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Signatures of the Gun Culture
NewsMax.com / CommentMax ^ | June 1, 2002 | Dr. Michael S. Brown

Posted on 06/01/2002 6:34:06 AM PDT by George Frm Br00klyn Park



NewsMax.com / CommentMax

Signatures of the Gun Culture
Dr. Michael S. Brown
June 1, 2002

Anthropologists study a culture by interviewing individuals and observing group meetings. Now that communications are mostly electronic, an easier way to gather data is to monitor e-mail lists and bulletin boards.

Many Internet correspondents set their e-mail program to automatically add a quote or slogan at the end of each e-mail to support their beliefs. These are called signatures or ".sig files" and in no other American subculture are they more popular or seen in greater variety than in the gun rights movement.

Anyone who wishes to understand this segment of society would be well advised to scan these brief sub-messages. They reveal a depth of knowledge that belies the image of the ignorant redneck gun owner. Let's read a few and you'll see what I mean.

Invoking the words of respected historical figures highlights the concept that those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it. Many signatures have included this popular Benjamin Franklin truism:

Those that give up essential liberty for a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty or safety.

A popular quote from Thomas Jefferson is actually his quotation of brilliant criminologist Cesare Beccaria:
Laws that forbid the carrying of arms ... disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. ... Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.

Famous authors are often quoted in e-mail signatures, especially Robert Heinlein, whose science fiction novels influenced a generation of baby boomers. The most famousHeinlein aphorism is:
An armed society is a polite society.

Even before the groundbreaking work of Prof. John Lott, this statement was a powerful reminder of the positive effect of guns on human behavior.

Author William S. Burroughs contributed this gem:
After a shooting spree, they always want to take the guns away from the people who didn't do it.


Some gun rights activists use their signature messages to change the terms of the gun control debate. Rejecting the anti-gun concept that guns are useless and dangerous, they include slogans like these:
Guns protect moms and kids.

Save a life, teach a woman to shoot.

Self-defense is a basic human right.

When did they revoke innocent until proven guilty?
expresses the feelings of many gun owners who believe they are being treated like criminals.

Another popular theme is to highlight the stupidity of the opposition. An activist named Sam Cohen came up with this one:
<B>
The philosophy of gun control: Teenagers are roaring through town at 90 MPH, where the speed limit is 25. Your solution is to lower the speed limit to 20.</B>

A speaker at the Million Mom March uttered this infamous malaprop:
If someone comes at you with a knife or gun, say, "I know you're upset." We all want to be valued as human beings.

This rather crude apothegm has been popular for years:
Gun Control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound.

A new group called "Pink Pistols" promotes the firearms rights of sexual minorities; some members have modified the previous statement to read like this:
Gun Control: The theory that Matthew Shepard hanging from a fence post in Wyoming is morally superior to Matthew Shepard explaining to the local sheriff how his attackers got those fatal bullet wounds.

Famous firearms instructors also contribute their share of quotes. Col. Jeff Cooper, considered the father of modern pistolcraft, said:
Owning a handgun doesn't make you armed any more than owning a guitar makes you a musician.

Massad Ayoob, the most famous currently active instructor, stated:
The irony is, if you're willing to kill a perpetrator, you probably won't have to.

I believe the most popular and significant signature of the gun rights subculture is an ancient challenge issued by King Leonidas of Sparta. In 480 B.C., he and 300 of his Spartan warriors occupied the narrow pass at Thermopylae to delay the onslaught of the gigantic Persian army. Historians put the size of the Persian forces between 150,000 and 2 million men.

When ordered by the Persian commander to give up their weapons, Leonidas shouted back, "Molon labe!" or "Come take them!" The valiant Greeks fought to the last man and bought precious time for their countrymen to prepare.

If the leaders of the anti-gun lobby had been aware that Molon labe! is a highly popular rallying cry among their enemies, they might have realized that their plan to force their views on American society was doomed to failure. Unfortunately for them, they were not comfortable monitoring the communications of their foes. They probably feared exposure to contagious ideas.

Dr. Michael S. Brown is a member of Doctors for Sensible Gun Laws (www.dsgl.org). He may be e-mailed at: rkba2000@yahoo.com
THIS article at NewsMax.com


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: banglist; freetrade; geopolitics; govwatch; nwo
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-58 next last
"After a shooting spree, they always want to take the guns away from the people who didn't do it."

All, And they call this phenomenum "prevention" in order to assume CONTROL!! Peace and love, George.
1 posted on 06/01/2002 6:34:06 AM PDT by George Frm Br00klyn Park
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Bang!
2 posted on 06/01/2002 6:38:59 AM PDT by Politically Correct
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To: Carry_Okie; "NWO"; "Free" Trade; Geopolitics; Gov_Watch; Black Jade; M1991; cdwright; mbb bill...
" The philosophy of gun control: Teenagers are roaring through town at 90 MPH, where the speed limit is 25. Your solution is to lower the speed limit to 20. "

Guys, Yep. That's it. Peace and love, George.

3 posted on 06/01/2002 6:41:08 AM PDT by George Frm Br00klyn Park
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Gun Control slogan bump
4 posted on 06/01/2002 6:56:23 AM PDT by gitmo
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Good post! I like Micheal Brown's stuff -- he writes so well, even an anti-gunner can understand it. And like he says, that's probably what they're afraid of.

Shameless self-plug: If you liked the quotes in this article, there's a 19 page document in PDF format of the best of the best right HERE.


5 posted on 06/01/2002 6:57:49 AM PDT by Joe Brower
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Since 9-11 and subsequent efforts to "stop terrorism", I have had the following sig (correctly quoted, unlike the article):

"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety" - Benjamin Franklin

Glad to see I'm not the only person who thinks this way.

I thought "molon labe" meant "kiss my @$$".....

6 posted on 06/01/2002 7:02:44 AM PDT by SW6906
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To: Joe Brower
Awesome compilation! A must-save-and-pass-on!

"Gun bans don't disarm criminals, gun bans attract them." - Walter Mondale

Ex-Presidential candidate Walter Mondale said that? He was (is?) pro-gun?!!!?

7 posted on 06/01/2002 7:08:47 AM PDT by SW6906
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Excellent!
8 posted on 06/01/2002 7:14:08 AM PDT by aomagrat
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
"After the enemies with guns have been wiped out, it will be time to wipe out our other enemies who do not have guns." -- Chairman Mao
9 posted on 06/01/2002 7:14:12 AM PDT by Liberty Ship
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Owning a handgun doesn't make you armed any more than owning a guitar makes you a musician.

Having had pistolcraft instruction from Colonel Cooper, this quote rings very true. More new gunowners need to take this to heart. The presence of a gun may often prevent an attack from taking place, but the gun "user" better project some confidence or he/she could quickly become a victim anyway. Predators are good at reading fear and hesitation in the eyes of their intended victim.

10 posted on 06/01/2002 7:16:37 AM PDT by toddst
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To: toddst
"Molon labe" is the motto of Freeperdom. King Leonidas' rejoinder to the ancient Persians, loosely translated into 21st century American idiom, would be: "Up Yours!!!"
11 posted on 06/01/2002 7:23:33 AM PDT by goldstategop
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To: SW6906
He was. Funny how they change their stance after being in Washington DC for awhile. Actually, if you read quotes on RKBA from JFK, Humphrey, et al, who were all considered liberals in their day, you see how they would be considered right-wing conservatives now. Start evidence of how far America has already slid down the slippery slope.

Please do pass on the RKBA quotes doc, as well as anything else you find of use on my site, to anyone and everyone you know. That's what it's all there for.

12 posted on 06/01/2002 7:27:25 AM PDT by Joe Brower
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Let's not forget the ever popular 'BLOAT' and 'FMCDH'.

2nd Amendement bump.

13 posted on 06/01/2002 7:28:45 AM PDT by Looking4Truth
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To: toddst, George Frm Br00klyn Park
Another of my absolute favorites from Col. Cooper is:

"A pistol is what you use to fight your way back to the rifle that you stupidly left behind."

You gotta love the guy! I'm currently reading his seminal work, "The Art of the Rifle". A very concise and brilliant work, wrought from the hand of experience.

14 posted on 06/01/2002 7:29:41 AM PDT by Joe Brower
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To: Joe Brower
Here's a few from my FReeper profile page, sometimes quoted elsewhere:

******************************************************************************

Dies Irae, Dies Illa

******************************************************************************

There exists a law, not written down anywhere, but inborn in our hearts; a law which comes to us not by training or custom or reading; a law which has come to us not from theory but from practice, not by instruction but by natural intuition. I refer to the law which lays it down that, if our lives are endangered by plots or violence or armed robbers or enemies, any and every method of protecting ourselves is morally right.

--Marcus Tulius Cicero, 106-53 BC

******************************************************************************

Any government that would attempt to disarm its people is despotic; and any people that would submit to it deserve to be slaves!

--Stephen F. Austin, 1835

*********************************************************************************

A government that fears arms in the hands of its people should also fear the rope!

--General Nathan Bedford Forrest, CSA

********************************************************************************

A society of sheep by nature, must beget a government of wolves.

-- Bertrand de Jouvenel, In Freedom

********************************************************************************

All laws which are repugnant to the Constitution are null and void.

Marbury vs. Madison, 5 US (2 Cranch) 137, 174, 176, (1803)

********************************************************************************

I am only one, but I am one.
I cannot do everything, but I can do something.
And because I cannot do everything,
I will not refuse to do the something that I can do.
What I can do, I should do.
And what I should do, by the grace of God, I will do.

-- Edward Everett Hale

********************************************************************************* None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free.

-Johann W. Von Goethe

*******************************************************************************

Governor, had I foreseen the use those people designed to make of their victory, there would have been no surrender at Appomattox Courthouse; no, sir, not by me. Had I foreseen these results of subjugation, I would have preferred to die at Appomattox with my brave men, my sword in this right hand.

-- General Robert E. Lee to Governor Stockdale of Texas, August 1870

*******************************************************************************

The greatest happiness is to scatter your enemy and drive him before you, to see his cities reduced to ashes, to see those who love him shrouded in tears, and to gather to your bosom his wives and his daughters.

-- Genghis Khan, 1226

*******************************************************************************

15 posted on 06/01/2002 7:30:04 AM PDT by archy
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To: archy
Kewl. I'm adding them to the next revision of the doc right now.
16 posted on 06/01/2002 7:31:04 AM PDT by Joe Brower
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Owning a handgun doesn't make you armed any more than owning a guitar makes you a musician.

My new signature file for e-mails bump.

17 posted on 06/01/2002 7:34:50 AM PDT by Looking4Truth
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To: Joe Brower
Another of my absolute favorites from Col. Cooper is:

"A pistol is what you use to fight your way back to the rifle that you stupidly left behind."

Actually, I think that one comes from Clint Smith at Thunder Ranch, but either sensei might well be quoting the other. My 1978 Orange Gunsight API 250 course served me well, and I felt much more comfortable going in harm's way with *only* a handgun than previously, and I certainly don't think of the Colonel, then or now, as at all undergunned with both a good handgun and the knowledge of how to use one effectively.

That said, there were generally some pretty serious longguns, or at least medium-longish ones around me in those days, particularly in the work vehicle I had then. And in these as well....

-archy-/-

18 posted on 06/01/2002 7:37:24 AM PDT by archy
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To: Joe Brower
"A pistol is what you use to fight your way back to the rifle that you stupidly left behind."

Damn, I like this one, too for a sig file. Decisions.....decisions...

19 posted on 06/01/2002 7:38:05 AM PDT by Looking4Truth
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Another collection of quotes can be found at Pro Gun Women.
20 posted on 06/01/2002 7:42:39 AM PDT by serinde
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
bump
21 posted on 06/01/2002 7:45:48 AM PDT by SauronOfMordor
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To: Looking4Truth
For the record, yours truly coined BLOAT.
22 posted on 06/01/2002 8:03:51 AM PDT by Travis McGee
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
A bit large for a Siggie, but a favorite of mine, nonetheless:

The Creed of the United States Marine

This is my rifle.
There are many like it, but this one is mine.
My rifle is my best friend.
It is my life.
I must master it as I must master my life.
My rifle, without me, is useless.
Without my rifle, I am useless.

I must fire my rifle true.
I must shoot straighter than my enemy who is trying to kill me.
I must shoot him before he shoots me.
I will.
My rifle and I know that what counts in this war is not the rounds we fire, the noise of our burst, nor the smoke we make.
We know that it is the hits that count.
We will hit.
My rifle is human, even as I, because it is my life.
Thus, I will learn it as a brother.
I will learn its weaknesses, its strengths, its parts, its accessories, its sights, and its barrel.
I will ever guard it against the ravages of weather and damage.
I will keep my rifle clean and ready, even as I am clean and ready.
We will become part of each other.
We will.
Before God I swear this creed.
My rifle and I are the defenders of my country.
We are the masters of our enemy.
We are the saviors of my life.
So be it, until victory is America's and there is no enemy, but Peace!

23 posted on 06/01/2002 8:05:46 AM PDT by Teacher317
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Here are some quotes from the gun control camp:

"Banning guns addresses a fundamental right of all Americans to feel safe." ~~Senator Diane Feinstein, 1993 (She holds one of the rare California concealed pistol permits.)

"If I could have gotten 51 votes in the Senate ofthe United States for an outright ban, picking up every one of them....'Mr. and Mrs. America, turn them all in', I would have done it." ~~Senator Feinstein, 1995

"Germans who wish to use firearms should join the SS or the SA: ordinary citizens don't need guns, as their having guns doesn't serve the state." ~~Heinrich Himmler

"If someone is so fearful that they are going to start using their weapons to protect their rights, it makes me very nervous that these people have weapons at all." ~~Henry Waxman

"One of the basic conditions for the victory of socialism is the arming of the workers [read communist party] and the disarming of the bourgeoisie." ~~V.I. Lenin, Collected Works

"I don't think everybody has a right to a weapon which can be used to kill innocent people and maybe threaten the life of a president of the United States." ~~Henry Waxman

"Make mass searches and hold executions for found arms." ~~V.I. Lenin

"We are going to hammer guns on the anvil of relentless legislative strategy! We are going to beat guns into submission!" ~~Senator Chuck Schumer

"If the opposition disarms, well and good. If it refuses to disarm, we shall disarm it ourselves." ~~Stalin, 1927

"I stand in support of this common sense legislation to license everyone who wishes to purchase a gun. I also believe that every new handgun sale or or transfer should be listed in a national registry, such as Chuck [Senator Schumer] is proposing." ~~Hillary Clinton, 2000

24 posted on 06/01/2002 8:09:19 AM PDT by Travis McGee
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
NICE!
25 posted on 06/01/2002 8:09:29 AM PDT by Dan from Michigan
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To: serinde
LOL, six of the seven links there are to FR threads!

Soldiers, Sailors & Airmen -  In Quotes

Confucius Says ...

Montaigne, Essays

Patton - War as he Knew it

Sun Tzu - The Art of War

Voltaire

  Here's the one that isn't a FR thread...

The Writer's Rights (pdf)
1068 quotations on freedom of expression,
censorship, civil liberties, and individual rights

26 posted on 06/01/2002 8:09:35 AM PDT by Teacher317
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To: SauronOfMordor
He didn't mention it, but I like this one, which I have seen more frequently. Because liberals tend to love Machiavelli, it can be effective with them. I've had liberals deny its authenticity, so its nice to rub their noses in it.

"When you disarm your subjects, however, you offend them by showing that either from cowardliness or lack of faith, you distrust them; and either conclusion will induce them to hate you. " Niccolo Machiavelli "The Prince"

27 posted on 06/01/2002 8:14:35 AM PDT by marktwain
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To: Joe Brower
Here are some short succinct "founding father" quotes:

"The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government." ~~Thomas Jefferson

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." ~~Thomas Jefferson

"Americans have the right and the advantage of being armed, unlike the citizens of other countries whose governments are afraid to trust the people with arms." ~~James Madison

"I ask you sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people, except for a few public officials." ~~George Mason

"To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them." ~~George Mason

The constitution shall never be construed to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms." ~~Samuel Adams

They that give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." ~~Ben Branklin

"Necessity is the plea of every infringement of human freedom. It is the arguement of tyrants, it is the creed of slaves." ~~William Pitt

28 posted on 06/01/2002 8:14:39 AM PDT by Travis McGee
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To: Travis McGee
Interesting list. I'll add, "When we got organized as a country and we wrote a fairly radical Constitution with a radical Bill of Rights, giving a radical amount of individual freedom to Americans ...... And so a lot of people say there's too much personal freedom. When personal freedom's being abused, you have to move to limit it. That's what we did in the announcement I made last weekend on the public housing projects, about how we're going to have weapon sweeps and more things like that to try to make people safer in their communities.’’ "~~Bill Clinton, 3-22-94

Look at the differences in the quotes themselves. The Pro's talk of Freedom, Liberty, Polite Society, Self-Defense, Philosophy, Theory, "won't have to", "morally superior", etc...
The quotes from the anti's use: Ban, "citizens don't need", Disarming, Searches, Hammer, Submission, Listed, "kill innocent", Fearful, "serve the state", Sweeps...

I hate the way that the Left always boils everything down to Good vs. Evil (actually, more like Bambi vs. Hitler), but these citations sure are revealing about the intentions of both sides, don't they?

29 posted on 06/01/2002 8:26:09 AM PDT by Teacher317
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To: Travis McGee
A-yep, got a bunch of quotes from the bad guys too, right HERE.

Now get that book done! $;-)

30 posted on 06/01/2002 8:32:25 AM PDT by Joe Brower
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To: Teacher317;RLK
Truthfully, the left hates freedom, because free persons may "opt out" of their utopian wealth distribution schemes.
31 posted on 06/01/2002 8:32:29 AM PDT by Travis McGee
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To: Cyrano; Tennessee_Bob; Free Trapper; Crowcreek; Abundy; Gianni; Gun142; Son of Rooster; dorben...
PING for gun rights sentiments...
32 posted on 06/01/2002 8:35:56 AM PDT by Terriergal
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
"Tyrants prefer unarmed subjects."

"Have gun, will vote."

"This car only carries $20 worth of ammo..."

33 posted on 06/01/2002 8:37:09 AM PDT by Terriergal
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To: toddst
Correct. New gun owners should spend a couple afternoons each week at the range. First, find out how really loud the damn thing is. Then put a hundred or more rounds into paper to see if you can hit anything and if the gun's gonna last.
34 posted on 06/01/2002 9:43:45 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: Joe Brower
"Molon labe!"
"Come and Take It"

BATTLE OF GONZALES
When Domingo de Ugartechea,qv military commander in Texas, received word that the American colonists of Gonzales refused to surrender a small cannon that had been given that settlement in 1831 as a defense against the Indians, he dispatched Francisco de Castañedaqv and 100 dragoons to retrieve it.

Texas Militiamen, fought off the Mexican Dragoons under a flag showing a cannon and the words "Come and Take It".

It was the first flag of Texas and the flag Robert A. Heinlein used for his rebels in the novel "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress"

35 posted on 06/01/2002 9:59:56 AM PDT by Servant of the Nine
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To: Servant of the Nine


36 posted on 06/01/2002 10:29:04 AM PDT by Joe Brower
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Author William S. Burroughs contributed this gem:
After a shooting spree, they always want to take the guns away from the people who didn't do it.

Burroughs is an odd choice to quote on guns. In a drunken stupor he shot his wife in the head, killing her, while playing 'william tell.'

37 posted on 06/01/2002 12:07:02 PM PDT by Looking for Diogenes
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Bookmarked!

Heinlein has so many brilliant quotes that I simply don't know where to begin :)

TANSTAAFL!

38 posted on 06/01/2002 12:42:50 PM PDT by Britton J Wingfield
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
MORE gems from COL Jeff Cooper, from his awesome book "THE GARGANTUAN GUNSITE GOSSIP" 702 pages of nothing but this stuff, covering from 1981 thru 1989 My favorites follow:

GUN CONTROL...it's not about guns...it's about CONTROL.

Safety is nice, but it's not FIRST. LIFE is FIRST...and...LIFE IS NOT SAFE!

"Blessed are they, who in the face of death, think only of the front sight.

The person you see in the mirror is the one responsible for your safety.

Among God's greatest gifts to humanity are fine weapons, beautiful women, great books, fast cars and good music. In return for these wonders we owe to HIM clear thought, good humor, courage and kindness.

Out of sight, out of range

Thomas Jefferson "Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God"

Theodore Roosevelt "There is but one correct answer to a dynamite bomb and it is best delivered with a Winchester rifle."

Another from Teddy: "Cowardice in a race, as in an individual, is the unpardonable sin."

The difference between a pickpocket and a Democrat is that when you ask for your money back, a pickpocket will not question your motives.

39 posted on 06/01/2002 1:16:09 PM PDT by ExSoldier
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To: Joe Brower
"A pistol is what you use to fight your way back to the rifle that you stupidly left behind."

"In World War II, the Swiss had defenses no other country had. Let's begin with the rifle in every home combined with the Alpine terrain. When the German Kaiser asked in 1912 what the quarter of a million Swiss militiamen would do if invaded by a half million German soldiers, a Swiss replied: shoot twice and go home."

America's Fifth Column ... watch PBS documentary JIHAD! In America
Download 8 Mb zip file here (60 minute video)

40 posted on 06/01/2002 1:43:16 PM PDT by JCG
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Nice post.

I didn't see it so I'll add this one, which I believe  can be attributed to Col. Cooper.

Anything which goes bang is better than fingernails.

41 posted on 06/01/2002 3:33:22 PM PDT by pa_dweller
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To: Joe Brower
Kewl. I'm adding them to the next revision of the doc right now. One I missed, I believe, and certainly bears inclusion- and is worth repeating if I did include it with the others:

"If the stars and stripes become the standard of a tyrannical majority, the ensign of a violated league, it will no longer command our love or respect but will command our best efforts to drive it from the State."

-- General Patrick Cleburne

I'll have one for you from T.E. Lawrence [*of Arabia*] worth adding in a couple of days, as well, but I want to check my references for his exact words first. He was precise enough in the way he used language as to deserve getting it spot-on.

-archy-/-

42 posted on 06/01/2002 3:33:44 PM PDT by archy
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To: Joe Brower
Here's a few I didn't see on your list...

"Firearms are second only to the Constitution in importance; they are the people's liberty's teeth." - George Washington

"When firearms go, all goes. We need them every hour. " - George Washington

"Citizens have the natural right and the common sense duty to protect themselves, their families, their communities, and their property...guns are the equalizing tools of self-protection, utopian lamentations notwithstanding." - Dr. Edgar A. Suter

"The Clinton administration launched an attack on people in Texas because those people were religious nuts with guns. Hell, this country was founded by religious nuts with guns. Who does Bill Clinton think stepped ashore on Plymouth Rock? " - P. J. O'Rourke

Will you ever forget this next one ?

"I do not believe in people owning guns. Guns should be owned only by [the] police and military. I am going to do everything I can to disarm this state." - Michael Dukakis

43 posted on 06/01/2002 4:01:12 PM PDT by in the Arena
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
Remember, Clinton said he could look with socialism in our private bedrooms, yet we could not look in our public bedroom of the whitehouse.

Those who believe in the sinlessness of government and the sinfulness of people are socialist hypocritical pigs. And, frankly, the gun is not for consumption but for God's jurisdiction in the end (as per the sin caveat), hence due process better be instituted either way.

However, the instituted sinfulness of individuals will not go through me, because my enemy needs to learn about its own sins for its own sake, and I will dare it sin and continue its hypocrisy.

44 posted on 06/01/2002 4:11:44 PM PDT by lavaroise
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To: SW6906
"Glad to see I'm not the only person who thinks this way."

Wow! A thread where the Constitution actually matters. What a relief. I'll add a couple of my favroites to it.

4/19!
minuteman


"[I]t is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."

--Reichsmarschall Hermann Goering


"Beware the leader who bangs the drums of war in order to whip the citizenry into a patriotic fervor, for patriotism is indeed a double-edged sword. It both emboldens the blood, just as it narrows the mind. And when the drums of war have reached a fever pitch and the blood boils with hate and the mind has closed, the leader will have no need in seizing the rights of the citizenry. Rather, the citizenry, infused with fear and blinded by patriotism, will offer up all of their rights unto the leader and gladly so. How do I know? For this is what I have done. And I am Caesar."

-- Julius Caesar

45 posted on 06/01/2002 4:18:44 PM PDT by Washington_minuteman
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
"If someone is so fearful that they are going to start using their weapons to protect their rights, it makes me very nervous that these people have weapons at all." ~~Henry Waxman

Does this apply to the terrorized in Israel?

46 posted on 06/01/2002 4:27:58 PM PDT by Aim small miss small
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To: Aim small miss small
"If someone is so fearful that they are going to start using their weapons to protect their rights, it makes me very nervous that these people have weapons at all." ~~Henry Waxman"

Gosh, that quote makes it look like Waxman almost understands the purpose of the Second Amendment.

47 posted on 06/01/2002 4:35:35 PM PDT by Washington_minuteman
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To: goldstategop
King Leonidas' rejoinder to the ancient Persians, loosely translated into 21st century American idiom, would be: "Up Yours!!!"

Or as was stated at the Battle of the Bulge, "NUTS".

48 posted on 06/01/2002 5:17:50 PM PDT by TheErnFormerlyKnownAsBig
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To: George Frm Br00klyn Park
BUMPED and bookmarked.
49 posted on 06/01/2002 5:30:06 PM PDT by Centurion2000
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To: in the Arena
Good stuff, and I've added these to the applicable docs. The "liberty teeth" quote by Washington, though, is untrue, as much as I like it personally.
Check out this info on guncite.com.
50 posted on 06/01/2002 6:42:26 PM PDT by Joe Brower
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