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To: Ditto
BTW. Do you really think that Washignton, Madison and the rest spent the summer of 1787 in Philadelphia crafting a constitution that would allow any group of conniving self-serving politicians to ignore at their pleasure.

You won't get a rise out of the neo-rebs on this.

They have to maintain that the framers met, and changed nothing at all, or even went backwards from the Arts. of Confed, which pledged a perpetual union. You have to assume that the "disorders" that G. Washington spoke of didn't faze anyone.

It's just another reason their logic is straight from "1984". Freedom is slavery, up is down, the Union is not a union.

Walt

24 posted on 06/21/2002 10:17:35 AM PDT by WhiskeyPapa
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To: WhiskeyPapa
BTW. Do you really think that Washignton, Madison and the rest spent the summer of 1787 in Philadelphia crafting a constitution that would allow any group of conniving self-serving politicians to ignore at their pleasure. You won't get a rise out of the neo-rebs on this.

Not a "neo-reb" - I'm American by birth - southern (Confederate) by the grace of God.

The convention was convened with the expressed purpose of amending the Articles of Confederation. The Articles (that LEGAL government that the founders were operating under) contained a certain article 13 that required unanimous consent to changes (meaning 13 independent and sovereign states that existed prior to any union).

Washington, Madison and the rest spent the summer of 1787 in Philadelphia crafting a constitution that would allow a group of conniving self-serving politicians to ignore the legal requirements at their pleasure. Rhode Island didn't even send delegates, numerous delegates were appointed but never attended, and many delegates walked out before the convention was over, among them 2 from New York - leaving that state without a legal vote and authority to binding assent. Of those in attendance the day of signing were 3 that STILL refused to sign - among them was Elbridge Gerry - a signer of both the DoI and Articles.

Speaking of the Articles and that perpetual union, care to observe what Marshall stated about it?

Both Governments could not be understood to exist at the same time. The new Government did not commence until the old Government expired. It is apparent that the Government did not commence on the Constitution being ratified by the ninth State; for these ratifications were to be reported to Congress, whose continuing existence was recognised by the Convention, and who were requested to continue to exercise their powers for the purpose of bringing the new government into operation. In fact, Congress did continue to act as a government until it dissolved on the first of November, by the successive disappearance of its members. It existed potentially until the 2d of March, the day preceding that on which the members of the new Congress were directed to assemble.
Chief Justice Marshall, Owings v Speed, 18 Wheat. 420, (1820)
The states of North Carolina and Rhode Island were not part of that new government. The union between them and the others had been dissolved. So much for binding legal arguments against secession, the "perpetual" union had been dissolved.
43 posted on 06/22/2002 8:31:13 AM PDT by 4CJ
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