Pedophiles 'born that way' - a Must Read and the quote of the month (great conservative article)

szasz ^

[chance33_98]

Ping!

[Rocksalt]

After reading Szasz's writings,I would say this is a prime example of someone who has dissected this issue way too much.There are laws against this type of behavior because enough people think it is wrong.Anyone who tries to justify child abuse by claiming it is genetic in nature is worthy of getting shot or clubbed.Just when I thought the human race couldn't come up with anything more abhorrant-now this.Luckily there are laws against pedophilia-they are there for a reason.

[Hemingway's Ghost]

With the divorce rate high and people spending more and more time around young kids who are not their own they will try to rationalize sex with those kids because they desire them - rationality such as, it is not incest really and we both enjoyed it.

I strenuously disagree with this.

Homosexuality is an "issue" conservatives like to harp on because its public face runs so counter to the public face of conservatism (i.e., Provincetown vs. Main Street America). And for many traditional conservatives, especially on Free Republic, the mere fact that such a place like Provincetown or Key West exists is a definitive sign of the coming Armageddon.

The plain fact of the matter is homosexuality is not normal, heterosexuality is. This article is all about semantics, isn't it? How could homosexuality ever be normal? It may be tolerable, but unless we wish to commit suicide as a species, it will never be normal. The vast majority of adult men want to have sex with women---and lots of sex at that. The vast majority of adult women want to have sex with men.

We're being reactionaries here. We see something so whacked out and so against what we consider the right way to live that we figure the whole world is going to hell in a hand basket merely because we can't fathom it and we can't control it. So we manufacture these "slippery slopes" (an expression I hope you'll pardon giving the topic at hand) that are specious at best in order to augment our opposition to it. Just because we, as a society, tolerate adult homosexuals doesn't mean we will inevitably tolerate "intergenerational" homosexual or heterosexual sex. Some of you may squeal at the libertarian definition of it, but think about it rationally: adult homosexuality involves two consenting adults. Pedophilia and ephebophilia, by definition, do not. If anything, Americans of all political persuasions---even evil liberals---put the safety and best interest of their children above even the safety and best interests of themselves. One of the foundations of society---any society---is that it’s formed to protect the interests of and help foster healthy children.

Also, it seems to me that others are merely defining in secular terms why some of us have instinctive moral and religious aversions to behaviors we find repulsive---behaviors like homosexuality and pedophilia. I don't think it matters why we're repulsed by them as long as we are.

[chance33_98]

While alchemy changed into chemistry, the soul changed into the mind and sins became sicknesses (of the mind). The early alienists (physicians who claimed special expertise regarding the diagnosis and treatment of mental illnesses) frankly acknowledged this metamorphosis. However, instead of recognising that it was an early manifestation of a move from a religious to a secular outlook on human behaviour, they attributed it to scientific advances and believed that a set of new brain diseases had been discovered which they called "mental diseases".

From his other article which seems to go along with your last paragraph.

Perhaps you are right about my point, but I think the more 'perversion' becomes prevelant and accepted in our society the more the morals of individuals on whole will go down over time. Sadly some of the aruguments used are terribly flawed but for reason they make it to the mainstream and into the education area.

I think the liberal objections to the bible for instance in schools will soften for several reasons related to this topic:
1. Group Blasts 'Pro-Gay Scriptures':New Bible (NOAB) waters down homosexuality, Jesus' sovereignty
2. Liberal activist Rev. Barry Lynn claimed that the slave of the Roman centurion commended by Jesus for his faith was actually a male sex slave kept with the Lord’s approval. The remark came during a formal debate last year on whether homosexuality is compatible with Christianity.

And on and on it will go as people attempt to remove the moral and social objections others have. After seeing Gore get so many votes I am convinced things will only get worse. Thanks for the well written reply, you may live up to your namesake yet ;)

[tutstar]

There is a lot of garbage info in the article, like no one knows if an impulse is resistible.

Glad you put the warning up for us.

[chance33_98]

like no one knows if an impulse is resistible

An excellent way of wording things. One of the ways many of us are different is that while some of us have the impulse to get that SOB that cut us off in traffic we resist it because even though it might make us feel better we know it to be wrong. Those who go through with those actions prove they are a danger to society, though some lawyers would get the sentences reduced as a crime of passion....

[MrLeRoy]

Why was this sent to the Wod_list?

[chance33_98]

It does not mention drugs directly, but often one gets into WOD disucssions regarding personal responsibilty and drug use v. govt regulations. Something covered here and in the listed article (post #1) quite well. Having participated in many of those discussions with too many people to mention I simply bumped it out to them for their consideration.

If one is to take Szasz's feelings on Mental Illness and apply them to drugs it gets interesting. Example:It is not by accident that, in all the psychiatric literature, there is not a single account of voices that command a schizophrenic to be especially kind to his wife. That is because being kind to one's wife is not the sort of behaviour to which we want to assign a causal (psychiatric) explanation.

Replace schizophrenic with the drug of your choice.

[Frumious Bandersnatch]

Sex with minors was not always considered a disease. In ancient Greece, sexual relationships between men and boys were a normal part of life. Such relations, called "pederastic," typically occurred between a 20-to-30-year-old man and a 12-to-17-year-old boy. The man pursued the boy, and the boy submitted to him as the passive partner in anal sex. The man also played the role of mentor to his pupil. With the arrival of heavy pubic hair, usually at age 18, the younger man found a boy to mentor and get sexual satisfaction from. Sexual relations between men and young children played no part in Greek pederasty.

I believe that there is evidence that pederasty was rare in Greek society. In point of fact, it may have been practiced by Sparta - but evidence even there is underwhelming.

[Sloth]

If you are going to call the unborn a "child," then what are you going to call those that are born. They are not the same thing.

What have you been smoking? This is like saying that I cannot use the word 'child' to describe someone in the kitchen because it already applies to somebody in the front yard. WTH???