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Scientist Says Ice Meteors a Sign of Climate Change (Environut alert)
Reuters (Yahoo) ^ | Fri Sep 27, 9:54 AM ET | Emma Ross-Thomas

Posted on 09/27/2002 9:06:27 AM PDT by narby

MADRID (Reuters) - A Spanish scientist says global warming ( news - web sites) may be to blame for giant blocks of ice which fall from clear skies and rip gaping holes in cars and houses.

Jesus Martinez-Frias has spent the last two-and-a-half years investigating so-called megacryometeors -- ice meteors -- which tend to weigh more than 22 lb and have been known to leave five feet holes in houses.

He fears the formation of these hailstone-like blocks on clear days could be a worrying symptom of climate change.

"I'm not worried that a block of ice might fall on your head ... but that great blocks of ice are forming where they shouldn't exist," said Martinez-Frias, director of planetary geography at Spain's Astrobiology Center in Madrid.

"Components of the atmosphere, like ozone and water, are changing in different levels of the atmosphere...We think these signs could be evidence of climate change," he said in a telephone interview with Reuters.

While Martinez-Frias said he was far from certain as to why the ice meteors formed, he said they were neither hoaxes nor blocks of ice falling from the bars or bathrooms of passing aircraft, as skeptics have suggested.

"We're not talking about hoaxes," Martinez-Frias said. "It's very easy to tell real and false ice blocks apart."

"It's not water from airplane toilets...Its isotopic composition bears the signature...of Iberian rain."

SMASHING WINDSCREENS

Ice clouds made from crystallized vapor trails of aircraft are well known to pilots, but Martinez-Frias suggests that because global warming involves one level of the atmosphere getting colder while another gets hotter, some ice clouds now remain longer.

Their centers then fall through the atmosphere, bouncing and gathering mass, to end up smashing through a car windshield or, more usually, landing softly in a field, he suggested.

The first megacryometeor found this year in Spain -- by a startled farmer riding his tractor in Soria -- weighed 35.27 lb.

Three others were found later, bringing the world total over the last decade to more than 50. But Martinez-Frias said only around a fifth of the ice meteors are ever found.

An ice meteor weighing around 440 lb has been found in Brazil, Martinez-Frias said. Other blocks have been found in Mexico and Australia.

The blocks form between two-and-a-half and six miles above ground, he said.

Some scientists doubt whether hail can form on a clear day.

"Solid ice cannot form in the absence of thick, highly visible clouds," Charles Knight, a hail expert at the University Corporation for Atmospheric Research in Boulder, Colorado was quoted as saying in a supplement of Science journal.

But geologist Roger Buick of the University of Washington in Seattle told the same publication that a model created by Martinez-Frias and his team showing ice can form on a clear day was an "important advance in that it thoroughly documents and provides an explanation for a spectacular phenomenon."


TOPICS: Extended News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: catastrophism; environmentalist; globalwarming
Maybe I should have posted this in "Humor". But as they say, some ideas are so stupid that it takes an intellectual to believe them.
1 posted on 09/27/2002 9:06:27 AM PDT by narby
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To: narby
Today's junk scientist is tomorrow's applicant for a multi million dollar Federal grant. It's not about science, it's about free money for wild assed theories.
2 posted on 09/27/2002 9:10:46 AM PDT by mgc1122
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To: narby
The ice was blue with high urine concentrations perhaps? pesky jumbo jets...
3 posted on 09/27/2002 9:14:52 AM PDT by Mark Felton
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To: narby
Now I get it, Global Warming causes Ice!
4 posted on 09/27/2002 9:16:09 AM PDT by Phantom Lord
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To: Phantom Lord
Now I get it, Global Warming causes Ice!

Don't you understand science at all man. The great ice shelves in the sky are receeding and its all because you drove your SUV to work today.

5 posted on 09/27/2002 9:33:37 AM PDT by Always Right
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To: narby
Global Warming Causes Global Cooling!
6 posted on 09/27/2002 10:21:20 AM PDT by mc5cents
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To: narby
Please see http://www.ijsklompen.net/divers.htm and http://www.gsfc.nasa.gov/news-release/releases/1997/97-59.htm
7 posted on 09/27/2002 12:11:03 PM PDT by mfulstone
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To: narby
Here is the original article from Science:

http://tierra.rediris.es/megacryometeors/megacryometeors.pdf

Like most popular news articles on scientific topics, the journalist has sensationalized and distorted the actual issues.

That aside, I don't know why Martinez-Frias calls them 'megacryometeors' since he is theorizing that they are hailstones, not meteors.

One of my favorite stories of 'scientific ignorance' involves meteorites. Aristotle reported stones (and frogs) falling from the sky and had his own theories. By the Enlightenment, Aristotle had been discarded and scientists assumed that falling rocks and frogs were ancient myths. When occasional reports would come in about falling rocks they would be discounted as tales from ignorant farmers.

In the late 18th Century there was a meetings of scientists in a French provincial city which coincided with a meteorite shower. The scientists finally believed that stones could fall from the sky when they saw it themselves. They literally had to be hit over the head with the evidence.

(Frogs and fish really do fall from the sky too.)

8 posted on 09/27/2002 1:44:25 PM PDT by Looking for Diogenes
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To: narby
Whoever said this got hit in the head with an ICE CUBE!
9 posted on 09/27/2002 1:58:43 PM PDT by INSENSITIVE GUY
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To: backhoe; madfly; Stand Watch Listen; brityank; OldFriend; Grampa Dave; editor-surveyor; ...
The damned envirofreaks get nuttier and nuttier all the time. They are the doom-saying astrologers of the 21st century. I remember Gore during the election saying how if he wasn't elected, there would be floods and storms and natural disasters. He might as well have predicted earthquakes and meteor storms and plagues of locusts.
10 posted on 10/01/2002 6:31:54 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Tailgunner Joe
Their problem is, they can't keep all their stories straight..one day it's warming, the next, we're headed for an ice age, and I just read yesterday that the "hole" in the ozone is shrinking... sheesh.. I don't even try to keep up anymore.
11 posted on 10/01/2002 6:38:12 PM PDT by goodieD
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To: Always Right
I remember a few years ago there was sooo much snow....was it in North Dakota.......that it was roof high in many places.......I actually heard a jackass on TV saying all that snow and bitter cold weather was the result of global warming.

They are idiots and they hope we are too.

12 posted on 10/01/2002 6:45:23 PM PDT by OldFriend
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To: Tailgunner Joe
The ozone hole over the Antartic is much smaller than it was two years ago. These morons need a lunch with Clinton.
13 posted on 10/01/2002 6:54:31 PM PDT by Tumbleweed_Connection
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To: Tailgunner Joe
I remember Gore during the election saying how if he wasn't elected, there would be floods and storms and natural disasters.

Oh save us, Algore, please save us! (I watched video of this on TV last night -- it was awful).

Typhoon No. 21 heading toward Kanto

Yomiuri Shimbun

Typhoon No. 21, which is predicted to be the most powerful storm yet this year, was moving northward in the Pacific Ocean toward Japan Monday night, and is expected to affect the Tokyo metropolitan area Tuesday evening. It likely will land in the Tokai or Kanto areas between Tuesday night and early Wednesday morning, the Meteorological Agency said.

The agency is calling for those in the metropolitan area to be prepared for high winds, heavy rain, tidal waves and landslides, as the typhoon might be one of the most powerful to hit the metropolitan area since the end of World War II.

Typhoon No. 21 was moving northward at a speed of about 30 kph in the Pacific Ocean west-southwest of Chichijima island of the Ogasawara Islands as of 6 p.m. Monday. It had an atmospheric pressure of 940 hectopascals at its center and winds of up to 162 kph.

14 posted on 10/01/2002 7:07:53 PM PDT by altair
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To: Looking for Diogenes; narby; backhoe; madfly; Stand Watch Listen; brityank; OldFriend; ...
Frogs and fish really do fall from the sky too.

...and COWS too. Really!

Hank

15 posted on 10/01/2002 8:02:33 PM PDT by Hank Kerchief
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To: Hank Kerchief

16 posted on 10/01/2002 8:12:28 PM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Looking for Diogenes
meteor means - more or less - "things that fall from the sky", as in meteorology. Meteorologist call rain, hail, snow, etc collectively "Hydrometeors". So he's fine on strictly "Meteorological" grounds.
17 posted on 10/01/2002 8:16:29 PM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets
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To: narby
Maybe I should have posted this in "Humor". But as they say, some ideas are so stupid that it takes an intellectual to believe them.

Of course, if there actually are such large ice masses falling from the sky, there has got to be some explanation. If they are so rare, it's not reasonable to assume that they are only now becoming more prevalent and that the reason for it is something that's not even occurring (global warming). There was a time when people who claimed to see rocks fall from the sky were laughed to scorn, and that by the scientific establishment.
18 posted on 10/01/2002 8:22:41 PM PDT by aruanan
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To: narby
Sounds to me like just another form of "smite." Some days, you're just in the wrong place at the wrong time.


19 posted on 10/01/2002 8:28:43 PM PDT by Nick Danger
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WIPE THE SMILE OFF OF THIS MAN'S FACE.

VOTE THE RATS OUT!!

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20 posted on 10/01/2002 8:29:07 PM PDT by Mo1
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To: narby
He's a little late on his theory. Here is a quote from Revelation 16:21

"Revelation 16
21 From the sky huge hailstones of about a hundred pounds each fell upon men. And they cursed God on account of the plague of hail, because the plague was so terrible."

I guess it's been going on for a while, eh?

21 posted on 10/01/2002 8:32:37 PM PDT by HighWheeler
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To: mfulstone
Makes you think about that guy's recent claim that the earth is being continually bombarded by icy asteroids.
22 posted on 10/01/2002 8:35:26 PM PDT by aruanan
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To: mfulstone
Ooops, it was Iowa!
23 posted on 10/01/2002 8:36:46 PM PDT by aruanan
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To: Mark Felton
The ice was blue with high urine concentrations perhaps? pesky jumbo jets...

Those are called 'pissbergs' ...

24 posted on 10/01/2002 8:39:08 PM PDT by spodefly
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To: Piltdown_Woman
"It's not water from airplane toilets...Its isotopic composition bears the signature...of Iberian rain."

By Jove, I think he's got it...... "The rain-in-Spain falls mainly-in-the-pla - in!"

25 posted on 10/01/2002 8:40:16 PM PDT by longshadow
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To: Always Right
We got our new suv this past week before Davis can pass new taxes on them!
26 posted on 10/01/2002 8:40:33 PM PDT by cinFLA
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To: dennis1x
In search of a reason (and excluding enviro-excuses like globlal warming), do you as a professional meteorologist, have a reason why giant ice blocks fall out of the sky?
27 posted on 10/01/2002 10:02:08 PM PDT by 2sheep
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To: longshadow
By Jove, I think he's got it...... "The rain-in-Spain falls mainly-in-the-pla - in!"

And not from the plane! Pesky megacryometeors!

28 posted on 10/01/2002 10:22:37 PM PDT by Aracelis
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets
Quite right, meteors are things that fall from the sky. Fish, rocks, chunks of ice, etc, are all included. Nonetheless, it is a confusing choice of terms because in modern usage it implies an extraterrestrial origin, which the researcher has discounted.
29 posted on 10/01/2002 10:42:46 PM PDT by Looking for Diogenes
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To: narby
One question: Where the hell is this ice when my ice in my Jack and coke melts??? It would be much more convenient at the beach if it were to fall from the sky.
30 posted on 10/01/2002 11:33:56 PM PDT by Nuke'm Glowing
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To: Tailgunner Joe
BTTT!!!!!
31 posted on 10/02/2002 3:09:16 AM PDT by E.G.C.
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To: narby
"A Spanish scientist says... "

What else do you need to know?

32 posted on 10/02/2002 3:25:14 AM PDT by Movemout
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To: 2sheep
Annihilation Central

http://armageddononline.tripod.com/

33 posted on 10/02/2002 6:41:55 AM PDT by Jeremiah Jr
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To: Tailgunner Joe
More junk science !!

The RATS are in disarray...eradicate the rodents !!

Fire Democrats, Hire Republicans !!

GWB Is The Man !!

Snuff Saddam, NOW !!

Death To all Tyrant's !!

The Second Amendment...
America's Original Homeland Security !!

Freedom Is Worth Fighting For !!

Molon Labe !!

34 posted on 10/02/2002 8:30:03 AM PDT by blackie
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To: narby
Howdy

Excellent post, illustrative of the fact that the appelation "scientist" is often applied to individuals who are, in fact, blithering idiots.

There was once a time when an individual had to master material beyond the grasp of the moron, but today, with relativism polluting objective science in liberal institutions of "higher" learning, many so-called scientists, are in fact, politicized useful idiots.

Caveat emptor.

35 posted on 10/02/2002 10:23:24 AM PDT by MoscowMike
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Small Comets and Our Origins
University of Iowa | circa 1999 | Louis A. Frank
Posted on 10/20/2004 2:13:25 AM EDT by SunkenCiv
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/1250694/posts


36 posted on 03/16/2007 11:37:42 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (I last updated my profile on Sunday, March 11, 2007. https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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Note: this topic is from November 2002.
 
Catastrophism
 
· join · view topics · view or post blog · bookmark · post new topic ·
 

37 posted on 11/29/2008 8:59:24 PM PST by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/_______Profile finally updated Saturday, October 11, 2008 !!!)
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