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In Texas: remembering the Alamo differently
Christian Science Monitor ^ | May 13, 2002 | Kris Axtman

Posted on 05/13/2002 11:42:33 AM PDT by tenderstone jr.

click here to read article


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To: w_over_w; gcruse

I doubt it. We have one flying in our local Court House. There are several companies that make replicas.

41 posted on 05/14/2002 2:05:57 PM PDT by deport
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To: deport
. . . in the Courthouse of which great city in the Republic of Texas?
42 posted on 05/14/2002 2:24:14 PM PDT by w_over_w
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To: w_over_w
Beaumont, Jefferson County
43 posted on 05/14/2002 2:44:29 PM PDT by deport
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To: deport
Beaumont huh? ...drove through many times on my "back and forths" to LSU. Do you still have that giant Goodyear plant?
44 posted on 05/14/2002 3:17:54 PM PDT by w_over_w
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To: w_over_w
Yes it's still out on I-10....

Geaux Tigers Geaux

45 posted on 05/14/2002 3:28:56 PM PDT by deport
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To: skeeter
He'd also like to see another, smaller monument placed next to the towering column in honor of the Mexican soldiers who died fighting for what they believed in.

Since when do we give honor to the enemy.

Were the Nazis given a monument in Germany after WWII to honor them for fighting in what they believed in?

This politically correct garbage is going to ruin America.

46 posted on 05/14/2002 3:32:35 PM PDT by RickyJ
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To: Brownie74; MeeknMing; COB1; lodwick
I thought this was interesting, so here is your PING. :)
47 posted on 05/14/2002 6:47:24 PM PDT by SpookBrat
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To: SpookBrat
"We teach a lot of kids who have just come from Mexico and many who still have loyalties to Mexico.

So? Teach history as it is written. If someone gets offended, they are free to leave!!

48 posted on 05/14/2002 7:07:32 PM PDT by Brownie74
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To: TADSLOS
He'd also like to see another, smaller monument placed next to the towering column in honor of the Mexican soldiers who died fighting for what they believed in.

Any historians know the proportion of conscripts to volunteers in the Mexican army during the Texas Revolution? Somehow, I suspect more Texans were fighting for their beliefs than were Mexicans.

49 posted on 05/14/2002 7:15:02 PM PDT by timm22
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To: Brownie74
I guess I feel sad for those who courageously fought and died at the Alamo. Or was that all a lie? Those darn imperialistic Americans trying to take Texas from Mexico!!! (I can't visit the Alamo without crying. I have no idea why. I guess they are tears of pride and sadness both).

How are you BTW?

50 posted on 05/14/2002 7:16:04 PM PDT by SpookBrat
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To: All

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51 posted on 05/14/2002 7:16:39 PM PDT by Bob J
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To: SpookBrat
I guess they are tears of pride and sadness both.

There is nothing wrong with that. I lived in San Antonio for 14 years and had the privilege of being one of the operators that ran a special events radio station out of the Alamo for 24 hours.

It is amazing that people from all over the world (Japan, Russia, China, New Zealand, everywhere) all signed off with us with the words - "REMEMBER THE ALAMO!!" I'll not let any of these PC revisionist take that from me.

How are you BTW?

I am well thank you. How do you like your new digs over there on the east coast?

52 posted on 05/14/2002 7:48:47 PM PDT by Brownie74
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To: deport
Yeah! That's two great things about you . . . you're a Texan and a LSU fan.
53 posted on 05/14/2002 9:08:04 PM PDT by w_over_w
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To: tenderstone jr.
FR downtime BUMP!
54 posted on 05/16/2002 3:51:03 AM PDT by MeekOneGOP
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To: Aggie Mama
1st Some background info. I wish I could have been in on this earlier, but workload prevented this being very contemporary to the posting date.

I returned to KCMO from a trip to visit relatives in Houston about the time this article was posted. I have intimate knowledge of the area in the article. I attended Luther Burbank Elementary until completion in 1970. I lived in the area from 1957 to 1976, just a few blocks from the school on Fichter St. ,where my mama and sister still live. Attended Sam Houston High school class of 76 then on to Texas A&M, Class of '80. I hope to fill in some missing parts of the previous postings as well pose some questions myself. Have lived here in KC since 1985.

To: Aggie Mama: Burbank Elementary / Burbank Jr. High & Sam Houston are in the "Near North Side" of Houston. Always has been part of HISD. If anyone is familiar with the H. Metro Area it would be just a couple of miles outside Loop 610 and between I45 and I59. I could and did walk to all 3. My older brother & sister did previous to me. They attended in the late 50s to early 60s.

The demographics of the neighborhood are of interest to me also. Periodically visiting over the past 25 years (due to college, marriage, relocating to Missouri, etc.) I have been witness to many ups and downs in the Near North Side (NNS) In elementary school our school reflected closely the neighborhood. Predominantly white low-middle to mid-middle income mostly blue-collar with a light smattering of white collar. Parents were 1st or 2nd generation off the farm and lots of WW2 vets. The area constructed in 1946, 1947 from independent developers/builders. Not yet the sprawling brick suburbs of other later Houston areas. Mostly wood frame houses on block foundations. Our house cost about $7000. The schools had good and bad teachers, kids. I am a user now of private schools here in KC. I don't think the schools were "bad govt. schools" then (like we discuss often at FR.) I strongly equate Burbank Elem. In the 60s to Leave It to Beaver . Was that so wrong???? Things got worse though, much worse.

About 1969 or 1970 social engineering took place thru de-segregation with blacks. Houston didn't do it half-a**ed. We saw some neat looking apartment type housing going up near the Burbank Jr. high. But they were instant slums. There was some flight from the neighborhoods. The schools/neighborhood started a downward-spiral. I don't know if it was hormones or what but there was NO discipline. HISD also de-seg'd the teaching staff with burnt out, non-caring types. There was very little learning in that school, but lots of racial fighting. I was (through MY own fault), a little lazy myself but I did not add to the chaos. Absolutely the worst 3 years of my life. On into Sam Houston High it got better. I did the ROTC thing and glad to this day. We all got along, blackwhitelatino. Maybe the maturity or burnt out hormones ?!!?? Don't know to this day. That 70s Show is what we looked like, even ROTC was somewhat hairy.

Now, since the background- these schools mentioned were/are mixed racially as follows. 1940s thru 1960s 95% white. 5% other 1969 thru 1976 ---50-60% white, 30-40% black, 10-20% latino 1976 thru 1986 ---40 - 60% black, 30-40% white, 20-30% latino 1986 to present --- 60-70% latino, 10-20% white, 10% black

I am showing the approx. mix for discussion only, to this day I don't understand The demographic changes that occurred. Some were Govt. driven and some are economic changes probably. I love history, especially Texana. In the last year have recommitted myself to learning the history. While there, visited San-Jac. And the inscriptions at the base leave no-doubt as to the outcome of the battle and its reaching effects. They used very strong wording in that respect for a purpose !!

Two of the eight inscriptions on the exterior base of the San Jacinto Monument reads :

#6 ON THIS FIELD ON APRIL 21, 1836 THE ARMY OF TEXAS COMMANDED BY GENERAL SAM HOUSTON, AND ACCOMPANIED BY THE SECRETARY OF WAR, THOMAS J. RUSK, AT-TACKED THE SUPERIOR INVADING ARMY OF MEXICANS UNDER GENERAL SANTA ANNA. THE BATTLE LINE FROM LEFT TO RIGHT WAS FORMED BY SIDNEY SHERMAN'S REGIMENT, EDWARD BURLESON'S REGIMENT, THE ARTILLERY COMMANDED BY GEORGE W. HOCKLEY, HENRY MILLARD's INFANTRY AND THE CAVALRY UNDER MIRABEAU B. LAMAR. SAM HOUSTON LED THE INFANTRY CHARGE WITH THE BATTLE CRY, "REMEMBER THE ALAMO! REMEMBER GOLIAD!" THE TEXANS CHARGED. THE ENEMY, TAKEN BY SURPRISE, RALLIED FOR A FEW MINUTES, THEN FLED IN DISORDER. THE TEXANS HAD ASKED NO QUARTER AND GAVE NONE. THE SLAUGHTER WAS APPALLING, VICTORY COMPLETE, AND TEXAS FREE! ON THE FOLLOWING DAY GENERAL ANTONIO LOPEZ DE SANTA ANNA, SELF-STYLED "NAPOLEON OF THE WEST," RECEIVED FROM A GENEROUS FOE THE MERCY HE HAD DENIED TRAVIS AT THE ALAMO AND FANNIN AT GOLIAD.

#7 "Measured by its results, San Jacinto was one of the decisive battles of the world. The freedom of Texas from Mexico won here led to annexationqv and to the Mexican War,qv resulting in the acquisition by the United States of thestates of Texas, New Mexico, Arizona, Nevada, California, Utah, and parts of Colorado, Wyoming, Kansas, and Oklahoma. Almost one-third of the present area of the American nation, nearly a million square miles of territory, changed sovereignty."

I always knew our history was more taught than other states. This bothers me that this path was taken by the teachers. Texians were several nationalities that fought against the Nat. Mexican Govt. Juan Seguine was a good example. I have learned that Jeffersonian type history is very important, specifically focusing on individuals and their effect on our past. Our history books in 5 th grade were written by the district. Its title was EARLY DAYS IN TEXAS (curriculum bulletin 58CBM36) by Dorothy Sinclair of the HISD Curriculum Dept. and it was simple but forthright. I still have it and have used it to instruct my Mo. born children.

One last thing….. the neighborhood seems to be turning around and there are some improvements. There is a economic resurgence although small now. Mostly Texicans holding steady jobs as far as I can tell.People don't want to spend all their time driving to work. Took me only 20 min. from house to Enron field parking for an afternoon game. I visited the ROTC and found it was a Kick-a** unit, nothing like we had in the 70s. The kids were clean, cut , clear -eyed. I think the school is better (maybe), lets not cheat them of truthful history.

55 posted on 06/03/2002 4:46:07 AM PDT by urtax$@work
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To: ALL
"as the Hispanic population quickly becomes a majority in this state, teachers, historians, and museum directors are realizing that celebrating these accomplishments without regard to their southern neighbors isn't cutting it anymore."

To any Freepers that are interested in the issue of illegal immigration: Type the word "Reconquista" into your search engine and see what you get.

56 posted on 06/03/2002 5:01:22 AM PDT by Destructor
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To: chaosagent
"Should I worry about how the English feel as I celebrate the 4th of July?"

According to the Liberals, you should be racked with guilt!

57 posted on 06/03/2002 5:15:30 AM PDT by Destructor
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To: deport
I understand a little more now...
58 posted on 06/03/2002 5:55:04 AM PDT by philman_36
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To: timydnuc
the battle cry of the Army of Texas...."Remember The Alamo"!
Remember The Alamo, Remember Goliad!

Lest we foget? Already forgotten!

59 posted on 06/03/2002 5:57:50 AM PDT by philman_36
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To: w_over_w; deport
Beaumont huh?
From the article...Adrian Anderson, a history professor at Lamar University in Beaumont, Texas.
Yeah, Geaux Beaumont?
Look at the red/blue county map.

See that blue county on the coast next to Louisiana?
Jefferson county/Beaumont, Texas/Golden Triangle...
60 posted on 06/03/2002 6:16:21 AM PDT by philman_36
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