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Bush to Sign Homeland Security Bill
Fox News ^ | Monday, November 25, 2002 | AP

Posted on 11/25/2002 9:12:06 AM PST by Sparta

WASHINGTON — On his first working day after a four-nation tour of eastern Europe, President Bush planned to sign the new Department of Homeland Security into law Monday, marking the biggest overhaul in the federal government in more than 50 years.

The president was expected to "thank Congress for its bold and historic action in creating a new department largely along the lines of his proposal," said Gordon Johndroe, spokesman for Homeland Security Director Tom Ridge, who was to be named the new secretary of the department and newest member of the Cabinet.

Navy Secretary Gordon England was also expected to be named Ridge's deputy.

The department will have "one primary mission — protecting the American people, and it will allow 170,000 people to work more efficiently and effectively than ever before," Johndroe said.

Not since the creation of the Defense Department in 1947 has the government had so large an overhaul. The new department will employ 170,000 workers and encompass all or parts of 22 federal agencies. It has a $38 billion budget, estimated from the allocations of the existing units being incorporated.

Though the president originally wanted homeland security directed by the White House, Bush relented last June and proposed a new agency that could coordinate all the disparate bureaus and provide a cohesive front against terrorist threats.

Bush's proposal came after reviews of intelligence agencies revealed that a lack of coordination hampered efforts to foresee and prevent the Sept. 11 attacks.

After the bill was introduced by Senate Democrats, partisan wrangling slowed down progress as Democrats demanded worker protections that Bush said were too strict for an agency that would need the highest quality of workers and flexible staffing to confront fast-changing threats.

The sides finally agreed to limited collective-bargaining arrangements after Democrats lost the majority in the Senate on Election Day.

The agency has 90 days to get its leadership structure in place, but was expected to take more than a year before it would be operating at full speed.

Senate Republican leader Trent Lott of Mississippi has already said that he wants some changes to be applied to the agency next year, and has gotten a pledge from House Speaker Dennis Hastert, R-Ill., to revise certain provisions in the next Congress.

One provision permits federal business with American companies that have moved their operations abroad to sidestep U.S. taxes.

Another measure legally shields drug companies already sued over ingredients used in vaccines. Democrats said this includes existing claims that mercury-based preservatives have caused autism in children.

Also re-examined will be a section that helps Texas A&M University win homeland-security research money, a priority of incoming House Majority Leader Tom DeLay of Texas.


TOPICS: Breaking News; Crime/Corruption; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: civilliberties; homelandsecurity; ridge
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A sad day for freedom in America.
1 posted on 11/25/2002 9:12:06 AM PST by Sparta
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To: Sparta
Imagine certain aspects in this Act in the hands of the Clinton-Reno Justice Department.
2 posted on 11/25/2002 9:17:15 AM PST by cardinal4
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To: Sparta
Maybe. But a bright day for coordination of intelligence and routing out terrorist scum from our woodwork.
3 posted on 11/25/2002 9:21:06 AM PST by Victor
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To: Sparta
And a sad day for boards like this one. It's not much of a stretch that this could be deemed a "gathering place for terrorists" by future administrations. It's sad that republican cheerleaders are too short sighted to realize that it will happen.
4 posted on 11/25/2002 9:24:03 AM PST by mysterio
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To: Victor
How in the hell will the department coordinate anything without the CIA or FBI in the department? Also, what in the hell will this do for the situation on our borders?
5 posted on 11/25/2002 9:25:26 AM PST by Sparta
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Comment #6 Removed by Moderator

Comment #7 Removed by Moderator

To: Sparta
War on Terror bump !
8 posted on 11/25/2002 9:31:58 AM PST by MeekOneGOP
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To: Aldous Huxley
"....Today terrorist scum, tomorrow your children. Enjoy the sunlight while you may....."

You know what? If you're not a terrorist, and you keep your nose clean, basically a law-abiding citizen and still entitled to your Constitutional rights....why do you fear so???

Look, we need coordinated effort to go after the enemy that is already here. The Washington establishment was so hopelessly mired down that it was paralyzed in many respects. What Bush wants/needs is a fast-response (read:non-union) organization. This will lead to the non-unionization of other Federal agencies, IMHO. Why are you so afraid of that?

9 posted on 11/25/2002 9:32:35 AM PST by Victor
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To: Sparta
A sad day for freedom in America.

Actually, this bill is fairly tame compared to the Patriot Act. I've read much of H.R. 5710, and now I'm gonna read the bill as actually signed by Bush - there are a few stinkers in this, but critics have also several exaggerated much of what is in this bill.

10 posted on 11/25/2002 9:35:37 AM PST by dirtboy
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To: Sparta
Let the spying on law-abiding citizens commence!


11 posted on 11/25/2002 9:36:06 AM PST by ppaul
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Comment #12 Removed by Moderator

To: potterman
"...It does not emmediately shut off the borders and sweep the country for illegals and get them out of here...."

What happens to the INS under this Bill? Is the INS being routed under Homeland Security?

13 posted on 11/25/2002 9:43:27 AM PST by Victor
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To: Victor
But a bright day for coordination of intelligence and routing out terrorist scum from our woodwork

With the INS intentionally releasing captured illegals, I doubt that the Vaterland, err, Homeland Defense Dept. will do much to either prevent terrorism (an impossibility) or expel terrorists who have been captured.

14 posted on 11/25/2002 9:45:54 AM PST by Teacher317
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To: Victor
What happens to the INS under this Bill? Is the INS being routed under Homeland Security?

Section 471 of this Act elimated the INS and replaced it with two agencies - the Bureau of Border Security and the Bureau of Citizenship and Immigration, which are both part of the new Department.

15 posted on 11/25/2002 9:46:45 AM PST by dirtboy
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Bush Naming Ridge to Lead Homeland Dept
16 posted on 11/25/2002 9:47:50 AM PST by NormsRevenge
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To: cardinal4
Imagine certain aspects in this Act in the hands of the Clinton-Reno Justice Department..

And you think Bush and his henchmen will NOT screw over anyone...??? Yeah...Right..!!!
17 posted on 11/25/2002 9:51:42 AM PST by freddy
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To: Sparta
A sad day for freedom in America.

God help us all.

18 posted on 11/25/2002 9:51:51 AM PST by FormerLurker
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To: dirtboy
"...Section 471 of this Act elimated the INS and replaced it with two agencies - the Bureau of Border Security and the Bureau of Citizenship and Immigration, which are both part of the new Department..."

Thanks, didn't know that. Well, I see it as a way to get the corrupt, union-infested INS out of the way and a more effective law enforcement dealing with this out-of-control immigration situation.

I'll really start cheering if I see these boys close the borders and start rounding up Muslims.

19 posted on 11/25/2002 9:52:03 AM PST by Victor
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To: Sparta

Good question... why don't you go read Title IV of the HSA, HR 5005 and see what it says.... Maybe it's all paper shuffling and nothing will be accomplished in the field.

20 posted on 11/25/2002 9:52:48 AM PST by deport
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To: NormsRevenge
Brillant pick. Who's going to be the deputy, Vicente Fox.
21 posted on 11/25/2002 9:53:06 AM PST by Sparta
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To: Victor
"You know what? If you're not a terrorist, and you keep your nose clean, basically a law-abiding citizen and still entitled to your Constitutional rights....why do you fear so???"

Three points.

1) The right to be free from unreasonable search and seizure has been greatly eroded. (Though as another poster above noted, the "Patriot" act is much worse on this point.)

2) Whether one is a terrorist or not is something that is determined *after* the exercise of these new powers. It is not possible to employ these new powers *only* on terrorists. The ostensible purpose of the new powers is after all, to *identify* terrorists. So the fact that I am not a terrorist provides little, if any, protection against these new powers.

3) The stated purpose of any law is seldom the only purpose for which it is eventually used. In fact, stated purposes of laws often have *nothing whatsoever* to do with the law's eventual effects. Rather than examining stated purposes, it is better to analyze laws according to the incentives and constraints they create, and the actual legal language that defines exceptions or constraints upon the law.
22 posted on 11/25/2002 9:53:52 AM PST by Tauzero
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To: deport
Do you have a link to it?
23 posted on 11/25/2002 9:54:19 AM PST by Sparta
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To: Victor
You know what? If you're not a terrorist, and you keep your nose clean, basically a law-abiding citizen and still entitled to your Constitutional rights....why do you fear so???

The people whose FBI files were used by Clinton to bring them into line, do you think they were terrorists?

24 posted on 11/25/2002 9:55:19 AM PST by FormerLurker
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To: FormerLurker
I don't agree with your premise. Clinton violated the law; will violate any law for political gain. In his case (as in the case of any outlaw) it doesn't matter what laws are on the books.
25 posted on 11/25/2002 9:59:24 AM PST by Victor
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To: Sparta
http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/D?c107:3:./temp/~c107auOcnG::

This link won't stay hot long.... as Thomas kills it shortly after you connect. If it doens't work then the following and click on 5005 about 5 down from the top in the 3rd column.... good luck

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LIS/roll_call_lists/vote_menu_107_2.htm
26 posted on 11/25/2002 10:01:11 AM PST by deport
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To: deport
I'm sorry, but all it does is shuffle papers from one agency to another. The fundamental problems(unwillingness to combat illegal immigration) still remain.
27 posted on 11/25/2002 10:05:44 AM PST by Sparta
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Comment #28 Removed by Moderator

To: Sparta
From Drudge:

SENATOR ASHCROFT HAD WARNED: 'KEEP
BIG BROTHER'S HANDS OFF THE
INTERNET': 'The [Clinton]
administration's interest in all
e-mail is a wholly unhealthy
precedent, especially given this
administration's track record on FBI
files and IRS snooping. Every medium
by which people communicate can be
subject to exploitation by those
with illegal intentions.
Nevertheless, this is no reason to
hand Big Brother the keys to unlock
our e-mail diaries, open our ATM
records, read our medical records,
or translate our international
communications' -- Ashcroft, Oct
'97...
29 posted on 11/25/2002 10:10:22 AM PST by Revel
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To: Victor
I don't agree with your premise. Clinton violated the law; will violate any law for political gain. In his case (as in the case of any outlaw) it doesn't matter what laws are on the books.

The power of the Presidency has been vastly enhanced by this bill. Future (or even current) presidents wouldn't even HAVE to break the law in order to stifle dissent.

30 posted on 11/25/2002 10:10:42 AM PST by FormerLurker
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To: Revel
Ashcroft being a hypocrite, what else is new.
31 posted on 11/25/2002 10:11:50 AM PST by Sparta
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To: freddy
I think the Bush admin would use it more against Foriegners as the Clinonistas would use it more against political enemies such as rape victims, weird religious cults, and Elian Gonzalez.
32 posted on 11/25/2002 10:14:28 AM PST by cardinal4
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To: Sparta
Well we shall see won't we. It takes time to do anything in this beauracy..... We can hope for the best. Unless you have an instant solution and can implement it.
33 posted on 11/25/2002 10:16:10 AM PST by deport
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Comment #34 Removed by Moderator

To: All
Bush set to sign Homeland Security bill any minute now.
35 posted on 11/25/2002 10:20:27 AM PST by Sparta
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To: Sparta
Agreed we need a good go-to guy south of the border... not "bus 'em over" foX..
36 posted on 11/25/2002 10:21:22 AM PST by NormsRevenge
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To: NormsRevenge
I was being sarcastic.
37 posted on 11/25/2002 10:22:53 AM PST by Sparta
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To: Sparta
A sad day for freedom in America.

Only if you're a terrorist or criminal.

38 posted on 11/25/2002 10:23:20 AM PST by swheats
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To: Sparta
Yep sounds like a winner to me.... now can you implement it or get the gov't to.
39 posted on 11/25/2002 10:24:11 AM PST by deport
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Over 50 years since this massive a re-org has been done in the federal govt. History in the making. 22 agencies become as 1, sort of.

For my next trick, world peace..

Good luck, President Bush.
40 posted on 11/25/2002 10:31:19 AM PST by NormsRevenge
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To: Victor
...a bright day for coordination of intelligence and routing out terrorist scum from our woodwork.

The sheep's naiveté knows no bounds.

Sure, government bureaus are famous for their efficiency and effectiveness, and the bigger they are, more effective they are. Right?!

This boondogle will definitely cause a lot of American citizens unnecessary trouble, but the terrorists are safer now than they have ever been.

Hank

41 posted on 11/25/2002 10:32:57 AM PST by Hank Kerchief
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To: Sparta
You guys this is so wierd! A new Department! So...just how does this really jive with our Constitution??? (sarcasm) Wierd and historical day in America...
42 posted on 11/25/2002 10:33:04 AM PST by Gal.5:1
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To: NormsRevenge
"For my next trick, world peace.. "

I think you meant to say New Global Order.
43 posted on 11/25/2002 10:35:20 AM PST by Revel
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To: Gal.5:1
Bush has just said we are doing everything we can to protect our country, since 9/11. Tell that to the ranchers on the border.
44 posted on 11/25/2002 10:35:27 AM PST by Sparta
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To: Sparta
Please tell me thats not the dem candidate for LA senate on stage with bush!
45 posted on 11/25/2002 10:38:18 AM PST by icwhatudo
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To: Sparta
riiiight. lol. :/
46 posted on 11/25/2002 10:40:38 AM PST by Gal.5:1
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To: Sparta
asa hutchinson under sec'y of borders and transportation.. what happens to norm mineta ? IS TSA staying around ? oh please oh please .. I hope mineta gets his butt retired or bronzed or something..
47 posted on 11/25/2002 10:41:47 AM PST by NormsRevenge
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To: Sparta
"Tell that to the ranchers on the border."

They aren't being shot at...

48 posted on 11/25/2002 10:42:14 AM PST by sabe@q.com
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To: Victor
I thought we were supposed to get a "coordinated effort" the last time the goobers in Washington screwed up. We poured billions into anti-terrorism and got a miserable failure. It's the same old song every time, "If we'ed just had adequate funding", "If we just had more "tools"". What does it take? If anyone takes a pro-constitution stance they are branded a traitor or non-patriotic. Is it treason to not want some Ninja-suited moron looking in your underwear? "If you don't have anything to hide why are you so worried?"
49 posted on 11/25/2002 10:45:01 AM PST by dljordan
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To: icwhatudo
Nah, our dem LA candidate is a dumb blond, not a brunette.
50 posted on 11/25/2002 10:45:28 AM PST by Sparta
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