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The Palestinians vision of Darkness
IsraelNationalNews.com | August 9, 2002 | Avi Davis

Posted on 08/11/2002 4:01:50 PM PDT by 1bigdictator

The Palestinian Vision Of Darkness Avi Davis 09 August 2002 Email this story Print this story

It should have been no surprise to anyone that among the victims in Sunday´s bus bombing in the Galilee were Arabs. The Galilee´s population is 52% Arab and it is inevitable that any attack on a bus in that region would have an impact on that population. So too the destruction in Hebrew University´s cafeteria last Wednesday. A university that proudly boasts a population 15% Arab should statistically have expected to find Arabs among the dead. It certainly shouldn´t have surprised most Israelis, who can now finally appreciate the true nature of the terrorist campaign they are facing: any Israeli institution, including the ones that service or care for Arabs, is a potential target. This would seem to include hospitals, day care centers, fire stations and welfare organizations. It goes a long way to answering the question posed by Alistair Goldrein, a British student studying at the Hebrew University when he asked: "Why would someone target this University - it is what was best about Israel."

Why, indeed. The good intentions of liberal institutions or service organizations are largely irrelevant to the master planners of Palestinian terrorism. For them the secular education offered by the Israelis is a trap, designed to goad Arabs from their culture and shatter Palestinian unity. So, too, are the hospitals where world class physicians often sweat to save Arab lives. So are the Israeli human rights groups who actively lobby for their interests and protection. All of these well-intentioned people are regarded as indistinguishable from other Zionists "occupying" Palestinian land – a land categorically defined by Hamas as stretching from the Mediterranean to the Jordan.

The spiral of self deception into which the Palestinians are rapidly spinning has, as its practical source, the acceptance by the international media and European governments that Palestinian terrorists are freedom fighters no different in nature than the French resistance during the Second World War. But a poorer analogy could not be imagined. The French resistance, which eventually unified communists, socialists and nationalists under the banner of the Forces Francaises de l´interiuer, not only had as its goals the liberation of German-occupied French territory, but the restoration of a French democratic republic and the reinstitution of French law. Furious debate was entered into by members of the resistance on the nature of that renewed French republic, giving rise to the ideological rifts that characterize French society to this day. But the important point is that debate ensued and the unifying theme of that debate was that only a vigorous democracy could save France from a descent into renewed authoritarianism or even civil war.

The Palestinians have no such mechanism vouchsafing the progress and prosperity of their inchoate state. There is no visible debate on the nature of such a state (although there is considerable tension between the religious and secular in that society); there are no intellectuals nor statesmen who feel free to talk openly about the challenges of democracy; there is no room for moderates, whose voices are silenced in the popular call for jihad. No, the Palestinian state-in-the-making speaks only in the language of hatred. Today, the target is Israel, but with the increasingly apparent failure to achieve any concrete political objective, the rancor and hatred unleashed by their venomous campaign is likely to turn inward. The most probable outcome is therefore not victory, but civil war.

Yet, an even graver malady afflicts the Palestinian people. Their cause has been hi-jacked, not by a resistance front, but by revolutionaries. Hamas, which has stepped into the vacuum left by Yasser Arafat´s corrupt Palestinian Authority does not merely seek to eject what it perceives as foreign occupation of its land, it seeks no less than the total transformation of Palestinian society. Its militant Islamist message resonates as prescriptive change reminiscent of many other historical revolutionary movements - conceived in high ideals, reverting to violence and ending in butchery.

Therefore, those looking for historical analogies should not waste time examining France of the 1940s. They should recall France of the 1790s when another revolution, conceived with noble aspirations reverted to carnage and destroyed itself in a frenzy of blood letting. That cynical Frenchman Albert Camus, once commented that "every revolutionary ends either as an oppressor or as a heretic." He might have also added that most die at the hands of their own people. The leaders of the Palestinian Revolution, wading knee deep in blood and accustomed only to the language of hate, should now be put on notice that history is unlikely to make an exception for any of them. Born in blood, they will likely die in blood.

No one should be surprised when this revolution begins to devour its own children. ---------------------------------- Avi Davis is the senior fellow of the Freeman Center for Strategic Studies in Los Angeles and senior editorial columnist for Jewsweek.com.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Government; Israel; News/Current Events; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: america; christian; israel; jew; muslim; palestine
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1 posted on 08/11/2002 4:01:51 PM PDT by 1bigdictator
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To: 1bigdictator
Interesting post. Bears lots of thought!
2 posted on 08/11/2002 6:35:32 PM PDT by dcwusmc
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To: 1bigdictator
Born in blood, they will likely die in blood.

"The power erected in blood, will die in blood." --- Alexander Pushkin, a Russian poet.

3 posted on 08/11/2002 8:37:01 PM PDT by TopQuark
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To: dcwusmc
Interesting post. Bears lots of thought!

yawn... I disagree. The Pile-of-slimians don't deserve a moment's thought.

After what Bin Goatroper and his goblins did on 9/11, we don't need to waste a moment's time "analyzing" the Pile-of-slimians - we just need to make a horrible example of them.

We need to forcibly disperse all the Pile-of-slimians among the Arab states, and make sure every last goat-roper among them knows we're doing it BECAUSE of what Bin Ladin did.

That'll give all the camel jockeys the only sort of lesson they understand - and next time they've got a "Grievance", they'll think twice before using terrorism to "Negotiate"...

4 posted on 08/12/2002 12:43:10 AM PDT by fire_eye
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To: 1bigdictator
>>"Why would someone target this University - it is what was best about Israel." <<

A common attitude in Israel, I am sure-also so misleading as to be false, and also irrelevant.

The Arabs don't care if the Israelis are good or bad, smart or stupid, caring or bastards, receptive to Arab welfare or scornful of it.

They want all the Jews dead.

That being the case, the level of ignorance implicit in "Why would someone target this University" is appallingly stupid.

They targeted the University because there were live Jews there.

What's so hard to understand about that?

5 posted on 08/12/2002 3:51:45 AM PDT by Jim Noble
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To: 1bigdictator
Yet another attempt to apply logical motivations to an illogical people. This conflict has nothing to do with an outcome based on compromise and sharing. If that was the case then Yassir "Thats My Baby" Arafat would have accepted the most generous terms that will ever be offered, at Camp David a few years back. It is all about driving the Jews into the sea, period. The eradication of Hamas, the PLA, and all Islamic fundamentalists is a daunting task and the Israelis ought to be doing it with vigor. The last great victory by the Islamists was by Saladin at the Horns of Hattit 900 years ago. Compromise has failed ever since.
6 posted on 08/12/2002 4:05:17 AM PDT by Movemout
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To: Movemout
Don't forget about the brilliant tactics of the Assasins. They never even had to fight battles. Victory without battle is the best kind.
7 posted on 08/12/2002 4:15:22 AM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Arius Piso
When Richard the Lionheart fought the Third Crusade, the Assassains played a role separate from Saladin and the "Franks." Richard got smeared by the French King, Phillip, who left the Crusade early, with some allegegly Richard ordered assassainations but in reality ordered by the Old Man of the Mountain, the chief of the Assassains. The Old Man actually documented his kills in letters to European leaders and helped clear Richard's reputation.
8 posted on 08/12/2002 4:27:35 AM PDT by Movemout
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To: Movemout
The annual tribute exacted from the Isma'ilis by the Templars is estimated to have been 2000 gold pieces. For the sources dealing with the murder of Raymond II, see A History of the Crusades:, ed. K.M. Setton (Phil. 1955) p. 120.
Think the Templars are still extorting the Ismailis? Naaa, couldn't be...
They were wiped out. Except for the ones that weren't.
9 posted on 08/12/2002 4:55:56 AM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Movemout
The annual tribute exacted from the Isma'ilis by the Templars is estimated to have been 2000 gold pieces. For the sources dealing with the murder of Raymond II, see A History of the Crusades:, ed. K.M. Setton (Phil. 1955) p. 120.
Think the Templars are still extorting the Ismailis? Naaa, couldn't be...
They were wiped out. Except for the ones that weren't.
10 posted on 08/12/2002 4:58:33 AM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Arius Piso
The Templars were actually funded by Richard's father, Henry. It was a penance for the murder of Beckett. Beckett was murdered at the behest(unknowing behest) of Henry, whose once confidant Thomas, took his duties as Archbishop of York seriously and defied Henry repeatedly. Henry never could understand the change of direction of his beloved friend and listened not to his best advisor, and queen, Eleanor of Acquataine.
11 posted on 08/12/2002 5:17:14 AM PDT by Movemout
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To: 1bigdictator; monkeyshine; ipaq2000; Lent; veronica; Sabramerican; beowolf; Nachum; BenF; angelo; ..
Muslims never know when to stop pushing it. And their madly high birthrates in Gaza/West Bank, mean Israel will never get peace.

Gaza--> highest birthrate on the planet and one of the most densely populated.

12 posted on 08/12/2002 6:50:13 AM PDT by dennisw
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To: dennisw
Gaza--> highest birthrate on the planet and one of the most densely populated.

It also has the highest ratio of weapons per household on the planet, courtesy of Shimon Peres and Oslo!!

13 posted on 08/12/2002 7:00:30 AM PDT by Alouette
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To: Alouette
It also has the highest ratio of weapons per household on the planet, courtesy of Shimon Peres and Oslo!!

I don't see how this can be true. I am not arguing that they have many guns though. Israel is always trying to stop the weapons smuggling at the Egypt/Gaza border. Done mostly in the Rafa refugee camp via underground tunnels. Egypt does nothing to stop this.

April 30, 2002| In a second assault, Israeli tanks and bulldozers drove into the Rafah refugee camp in the southern Gaza Strip, where they destroyed tunnels being used to smuggle arms into the Palestinian territory. A 15-year-old boy was reported wounded.
     


14 posted on 08/12/2002 7:18:20 AM PDT by dennisw
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To: 1bigdictator
The Palestinians have no such mechanism vouchsafing the progress and prosperity of their inchoate state. There is no visible debate on the nature of such a state (although there is considerable tension between the religious and secular in that society); there are no intellectuals nor statesmen who feel free to talk openly about the challenges of democracy; there is no room for moderates, whose voices are silenced in the popular call for jihad.

That's because everytime someone starts to talk about this they get their breathing privileges revoked. It's not like the arab world is exactly crawing with Democratic models.

15 posted on 08/12/2002 8:07:42 AM PDT by Valin
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To: Movemout
The last great victory by the Islamists was by Saladin at the Horns of Hattit 900 years ago.

Well not really. As I recall the Turks seemed to have one or two good days.

16 posted on 08/12/2002 8:11:51 AM PDT by Valin
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To: dennisw
Gaza--> highest birthrate on the planet and one of the most densely populated.

Which is after all, why neutron weapons were invented. To sterilize the fungus among us.

17 posted on 08/12/2002 9:01:54 AM PDT by American in Israel
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To: Valin
They weren't Islamists by the current definition.
18 posted on 08/12/2002 9:55:39 AM PDT by Movemout
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To: Valin
Well not really...the Turks seemed to have one or two good days.

Now Valin, don't go confusing the Muslim demonization squad with facts. As you have already seen, they'll just raise the bar and claim your comment doesn't apply to what they really meant... :^)

19 posted on 08/12/2002 4:06:27 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: American in Israel
...neutron weapons were invented...to sterilize the fungus among us.

Mass murder via nuclear weapons is the best response to those with high birth rates?!?
Is that your Final Solution to Mother Israel's Pallie Problem?

20 posted on 08/12/2002 4:12:14 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Movemout
Facinating history. Could you recommend a good book or web page for more? Thanks.

PS Doesn't the title "the Darkness of the Palistinian Vision" sound like Warcraft II "The Tides of Darkness?" As if the Pallies were an Orcish horde storming through a portal, invading our diminsion! What blatant demonization. Lok-Tar!

21 posted on 08/12/2002 4:17:54 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Arius Piso
Is that your Final Solution to Mother Israel's Pallie Problem?

It's not the best solution for the problem which does exist in the relaity of Israel. The best one would be, IMHO, to relocate all the Pallies from Judea, Samaria, and Galilea to the Gaza Strip, and then use the neutron bomb.

Woddyasay, Aryan Piso?

22 posted on 08/12/2002 6:42:26 PM PDT by Neophyte
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To: Movemout
Salah al-Din Yusuf bin Ayub or Saladin as he is popularly known was born in 1138 C.E. and was of Kurdish descent. The meaning of his Arabic name is "righteousness of the faith" As a child Saladin was a scholar who studied the Koran as well as poetry and his scholarly ways would continue through his life even when the thoughts of Holy War -"Jihad" consumed his focus.

At the young age of fourteen, he entered into the service of his uncle Nur ed-Din another great and respected Arab warrior. Another mentor of the young Saladin was the Saracen chief Zenghi who in 1144 overthrew the city of Edessa, an outpost of Western world for many years prior because of its proximity to Antioch. Saladin learned his military lessons well and soon began to stand out among Nur ed-Din's forces. In several campaigns between the years of 1164 and 1169 C.E. he had made a lasting impression on his peers.

In 1169 Saladin served with another uncle named Shirkuh as second to the commander in chief of the Syrian army. Shirkuh died only two months after Saladin received his new position. Despite his humble position and due to the fact that he held little regard for the Fatimid ruler of Cairo, Saladin turned Egypt into an Ayyubid powerhouse. He used many Kurds in important positions in his army and in no time he had improved the Egyptian economy and trained an army ready to take on the Frankish Crusaders.

In just two years Saladin suppressed the rulers for which he had little regard and thus united Egypt with the Abbasid Caliphate. When Nur ed-Din died in 1174, Saladin began his expansion of territories. In just twelve years he had Damascus, Syria, Alleppo, Mawsil and Iraq. After a three-month battle he captured Jerusalem in 1187 at theBattle of Hattin.

In February of 1193 Saladin rode out to meet some pilgrims returning from Mecca. That evening he became bed ridden due to pain and fever and in a number of days fell into a comma from which he never returned. Saladin died March 3rd 1193 at the age of 55.

According to The French Writer Rene Grousse:
"It is equally true that his generosity, his piety, devoid of fanaticism, that flower of liberality and courtesy which had been the model of our old chroniclers, won him no less popularity in Frankish Syria than in the lands of Islam"

Renee Grousse
The Epic of the Crusades
Orion Press 1970
Translated from the French by Noel Lindsay

So this guy is akin to old Osama? apparently some of his contemporaries would disagree.

23 posted on 08/12/2002 8:22:44 PM PDT by Valin
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To: Neophyte
That's a lovely thought; just like in Warcraft II when you use powerful spells to seal the black gate and banish the otherworldly orcs.
I'm sure the other 980,000,000 Muslims won't miss 20 mill or so. They'll send Areil FTD bouquets thanking him for removing their claim to Al Aqsa and Templar Hill... Then they'll be like, "Hey Ariel, why is it ok to hate all muslims for 9/11 but not to hate all catholics for promoting boy raping?"
Ariel will say "you fools, conservative logic is based on pick-and-choose irrational relationships with mythology, so why NOT?!

Wattuyusay, Neocon's Fight?

24 posted on 08/12/2002 8:26:47 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: 1bigdictator
Let the cannibalism begin. Not to be cruel, but rather than drag this out for another five centuries, let's just get it over with, see who's left standing, and decide whether or not the civilized world can deal with them.
25 posted on 08/12/2002 8:39:09 PM PDT by Inkie
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To: dennisw
It also has the highest ratio of weapons per household on the planet, courtesy of Shimon Peres and Oslo!!

"I don't see how this can be true"

The 1995 Oslo accords provided for [Israel to transfer to the PA]15,000 automatic rifles and sidearms, plus a few hundred heavy machine guns, for Palestinian police and security forces, yet there could be 30,000 or more weapons in the Palestinian community.

See Bulletin of the Atomic Scientists

26 posted on 08/12/2002 9:11:34 PM PDT by anapikoros
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To: Arius Piso
Mass murder via nuclear weapons is the best response to those with high birth rates?!? Is that your Final Solution to Mother Israel's Pallie Problem?

Well, there are conventional nuclear weapons, cluster bombs, napalm, FAE bombs, carpet bombing, and various other ways to make war. This war is not of Israeli choosing, and the desire for genocide is all on the Arab side.

So before you get in a huff about genocide examine yourself. How do you want the Palestinians to go, one at a time as exploding children, or all at once in a war of their choosing. For, unless they suddenly learn to live with the other people on this planet, they must go. Ask Robert Kennedy of what he thought of Palestinians, as one killed him.

"Palestinians" are not a people, they are a political movement that has killed far more innocent Arabs and other foreigners to Israel than Jews. To think that they will stop killing because they run out of Jews is pretting stupid. Like all evil men, they will stop killing when they die. I suggest we get that accomplished sooner rather than later.

27 posted on 08/12/2002 9:14:56 PM PDT by American in Israel
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To: Arius Piso
Well, I think of the Palis as Uruk-Hai rather than garden variety Orcs if you are using Tolkien's imagery. But Uruk Hai are easy to deal with: Just find and neutralize the Wizard. Just some info from my D&D geek girl days!
28 posted on 08/12/2002 9:15:29 PM PDT by CARepubGal
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To: Arius Piso
Want to hear mine? It goes for all of Islam. Forced baptism...conversion...not once but twice....that way, according the Koran, the punishment for a second Apostasism is death, plain and simple. Ain't it a beaut?
29 posted on 08/13/2002 4:31:05 AM PDT by Stavka2
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To: Arius Piso
conservative logic is based on pick-and-choose irrational relationships with mythology

All your quoting of Warcraft II and orcs, as well as figures you cite, show absolutely clear that you've no relationship with mythology whatsoever, and indeed with any education worth to be mentioned.

If you're of age accepted usually as mature, but are just retarded, I offer you my condolence.

If you're a kid masturbating over the keyboard when mom and dad have their night out, return to your computer games, don't waste our time.

30 posted on 08/13/2002 4:46:18 AM PDT by Neophyte
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To: Arius Piso
Well, if the horde fits....you know the rest. Civilization is a difficult concept for the Orkish Palistinians.
31 posted on 08/13/2002 4:46:59 AM PDT by Stavka2
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To: Arius Piso
Yes, definitly...we shouldn't hate Islam for 9/11....there are so many better reasons...for example:
  1. 1300 years of endless wars of aggression
  2. stealing Jerusalem from Christians and Jews
  3. building damned mosques ontop of Christian and Jewish and Hindu holy sites.
  4. burning the greatest liberary in all of history
  5. slavery
  6. extermination
  7. cultural genocide
  8. terrorism
  9. genocide (Armenians, Jews, Assyrians, Greeks)
  10. theft of Constantinople...and while we are at it, the whole middle east which did not belong to the Arabs but to various other peoples.
  11. turning Egypt from the bread basket and richest province of the Mediterranian and a strong seat of Christianity into an Islamic sheite hole worthy of disease, corruption and fanaticism.
Yup I can think of quite a few other reasons.
32 posted on 08/13/2002 4:56:52 AM PDT by Stavka2
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To: American in Israel
This war is not of Israeli choosing, and the desire for genocide is all on the Arab side.

I'll grant that the desire for genociding the other side is mostly on the Arab Islamist side. But look at post #22 for an example of why Israel banned the lunatic fundamentalist Kach party. Most Isrealis see the irony in advocating Palli genocide, but not all. And none of the Neocons' herds of red heifer cultist abandonment theology lunatics have much of a threshold for detecting hyprocrisy much less irony.

33 posted on 08/13/2002 2:47:33 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: American in Israel
So before you get in a huff about genocide examine yourself. How do you want the Palestinians to go, one at a time as exploding children, or all at once in a war of their choosing. For, unless they suddenly learn to live with the other people on this planet, they must go.

How silly of me; of course only Zionists are allowed to huffily play the genocide card. I must have forgotten. :^)
In case you aren't just baiting me, and don't realize how Hitler-esqe your words are, let me show you the striking parallels. It took 10 seconds to find on google...

Hitler's speech to the Reichstag of January 30, 1939:
Europe [Israel] will not have peace until the Jewish [Pallie] question has been disposed of. The world has sufficient capacity for settlement, but we must finally break away from the notion that a certain percentage of the Jewish [Muslim] people are intended, by our dear God [Allah], to be the parasitic beneficiary of the body, and of the productive work, of other peoples. Jewry [Islam] must adapt itself to respectable constructive work [unless they suddenly learn to live with the other people on this planet], as other peoples do, or it will sooner or later succumb to a crisis of unimaginable proportions. If the international finance-Jewry [rich Saudis] inside and outside Europe [Arabia] should succeed in plunging the nations into a world war yet again, then the outcome will not be the victory of Jewry [Palistinians], but rather the annihilation of the Jewish [Arab] race in Europe [the Mid-East]!

34 posted on 08/13/2002 3:08:58 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Arius Piso
And none of the Neocons' herds of red heifer cultist abandonment theology lunatics have much of a threshold for detecting hyprocrisy much less irony.

Were you born stupid, or did you work really hard to get there? What say you, newbie?

35 posted on 08/13/2002 3:14:05 PM PDT by rdb3
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To: American in Israel
"Palestinians" are not a people, they are a political movement

It's time to put this often used, silly, strawman argument to bed.
1. The Palistine has always been inhabited by many tribes.
2. Some of the tribes are Semetic. Some Semetic tribes are Jewish, some Arab.
3. Also a lot of Bedoin and Druze and Christians and Zoroastrians, etc, etc.
4. How stupid of you it is to expect all different, non-Jewish peoples residing in the Palistine to consider themselves "a people!"
5. "Palistinian" is therefore describing a person's geographic, not nationalistic, origin.
6. Zionism is a nationalist political movement. Any political aspect of "palistinianism" is a reaction to Zionism.
7. Atzlan is a separatist political movement of Hispanic people. "Californians" are people that live in California. "Zionism" describes the political like Atzlan, "Palistinian" is geographical like Californian. If the UN told Californians to give Atzlan (perhaps as Reparations for the Indian Holocaust), one's status as Californian would not supervene on thier reaction. Because only some Californians are Atzlanists or anti-Atzlanists.

36 posted on 08/13/2002 3:35:07 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Neophyte
Sorry for reducing you to a blubbering pile of ad-hom flame cliches, Neocon'sfight, but you seemed to be asking for it.
Since you aren't up to my caliber, I'll just let you post your childish daydreams of nuking innocent peoples without making any more comments that might confuse and irratate you.
Peace :$)
37 posted on 08/13/2002 3:52:35 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: rdb3
Were you born stupid, or did you work really hard to get there?
Great question! The answer is that I had to work at it, but not really that hard. The secret to getting really stupid is taking lots of bong hits while watching Jack Van Impe. Rexella, on weed, is priceless!!! Jack is really good, too. Why not call now, and get your free "Dummies Guide to Eschatology?"
38 posted on 08/13/2002 3:56:49 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Stavka2
1300 years? And Moham's birthday was...?
All the rest of your items go for any Imperial Religeon, especially Catholocism.
It's silly to hate an abstract belief system because of individuals' actions anyway. Contempt, yes. Hate, no.
39 posted on 08/13/2002 4:08:04 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Arius Piso
Yup, you are so right, except for that little bit about 1. the Jews were loyal citizens of Germany and were not out attacking Germany and 2. they were a minority in the region, not the overwhelming majority...oh and 3. Judism like Christianity doesn't teach conversion by the sword...but that happy go lucky Koran just has sooo many verses concerning that...and human mutilation.
40 posted on 08/13/2002 4:21:31 PM PDT by Stavka2
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To: Arius Piso
5. "Palistinian" is therefore describing a person's geographic, not nationalistic, origin

Well by your definition then, Sharon is a palistinian and Yasser is just an Egyptian...welp, matter solved, time for Yasser to leave.

41 posted on 08/13/2002 4:23:49 PM PDT by Stavka2
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To: Arius Piso
Sorry, no other religion destroyed the Great Liberary of Alexandria. Though some in Christianity converted by the sword, no where is that taught and in the end it always died out...except for Islam. The Koran is chock full, as you well know, being a Pakistani. Christians set up hospitals, Islamics open air executions. Just like that little grenade attack last week into a Christian hospital in Pakistan. Islam and the arabs have stolen every piece of land they own. They desecrated every religious site they found, even going as far as setting up a mosque in Hague Sophia. Problem is, people here are a bit better educated then you think and better Islamic propagandists then you have come and burned away....life's tough....make it easier and convert.
42 posted on 08/13/2002 4:27:47 PM PDT by Stavka2
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To: Stavka2
...and Yasser is just an Egyptian...

To be sure, Arafat is indeed an Egyptian. The so-called "Palestinians" is nothing more than a political creation, the same way the so-called "African-Americans" are.

Palestinians are Jordanians. African-Americans are Americans.

End of story.

43 posted on 08/13/2002 6:21:39 PM PDT by rdb3
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To: Stavka2
Again: all Imperial Religeons have skeletons in their closets. I'm not saying that Islam is good. I am saying that we should avoid stereotyping and demonizing 20% of the world. Also, it's hypocritical to bash Islam as worse than other Imperial Religions.
Your minimizing the conquest of the New World is too transparent. The Olmec, Toltec, Inca, Maya, Aztec libraries burned were as priceless as Alexandria, and the suffering of the people worse than anything Saladin would or did do.
Neocolonialism continues under color of National Interests because the religous excuse got old in Christiondom. Many conservative freepers too oppose UN NWO IMF Globalony, so your intended insult of calling me Pakistani doesn't apply. Most Pakistanis are perfectly nice people and hate getting smeared by their lunatic fringe as much as conservatives or anyone else!
44 posted on 08/13/2002 6:33:50 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Movemout
The Turks were Muslim extremists whom bin Laden praised in his video released right after 9-11. What is the distinction you're making?
45 posted on 08/13/2002 6:38:29 PM PDT by tabsternager
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Comment #46 Removed by Moderator

To: Arius Piso
By the way: the Olmecs, Toltecs and Mayas were extinct as civilizations when the W. Europeans arrived. As for liberaries..that's funny, the Indians didn't have a writen language...they used heiroglyphs.
47 posted on 08/13/2002 8:04:55 PM PDT by Stavka2
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To: Arius Piso
"Let them play tit-for-tat another 2000 years, but keep my USA the hell out of it. That's what caused 9/11"

You should know better than that by now. The Arabs hate us for who we are. They fear us because we are rich, their children like our movies, our women have equal rights, etc.

They do not care about the Palestinians. If they did, Palestinians would not have been left in horrid camps for 50 years. They are the last refugees from the World War II era, where all others have been resettled decades ago. Kindly note that most of the Jewish refugees from Arab countries were resettled by the early 50s.

As long as the West has the potential to give Arab women the concept that they can be more than chattel, the USA will be hated and feared.
48 posted on 08/13/2002 9:01:34 PM PDT by Klein-Bottle
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To: Stavka2
I'm aware of those peoples' history, of course. You don't seem to know that they left behind large libraries of heiroglyphics that the conquistadores burned. Only a few cotex remain, scattared around museums.
And they weren't extinct, their empires just toppled over. Unsustainable agriculture played a role, too. People still speak the languages.
49 posted on 08/13/2002 9:41:54 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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To: Klein-Bottle
What does wealth, Hollywood, or women's lib have to do with Camp David. Oh, that's right, you edited the mention of Camp David out of what you quoted from my post.
Still pulling the wool over the sheeples' eyes, eh?
50 posted on 08/13/2002 9:44:23 PM PDT by Arius Piso
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