Smart Case, Tuesday, July 16

Deseret News ^ | 7/16/2002 | Derek Jensen

[Palladin]

Police still seeking van seen in Nebraska

Officers there have made no connection to the Smart case

By Derek Jensen
Deseret News staff writer

Police were still looking Tuesday for a van spotted Thursday at a Lincoln, Neb., gas station with a girl inside matching Elizabeth Smart's description.

No additional sightings of the van have been reported since it was spotted last week, Lincoln Police Sgt. Larry Barksdale said Tuesday morning.

The 14-year-old blond teen has been missing almost six weeks since she was taken by gunpoint from her bedroom early June 5.

"We haven't made a connection with Elizabeth Smart at all," Barksdale said Tuesday morning. "This was a check-welfare call for us. We get a dozen of those a week or more. I think it's got enhanced to connect it to Elizabeth Smart."

As the Deseret News reported Saturday, a convenience store clerk, her manager and a customer inside the Texaco Food Mart in Lincoln spotted a 12- to 14-year-old girl with blond hair. Three men, who appeared to be in their 20s, were in the van with her.

Cashier Andrea Kolarik told the Deseret News Friday the girl was crying and looked "scared and exhausted."

Lincoln police responded to the incident as a check-welfare call and have faxed their case file to Salt Lake police, Barksdale said. The van appears to have been spotted in Colorado before it was in Lincoln, but police say they have no information the vehicle was ever in Utah, Barksdale said.

The vehicle is described as light blue and gray Chevy Astro van with Pennsylvania license plate ECJ1368. Police have learned the identity of the van's registered owner in Pennsylvania but still aren't sure if that person was one of the three men seen driving the van, Barksdale said.

Meanwhile, police in Utah continue to scrutinize former Smart handyman Richard Ricci, interviewing his associates and trying to determine where the 48-year-old's Jeep Cherokee was between May 30 and June 8 and why it logged 500 to 1,000 extra miles during that time.

"We're making a lot of progress on that," FBI special agent Kevin Eaton said, declining to elaborate or say if the Jeep left Utah during that time. "I'd just say we're getting more information on where the Jeep was."

Ricci remains at the Utah State Prison and was charged last week with stealing items from the Smart residence and burglarizing another home in the Federal Heights area.

[Palladin]

Please continue discussion of the case here, if you wish.

The van mentioned is registered in Cambridge Springs, PA. No indication that it is case-related.

Also, note that special agent Eaton states they have more information on where the Ricci jeep was during the time it was missing from Moul's lot.

[DoughtyOne]

A little girl in California was abducted yesterday afternoon. There is already a composit photo of the perp in the media. Where is the one of Elizabeth Smart's perp? I hate to say it, but this case wreaks of mishandling more every day. I can't help but compare it to the Ramsey girl who's death will never be solved.

[Palladin]

All viewpoints welcome here.

[Bella]

I heard the authorities state this beautiful little girl's 5yr old friend gave an excellent description of this actor...

[Palladin]

This is becoming a major problem. What is wrong with this society when we cannot protect our kids by keeping these predators under lock and key?

[Palladin]

...and little Samantha was fighting tooth and nail. I pray to God that this one ends well.

BTW, this is a censorship-free zone.

[Palladin]

Your input is invited here.

[DoughtyOne]

The Klauss father was on FoxNews earlier. He stated that California has 90,000 registered sex-offenders on the streets. He further stated that 4,600 children wind up like Elizabeth Smart each year. If this is accurate every 1:54:00 minutes another child goes missing.

As far as I am concerned it's one time and you're out. These people should be behind bars.

[GovernmentShrinker]

Seems to me that police should be paying more urgent attention to multiple witness reports of a 12-14 year old girl, crying and apparently being restrained in a vehicle by men far too young to be her father or responsible adult relatives. It's probably not Elizabeth, but it's almost certainly a minor who's in serious danger. If the owner of the vehicle has been identified, have Pennsylvania police been to his home address to see if he still lives there? It's illegal to have a vehicle registered in a state where one no longer resides, and the insurance would be invalid. Do they have a photo of him? Previous reports said Boulder police knew who the two men were -- so what are they doing to track them down? If neither is the owner of the vehicle, have police attempted to contact the owner and ask him if knows how to reach them, since they're driving his van around the country? Shouldn't their photos be posted? Everybody seems awfully relaxed about this "check welfare" case.

[freedox]

freedox reporting for duty.......LOL!! Thanks, Palladin.......

[Palladin]

Good questions, for which I have no answers. This van sighting seems to have dropped off the radar. Let us know if you hear anything further.

I am darn sick and tired of the way children are being treated nowadays. To me, childhood and its innocence should be sacrosanct.

No wonder Marc Klaas looks like he's ready to tear someone apart every time he has to speak about yet another defilement of yet another child!

[Bella]

I concur..

[freedox]

The article states that "Lincoln police responded to the incident as a check-welfare call and have faxed their case file to Salt Lake police." It would appear to me that they do know who owns the van, and are checking the facts on this incident. In all fairness, would you want your picture posted just because someone happened to see a crying child in your car? I have to wonder if the media isn't making more of this than is really there.

[varina davis]

Your input is invited here.

Thank you. I appreciate it.

[IamHD]

Thanks!

[IamHD]

90,000 sexual predators, just in California, and those are only the one's that they know about! Time to throw away the keys! When will they ever learn that these people cannot be changed/rehabilitated/healed?

[Bella]

Where is the one of Elizabeth Smart's perp? I hate to say it, but this case wreaks of mishandling more every day.

Most definitely..If a 5yr girl CAN give a description of the perp, a 9yr old certainly can..Wonder what's going on here & who's calling the shots..

[IamHD]

I saw a very short press conference this afternoon, and one of Ed's sisters was giving the information out on the van. Why aren't the police doing this?

[Neenah]

Thanks so much for the ping. Appreciate it.

[Republicus2001]

Child kidnap USED to be a capital crime...ala Lindberg case - sadly no more, consequently children are snuffed everyday...

[Neenah]

* applause, applause to you, Palladin *

[Bella]

I saw a very short press conference this afternoon, and one of Ed's sisters was giving the information out on the van. Why aren't the police doing this?

I saw the aunt telling the family of the beautiful little girl who was abducted today to contact Them for any kind of help??

[IamHD]

This is where they were searching, today:

Description Hiking Trappers Loop
Start Date 7/16/2002 9:00:00 AM
End Date Meet At 900 S Main Kaysville
Search Duration 5(Hours)
North Boundary none
South Boundary none
East Boundary none
West Boundary none
Volunteers? Y

"Requirements we will be searching both sides of trappers loop on foot, and knocking doors in the area. There is steep terrain and road side walking. If you would like more info. please call, also for other meeting destinations. 546-6246 or 510-1649. Come help search for Elizabeth let's bring her home! The feeling of volunteering is like nothing I have ever felt, As you search you gain a great love for this little girl and want nothing more than to find her."

[Jolly Green]

Most definitely..If a 5yr girl CAN give a description of the perp, a 9yr old certainly can..Wonder what's going on here & who's calling the shots.

Give it a rest, Bella! IF it wasn't dark, and IF he wasn't wearing a mask and IF she got a good look at the perp, we would have a sketch.

[Bella]

Give it a rest, Bella! IF it wasn't dark, and IF he wasn't wearing a mask and IF she got a good look at the perp, we would have a sketch.

There's too many IF's..Granted it was dark, but, she did see hair on his hands, and was able to tell what he was wearing, even the type of HAT. Plus, they refused a sketch artist, but said the authorities had a good sketch artist...well, where's the sketch? Did she, or didn't she? Where's the results?

[crystalk]

IIRC the Stanton, Cal. 5 yr old, was seen being abducted not only by her 5-yr old playmate, but by a number of neighbors and bystanders.

If Elizabeth had resisted in the same way little Samantha did, she would probably be alive today.

[IamHD]

With all due respect, Jolly, Palladin started this thread and specifically stated that all points of view are welcome here. If you don't like a poster's point of view, or their message, don't reply. Nobody is starting, or wants a battle here. (I know what's coming next.) Bella is entitled to whatever she voices, as are you.

[Bella]

BTW, this is a censorship-free zone.
6 posted on 7/16/02 5:22 PM Eastern by Palladin

[Utah Girl]

Yeah, how dare the Smart family offer their condolences and help. Who do they think they are?

[Bella]

Yeah, how dare the Smart family offer their condolences and help. Who do they think they are?

I feel they were genuine w/ their condolences, but, how can they help when they haven't found their own, and both abductions were different w/ the exception of a missing child.

[freedox]

spore-gasm posted a news report from June 5 on yesterday's thread (#89) wherein it was reported that "Her sister said that she saw the suspect very clearly, which leads police to believe that it was not a family friend." SLC police spokesman, Duane Baird was cited as a source for the article.

While I do understand that mistakes can be made, especially in early reporting, this statement is very clear and emphatic. Unfortunately, it's statements like this that cause questions to linger regarding the lack of a sketch/description of the alleged abductor.

[IamHD]

Utah Girl, that was a cheap shot! Why are you all going after Bella?

[TheDon]

It must have been an alien from Jupiter that stole Liz, that don't have blond haired people there.

[Utah Girl]

I should have changed the TO: to all. Because I am tired of many posters taking cheap shots at the Smart family. The Smart family has every right to offer their condolences, and help, if they can.

[IamHD]

Oh, really? Well, maybe you all should go back to the other board where everyone thinks alike. How boring.

[CindyDawg]

Thank you for keeping the thread here but do you have to keep the c-free digs going though? You said all opinions are welcome here. I hope you meant this because in my opinion the posts were getting very ugly last night. Anyway, no news about the van, huh? Can't believe they couldn't find it.

[Bella]

I should have changed the TO: to all. Because I am tired of many posters taking cheap shots at the Smart family. The Smart family has every right to offer their condolences, and help, if they can.

No one's taking "cheap shots" at the Smart family as you and your friends think..Perhaps if you and the community, church, and whatever else is available there, would ASK the same questions and put pressure on this case which has been been extremely unusual from day one, that we are instead of going through the dramatics, there would be answers..I don't care who's involved, Joe Schmo, Santa Claus, aliens, family, neighbor, and whoever else, ASK the questions! The longer this continues, the longer everyone suffers.

[varina davis]

Why aren't the police doing this?

I've noticed the police don't seem very involved at all at this point and haven't been for a while. Still think they are watching and waiting for someone to show his hand. And I'll bet it's someone not now on the published suspect list.

[varina davis]

Give it a rest, Bella! IF it wasn't dark, and IF he wasn't wearing a mask and IF she got a good look at the perp, we would have a sketch.

Last night in the original news story someone posted to refresh our memories, the police said MK got a "good look" at the intruder.

[varina davis]

Good questions, Bella. BTW, thanks for the heads up.

[CindyDawg]

Bella, I'm not Mormon, and don't live any where near Utah. I have to respectfully disagree with you though. "cheap shots" are being made against the Smarts. If any thing in their behavior caused this, it will come out but there is no proof they have done any wrong at this time. CD

[Utah Girl]

I'm really tired of fighting. I can't say that the Smart family can offer their assistance and it is appreciated, but others can say why should the Smart family offer their assistance??? Double standard here, and I am quite tired of it. Every time one of us tries to defend the Smarts say something nice about them, we get jumped on. So, I"m out of here...

[varina davis]

If any thing in their behavior caused this, it will come out but there is no proof they have done any wrong at this time. CD

That's absolutely correct. But in the meantime, many people will continue to ask questions and speculate about how this could have happened. No one is off the suspect list.

[Bella]

I've noticed the police don't seem very involved at all at this point and haven't been for a while. Still think they are watching and waiting for someone to show his hand. And I'll bet it's someone not now on the published suspect list.

This case reeks from here to hell and back again. They're at standstill as was stated in an article posted on the other thread...IamHD posted awhile ago a statement made by one of the aunts that the "authorities were cooperating w/ them"..If I was involved in this case, believe me, someone would be singing, I'd have a lot of questions for all.

[CindyDawg]

Varina, I agree with you but there is a difference between asking questions and saying mean things about people without any evidence or proof.

[varina davis]

Varina, I agree with you but there is a difference between asking questions and saying mean things about people without any evidence or proof.

I don't recall anything specifically "mean," but maybe it's a matter of interpretation.

[IamHD]

"Last night in the original news story someone posted to refresh our memories, the police said MK got a "good look" at the intruder."

I saw that. The story sure has evolved, hasn't it? How can the Smarts' possibly help this woman in California, when they can't even find their own child? Is it to keep their own story alive? This is stranger than the Ramsey case, and I have always thought that they killed their own daughter. However, I don't believe that Ed & Lois are involved in this, but it probably is an extended family member, friend, neighbor, or acquaintance.

[Utah Girl]

The pressure is being put on the Smarts and on the police to find Elizabeth and find whoever did this. There is no coverup going on. There are STILL over 100 police and detectives working on the Smart case. Everyone and everything is being looked at with a microscope, still. I did read an article the other night, sorry can't remember the source, that police and psychologists are concerned that Mary Katherine may be suppressing unconsciously some important information about the abduction. They just don't know. But the child forensic psychologist also said that her story is consistent and is a good one, and she went on to say how hard it is to fabricate a story and keep telling that story. It is hard for an adult, and almost impossible for a child.

OK, and now I am thinking out of the box. And this is just MY OWN supposition. Perhaps it is a big fabrication on the part of someone (neighbor, boyfriend, uncles WHOEVER). They took/abducted/Elizabeth went with them for whatever reason, and no one was supposed to know. But then the person brought a gun, and Mary Katherine woke up, and saw what she saw (not much from all accounts), and that is what she is remembering. It is what happened from her perspective, a stranger abduction, but maybe there is something else to it.

As far as the SLPD goes, I have a friend who is a police detective, so I asked him on Sunday at church what he thought was going on. He said he thought the SLPD was doing everything, and more in its power to solve this mystery/abduction, and how glad he was he didn't work for the SLPD. And I have another friend who is a police chief in Illinois, he used to investigate child abuse/abduction cases. And he said the same thing when I talked to him Saturday evening, that the SLPD was working very well with the breaks and the clues that they had, but they really hadn't caught too many breaks in this abduction. And in his opinion (only), the family didn't have anything to do with it. He said that was his gut instinct...