FReeper Needs Advice: How Can We Better Respond To Pro-Aborts?

Sparta | 26 Nov 02 | Sparta

[Mr. Silverback]

Sparta graciously gave me permission to post the text of this freepmail, which was sent to me from the "Pro-Life Families Complain About Group's Telemarketing Calls" thread:

This was going to be off topic, so I chose to freepmail you this instead.

I was debating abortion with my friends today. They were saying that abortion should be legal because children of poor parents would grow up in misery. Also, raped women would be too traumatized to carry their children. Also, teenage girls would have their lives ruined by caring for illegitmate children. I said that adoption would give the children a chance for life in the first two situations a better life and I said the teenage girls need to learn how to responsible. They then said that pro-lifers were just cruel and evil. How do I better respond to pro-abortion arguements?

[Frohickey]

Someone mentioned it in FR, and seeing a TV ad about pets makes me think.

Ask them what should be done with dogs and cats in the shelter. Should they be killed/destroyed, or should they be 'adopted' by loving families/owners.

Then ask them what should be done with babies.

After that, if it gets through their thought-shields, you can watch the reaction as their pro-choice brains overload.

[PaxMacian]

Genetics = Identity

Woman's body or Seperate Identity?

Potentiality or Viability are moot points!

DISTINCTION!

[Anitius Severinus Boethius]

When abortion is legal:

-There will be fewer children in poverty.
-Every child will be wanted and so there will be no child abuse or neglect.
-Welfare roles will be reduced as there will not be any single mothers.
-Children, knowing they were wanted, will be happier.

Has any of those prophecies heard in the 1970's by pro-abortion forces come true? No. In fact, child abuse is much more prevalent now, single mothers are an epidemic, and there are just as many children in poverty.

Abortion as a social tool has been a dismal failure.

And what about our children? Many kids have asked these questions.

-How many of my classmates were killed by abortion?
-What would have happened if my Mom went through a tough period when she was pregnant with me?
-I wonder if I lost any brothers or sisters to abortion?

Far from making a child view their lives as precious, it shows children that their lives are up to the whim of their mother. How is that comforting?

"Yes, she may care for me know, but what if I had gotten in the way of her career?"

Mentally healthy children indeed.

[Libertarianize the GOP]

If you hope to persuade others the best bet is to find common ground, a common ground that also moves the current situation in the direction you desire. Start by looking at what the effect of overturning Roe v Wade would be. Since most States had legal abortion before Roe v Wade and if opinion has shifted in the intervening years it is now more favorable to maintaining legal abortion. If Roe v Wade is overturned the issue of what is legal and illegal reverts to the State’s legislatures. A handful of States may pass general bans while most would place a few limits on things like late term abortion and require things like parental consent. Some States would make no changes to the current law. It may not accomplish your ultimate goal but it would be an improvement that most voters could support.

Very few people would support a right to abort a healthy 8 or 9 month unborn child, very few people would oppose an abortion in a case where both mother and child will die but an abortion could save the mothers life. Most people are somewhere in the middle and the nuances of opinion don’t lend themselves to Court edicts but are best resolved in the give and take of the Legislative process.

Work on convincing a majority that they have nothing to fear if Roe v Wade is overturned and that letting their State’s legislatures massage a compromise would actually better represent their personal opinions on when abortion is appropriate.

[Delphinium]

Do you think it is my responsibility as a believer, and co-church worker to confront these friends with this issue? I believe "judgment begins at the house of God". I believe the American church will be held just as accountable for all the murdered babies, as I believe the German church will answer for not speaking up when the Jews were being murdered. Even those pro-life Christians who refuse to vote are allowing it to happen. It is so frustrating to me to see American Christians so caught up in playing church, going to parties, etc.. Their excuse for not getting involved in these important issues is they are too busy.

[dredhawk]

http://www.abortiontv.com/

[dpa5923]

Good link. thanks for posting it.

[PaxMacian]

Jeremiah 1:5
Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and before thou camest forth out of the womb I sanctified thee, and I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations.

Isaiah 49:1 :
Listen, O isles, unto me; and hearken, ye people, from far; The LORD hath called me from the womb; from the bowels of my mother hath he made mention of my name.

Galatians 1:15
But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,

Psalm 139:13
For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother's womb.
14 :
I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well.
15 :
My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.
16 :
Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.

[jwalsh07]

Show them this.

[mlmr]

By adopting all of America's children in foster care instead of letting them go to homosexual couples. By telling birthmothers of all races that their children are important and then adopting them.

Marvin Olansky and the Terry Somebody who headed Operation Rescue impressed me because they did put their convictions on the line and have adopted children who really need homes...right here in the US.

[jwalsh07]

Ask Sarah Smith, an abortion survivor if life is better than abortion

[laotzu]

For me, absolute confirmation was provided by the following line of thought:
Each side(pro-life & pro-choice) can easily identify where the other is wrong. Accept both "wrongs" as true and legitimate (just for the sake of this analysis).

Placing yourself alternately on each side, imagine that you are wrong, and; what the consequences are of your being wrong.

For one, the result is having given another tyrannical control to the government over an individuals life.

For the other, the result is the realization that you have murdered helpless babies.

They are both tragic, repugnant results. Each, rightly, should be strongly gaurded against. But, for me, one clearly has a more tragic consequence for being wrong.

Hope it helps.(my logic...may only work in my head)

[jwalsh07]

[agrace]

Pro-Life Answers to Pro-Choice Arguments - Randy Alcorn, great book.

[KeyBored]

He's an ex-pastor? Then he should be familiar with Psalm 139.

These verses (Ps. 139:13-16) speak to the fact that God knew each one of us - even before our birth
13 For thou hast possessed my reins: thou hast covered me in my mother’s womb.

14 I will praise thee; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made: marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knoweth right well.

15 My substance was not hid from thee, when I was made in secret, and curiously wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.

16 Thine eyes did see my substance, yet being unperfect; and in thy book all my members were written, which in continuance were fashioned, when as yet there was none of them.

[jwalsh07]

Invite them to Washington DC on Jan 22, 2003.

[airborne]

BEAUTIFUL! Thank you for finding the picture that should end the debate (but for some doesn't).
LIFE IS PRECIOUS!!!

[Delphinium]

Maybe I should give these scriptures to him, and then ask him to justify his comments to me that it didn't matter to him whether other people had abortions.

[Texas Eagle]

Try to politely inject the following question into the conversation:

"Have you ever noticed that the only people who benefit from abortions are the man involved and the doctor who performs the abortion?"

Odds are they will totally skip over the comment about the doctor but they will most likely respond by saying something like, "How does the man involved benefit?"

To which your response would be, "Well, think about it. The guy gets his rocks off and then he avoids the possibility of paying child support for 18 years." Wait a couple of seconds as they ponder this and then say, "I mean, it's like they think women are nothing but walking sperm banks."

[peter the great]

Unfortunately I am way too tired to give this some thought, but I really do not believe that it is only the woman who should feel some guilt over an abortion ,after all, it does take two to tango. I believe that when this life is over and we are judged we will be judeged on how well we treated each other. Trust me, causing a woman to have an abortion in this life will not help us out in the next. To make abortions less rare, changing peoples hearts and minds is the way to go as you said, but we really need to reward those of us who do the right thing.