Smart Growth Policies 'Hurt Poor and Minorities,' Report Alleges

CNSNEWS.COM ^ | 11/25/02 | Marc Morano

[Edmund Burke]

Get rid of zoning and the private development industry will construct the higher density communities that the smart growth types are looking for. It is zoning that has created the sprawled development patterns since WWII. Zoning is the problem, not the solution to the problem.

[George Frm Br00klyn Park]

"So it is not a decree from the Central Committee but a plan that can be used or not by local communities."

KW, And IF the communities implement "smart growth", they are given handsome "incentives" from above {godgov}. "zoning" by any other name is social engineering the use of property. In a word. SOCIALISM!! Us "tinfoilers" laugh at you ignore-ants. Peace and love, George.

[George Frm Br00klyn Park]

"Get informed and I promise I'll try not to hurt your feelings."

3AB, Thanks!! I NEEDED that. Peace and love, George.

[gitmo]

Freedom's just too dam*ed disorganized. If everyone does what makes sense to them with their land, then our maps will look funny. </sarcasm>

[AAABEST]

KW, And IF the communities implement "smart growth", they are given handsome "incentives" from above {godgov}.

Not only that George, if they don't implement "smart growth" they get sanctioned by the state. As Jeb has threatened my community. Legal plunder by legal blackmail. From the Governors "letter"

The following are the potential sanctions to be imposed:

1. All state agencies will be directed not to provide funds to increase the capacity of roads, bridges, or water and sewer systems within the boundaries of Collier County.

2. Collier County will not be eligible for grants administered under the following programs:

a. Florida Small Cities Community Development Block Grant Program, as authorized by Sections 290.041-290.049, Florida Statutes.

b. Florida Recreation Development Assistance Program, as authorized by Chapter 375, Florida Statutes.

c. Revenue sharing pursuant to Sections 206.60, 210.20 and 218.61 and Chapter 212, Florida Statutes, to the extent not pledged to pay back bonds.

Boy do I love "democracy". Do what we tell you or we shut off funding for your roads and sewers.

[Kay Ludlow]

The latest term, and by far the most frightening I've heard them promote, is "view shed" meaning that they want to control not only how land they do not own is disposed, but how it looks.

Yep, that one's been hot here for 2-3 years. They want all the mountain ridges and sides protected, both because they are part of the watershed (like there is any place that's not in a watershed) and also because it's part of the view-shed, and benefits everyone. Since we own mountain land, my husband keeps saying he wants to start a movement to protect his "freedom-shed"!!!

It never ends, the left have incredible task persistence. They often win just by outlasting their opponenents...

[Carry_Okie]

Boy do I love "democracy". Do what we tell you or we shut off funding for your roads and sewers.

'Then our buddies in complicit RICOnut NGOs will sue you for non-compliance.'

[Kay Ludlow]

It is zoning that has created the sprawled development patterns since WWII. Zoning is the problem, not the solution to the problem.

Right On! They require minimum lot sizes, minimum square footage, minimun number of baths, etc. In Pennsylvania, the constitution doesn't really allow local government to require those things, so instead they have 'sub-division ordinances". They are apparently allowed as much regulation on subdividing as they want, so the "progressive" local governments are requiring all this and more as a condition of subdividing.

"Sprawl" started with a different government program - FDR's Rural Electrification project. Before that there were some real trade-offs between living in the country and living in the city, like electric lights, heat in the winter, ice year-round. Rural electrification had the federal government subsidize running electricity to every home in the country at a low cost, so the advantages to city living went away. Everyone had easy heat, refrigeration, etc, and often cheaper in the country. Zoning has only added to this by not permitting developers outside urban areas to build dense housing...

[AAABEST]

Heh. When I was in real estate, I thought zoning laws were the cat's meow.

Then I got to thinking, "why do the people in the nice areas get to not have a gas station in their 'pretty' part of town?"

Because they'd rather the surfs have those, while they have the art galleries.

[Sweet Hour of Prayer]

I'm completely confused about "Smart Growth." I live in Loudoun County, VA (second fastest growing county in the USA) and we're having all kinds of zoning battles! My biggest frustration is that the builders built townhomes, apartments, mid-size homes and estates by the hundreds but they didn't contribute any funds to build the required schools and roads. My oldest daughter shared a locker with two other students her freshmen year of high school. The school was 500 students over-enrolled! My youngest daughter is in kindergarten in a class with 28 students. Most kindergarten classes are full at 20. It's hard to sort through all the rhetoric to find out how this lack of foresight and planning took place. I just don't know what to think.

[Clinging Bitterly]

Thanks for the flag, Andy.
Of course you're right up there at the Mecca of "smart growth", and the gentrification, the trolleys, all of that.

I have followed the topic for a number of years as it's constantly discussed on the or.politics usenet group, sometimes a fun group, other times a low signal:noise ratio.

We get some of that in Eugene too. The big push the last few years has been that whole socialized transportation thing. Of course we're not big enough for trains, so this thing called "bus rapid transit" is about to launch here. If you don't know what that's all about, you ought to look it up. There's a lot not to like about it, but my comments would get long winded and too far off topic.

Ah, the urban growth boundary, it's been used to do many things hereabouts, none of them good. If your land lies within, you can get permission to develop. If you're just on the other side of it, the best you can hope for is to keep up the tax payments in anticipation of inclusion sometime before you die. More typically, some local baron will swindle you you out of it while you are on your deathbed, and they'll get the gravy. Seen it happen a hundred times around here.

Dave in eugene

[dixiechick2000]

Thanks for the pings!

Andy, not all property outside the UGB is losing value. While there are not many areas like this left, property in my area is zoned RR-5. It could, also, be subdivided into minimum 1 acre lots. It was grandfathered in the last time there were changes in zoning laws. There's a vineyard behind our house. The owner has been gradually developing it since 1998. He now has 6-8 1 to 1.2 acre lots for sale starting at $399,000.

I didn't realize grapes were so lucrative...

[dixiechick2000]

Oh, nooooo! You had to mention "the trolleys"...

;o)

[KeyWest]

The problem with any zoning plan is that it may be a national program but it can only be instituted locally, so smart growth can be fine in one area but lousy in another. Mainly because it is different in both places. In our area we have two different flavors. One is what many in this thread are complaining about, the influence on the zoning code by the elite , resulting in what I consider a bad code. It favors the rich at the expense of all others. And it hurts those in established homes by environmentally restricting their use of the land.

In my town, it is good, since it favors small clusters of houses when a development is planned, but anyone can still build where and what he wants for single family dwelling in the rural area, within reason (there are minimum standards and they are minimum!)

Zoning law is local. The problem is that most zoning law sneaks under the radar and is put into place without much comment from the public. The reason is most newspapers do not cover code changes, since they have become news gatherers, not seekers after news. Plus most in the public do not want to get involved, since it is not in their back yard. Hence, most of the complaining on this thread are from those who have found that the changes have taken place and they never knew it. Or they knew it and either could not or did not do anything about it.

In my town, at the last planning board meeting, where most of the zoning decisions are made, we had a full house fighting a new shopping center, gravel pit (which is why I was there) and supporting a new tourist attraction. The efforts of those there materially changed the direction of each project. An informed electorate can do something about zoning law. You have to organize and make noise. which is what we did. We went door to door in the effected area and got a group to come to the meeting. We planned who would speak about what and when. We stopped the pit in its tracks. What as to be a major operation is now small and manageable, with lots of restrictions.

If you do not fight city hall locally, you will get whatever those who are pushing programs want. Otherwise you are left to complaining on FR about the injustice of the universe.

[Issaquahking]

Key West,

What a bag of wind you are! You have the odacity to talk about people coming to FR to complain - you must be a disruptor or less, quite obviously you haven't done much homework into the issue as a whole. But you just keep believing the trash your putting out here - you know not of which you speak.

Most of these people you are talking about as complainers I've personally met and are some damn fine people and patriots to boot.Sorry bout the rant, but the guy needs a wake up call and am trying to serve it to him.

[meadsjn]

Democrat policies, in general, are designed to keep people ignorant, poor, and dependent on their betters for their daily bread. Advanced Democrat policy-making is geared toward forcing more and more people into their traps.

LBJ was quoted by a senator as saying, after signing the War on Poverty Act in 1964, "We'll have the Negroes eating out of our hand and voting Democrat for the next 200 years."

[countrydummy]

Believe me, viewshed is most dangerous!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The Nps is trying to take my home because I will "pollute" the viewshed after a "scenic roadway" is built that only goes 10 miles and really goes nowhere! The land that I live on and own, has been owned for over 200 years!

In other words, we had the "viewshed" along time ago!!!!!! Please visit our website for the dangers of proposed viewsheds! http://www.newriverfriends.org

[countrydummy]

I kind of agree with you on this. But let me expound some. In rural WV most folks do live in trailers, be they single wides or double wides. One of the reasons for this, is that the environmental regulations has stopped development and thus decreased needed jobs in these areas! So they are forced back onto welfare programs or have no job security! Yet they do the best they can to survive and provide a roof over their families homes!

Yet here is the real reason for all of this junk! Our properties are valuable under all of these so called attempts at stopping urban sprawl, viewsheds, etc.. and so on....that is why they are trying so hard to "devalue" our property so we get screwed, yet when the land is owned or reulated to death and we have to pay fines of up to $10,000 dollars a day for such minute violations such as building a bird house (no development allowed) then we lose our lands! How can we afford to pay such a fine? Yet then our lands become so "unique", so greatly needed! Thus the value goes sky high, but we don't own it anymore!

I probably am not making much sense, but I know very well how this game is being played. I refuse to surrender!

[NYpeanut]

I will check it out, thanks.

[Askel5]

You obviously know nothing of what you speak, but that's to be expected from numbskulls that insist on calling our republic a "democracy".

Cheers!