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State Farm And Prudential Don't Like Guns
Gun Owners of America Newsletter ^ | May, 2001 | Larry Pratt

Posted on 07/10/2002 5:50:14 AM PDT by Dick Bachert

Gary Atkinson, a South Carolina businessman and Del Bruno, a Connecticut cop, have had a common problem. When their insurance companies found out that they were involved with guns, they had their insurance coverage canceled.

Del Bruno sought a homeowners policy for his new condo. Just after taking out his policy with Prudential, they wanted a list of his guns and their serial numbers upon learning that he owned firearms. For whatever reason, they decided that the Mossberg 500 was a no-no, and they cancelled his policy.

Prudential was of the opinion that Bruno's shotgun was not a sporting weapon, the only kind they will insure.

Gary Atkinson had been with State Farm for 34 years. He wanted to be sure his homeowners policy was up to date, especially -- as he told his agent's assistant -- since he has a pool and a shooting range on an adjacent property. "A shooting range?" (Forget the fact that pools are more dangerous. The magic word is GUN.)

Atkinson got a call from his agent the next day telling him he had seven days to find a new policy. Then State Farm was going to cancel him. Atkinson brought the agent to the adjacent property to see his range. It is actually rather professional, since Atkinson has heavy equipment, which his company makes. He used the equipment to make berms in front of hills that were already on the property.

Gary got a million dollar liability policy through the NRA to cover the range and offered to sign a total waiver of responsibility for State Farm on any firearm related claims. All of this was to no avail.

After some research, Atkinson learned that State Farm has canceled other people in other parts of the country. It seems they have -- for the agents -- a permissive policy. If the agent wants to cancel a gun owner, they can do so at their own discretion.

Atkinson was told by his agent that no company would insure someone like him. That is when Atkinson found out about Lockton Risk Services in Kansas City, MO (phone: 913-676-9150). They referred him to three insurance companies -- Farm Bureau, Nationwide and American National Property and Casualty.

Gary ended up switching all of his insurance to American National and saving money from what he had been paying State Farm.

One of his last conversations with his State Farm agent involved his discovery that she had the discretion to cancel him, not the requirement to do so. When he told her that he would tell others what State Farm had done to him, she retorted: "What are you going to be able to do by yourself?"

When Gary told me that, I decided that others should know about this anti-self-defense policy at State Farm (and, of course, at Prudential).

Hopefully there is one more reason you may decide to cancel your State Farm Policy -- they are anti-customer in general.

An investigative reporter for New Times found that State Farm has a national policy of underpaying claims. The policy even extends to dragging out lawsuits that any disappointed claimants might file against them in order to increase the cost of litigation to the point of forcing them to settle for less than the policy is worth.

You can go to the web page of Grass Roots South Carolina (www.scfirearms.org) and see the whole story with a very nice piece of artwork to represent Snake Farm Insurance Company.

After you have canceled your Snake Farm insurance policy, you might want to let them know why. Mr. Edward Rust is the president of State Farm Fire and Casualty Company in Bloomington, IL. The phone there is 309-766-2311.

And don't forget to let Prudential know why you have cancelled them if you have a policy with them. Their phone number at their Newark, NJ headquarters is: 1-800-562-8838.

See the archives at http://www.gunowners.org/radio.htm to listen to my interview on Live Fire with Gary Atkinson.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 2ndamendment; banglist; firearm; gun; guns; insurance; prudential; rhodesia; rkba; statefarm

1 posted on 07/10/2002 5:50:14 AM PDT by Dick Bachert
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To: *bang_list

CLICK HERE for a large assortment of powerful, pro-RKBA docs in PDF format.


2 posted on 07/10/2002 5:51:31 AM PDT by Joe Brower
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To: Dick Bachert
The only solution is to vote with your wallet by taking your business elsewhere (and letting the offending insurance company know about it), or if possible get an organized boycott going. These companies are whores and will abandon their, ahem, principles in a New York nanosecond for the almighty dollar.
3 posted on 07/10/2002 6:01:05 AM PDT by Another Galt
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To: Dick Bachert
There Agent most certainely has the right to cancel any policy holder they believe is an un-accepatable risk......

But as an avid gun collector and NRA member, I have a right to "cancel" them as my insurance company ad take my business elsewhere.....

As an American citizen, I have the right to voice my displeasure with this companies policies to like minded folk to ensure they do not use this company...

Geeeee State Farm......Did I just hear the beginning of a stampede???

Even gun owners who just have hunting rifles will stand with those who collect a variety of guns.....Some dumba$$ actuary at State Farm probably believed that this was a small segment of society, so who cares.......The guy/gal just doen't understand gun owners and NRA members......We all swing together....

NeverGore

4 posted on 07/10/2002 6:04:55 AM PDT by nevergore
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To: Dick Bachert
Trust me Prudential and State Farm. You both have 100% of all my insurances. I will drop you like a lead balloon if this intrusive type of policy segregating continues much longer. My gun or their gun.
5 posted on 07/10/2002 6:10:59 AM PDT by chachacha
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To: nevergore
Gun owners need to be selective. 'swhy I say NO to AARP. They are very anti-gun.
Life Member NRA
6 posted on 07/10/2002 6:11:37 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks
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To: Dick Bachert
I don’t much like State Farm and Prudential – far too restrictive.
7 posted on 07/10/2002 6:13:39 AM PDT by R. Scott
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To: chachacha
Bump!
8 posted on 07/10/2002 6:14:52 AM PDT by Libertarian_4_eva
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To: nevergore
Some dumba$$ actuary at State Farm probably believed that this was a small segment of society, so who cares.......The guy/gal just doen't understand gun owners and NRA members......We all swing together....

I'm a Life NRA member & shooting instructor, have been with State Farm for many years - home, two vehicles, small business. I know my insurance agent well enough to sit down and discuss the situation - after sending him this post.

Insurance is a necessary, irritating evil. Most of these companies don't work hard enough to separate out the high-risk people from those of us who just never have a claim that results from negligent behavior.

Our Sportsmen's Club has over 2300 members and I would not be shy about bringing the anti-gun posture up. This should be interesting.

9 posted on 07/10/2002 6:16:46 AM PDT by toddst
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To: Dick Bachert
State Farm and Prudential stand to lose about 50 million potential customers. Some enterprising agents from John Hancock or The Hartford stands to reap a ton in commissions.

It's a good time for gunowners the NRA to get the word out that a boycott of SF and the Pru are in order.

Pass the word...

10 posted on 07/10/2002 6:18:29 AM PDT by Wm Bach
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To: Wm Bach
I'm already boycotting State Farm for unrelated but similarly stupid policies. I had SF auto for 20 years with a clean record then decided to try another cheaper brand of insurance. The cheap insurance screwed up, did not deduct my payment from my bank account as they were authorized to do, then didn't tell me about it until one day I received a letter saying that my policy had been cancelled a month earlier. I was furious and went back to State Farm. They told me that since my insurance had lapsed, they would never write me a policy again. Didn't matter that the "lapse" was none of my fault. Then they had the nerve to send me a friggin State Farm calender with my rejection letter. Well they can do without my payments in the future.
11 posted on 07/10/2002 6:30:52 AM PDT by Sender
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To: Dick Bachert
Look at how they're being investigated and you'll see how and why they want to ingratiate themselves with the Daschle crowd.
12 posted on 07/10/2002 6:34:05 AM PDT by chemainus
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To: Dick Bachert
Lift up any rock and you will find a trial lawyer.
13 posted on 07/10/2002 6:38:59 AM PDT by verity
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To: Dick Bachert
I've got State Farm - and their agent never asked me about guns. Nor does any of their mailout stuff they include with their bill mention guns. Had State Farm for decades, BTW.

But that may be because I live in a region where an insurance company couldn't find clients without insuring gunowners - the South!

Scandals of antigun activists - from coast to coast!

14 posted on 07/10/2002 6:40:17 AM PDT by glc1173@aol.com
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To: Dick Bachert
I've never had even a squeak of trouble from USAA. ;-D

They even put "extra riders" on my collection ... only asking the value, not the makes and models.

15 posted on 07/10/2002 6:40:32 AM PDT by GingisK
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To: Wm Bach
This topic has been discussed on the internet for some time now. Here is the response from State Farm regarding this subject. The source is here:

http://www.conservativemonitor.com/news/2001020.shtml

The Conservative Monitor Received the following note regarding this article. It is a statement reputedly from State Farm Insurance to an interested reader who researched the matter further. The Conservative Monitor is making further inquiries regarding the facts of the case.

State Farm insures millions of gun owners, likely the most of any insurer in the United States -- many of whom are our own agents and employees. We provide firearms property and liability coverage automatically as part of our homeowners insurance policy. We also have personal articles and personal liability policies that cover firearms and the lawful use of those firearms by our policyholders. Our homeowners policy covers the liability exposure for normal recreational shooting and hunting activities for policyholders and guests. In general, deciding whether to provide or continue insurance coverage involves examining every situation (risk) on its own merits. When the risk presented exceeds our expectations of normal recreational shooting, it may become a necessary business decision to decline coverage. A reasonable level of shooting activity would be within the parameters of intended coverage. State Farm works very hard to earn and keep the business of its customers; it is a very serious matter when we feel we must end a relationship with a policyholder. Our insurance decisions are based on the individual facts at hand and the level of risk involved. We hope this information demonstrates that State Farm Insurance is not opposed to the reasonable and responsible ownership and use of firearms.

Thank you for the opportunity to respond.

16 posted on 07/10/2002 6:41:09 AM PDT by kipj
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To: kipj
Hot link to above post:

http://www.conservativemonitor.com/news/2001020.shtml
17 posted on 07/10/2002 6:47:37 AM PDT by kipj
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To: Dick Bachert
Good, I do not like Prudential or State Farm.
18 posted on 07/10/2002 6:52:10 AM PDT by Texbob
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To: Dick Bachert
They are not real keen on bad dogs either!
19 posted on 07/10/2002 6:57:07 AM PDT by WKB
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To: Dick Bachert
One of the insurance companies you should consider is Chubb. This is a great company; on the two occasions in which I needed help, I got it quickly and generously. I even have a "rider" on my homeowners policy with them in which they list my three guns (including their serial numbers) and give me good coverage at an extremely low price.
20 posted on 07/10/2002 7:29:50 AM PDT by OldPossum
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To: Dick Bachert
bttt
21 posted on 07/10/2002 7:53:35 AM PDT by Freebird Forever
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To: Dick Bachert
For whatever reason, they decided that the Mossberg 500 was a no-no, and they cancelled his policy.

Prudential was of the opinion that Bruno's shotgun was not a sporting weapon, the only kind they will insure.

WTF!?! The Mossberg 500 is probably one of the most used shotguns out there during hunting season. I myself have owned THREE of them.

Oh, I see. It's a PUMP! Germany has decided to outlaw pump shotguns. First the semis, then the pumps. I guess the only shotguns that are OK are single shots and the rare bolt-actions.

22 posted on 07/10/2002 8:04:21 AM PDT by AK2KX
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To: glc1173@aol.com
Two years ago I bought a place and took out State Farm homeowners insurance. I am a woman, and at that time, was 56 years old. THEY ASKED ME IF I OWNED ANY GUNS! Yes, I do own a gun and I told them. The question seemed like a red flag to me in light of the other usual questions about the value of my possessions. They didn't ask me if I owned any diamonds or rubies, for example, why a gun question? Now I know why. Last year I had a claim for water damage which they turned down in the form of a letter which included the recourse they would take if I tried to sue them for their decision! Again a red flag. I will call my Farmers agent today about switching. Thank you for all this very valuable information.
23 posted on 07/10/2002 8:48:56 AM PDT by ZDaphne
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To: Sender
They told me that since my insurance had lapsed,
they would never write me a policy again...
Well they can do without my payments in the future.

I think they sort of expect that...

24 posted on 07/10/2002 2:57:58 PM PDT by gcruse
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To: Dick Bachert
Prudential was of the opinion that Bruno's shotgun was not a sporting weapon, the only kind they will insure.

Good thing I'm not with pru or State Farm. I doubt my firearms would qualify as "sporting weapons". No, they wouldn't be sporting at all....

25 posted on 07/10/2002 3:09:44 PM PDT by neutrino
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To: AnnaZ; HangFire; Lady Jenn; Kithlyara; AZ Spartacus; feinswinesuksass; abigail2; AnneJustice4all; ..
Belles bump
26 posted on 07/10/2002 5:46:10 PM PDT by lowbridge
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To: no one in particular
Since we are sharing homeowners policies... I asked Pemco about my guns when setting up the policy, because they had not asked me. They automatically cover up to $3000 worth of firearms without a rider. Over that, I would need to add them up. I thought that was a very generous baseline.
27 posted on 07/10/2002 5:58:51 PM PDT by HairOfTheDog
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To: lowbridge
Thanks for the pings!
28 posted on 07/10/2002 7:59:30 PM PDT by facedown
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To: nevergore
The guy/gal just doen't understand gun owners and NRA members......We all swing together....

Well I guess I will have to start shopping for a new insurance company as I have state farm. Hopefully that claim I filed earlier this year doesn't turn any other companies off.

29 posted on 07/10/2002 10:19:14 PM PDT by TheErnFormerlyKnownAsBig
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To: big ern
It will. They immediately ask if you have filed any previous claims.
30 posted on 07/10/2002 11:03:34 PM PDT by Angelique
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To: lowbridge
I have had both insurers, and that question was never asked. My brother owns an insurance brokerage firm, and again, the question is never asked.
31 posted on 07/10/2002 11:06:02 PM PDT by Angelique
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Comment #32 Removed by Moderator

To: Dick Bachert
BTTT
33 posted on 07/11/2002 7:03:39 AM PDT by betty boop
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To: lowbridge
Sate Farm canceled my homeowners policy, I have until 8/30.
I guess the claim for our cat scratching my wife's ex-best friend, (she also claimed he broke her nose) was the straw that did the policy in...
It was the second claim in 12 years...

I'm going to use Colonial Penn which has our vehicle insurance.

Here is a picture of the little 12 lb nose breaking boxer...I don't think he liked her mauling him and blowing her alcohol laden breath on him... :o)

Mad Max

34 posted on 07/11/2002 12:00:21 PM PDT by blackie
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To: Dick Bachert
I can't believe we aren't screaming about this from the rooftops...I only found this when I was doing an unrelated search.
35 posted on 07/13/2002 9:55:20 AM PDT by DoSomethingAboutIt
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To: Dick Bachert
Glad I don't have Prudential... my owning a slug gun for deer (Moss 500 20g) would be causing them indigestion. Wonder what would happen if they found someone had all the parts to an AR15?

How about all those nice .223's that sort of look like assault rifles? I wonder if those would be ok? sheesh this is just ridiculous.

36 posted on 07/17/2002 8:01:15 AM PDT by Terriergal
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