based on deception. Therefore, when capable, feign incapacity; when active, inactivity. When near, make it appear that you are far away; When far away that you are near. Offer the enemy a bait to lure him; feign disorder and strike him. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


DETERRENCE

It is a doctrine of war not to assume the enemy will not come, but rather to rely on one's readiness to meet him; not to presume that he will not attack, but rather to make one's self invincible. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


ENEMIES

Do not press an enemy at bay. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War, c.400-320 b.c.


FIGHTING

To fight and conquer in all our battles is not the supreme excellence; supreme excellence consists in breaking the enemy’s resistence without fighting. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War, c.400-320 b.c.

He who knows when he can fight and when he cannot will be victorious. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


FOREIGN POLICY

If not in the interests of the state, do not act. If you cannot succeed, do not use troops. If you are not in danger, do not fight. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


GENERALS

He whose generals are able and not interfered with by the sovereign will be victorious. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War, c.400-320 b.c.

It is the business of a general to be serene and inscrutable, impartial and self-controlled. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War, c.400-320 b.c.

The General who in advancing does not seek personal fame, and in withdrawing is not concerned with avoiding punishment, but whose only purpose is to protect the people and promote the best interests of his sovereign, is the precious jewel of the state. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War, c.400-320 b.c.


INFORMATION

Know the enemy, know yourself; your victory will never be endangered. Know the ground, know the weather; your victory will then be total. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War, c.400-320 b.c.


LEADERSHIP

When orders are consistently trustworthy and observed, the relationship of a commander with his troops is satisfactory. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War, c.400-320 b.c.

The general must be the first in the toils and fatigues of the army. In the heat of summer he does not spread his parasol nor in the cold of winter don thick clothing. In dangerous places he must dismount and walk. He waits until the army's wells have been dug and only then drinks; until the army's food is cooked before he eats; until the army's fortifications have been completed, to shelter himself. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War, c.400-320 b.c.

A skilled commander seeks victory from the situation and does not demand it of his subordinates. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War, c.400-320 b.c.


MANEUVER

Nothing is more difficult than the art of maneuver. What is difficult about maneuver is to make the devious route the most direct and to turn misfortune to advantage. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


PATIENCE

He who is prudent and lies in wait for an enemy who is not, will be victorious. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


POWER

In war, numbers alone confer no advantage. Do not advance relying on sheer military power. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 B.C.


PREPARATION

One who has few must prepare against the enemy; one who has many makes the enemy prepare against him. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


PROVOCATION

Agitate him and ascertain the pattern of his movement. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


SPEED

Speed is the essence of war. Take advantage of the enemy's unpreparedness; travel by unexpected routes and strike him where he has taken no precaution. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


STRATEGY

Should one ask: 'how do I cope with a well-ordered enemy host about to attack me?' I reply: seize something he cherishes and he will conform to your desires. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.

Subtle and insubstantial, the expert leaves no trace; divinely mysterious, he is inaudible. Thus he is the master of his enemy's fate. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.

What is of supreme importance in war is to attack the enemy's strategy. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.

To a surrounded enemy you must leave a way of escape. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.

When campaigning, be swift as the wind; in leisurely march, majestic as the forest; in raiding and plundering, like fire; in standing, firm as the mountains. As unfathomable as the clouds, move like a thunderbolt. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


SURPRISE

Birds rising in flight is a sign that the enemy is lying in ambush; when the wild animals are startled and flee he is trying to take you unaware. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.

Attack where he is unprepared; sally forth when he does not expect you. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


TACTICS

When I have won a victory I do not repeat my tactics but respond to circumstances in an infinite variety of ways. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War, c.400-320 b.c.


VICTORY

As water shapes its flow in accordance with the ground, so an army manages its victory in accordance with the situation of the enemy. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.

Victory is the main object in war. If this is long delayed, weapons are blunted and morale depressed. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.

He whose ranks are united in purpose will be victorious. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


VULNERABILITY

Invincibility depends on one's self; the enemy's vulnerability on him. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


WAR

War is a matter of vital importance to the state; the province of life or death; the road to survival or ruin. It is mandatory that it be thoroughly studied. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.

Generally in war the best policy is to take a state intact; to ruin it is inferior to this. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.

There has never been a protracted war from which a country has benefitted. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


WINNING

The supreme excellence is not to win a hundred victories in a hundred battles. The supreme excellence is to subdue the armies of your enemies without having to fight them. - Sun Tzu, The Art of War. c.400-320 b.c.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Government; Miscellaneous; Philosophy; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: government; history; philosophy; politics; quotes; strategy; suntzu; tactics; theartofwar; war
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100 last
To: martin_fierro
I especially like the "cracked head".

So do I. Pretty much says it all about psyops and psyoperators. Thanks.

51 posted on 05/05/2002 10:21:14 PM PDT by PsyOp
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: Cacique
let's not forget Julius Caesar's maxim

Yep. Glory and patriotism will only take an army so far. Even in modern times. We ought to forward that quote to Congress.

52 posted on 05/05/2002 10:27:43 PM PDT by PsyOp
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: Cacique
Unfortunately military and political genius proved not to be heredetary...

It never does. Those recessive genes will do you in every time.

53 posted on 05/05/2002 10:29:33 PM PDT by PsyOp
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: sleavelessinseattle
Con Fu Tse

I have to admit you stumped me there. I'm not familiar with the name.

54 posted on 05/05/2002 10:36:46 PM PDT by PsyOp
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: Cincinatus' Wife
The Good the Bad and the Ugly

Only the greatest movie of all time - not to mention the greatest movie theme music of all time!

55 posted on 05/05/2002 10:42:34 PM PDT by PsyOp
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: Ramius
Yes, and you can sum up all of Sun Tzu as: "Never pick a fair fight."

There's only one proper definition of a fair fight - the kind you win. Especially when losing means dying.

56 posted on 05/05/2002 10:49:39 PM PDT by PsyOp
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: SJackson
That works.

Sounds like a pretty good summary of Sun Tzu and a few others to me. You really think that everything in the marine guidebook was first time those ideas appeared in print? that guidebook and those used by the other armed services are but the distillation of 2,000 + years of military thought and practical application.

I geuss I'll toss out my library now that I know every worth knowing is in the Marine Guide Book. ;-]

57 posted on 05/05/2002 10:57:04 PM PDT by PsyOp
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]

To: McGavin999
I think our president has a well worn copy of Sun Tzu.

That's probably a safe bet. And perhaps a copy of Vom Krieg by Clausewitz.

58 posted on 05/05/2002 11:03:16 PM PDT by PsyOp
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp
Bumping for a more complete list and a better translation than the one I currently have.
59 posted on 05/06/2002 3:48:16 AM PDT by Maelstrom
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Lazamataz
Poohbah's Art of War

Timeliness

Do unto others as they would do unto you, but do it first.

It is far better to do something lethal to the enemy right now than to spend two days preparing the "perfect" battle plan.

The most useless quantity on the battlefied: five second ago.


Battlefield Chaos

No battle plan ever survives contact with the young lieutenant trying to execute it.

No brigade battle plan ever survives contact with division heardquarters, unless it is comes with a really spiffy set of PowerPoint slides, whereupon the Division G-3 puts his name on the slides and sends it to Corps.


Information

I don't care what the Politburo in Beijing is discussing, I want to know what's on the other side of this hill.

Getting your story out the way you want it to go out is important. Remember this when the presstitute is getting on your nerves. Slitting his throat is only a momentary pleasure, and it's bound to get you talked about in less-than-flattering terms.


Victory

Sometimes, victory in war is neat and clear-cut. If any such victory comes your way, please FReepmail me, as it would be the first since the Japanese signed their names on the Missouri's main deck.

60 posted on 05/06/2002 4:43:47 AM PDT by Poohbah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

Comment #61 Removed by Moderator

Comment #62 Removed by Moderator

To: rudy45

ping


63 posted on 12/30/2005 1:36:56 PM PST by rudy45
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: rudy45

I picked up a paperback copy of this a couple of weeks ago and it is a fairly easy read except that it was translated by an Englishman in 1910 and so the English is a little difficult to decipher at times but still a great read! I wonder how many times W has read it?


64 posted on 12/30/2005 1:49:25 PM PST by Xanadu2112
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 63 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp

Bump!


65 posted on 12/30/2005 1:51:02 PM PST by G Larry (Only strict constructionists on the Supreme Court!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: TR Jeffersonian

ping


66 posted on 12/30/2005 1:53:06 PM PST by kalee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp

Sun Tzu's Art of War is a great handbook for fighting a war, but if you try to apply away from the battlefield, towards the inner workings of government all you will end up with is a Macivellian tyranny.


67 posted on 12/30/2005 1:54:40 PM PST by Paul C. Jesup
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: XJarhead; You Dirty Rats

Major PING!!!!


68 posted on 12/30/2005 2:04:21 PM PST by GoldwaterChick
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Paul C. Jesup

What about applying it to business? I see SOME parallels, but obviously we can't apply everything.


69 posted on 12/30/2005 2:04:32 PM PST by rudy45
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 67 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp

Thanks. Which translation are you quoting from?


70 posted on 12/30/2005 2:07:38 PM PST by rudy45
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 51 | View Replies]

To: Lazamataz

Sounds like Zawahiri (???) But for sure it sounds like the MSM too--"Get news out on your terms and you may win world approval" (Especially if it's all lies!)


71 posted on 12/30/2005 2:09:06 PM PST by GoldwaterChick
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: rudy45
What about applying it to business?

If you treat business like war, you will soon have real bloodshed between companies.

72 posted on 12/30/2005 2:30:49 PM PST by Paul C. Jesup
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 69 | View Replies]

To: Squantos
I picked up a copy of "Discourses Upon the First Ten Books of Titus Livy - text of the work by Niccolo Machiavelli" today

The Discourses is a great book

73 posted on 12/30/2005 3:11:40 PM PST by SauronOfMordor (A planned society is most appealing to those with the hubris to think they will be the planners)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 23 | View Replies]

To: Lazamataz
"Mobility is better than fortification."

Unless you are proceeding through a kill zone.

74 posted on 12/30/2005 3:22:42 PM PST by verity (The MSM is a National disgrace.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: Squantos

Chusingura, the 47 Ronin.


75 posted on 12/30/2005 3:28:18 PM PST by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: SauronOfMordor; tet68

Man ya'll diggin up old stuff tonight !....LOL !

Great works.......Ya'll Stay safe I have to run some errands !

Will check back later.....


76 posted on 12/30/2005 3:43:53 PM PST by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet. )
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 73 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp
When orders are consistently trustworthy and observed, the relationship of a commander with his troops is satisfactory.

I can't find this saying, or a similar one, in the Giles/Clavell edition. Is it there? If so, which chapter? Thanks.

77 posted on 12/30/2005 8:24:01 PM PST by rudy45
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Squantos
"To: Lazamataz
"Mobility is better than fortification."
Unless you are proceeding through a kill zone.
74 posted on 12/30/2005 3:22:42 PM PST by verity (The MSM is a National disgrace.)

Did I commit a breech of etiquette, i.e., piss on his corn flakes?

78 posted on 12/31/2005 5:50:36 AM PST by verity (The MSM is a National disgrace.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 76 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp
Nothing on what to do about spy's in your midst?
79 posted on 12/31/2005 5:52:54 AM PST by mware (everyone that doesn't like what America and President Bush has done for Iraq can all go to HELL.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: verity
"Mobility is better than fortification."

Unless you are proceeding through a kill zone.

But is mobility better than fornication?

80 posted on 01/03/2006 6:47:36 AM PST by Lazamataz (I have a Chinese family renting an apartment from me. They are lo mein tenants.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 74 | View Replies]

To: Lazamataz
"But is mobility better than fornication?"

I think they are mutually inclusive. Thinking

81 posted on 01/03/2006 6:52:30 AM PST by verity (The MSM is a National disgrace.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 80 | View Replies]

To: verity
Well, I *move* when I fornicate.

Which explains my popularity wit' da ladies.

Y'see.

82 posted on 01/03/2006 6:53:34 AM PST by Lazamataz (I have a Chinese family renting an apartment from me. They are lo mein tenants.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 81 | View Replies]

To: Paul C. Jesup
Sun Tzu's Art of War is a great handbook for fighting a war, but if you try to apply away from the battlefield, towards the inner workings of government all you will end up with is a Macivellian tyranny.

The key to applying the type of generalized rules that Sun Tzu laid out is knowing when they apply and when they don't. Once having identified that, one then has to apply a proper response. The application of Sun Tzu in the business place does not result in tyranny, but rather the mis-application, IMHO.

As for Machiavelli, he never advocated tyranny, but was simply one of the most astute observers of human nature that has ever put pen to paper since Aristotle.

Machiavelli

83 posted on 01/03/2006 10:08:52 AM PST by PsyOp (The commonwealth is theirs who hold the arms.... - Aristotle.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 67 | View Replies]

To: rudy45
Thanks. Which translation are you quoting from?

I don't recall. In retrospect I should have included that info. If the book isn't in storage I'll try to get that info and post it. It was one of the major translations though.

84 posted on 01/03/2006 10:18:51 AM PST by PsyOp (The commonwealth is theirs who hold the arms.... - Aristotle.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 70 | View Replies]

To: rudy45
I can't find this saying, or a similar one, in the Giles/Clavell edition. Is it there? If so, which chapter? Thanks.

If the book is not in storage, I'll see if I can dig it out and let you know.

85 posted on 01/03/2006 10:20:24 AM PST by PsyOp (The commonwealth is theirs who hold the arms.... - Aristotle.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 77 | View Replies]

To: mware
Nothing on what to do about spy's in your midst?

Perhaps he thought is was a no-brainer. Turn-em or kill-em.

86 posted on 01/03/2006 10:21:56 AM PST by PsyOp (The commonwealth is theirs who hold the arms.... - Aristotle.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 79 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp

Two men in elevator - one fart - both know who did it.


87 posted on 01/03/2006 10:22:31 AM PST by AD from SpringBay (We have the government we allow and deserve.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Lazamataz
When the great Free Republic Paintball World Championships get underway....I want to be on your team.     =;^)
88 posted on 01/03/2006 10:25:02 AM PST by Bloody Sam Roberts (Crime cannot be tolerated. Criminals thrive on the indulgences of society's understanding.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: Cacique
Good morning.

There is really only one rule of war that matters.

Don't lose.

Michael Frazier
89 posted on 01/03/2006 10:35:28 AM PST by brazzaville (no surrender no retreat, well, maybe retreat's ok)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp
The key to applying the type of generalized rules that Sun Tzu laid out is knowing when they apply and when they don't. Once having identified that, one then has to apply a proper response. The application of Sun Tzu in the business place does not result in tyranny, but rather the mis-application, IMHO.

The Art of War does not take into account of personal freedoms of the masses/people since such concepts did not did not exist back then.

As for Machiavelli, he never advocated tyranny, but was simply one of the most astute observers of human nature that has ever put pen to paper since Aristotle.

Machiavelli wrote the book "The Prince", which was basically a handguide to the justifications of a tyrant.

90 posted on 01/03/2006 1:38:21 PM PST by Paul C. Jesup
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 83 | View Replies]

To: Paul C. Jesup
Machiavelli wrote the book "The Prince", which was basically a handguide to the justifications of a tyrant.

You need to read more than just "The Prince" to pass judgement on Machiavelli. The Prince was a hurried synopsis of his greater works called "The Discourses". In the Discourses his explanations go into greater detail.

Many people make the mistake of thinking that Machiavelli advocated all of the things of which he wrote, which is not true. Machiavelli was an objective observer of human nature and politics. The things he reveals about them are unpleasent, but nevertheless true, and he was reviled for that.

Machiavelli was primarily interested in "good" government and how to achieve that. But to understand what is good in government, one must understand what is bad about it, so that it can be recognized and avoided. In "The Prince," (1537) Machiavelli stated: "In the actions of men, and especially of Princes, from which there is no appeal, the end justifies the means."

At its publication most understood it to mean (and still do), that it was o.k. to do whatever you wanted if you achieved your means. And if all you ever read was "The Prince" (or the cliff-notes thereof), that is probably what you think.

In fact, he was simply stating a fact that has been proven time and time again. If your end is good and results in good, the people will generally forgive the means used to achieve them. It was a statement of fact, not a moral judgement, which, unfortunately, he did not fully explain in "The Prince."

For example, he wrote in The Discourses: "It will consequently be exceedingly rare that a good man should be found to employ wicked means to become prince, even though his final object be good; or that a bad man, after having become prince, should be willing to labor for good ends, and that it should enter his mind to use for good purpose that authority which he has acquired by evil means." Is that statement arguable?

He goes on to say: "A well-regulated republic, therefore, should open the way to public honors to those who seek reputation by means that are conducive to the public good; and close it to those whose aim is the advancement of private ends." We could all agree on that, I think.

Machiavelli was maligned by his "political" enemies in life (to whom he was threat by way of his illuminations), and continues to be to this day by people who think they can understand him by reading a pamphlet titled "The Prince". Read all three volumes of "The Discourse" and his "Art of War" before you pass judgement. Then read Aristotle's "Politics" and "Ethics" to see the similarities.

"No reading is more necessary than that of Machiavelli; those who affect to be shocked by his principals are nothing but petty intellectuals posing as humanists." - Karl von Clauswitz, On War, 1832.

As for Sun Tzu's Art of War, the application of any military strategy text, written in any age, to private life, is a matter of interpretation. Going from the Macro to the micro. The military axioms of Sun Tzu repeat themselves in various forms in most accepted strategy primers from Machivelli to Clauswitz, from Patton to Rommel. They are universal observations of strategy.

Take the following observation from Sun Tzu: "To capture an enemies army is better than to destroy it."

Does that apply to corporate life? Maybe yes, maybe no. It might be appllied to say that it is better to buy out the competition than it is to destroy it, (re: Bill Gates). Who knows? It is subject to interpretation when removed from pervue of the battlefield.

Or take this quote: "All warfare is based on deception. Therefore, when capable, feign incapacity; when active, inactivity. When near, make it appear that you are far away; When far away that you are near. Offer the enemy a bait to lure him; feign disorder and strike him."

Is this applicable to the work place? Perhaps. First you would have to determine if you have enemies that are trying to do you in from the next cubicle. If so, then it may be useful. If not, it could be destructive. The same as applied to politics.

The Art of War is applicable in private life, but not in all situations. Anymore than it is applicable in all military situations. That is why good military leaders don't just read Sun Tzu. They also read Clauswitz, Jomini, Machiavelli, Napoleon, Rommel, Patton, Hamurabbi, and others. So you can see where the lines of thought intersect and diverge and can make better judgements as to which rules apply best in any given military situation. General truths and axioms are only that. They must still be interpreted to the specific situation at hand for them to have relevance and meaning. They also have relevent corollaries in private life, but one needs to be careful in their application. Those that think they can be used as general rules of conduct (and there are many) are mistaken.

91 posted on 01/03/2006 2:43:49 PM PST by PsyOp (The commonwealth is theirs who hold the arms.... - Aristotle.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 90 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp
Many people make the mistake of thinking that Machiavelli advocated all of the things of which he wrote,

I never said Machiavelli advocated anything. YOU JUST ASSUMED THAT!!

In my first post on this thread, I used the word "Machiavelian", which means: a cunning and unprincipled politician.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=Machiavelian

As for Sun Tzu's Art of War, the application of any military strategy text, written in any age, to private life, is a matter of interpretation.

And there is the flaw in your logic, Sun Tzu wrote "Art of War" for war and only war. He wrote it at a time when a Emperor/King/Leader's word was law, where the common people had NO RIGHTS, NOR FREEDOMS. So Sun Tzu did not take such freedoms into account in his writings.

If you apply Sun Tzu's "Art of War" to politics and the form of government, you will end up with a tyranny.

92 posted on 01/03/2006 3:00:06 PM PST by Paul C. Jesup
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 91 | View Replies]

To: Paul C. Jesup

I don't know where you bought your education, but I'd demand a refund. You got gipped.


93 posted on 01/03/2006 3:17:46 PM PST by PsyOp (The commonwealth is theirs who hold the arms.... - Aristotle.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 92 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp

I actually posted a link to the meaning of the word "Machiavelian", which you seem to have a problem with.


94 posted on 01/03/2006 3:47:26 PM PST by Paul C. Jesup
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 93 | View Replies]

To: Paul C. Jesup

You posted a link? You might want to hit the HTML sandbox and and check the definition of the term "link".

As for the term Machiavellian, the modern definition is nothing more than a continuation of the age old, and now PC slander of Machiavelli by people who were too lazy to read anything more than the Prince. It assumes that people/politicians and such that are "cunning and unprincipled" are somehow behaving as Machiavelli would have them behave. This is not true. Had you actually read the explanation I offered and considered it, you might have understood that.

As for Sun Tzu, he himself discusses the unversality of his military principals and there application in all adversarial relationship: military, political, personal. They are not all that different from many precepts of confucious. And on that note:

"A gentleman can see a question from all sides without bias. The small man is biased and can see a question only from one side." - Confucius, Analects, c.400 b.c.

Get back to me when you expanded your reading list. There is no point in arguing with you since you lack knowledge of the basic reference material I am using. And yes, I have read every single author I mentioned and many others as well. I encourage you to do the same.


95 posted on 01/03/2006 4:34:17 PM PST by PsyOp (The commonwealth is theirs who hold the arms.... - Aristotle.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 94 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp
You posted a link? You might want to hit the HTML sandbox and and check the definition of the term "link".

Now you are just being insulting, I posted the link/address. Copy and paste it to the address bar and it will work, but I see you are to lazy to do that.

As for the term Machiavellian, the modern definition is nothing more than a continuation of the age old, and now PC slander of Machiavelli by people who were too lazy to read anything more than the Prince.

Note the term "modern definition", which you admit I used the word "Machiavellian" in the correct "modern definition".

As for Sun Tzu, he himself discusses the unversality of his military principals and there application in all adversarial relationship

Note an "adversarial relationship" in which the government views it's country's citizens as it's adversaries, is a tyranny.

"A gentleman can see a question from all sides without bias. The small man is biased and can see a question only from one side." - Confucius, Analects, c.400 b.c.

I guess by this quote, you are a 'small man' because you refuse to see any other side by your own.

Get back to me when you expanded your reading list.

You're the one who refuses to accept the modern english language.

96 posted on 01/03/2006 5:03:36 PM PST by Paul C. Jesup
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 95 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp

Bump for later...


97 posted on 01/03/2006 5:21:38 PM PST by JDoutrider
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Lazamataz
I also observed later on that the best camouflage is not Woodland Camouflage #2, or the new "Pixelized" version of Woodland that they are issuing, but ordinary street clothes.

UPS brown is great urban camo...

98 posted on 01/04/2006 8:11:06 AM PST by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: Paul C. Jesup

Isn't it interesting that none of your arguments rely on any of the source material I mentioned? In fact you have mentioned no source material at all to bolster or back up your argument/opinion. Why is that? If parsing my words or looking up the word "Machiavellian" in the dictionary is the best you can come up with, you stop embarassing yourself. This is not an argument over the definition of "is". You need to come up with something else if you want to be taken seriously.


99 posted on 01/04/2006 8:16:16 AM PST by PsyOp (The commonwealth is theirs who hold the arms.... - Aristotle.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 96 | View Replies]

To: PsyOp
Isn't it interesting that none of your arguments rely on any of the source material I mentioned? In fact you have mentioned no source material at all to bolster or back up your argument/opinion.

That is because the core of this argument is that you have taken a stated pronoun "machiavelian", I stated, which you admit I used correctly in the present tense of the term, and you have unjustly taken it as a personal insult.

You need to grow-up.

This is not an argument over the definition of "is".

Yes, it is such an argument.

100 posted on 01/04/2006 3:26:24 PM PST by Paul C. Jesup
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 99 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100 last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson