Skip to comments.The Sniper: For shooters
Posted on 10/15/2002 4:22:24 PM PDT by DrCarl
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The Japanese NEVER intended to directly attack and try to occupy the US because our Militia probably comprises the largest army in the world's history. If there is ever a boots on the ground invasion President Bush will call up the Militia and we will kick some ass American Style!!
No, the Muslims will use the liberal gun haters and other enabling groups that I do not feel like naming to disarm us and make us sheep ready to be shorn then slaughtered.
This will NOT happen to the Texas Range Rovers!!!! Note the addition to my signature. This will stay until we win the War on Terror.
Stay safe; stay armed.
You'd be surprised. You shoot nothing but open, iron sights for years and you shoot better with them than with a scope. Me? I get confused when I look through a scope. If I can see my target with the naked eye, I'm better off with a buckhorn and a blade.
Now the end-game.
I'll be there with you.
I sure hope we do get to the end game because this murderer or these murderers, sure need to get caught. If they stop now and this turns into another anthrax mystery, it'll be hard for many to live with.
I hope they don't kill themselves when they are finally surrounded. We need to know who they are.
He's not using night vision because all of the victims have been in lit areas.
Actually, while surfing around on this very topic, I ran across a very interesting article on Soviet 'closed circuit' rounds.
The Russians, during the Cold War, developed something called the Closed Circuit round. It had a tiny bolt inside the shell to kick the round out, and an insignificant amount of gunpowder was all that was needed to drive that miniature bolt. Usually they had to be tapered casings. They were first produced in 7.62, but eventually were produced in all major calibers. They were classified weaponry in the Soviet Union, and were a much lighter load because they don't need as much powder, since the gas pressure never leaves the shell. Its just enough charge to send the round out at 900 fps. The only sound heard is the click of the hammer and the pling of the ejected casing, and the whining whoosh of the round downrange.
However, all you'd need to do to get the next round up and ready is to cycle the action manually.
When all of this first started, the AR-15 was the weapon of choice for the anti-gunners as the weapon which the sniper was using to kill people.
That was a real handy excuse to outlaw assault weapons.
You can bet that no matter if this turns out to be a bolt action single shot, the assault weapons are somehow to blame.
I take all of this info that we are getting with a grain of salt.
I doubt seriously that the forensics people can tell a varmint round from an anti-personnel round after it disintegrates in the target.
I'm sure that the pressure is tremendous to make some guesses which can be used as facts until the facts present themselves.
But, you have ideological and emotional company. We have some Alaskans out there wanting to know why folks in the effete East chose to go around unarmed. They note that "back home" they'd shot this perp to pieces.
This always requires a long story about Virginia not being part of Maryland, and we have guns - big guns - actually really, really, really big guns, and they have to give us a permit to carry a concealed weapon, which is why all adult males walk with a limp - it's from the rifle or shotgun down their britches!
Leastwise some folks think that. In any case, the situation at the Home Depot involved dozens of people running and screaming. This spoiled the shot. Besides, the witnesses knew how valuable they were alive, and it was clear the guy was ready to rock and roll with bursts of 4 from his AK-74~ ~ ~ ~ / ~ ~ ~ ~ /
I agree to a point.
That's all I shot with for most of my life; however, if I were going after people and planning on taking shots of two hundred yards or so, I'd always opt for a good scope.
Case in point:
You've not seen a sniper in the military using open sights since they quit using the Springfield '06.
If they really did it that way, it was a real mistake. However as yet, I have not heard pursuasive testimony that is what happened--what we have heard is a witness who heard a "muffled" shot; and then saw a white van driven by two ME types in an agitated condition attempting to break into traffic. No where have we heard or read him saying "I saw the muzzle flash from the white truck driven by the two . . . "
These guys have been very careful to maintain operational security and this kind of amateur mistake at this point would be surprising but possible.
Also, in order for this guy to have seen the truck and the ME types at the time the shot was fired, the shot was relatively short range--50 yards or so. It appears that the prior shots have been at greater ranges up to 200-300 yards which helps maintain operational security also.
So where's the cartridge?
My guess is the witness described something, possibly mentioning the AK-47, and the cops/feds figured it out. It's possible they already knew from the bullet signature.
Well, my eyes are a tad older than yours, my gun is more primitive than yours and I can hit a deer at distances greater than 100 yards, so we're both pretty good, but we don't know how far these shots have been. I don't know about you but I'm hearing everything from 30 yards to 200 yards.
Would the use of such a mechanical device fit these scenarios?
We don't know how far these shots are. We're hearing everything. For me, with open sights, 200 yards is a long way off but basically, if I can see it, I can shoot it. If I needed to shoot a man at 200 yards with open, iron sights, I'd hit him, but I'd be pushing my luck to be going for one shot head shots.
Naaaa... I don't think this guy is using a range finder. I am not hearing anything that suggests these are very long distance shots.
I don't know. I hope the authorities are working with a lot more information than we are.
The Contender Carbine Kit uses the Contender pistol's frame to attach a shoulder stock and carbine barrel thereby converting the pistol to a single shot rifle using an allen wrench and a screw driver. While it is illegal to attach the 10" or 14" .223 barrel to the frame with the shoulder stock in place, I doubt this would stop some one that was going to use it for murdering people.
The 10" and 14" barrels can be fitted with telescopic sights and when combined with the shoulder stock provide a very compact single shot rifle that is more than capable of making the kind of shots reported on the victims.
Is this what is being used? Possibly but I doubt it, since the Contender is not a main-stream weapon and the carbine kit for the pistol is even less well known.
However we are being lead to beleive that the projectile has survived intact or in large fragments within the some of the victims and this would indicate less velocity than a standard bolt action or semi automatic rifle would produce.My thoughts are that the bullet would completely penetrate the victim and be long gone or lodged in something down range. In fact I recall that the school child actually had the bullet traverse several organs and not exit his body. A shortened rifle barrel will produce less velocity from a "standard" .223"(5.56mm) round.
The Contender is capable of hitting human head size targets at 200 meters (220 yds.) in the hands of a very skilled shooter with regular iron sights. With a scope, a rest and a shoulder stock you do not need to be highly skilled just competent.
However, I doubt the shooter is using a suppressor.I agree. Also to use a suppressor correctly, one has to use subsonic ammunition. I am not aware of any subsonic .223 ammunition (although it may be available somewhere) and for some reason I just doubt that these guys are reloaders...
Hey, remember, you were already invited as the voice of reason!!!!!
Now all that we need is a Hummer, carrier and airforce.
I am researching payment options on the Hummer, if you check out pricing on the carrier and COB buys about 70 mixed hat of F-14, F-15, F16, A10 and maybe an AWAC's we should all be good!!
Stay safe; stay armed.
I forgot that the Egyptian culture had died out before you were born!!!
Stay safe; stay armed.
MOLON LABE (hope this helps!)
That's when the cops have him strip down to his bare butt before approaching, I hope.
And this being a Home Depot, it couldn't be a couple of ME or Hispanic construction types in their white van FLEEING IN PANIC from the scene of the shooting?
I think that the reason they are not releasing a composite is because the witness accounts were unreliable. I read yesterday where the bloodhound (more reliable than wigged-out witnesses) followed the trail of the scent from the victim to a dark area accross the road.
A freeper speculated that he might scoped out the area where he was going to shoot and then walked to the dark area.