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150,000 Arabs - But Not One Jew
Arutz Sheva | November 8, 2002

Posted on 11/08/2002 1:25:46 PM PST by 1bigdictator

150,000 Arabs - But Not One Jew

Close to 150,000 Arabs visited the Temple Mount today for the first week of Ramadan-month prayers. Some 2,000 police officers were on hand to ensure public order, and in fact no incidents were reported. A Jewish man wearing an Arab headdress (kefiye) was arrested at the entrance to the Temple Mount; he said he was a Moslem who wished to pray there. The man is known for his previous attempts to pray on the Mount. The Temple Mount, the holiest Jewish site in the world, has been closed to Jewish worship for over two years.


TOPICS: Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Government; Israel; News/Current Events; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: templemount
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1 posted on 11/08/2002 1:25:46 PM PST by 1bigdictator
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To: 1bigdictator
The Temple Mount, the holiest Jewish site in the world, has been closed to Jewish worship for over two years.

Jeepers! does the U.N. know about this? ... [/sarcasm]
2 posted on 11/08/2002 2:07:53 PM PST by Bobby777
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To: Bobby777
Yes, it was their idea.
3 posted on 11/08/2002 2:14:57 PM PST by Sinner6
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To: Sinner6
Yes, it was their idea.

no doubt about that ...
4 posted on 11/08/2002 2:19:20 PM PST by Bobby777
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Comment #5 Removed by Moderator

To: Ivy League Professor
Prof,

There were 2 Temples. Solomon's Temple was destroyed by the Babylonians and the Jews were exiled. 70 years later, they returned and started the construction of the Second Temple. The Temple Mount is the remains of the Second Temple.

6 posted on 11/08/2002 6:55:10 PM PST by rmlew
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To: rmlew
but the second temple was completely destroyed by Titus according to the bible and josephus.
7 posted on 11/08/2002 6:58:59 PM PST by Soriety Sister
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Comment #8 Removed by Moderator

To: 1bigdictator
http://home.att.net/~professorboris/SPECTRE/Solomon_temple.htm

maybe this will help

330 BC
Alexander the Great captures Jerusalem, but does not harm the Temple.

170 BC
Antiochus Epiphanes, King of Syria, plunders the temple and offers a pig on the Temple altar. Daniel predicted Antiochus Epiphanes would be a type of Antichrist. Where Epiphanes defiled the temple by offering a pig on the altar, the real Antichrist will defile the Tribulation Temple by offering himself to be worshipped. (Dan 11:31) (2Thess 2:3)

165 BC
The Maccabees successful revolt against Antiochus Epiphanes allowed for rededication of the Temple and for the brief freedom of the Jewish people. (The book of Maccabees)

63 BC
The Roman Empire conquers Jerusalem starting a period of domination of the Holy land by foreign force that would last until 1948 AD.

20 BC
Herod the Great starts a remodeling job on the Temple sight that will continue until the Romans destroy the Temple in
70 AD. (John 2:20)

4 BC
Jesus Christ is born in Bethlehem - four years ahead of His time. [0 or 1 AD] (Mic 5:2)(Mat 2:1)

30 AD
Jesus is hailed as the Son of David as He rides into the city of Jerusalem. He Predicts the destruction of the second Temple. Jesus is crucified, stopping Daniel's prophetic clock at the 69 weeks mark. Jesus also gloriously rose from the grave on the third day. (Mark 13:2) (Dan 9:24-26)

70 AD
Roman general Titus destroys the Second Temple. Because of rumors that gold may have been hidden in the stonework of the Temple, the Roman soldiers completely tore apart the Temple, fulfilling Jesus prophecy that not one stone would be left upon another. (Josephus) (Mat 24:2)

132-135 AD
Second Jewish Revolt against Roman was led by Bar Kochba. The revolt failed and much of Jerusalem was razed. Jews were excluded from Jerusalem.
9 posted on 11/08/2002 7:07:31 PM PST by Soriety Sister
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To: 1bigdictator; dennisw; 2sheep; Simcha7; Jeremiah Jr
Close to 150,000 Arabs visited the Temple Mount today for the first week of Ramadan-month prayers.

It'll be closer to 400,000 on the last Friday of Ramadan, which is the beginning of Chanukah. Bursting bulge? Buh bye Al Aqsa?

150,000 Arabs - But Not One Jew

It's a miracle!

10 posted on 11/08/2002 7:18:42 PM PST by Thinkin' Gal
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To: Thinkin' Gal
the Jordanians engineers prepared a 36 page report and will repair the bulge

http://wordofmessiah.org/jordanian_report_on_wall.htm

The decision to let the Jordanians do to the work, which was made at a top-level meeting headed by Prime Minister Ariel Sharon, follows repeated warnings by Israeli archaeologists that sections of the wall are in unequivocal danger of collapse, and comes just ahead of the Muslim holy month of Ramadan when hundreds of thousands of Muslims are expected to flock to the site.

Kahhaleh said that the findings of the report were "not as dramatic" as the warnings voiced by many Israeli archaeologists and the Antiquities Authority, and voiced his readiness to carry out the needed renovation work at the site, pending his government's authorization.

11 posted on 11/08/2002 7:26:57 PM PST by Soriety Sister
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To: Soriety Sister; dennisw; Alouette; Lent
the Jordanians engineers prepared a 36 page report and will repair the bulge

Wouldn't that be astonishing!

12 posted on 11/08/2002 7:35:20 PM PST by Thinkin' Gal
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To: 1bigdictator
some Rabbinic authorities have forbidden Jews from visiting the Temple Mount. not all rabbis agree. the reason that some authorities have made this proscription is to ensure that Jews do not approach the "Holy of Holies".
13 posted on 11/08/2002 7:35:23 PM PST by Soriety Sister
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To: Thinkin' Gal
why? its been in need of repair for 30 years.
14 posted on 11/08/2002 7:36:29 PM PST by Soriety Sister
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To: Ff--150; 4ConservativeJustices
Temple mount bump
15 posted on 11/08/2002 7:38:26 PM PST by billbears
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To: Soriety Sister; Sabramerican; dennisw
why? its been in need of repair for 30 years.

Lematha, indeed. A lot of pilgrims have passed though during that time. Certainly the Jordanians will be able to tinker with it.

16 posted on 11/08/2002 7:40:31 PM PST by Thinkin' Gal
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To: Ivy League Professor
That's a lot of bull. That's the Jewish Temple that the Muslims have thieved and built some crappy buildings on top of.
17 posted on 11/08/2002 8:16:45 PM PST by dennisw
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To: Ivy League Professor
Thank you for sourcing your porpganda to an agenda site that contains misiformation.

It ignores all historical evidence including Biblical, contemporary, and Roman accounts. It uses the fact that Jews are not allowed excavate Mt. Moriah as the basis of the claim that nothing can be found. Given the amount of artifacts recently dug up, destroyed, and thrown in garbage pits by the Waqf, I find the claim laughable, but for the matter at hand.

Here are some sights that give facts and history.
http://www.jerusalem-archives.org/
http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/Society_&_Culture/geo/Mount.html

Here is a site that discusses the location of the Temples:
http://www.templemount.org/

For a less objective view
http://www.har-habayt.org/
http://www.templeinstitute.org/main.html

18 posted on 11/08/2002 10:06:50 PM PST by rmlew
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To: Soriety Sister
But the site existed as did debrus, caves, and stones.
19 posted on 11/08/2002 10:16:16 PM PST by rmlew
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Comment #20 Removed by Moderator

Comment #21 Removed by Moderator

To: dennisw
how could the Muslims have stolen it. it was destroyed hundreds of years earlier.

JOSEPHUS:

"Titus retired into the tower of Antonia, and resolved to storm the temple the next day, early in the morning, with his whole army, and to encamp round about the holy house; but, as for that house, God had for certain long ago doomed it to the fire; and now that fatal day was come, according to the revolution of ages; it was the tenth day of the month Lous [Av], upon which it was formerly burnt by the king of Babylon."(1)


Scriptural References about Jerusalem's Destruction in A.D. 70:

Daniel 9:26 "the people of the prince who is to come will destroy the city [Jerusalem] and the sanctuary[the temple]"
Luke 21:20-24 "When you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then recognize that her desolation is at hand. . . . and they[the Jewish people] will fall by the edge of the sword and will be led captive into all the nations."
22 posted on 11/09/2002 7:03:22 AM PST by Soriety Sister
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To: Sinner6
Yes, it was their idea.

Actually not. It was their "idea" under Resolution 181 to internationalize Jerusalem. The Arab Islamics wanted it all though with a monopoly on everything.

23 posted on 11/09/2002 7:17:13 AM PST by Lent
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To: 1bigdictator
Three words:

Target Rich Environment

24 posted on 11/09/2002 7:21:10 AM PST by Wormwood
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To: billbears
ROFL!
25 posted on 11/09/2002 7:23:18 AM PST by Diana Rose
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To: Soriety Sister
Muslims stole it from the Byzantines who were in possession of it for hundreds of years. Of course they took it over from the Romans who stole it from the Jews. The Muslims converted the ancient Byzantine Church of St. Mary into the Aksa Mosque. They're good at stealing and and then claiming the other culture never existed.
26 posted on 11/09/2002 7:23:48 AM PST by Lent
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To: Ivy League Professor
Solomons Temple was located in the City Of David South of the Haram El Sharif
Interesting stuff. What I don't see is what currently sits on the site of Solomon's Temple as described here.

-Eric

27 posted on 11/09/2002 7:28:30 AM PST by E Rocc
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To: Soriety Sister
Soriety Sister? What the hell is that you Muslim shill? I know a dim bulb named skunkie (banned many times from here) who can't spell worth a damn either.
28 posted on 11/09/2002 7:28:48 AM PST by dennisw
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To: dennisw
Hello dennis. I have seen and admired your posts for an awfully long time.
29 posted on 11/09/2002 7:29:33 AM PST by Perceptive
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To: Perceptive
Thanks and welcome to FR.
30 posted on 11/09/2002 7:31:17 AM PST by dennisw
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To: dennisw
More like re-welcome.
31 posted on 11/09/2002 7:31:56 AM PST by Lent
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To: Lent
Not necessarily. I'm a lurker who finally decided to come out of the cold.
32 posted on 11/09/2002 7:33:23 AM PST by Perceptive
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To: Perceptive
Not necessarily. I'm a lurker who finally decided to come out of the cold.

Come, sit by the fire and warm yourself.

33 posted on 11/09/2002 7:35:52 AM PST by Lent
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To: Lent
Thank you, friend.
34 posted on 11/09/2002 7:37:01 AM PST by Perceptive
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To: Lent
During Constantine's reign, Christianity was the official religion of the empire (324 CE), and Jerusalem -- which at the end of the Roman era was mainly a housing facility for soldiers of the Roman legion.

The first church built by Constantine in Jerusalem was a large basilica (a long rectangular structure, which was originally a Roman public building), and a rotunda (a round structure), located at the place where, according to tradition, Jesus had been buried.

The site was chosen as a result of a dream experienced by Constantine's mother. This church became the center of life in Jerusalem. The Temple Mount, the center of Jewish Jerusalem, was completely deserted.

Byzantine Jerusalem was based upon the standard Roman city. This is evident in the layout of the city rebuilt on the ruins of Jewish Jerusalem, which the Romans renamed "Aelia Capitolina".

But, the Muslims had nothing to do with the destruction of the Temple Mount in 70 AD.

The Pharisees were Persians. The Herodians were loyal to Herod. There were also the Saducees, Zealots, Sicarri, and Essenes.

Some Jews were Hellenized other weren't. Many revolutionary groups were operating. They fought each other much more than they ever fought the Romans. It was a time of terrible anarchy. Rome had controlled the province for nearly 100 years by 70 AD.

The Romans were hardly to blame for the destruction of the Temple either, but it certainly wasn't the Muslims who did it.




35 posted on 11/09/2002 7:42:33 AM PST by Soriety Sister
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To: Ivy League Professor
It is not the Temple Mount.

The websites you listed and what you presented regarding the Temple Mount is revisionist history.

You get a D minus.

36 posted on 11/09/2002 7:43:09 AM PST by SkyPilot
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To: Soriety Sister
The Romans were hardly to blame for the destruction of the Temple either, but it certainly wasn't the Muslims who did it.

What? The Romans did destroy the Temple in 70 A.D.. I told you it was the Byzantines who were in possession of the Temple Mount. I told you it was the ancient Byzantine Church of St. Mary which was converted to the Aksa Mosque on the Temple Mount. You choose to believe revisionist history with respect to the Mount because that's what returnee's to FR like to do. Play revisionist games.

Insofar as you other blatherings are concerned - try to stick with the subject.

37 posted on 11/09/2002 7:50:47 AM PST by Lent
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To: SkyPilot
You get a D minus.

Actually: F her.

38 posted on 11/09/2002 7:53:03 AM PST by Perceptive
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To: Soriety Sister

The Islamic Claim to Temple Mount

Most of the problems surrounding Jerusalem can be traced to two areas of dispute. One is the political area that asks Jereusalem to be the capital of both Israel and the nascent Palestine. The other and most contentious problem is the holiness of Temple Mount to both Judaism and Islam.

The role Jerusalem has in the Hebrew holy works is well known and not open to debate; however, there are varying opinions on the holiness of Jerusalem, specifically Temple Mount to Islam.

Many if not most opinions that counter Islam's claim point out the Jerusalem is not mentioned in the Quran and did not occupy any special role in Islam until recent political exigencies transformed Jerusalem into Islam's third holy site.

Following is an analysis by a well known scholar:


THE MOSLEM CLAIM TO JERUSALEM IS FALSE

by Dr. Manfred R. Lehmann

The Moslem "claim" to Jerusalem is based on what is written in the Koran, which although Jerusalem is not mentioned even once, nevertheless talks (in Sura 17:1) of the "Furthest Mosque": "Glory be unto Allah who did take his servant for a journey at night from the Sacred Mosque to the Furthest Mosque." But is there any foundation to the Moslem argument that this "Furthest Mosque" (Al-Masujidi al-Aqtza) refers to what is today called the Aksa Mosque in Jerusalem? The answer is, none whatsoever.

In the days of Mohammed, who died in 632 of the Common Era, Jerusalem was a Christian city within the Byzantine Empire. Jerusalem was captured by Khalif Omar only in 638, six years after Mohammed's death. Throughout all this time there were only churches in Jerusalem, and a church stood on the Temple Mount, called the Church of Saint Mary of Justinian, built in the Byzantine architectural style.

The Aksa Mosque was built 20 years after the Dome of the Rock, which was built in 691-692 by Khalif Abd El Malik. The name "Omar Mosque" is therefore false. In or around 711, or about 80 years after Mohammed died, Malik's son, Abd El-Wahd - who ruled from 705-715 - reconstructed the Christian- Byzantine Church of St. Mary and converted it into a mosque. He left the structure as it was, a typical Byzantine "basilica" structure with a row of pillars on either side of the rectangular "ship" in the center. All he added was an onion-like dome on top of the building to make it look like a mosque. He then named it El-Aksa, so it would sound like the one mentioned in the Koran.

Therefore it is crystal clear that Mohammed could never have had this mosque in mind when he compiled the Koran, since it did not exist for another three generations after his death. Rather, as many scholars long ago established, it is logical that Mohammed intended the mosque in Mecca as the "Sacred Mosque," and the mosque in Medina as the "Furthest Mosque." So much for the Moslem claim based on the Aksa Mosque.

With this understood, it is no wonder that Mohammed issued a strict prohibition against facing Jerusalem in prayer, a practice that had been tolerated only for some months in order to lure Jews to convert to Islam. When that effort failed, Mohammed put an abrupt stop to it on February 12, 624. Jerusalem simply never held any sanctity for the Moslems themselves, but only for the Jews in their domain.

[DR. MANFRED R. LEHMANN is a writer for the Algemeiner Journal. Originally published in the Algemeiner Journal, August 19, 1994.]


To attempt to resolve the problem we examined Arab photographs taken about 1875 by the Bonfils out of Lebanon. The photographs are from a Lebanese WEB site whose address is: http://almashriq.hiof.no/general/700/770/779/historical/pcd0109.html, and http://www.lib.uchicago.edu:80/LibInfo/SourcesBySubject/MiddleEast/Photo/Jerusalem.html, and http://almashriq.hiof.no/general/700/770/779/historical/pcd0109/17.jpg

The photos were computer enhanced to build up contrast as they are old and faded.

We also added a photograph of the Western Wall, part of the same collection, to demonstrate Jewish use of the Wall.

Following are some of the description of the photographs:

17 Mosque of Omar [Dome of the Rock] and David's Judgment Seat, Jerusalem, Mosquee d'Omar et tribunal de David.
15 The Jews Wailing Place, a Friday, Mur des Juifs, un vebdredi.
19 Mosque of El-Aksa, Jerusalem, Jerusalem. Mosquee, El-Aksa.
20 Mosque of Omar [Dome of the Rock] from the South, Jerusalem.
Bonfils, ca. 1875. Mount labelled "119. Different cupolas on platform of Temple." Produced by the Bonfils Studio, Beirut, and sold by Charles Taber & Co., New Bedford, Mass. Albumen. Mounted. 11 x 8.5 inches. Acquisition number 43-85.
Bonfils, ca. 1875. Mount labelled "113. Mosque of Omar and Court of David." Produced by the Bonfils Studio, Beirut, and sold by Charles Taber & Co., New Bedford, Mass. Albumen. Mounted. 11 x 8.5 inches. Acquisition number 155-85.

Dome of the Rock
Dome of the Rock
Note overall disrepair and lack of use

Dome of the Rock
Dome of the Rock

Missing tiles

Note missing tiles and condition of roof

Dome of the Rock
Dome of the Rock, additional view


Cupolas on Temple Mount
Note overall disrepair and lack of use

Al Aqsa
Al Aqsa Mosque
Note overall disrepair and lack of use

Western Wall
The Western Wall
In constant use since biblical times

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


39 posted on 11/09/2002 7:53:45 AM PST by Lent
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To: Lent
I don't much know about Mohammed's dream concerning Jerusalem but, I don't find it so surprising since Islam reveres the patriarchs and Jesus. Wouldn't it be natural that Jewish and Christian Holy sites would also be Holy to Muslims?

Wonderful old photos. All of the Holy Land was neglected during the Ottoman Empire. I'm not sure how poverty alters the history. Many accounts from traveling scholars think the Western Wall was not a Holy site until around 600 AD.

The Koran refers to Al Kuds which is the Arabic for the Hebrew Al Kadesh, I think.. The similarites aren't so surprising since both Hebrew and Arabic are semitic languages.
40 posted on 11/09/2002 8:06:21 AM PST by Soriety Sister
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To: Soriety Sister
I don't much know about Mohammed's dream concerning Jerusalem but, I don't find it so surprising since Islam reveres the patriarchs and Jesus. Wouldn't it be natural that Jewish and Christian Holy sites would also be Holy to Muslims?

No. Moslems typically will destroy or convert Jewish or Christian sites and indeed Hindu Fire Temples, Buddhist Shrines, etc., etc. They then claim their own history for the site. Where have you been?

Wonderful old photos. All of the Holy Land was neglected during the Ottoman Empire. I'm not sure how poverty alters the history. Many accounts from traveling scholars think the Western Wall was not a Holy site until around 600 AD.

You missed the point. Muslims let the area go to waste so it wasn't revered until the Jews returned to their ancient homeland. Even then it was the British who undertook to repair the Dome of the Rock, etc. Hence Arab Islamic nationalism (fascism) made this area an all important site. To keep it from the Jews.

The Koran refers to Al Kuds which is the Arabic for the Hebrew Al Kadesh, I think.. The similarites aren't so surprising since both Hebrew and Arabic are semitic languages.

I've seen this take on it and as noted above no historical Koranic connection.

41 posted on 11/09/2002 8:13:41 AM PST by Lent
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To: Lent
"No. Moslems typically will destroy or convert Jewish or Christian sites and indeed Hindu Fire Temples, Buddhist Shrines, etc., etc. They then claim their own history for the site. Where have you been?"

How can you say that when Muslims were the dominant group in Jerusalem for 1400 years and didn't destroy the Holy sites?

42 posted on 11/09/2002 8:16:41 AM PST by Soriety Sister
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Comment #43 Removed by Moderator

To: Soriety Sister
How can you say that when Muslims were the dominant group in Jerusalem for 1400 years and didn't destroy the Holy sites?

Why do you blatantly lie? Caliph Qadir in the 11th century destroyed the church of the Resurrection in Jerusalem and numerous other churches in that city. He then brutally subjugated the Christians by forcing them to either convert or, if they wore crosses around their neck, to have them replaced with wooden crosses weighing 4 pounds. Take your propaganda somewhere else.

44 posted on 11/09/2002 8:27:29 AM PST by Lent
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To: Soriety Sister

The architects of the Oslo peace accords understood Jerusalem's power. Fearing that even discussing the holy city's future before less combustible issues are resolved would detonate the fragile truce between Israelis and Palestinians, they tried to delay this issue to the end. But they failed: riots met the opening a new entrance to an ancient tunnel last September and now the building of apartments on an empty plot in eastern Jerusalem has brought the negotiations to a halt. As it becomes clear that the struggle for Jerusalem will not wait, the outside world must confront the conflicting claims made by Jews and Muslims on the city that King David entered three millennia ago.

When they do, they will no doubt hear relativistic cliches to the effect that Jerusalem is "a city holy to both peoples," implying a parallel quality to the Jewish and Islamic claims to Jerusalem. But this is false. Jerusalem stands as the paramount religious city of Judaism, a place so holy that not just its soil but even its air is deemed sacred. Jews pray in its direction, mention its name constantly in prayers, close the Passover service with the wistful statement "Next year in Jerusalem," and recall the city in the blessing at the end of meals.

What about Jerusalem's role in Islam? Its significance pales next to Mecca and Medina, the twin cities where Muhammad lived and which hosted the great events of Islamic history. Jerusalem is not the place to which Muslims pray, it is not once mentioned by name in the Qur'an or in prayers, and it is directly connected to no events in Muhammad's life. The city never became a cultural center and it never served as capital of a sovereign Muslim state. Jerusalem has mattered to Muslims only intermittently over the past 13 centuries, and when it has mattered, as it does today, it has done so because of politics. Conversely, when the utility of Jerusalem expires, the passions abate and its status declines.

In A.D. 622, the Prophet Muhammad fled his home town of Mecca for Medina, a city with a substantial Jewish population. On arrival, if not earlier, he adopted a number of practices friendly to Jews, such as a Yom Kippur-like fast, a synagogue-like house of prayer, and kosher-style dietary laws. Muhammad also adopted the Judaic practice of facing the Temple Mount in Jerusalem during prayer; "He chose the Holy House in Jerusalem in order that the People of the Book [i.e., Jews] would be conciliated," notes At-Tabari, an early Muslim commentator on the Qur'an, "and the Jews were glad." Modern historians agree: W. Montgomery Watt, a leading biographer of Muhammad, interprets the prophet's "far-reaching concessions to Jewish feeling" as part of his "desire for a reconciliation with the Jews."

But Jews criticized the new faith and rejected Muhammad's gestures, leading Muhammad to eventually break with them, probably in early 624. The most dramatic sign of this change came in a Qur'anic passage (2:142-52) ordering the faithful no longer to pray toward Syria but toward Mecca instead. (The Qur'an and other sources only mention the direction as "Syria"; other information makes it clear that "Syria" means Jerusalem.)

This episode initiated a pattern that would be repeated many times over the succeeding centuries: Muslims take religious interest in Jerusalem because it serves them politically and when the political climate changes, their interest flags.

In the century after Muhammad's death, politics prompted the Damascus-based Umayyad dynasty, which controlled Jerusalem, to make this city sacred in Islam. Embroiled in fierce competition with a dissident leader in Mecca, the Umayyad rulers sought to diminish Arabia at Jerusalem's expense. They sponsored a genre of literature praising the "virtues of Jerusalem" and circulated accounts of the prophet's sayings or doings (called hadiths) favorable to Jerusalem. In 688-91, they built Islam's first grand structure, the Dome of the Rock, on top of the remains of the Jewish Temple.

In a particularly subtle and complex step, they even reinterpreted the Qur'an to make room for Jerusalem. The Qur'an, describing Muhammad's Night Journey (isra'), reads: "[God] takes His servant [i.e., Muhammad] by night from the Sacred Mosque to the furthest mosque." When this Qur'anic passage was first revealed, in about 621, a place called the Sacred Mosque already existed in Mecca. In contrast, the "furthest mosque" was a turn of phrase, not a place. Some early Muslims understood it as metaphorical or as a place in heaven. And if the "furthest mosque" did exist on earth, Palestine would have seemed an unlikely location, for that region elsewhere in the Qur'an (30:1) was called "the closest land" (adna al-ard).

But in 715, the Umayyads built a mosque in Jerusalem, again right on the Temple Mount, and called it the Furthest Mosque (al-masjid al-aqsa, or Al-Aqsa Mosque). With this, the Umayyads not only post hoc inserted Jerusalem into the Qur'an but retroactively gave it a prominent role in Muhammad's life. For if the "furthest mosque" is in Jerusalem, then Muhammad's Night Journey and his subsequent ascension to heaven (mi`raj) also took place on the Temple Mount.

But, as ever, Jerusalem mattered theologically only when it mattered politically, and when the Umayyad dynasty collapsed in 750, Jerusalem fell into near-obscurity. For the next three and a half centuries, books praising the city lost favor and the construction of glorious buildings not only stopped, but existing ones fell apart (the Dome over the rock collapsed in 1016). "Learned men are few, and the Christians numerous," bemoaned a tenth-century Muslim native of Jerusalem. The rulers of the new dynasty bled Jerusalem and its region country through what F. E. Peters of New York University calls "their rapacity and their careless indifference."

By the early tenth century, notes Peters, Muslim rule over Jerusalem had an "almost casual" quality with "no particular political significance." In keeping with this near-indifference, the Crusader conquest of the city in 1099 initially aroused a mild Muslim response: "one does not detect either shock or a sense of religious loss and humiliation," notes Emmanuel Sivan of the Hebrew University, a scholar of this era.

Only as the effort to retake Jerusalem grew serious in about 1150 did Muslim leaders stress Jerusalem's importance to Islam. Once again, hadiths about Jerusalem's sanctity and books about the "virtues of Jerusalem" appeared. One hadith put words into the Prophet Muhammad's mouth saying that, after his own death, Jerusalem's falling to the infidels is the second greatest catastrophe facing Islam.

Once safely back in Muslim hands after Saladin's reconquest, however, interest in Jerusalem dropped, to the point where one of Saladin's grandsons temporarily ceded the city in 1229 to Emperor Friedrich II in return for the German's promise of military aid against his brother, a rival king. But learning that Jerusalem was back in Christian hands again provoked intense Muslim emotions; as a result, in 1244, the city was again under Muslim rule. The psychology at work here bears note: that Christian knights traveled from distant lands to make Jerusalem their capital made the city more valuable in Muslim eyes too. "It was a city strongly coveted by the enemies of the faith, and thus became, in a sort of mirror-image syndrome, dear to Muslim hearts," Sivan explains.

The city then lapsed back to its usual obscurity for nearly eight centuries. At one point, the city's entire population amounted to a miserable four thousand souls. The Temple Mount sanctuaries were abandoned and became dilapidated. Under Ottoman rule (1516-1917), Jerusalem suffered the indignity of being treated as a tax farm for non-resident, one-year (and so very rapacious) officials. The Turkish authorities raised funds by gouging European visitors, and so made little effort to promote Jerusalem's economy. The tax rolls show soap as the city's only export item. In 1611, George Sandys found that "Much lies waste; the old buildings (except a few) all ruined, the new contemptible." Gustav Flaubert of Madame Bovary fame visited in 1850 and found "Ruins everywhere." Mark Twain in 1867 wrote that Jerusalem "has lost all its ancient grandeur, and is become a pauper village."

In modern times, notes the Israeli scholar Hava Lazarus-Yafeh, Jerusalem "became the focus of religious and political Arab activity only at the beginning of the present century, and only because of the renewed Jewish activity in the city and Judaism's claims on the Western Wailing Wall." British rule over city, lasting from 1917 to 1948, further galvanized Muslim passion for Jerusalem. The Palestinian leader (and mufti of Jerusalem) Hajj Amin al-Husayni made the Temple Mount central to his anti-Zionist efforts, for example raising funds throughout the Arab world for the restoration of the Dome of the Rock. Arab politicians made Jerusalem a prominent destination; for example, Iraqi leaders frequently turned up, where they demonstrably prayed at Al-Aqsa and gave rousing speeches.

But when Muslims retook the Old City with its Islamic sanctuaries in 1948, they quickly lost interest in it. An initial excitement stirred when the Jordanian forces took the walled city in 1948_as evidenced by the Coptic bishop's crowning King `Abdallah as "King of Jerusalem" in November of that year_but then the usual ennui set in. The Hashemites had little affection for Jerusalem, where some of their most devoted enemies lived and where `Abdallah himself was shot dead in 1951. In fact, the Hashemites made a concerted effort to diminish the holy city's importance in favor of their capital, Amman. Jerusalem had served as the British administrative capital, but now all government offices there (save tourism) were shut down. The Jordanians also closed some local institutions (e.g., the Arab Higher Committee) and moved others to Amman (the treasury of the Palestinian waqf, or religious endowment).

Their effort succeeded. Once again, Arab Jerusalem became an isolated provincial town, now even less important than Nablus. The economy stagnated and many thousands left Arab Jerusalem. While the population of Amman increased five-fold in the period 1948-67, Jerusalem's grew just 50 percent. Amman was chosen as the site of the country's first university as well as of the royal family's many residences. Perhaps most insulting of all, Jordanian radio broadcast the Friday prayers not from Al-Aqsa Mosque but from a mosque in Amman.

Nor was Jordan alone in ignoring Jerusalem; the city virtually disappeared from the Arab diplomatic map. No foreign Arab leader came to Jerusalem between 1948 and 1967, and even King Husayn visited only rarely.

King Faysal of Saudi Arabia often spoke after 1967 of yearning to pray in Jerusalem, yet he appears never to have bothered to pray there when he had the chance. Perhaps most remarkable is that the PLO's founding document, the Palestinian National Covenant of 1964, does not even once mention Jerusalem.

All this abruptly changed after June 1967, when the Old City came under Israeli control. As in the British period, Palestinians again made Jerusalem the centerpiece of their political program. Pictures of the Dome of the Rock turned up everywhere, from Yasir Arafat's office to the corner grocery. The PLO's 1968 Constitution described Jerusalem as "the seat of the Palestine Liberation Organization."

Nor were Palestinians alone in their renewed interest. "As during the era of the Crusaders," Lazarus-Yafeh points out, many Muslim leaders "began again to emphasize the sanctity of Jerusalem in Islamic tradition," even dusting off old hadiths to back up their claims. Jerusalem became a mainstay of Arab League and United Nations resolutions. The formerly stingy Jordanian and Saudi governments now gave munificently to the Jerusalem waqf.

As it was under the British mandate, Jerusalem has since 1967 again become the primary vehicle for mobilizing international Muslim opinion. A fire at Al-Aqsa Mosque in 1969 gave Faysal the occasion to convene twenty-five Muslim heads of state and establish the Organization of the Islamic Conference, a United Nations for Muslims. Lebanon's leading Shi`i authority regularly relies on the theme of liberating Jerusalem to inspire his own people to liberate Lebanon. Since the Islamic Revolution, Iran's 1-rial coin and 1000-rial banknote have featured the Dome of the Rock. Iranian soldiers at war with Saddam Husayn's forces in the 1980s received primitive maps marking a path through Iraq and onto Jerusalem. Ayatollah Khomeini decreed the last Friday of Ramadan as Jerusalem Day, and the holiday has served as a major occasion for anti-Israel harangues.

Since Israeli occupation, some ideologues have sought to establish the historical basis of Islamic attachment to Jerusalem by raising three main arguments, all of them historically dubious. First, they assert a Muslim connection to Jerusalem that predates the Jewish one. Ghada Talhami, a scholar at Lake Forest College, typically asserts that "There are other holy cities in Islam, but Jerusalem holds a special place in the hearts and minds of Muslims because its fate has always been intertwined with theirs."

Always? Jerusalem's founding antedated Islam by about two millennia, so how can that be? Ibrahim Hooper, national communications director for the Washington-based Council on American-Islamic Relations explains: "the Muslim attachment to Jerusalem does not begin with the prophet Muhammad, it begins with the prophets Abraham, David, Solomon and Jesus, who are also prophets in Islam." In other words, the central figures of Judaism and Christianity were really proto-Muslims.

Second, and equally anachronistic, is the claim that the Qur'an mentions Jerusalem. Hooper (and others) argue that "the Koran refers to Jerusalem by its Islamic centerpiece, al-Aqsa Mosque." But this makes no sense: a mosque built a century after the Qur'an was delivered cannot establish what a Qur'anic verse originally meant.

Third, some Muslims deny Jerusalem any importance to Jews. `Abd al- Malik Dahamshe, an Arab member of Israel's parliament, flatly stated last month that "the Western Wall is not associated with the remains of the Jewish Temple." A fundamentalist Israel Arab leader went further and announced that "It's prohibited for Jews to pray at the Western Wall." Or, in the succinct wording of a protest banner: "Jerusalem is Arab."

Despite these deafening claims that Jerusalem is essential to Islam, the religion does contain a recessive but persistent strain of anti-Jerusalem sentiment. Perhaps the most prominent adherent of this view was Ibn Taymiya (1263-1328), one of Islam's strictest and most influential religious thinkers. (The Wahhabis of Arabia are his modern-day successors.)

In an attempt to purify Islam of accretions and impieties, Ibn Taymiya dismissed the sacredness of Jerusalem as a notion deriving from Jews and Christians, and from the long-ago Umayyad rivalry with Mecca. More broadly, learned Muslims living in the years following the Crusades knew that the great publicity given to hadiths extolling Jerusalem's sanctity resulted from the Countercrusade-that is, from political exigency-and treated it warily.

Recalling that God once had Muslims direct their prayers toward Jerusalem and then turned them instead toward Mecca, some early hadiths suggested that Muslims specifically pray with away from Jerusalem, a rejection that still survives in vestigial form; he who prays in Al-Aqsa Mosque not coincidentally shows his back precisely to the Temple area toward which Jews pray.

In Jerusalem, theological and historical claims matter, serving as the functional equivalent of legal documents elsewhere. Whoever can establish a deeper and more lasting association with the city has a better chance of winning international support to rule it. In this context, the fact that politics has so long fueled the Muslim attachment to Jerusalem has two implications. First, it points to the relative weakness of the Islamic connection to the city, one that arises as much from transitory considerations of mundane need as from the immutable claims of faith.

Second, it suggests that the Muslim interest lies not so much in controlling Jerusalem as it does in denying control over the city to anyone else. Jerusalem will never be more than a secondary city for Muslims.

In contrast, Mecca is the eternal city of Islam, the place where Muslims believe Abraham nearly sacrificed Isaac's brother Ishmael and toward which Muslims turn to pray five times each day. Non-Muslims are strictly forbidden there, so it has a purely Muslim population. Mecca evokes in Muslims a feeling similar to that of Jerusalem among Jews: "Its very mention reverberates awe in Muslims' hearts," writes Abad Ahmad of the Islamic Society of Central Jersey. Very roughly speaking, what Jerusalem is to Jews, Mecca is to the Muslims. And just as Muslims rule an undivided Mecca, so Jews should rule an undivided Jerusalem.

Daniel Pipes is editor of the Middle East Quarterly and author of The Hidden Hand: Middle East Fears of Conspiracy (St. Martin's Press).

http://www.yahoodi.com/peace/jerusalem.html


45 posted on 11/09/2002 8:30:26 AM PST by Lent
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To: Perceptive
Better site:

Which Conjecture is Correct?

In Israel it is often said that if you have two Jews you will have three opinions! Only time will tell which of the above views is correct. These conjectures will continue to be debated until Israel is able to conduct a thorough archaeological investigation beneath the Temple Mount itself. (3)

Unfortunately, the Temple Mount presently remains under the supervision of the Waqf, the Supreme Moslem Council, and they have prevented any systematic archeological studies. In fact, the Waqf has gotten increasingly resistive to investigations of any kind on the Platform - which they consider to be a huge outdoor mosque sacred to Islam.

Who knows what events developing in the history of Jerusalem will one day change the status quo, allowing scientific investigation of the entire Temple Mount, below ground as well as above? Then, according to the hopes and dreams of devout Jews for centuries, a Third Temple can be built on the foundations of the First and Second Temples and temple worship according to the Torah restored.



If Tuvia Sagiv is correct, the Temple site lies due east of the Western Wall,
under the clump of trees between the Dome of the Rock and Al Aqsa Mosque.

Addendum: Personal Notes

For more than twenty years one of us (Dolphin) has maintained an active interest in archaeology in Israel, and especially in the Temple Mount in Jerusalem.

Dr. Asher Kaufman, retired Professor of Physics at the Racah Institute of Physics of the Hebrew University in Jerusalem, and I began corresponding in the early '80's and have been good friends ever since.

I have followed with great interest Asher's hypothesis that the First and Second Temples were located 110 meters North of the Dome Rock on the Mount. The area in question would put the Holy of Holies and the Foundation Stone under a small Islamic structure known as the Dome of the Tablets or the Dome of the Spirits. Exposed bedrock outcrops beneath this small structure.

Dr. Dan Bahat, former District Archaeologist for Jerusalem, and now Professor at Bar Ilan University, is also a good friend. His arguments, vast knowledge, and experience convince him that the First and Second Temples are located in the immediate vicinity of the Moslem Dome of the Rock. His case is also a persuasive one. Dr. Leen Ritmeyer's PhD thesis involved his research delineating the original 500 cubit square Temple Mount.

Several years ago my good friend (since 1982), Stanley Goldfoot in Jerusalem introduced me to Tuvia Sagiv, a talented and enterprising Tel Aviv architect. Tuvia has spent hundreds of hours and many thousands of dollars of his own money researching the temple locations and has now built a strong and convincing case that the Temples were immediately east of the present Western Wall, with the Holy of Holies probably located under the El Kas Fountain. This fountain lies approximately midway between the Dome of the Rock and Al Aqsa Mosque.

The bedrock drops rapidly just south of the Dome of the Rock. If Tuvia's model is correct the Temples would be lower that the outcropping bedrock under the Dome of the Rock. In fact, Tuvia's recent research suggests the Dome site may have been originally a Canaanite High Place with tombs beneath, and later (until the reforms of Josiah) the location of an Ashoreh pillar.

For further information on the political, religious and archaeological aspects of the Temple Mount in our time, we recommend the briefing package The Coming Temple by Chuck Missler, available from Koinonia House. This briefing package contains two audio cassette tapes and 22 pages of notes with 30 diagrams.

Each year for four years (1992-1995) Chuck Missler and Lambert Dolphin co-hosted an annual International Conference on the Temple Mount in Jerusalem in conjunction with Chuck Missler's tour group visit to Israel. Video and audio tapes of speakers at these outstanding meetings are also available from Koinonia House and are highly recommended.

For further information on ground penetrating radar and other modern geophysical methods useful in archaeology see Lambert Dolphin's Library.

Nancy DelGrande, a former physicist at Lawrence Livermore Labs, has been for many years the principal advisor to Asher Kaufman, Tuvia Sagiv and others in Israel, concerning the science of Thermal Infra-Red Imaging. Email: NDelgrande@aol.com

Endnotes:

1. Leen Ritmeyer, Biblical Archeological Review, March/April, 1992. Email to Dr. Leen Ritmeyer (ritmeyer@dial.pipex.com).

2. Dr. Asher Selig Kaufman, Biblical Archeological Review, March/April 1983; Tractate Middot, Har Yearíeh Press, Jerusalem, 1991.

3. Audio tapes featuring speakers at recent Temple Mount Conferences in Jerusalem defending all three proposed locations for the Temples may be obtained from Koinonia House, PO Box D, Coeur d'alene, Idaho 83816-0347.

On the Location of the First and Second Temples

by Lambert Dolphin and Michael Kollen



Email: (dolphin@best.com)
(mkollen@primenet.com)
Lambert Dolphin's Web Pages: (http://ldolphin.org/)

Created July 21, 1995. Updated, July 20, 1996. Typographical corrections June 16, 2000, with thanks to Jon E. Schoenfield (103626.3140@compuserve.com). March 25, 2002.

Note: Because of the embedded graphics this file will not print well from all browsers.
To select the same file for printing, with links to the larger graphics, go to Theories2


http://www.templemount.org/theories.html
46 posted on 11/09/2002 8:44:26 AM PST by Lent
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To: Lent
In 1267 the Jewish sage Nahmanides wrote to a letter to his son. It contained the following references to the land and the Temple.

"What shall I say of this land . . . The more holy the place the greater the desolation. Jerusalem is the most desolate of all . . . There are about 2,000 inhabitants . . . but there are no Jews, for after the arrival of the Tartars, the Jews fled, and some were killed by the sword. There are now only two brothers, dyers, who buy their dyes from the government.

At their place a quorum of worshippers meets on the Sabbath, and we encourage them, and found a ruined house, built on pillars, with a beautiful dome, and made it into a synagogue . . . People regularly come to Jerusalem, men and women from Damascus and from Aleppo and from all parts of the country, to see the Temple and weep over it. And may He who deemed us worthy to see Jerusalem in her ruins, grant us to see her rebuilt and restored, and the honor of the Divine Presence returned."


I know the British assisted with repairs during the 1920s, but it was repaired many times and the site has undergone many changes in its long history.. At later dates the Jordanians assisted with repairs.

136 AD Hadrian erects Temple of Jupiter on Temple Mount and statue of himself facing east in front.

831 CE Caliph al-Mamun orders restoration work on the Dome of the Rock.

Crusaders turned it into Temple Domini" and El Aksa as "Temple Salomonis."

After the Crusades under Saladin, the Dome of the Rock and El Aksa restored to Islam. The icons were removed. 1190, walls overlaid with marble inscriptions added in Arabic.

Those are just a few...

47 posted on 11/09/2002 8:47:25 AM PST by Soriety Sister
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To: Soriety Sister
With respect to the Jews in Jerusalem, the Jews were Jihaded and dhimmiized out of Jerusalem. However, there was always a remnant there. Indeed, by the 19th century the Jews were the religious majority in Jerusalem.

Insofar as your other comments see above post on how Arab Islamics are lying about this site and the useless state they allowed it to be in until the British were involved.

48 posted on 11/09/2002 8:53:17 AM PST by Lent
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To: Lent
Don't waste your time, Lent. Trolls aren't worth it.

No mercy.
Coming soon: Tha SYNDICATE.
101 things that the Mozilla browser can do that Internet Explorer cannot.

49 posted on 11/09/2002 8:54:53 AM PST by rdb3
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To: Soriety Sister
The city then lapsed back to its usual obscurity for nearly eight centuries. At one point, the city's entire population amounted to a miserable four thousand souls. The Temple Mount sanctuaries were abandoned and became dilapidated. Under Ottoman rule (1516-1917), Jerusalem suffered the indignity of being treated as a tax farm for non-resident, one-year (and so very rapacious) officials. The Turkish authorities raised funds by gouging European visitors, and so made little effort to promote Jerusalem's economy. The tax rolls show soap as the city's only export item. In 1611, George Sandys found that "Much lies waste; the old buildings (except a few) all ruined, the new contemptible." Gustav Flaubert of Madame Bovary fame visited in 1850 and found "Ruins everywhere." Mark Twain in 1867 wrote that Jerusalem "has lost all its ancient grandeur, and is become a pauper village."

Quote above. Yeah, such an important site to Islam. LOL! Only when the Christians or Jews are in control or threaten to control it. Quit shoveling your load of Islamic malarky.

50 posted on 11/09/2002 8:57:34 AM PST by Lent
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