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Hopeless in Haiti: A Rickety Nation Sinks Deeper into Chaos
CBN News at CBN.com ^ | November 26, 2002 | Paul Strand

Posted on 11/26/2002 12:47:54 PM PST by KriegerGeist

Hopeless in Haiti:
A Rickety Nation Sinks Deeper into Chaos

By Paul Strand
CBN News Correspondent

In 1994, President Clinton and the United Nations decided to send some 20,000 troops and sink $3 billion of aid into Haiti in an attempt to save the sinking state. Eight years later, the question is, did it do anything at all?

CBN.com– PORT AU PRINCE, Haiti - Haiti is wracked with violence again. The poorest Caribbean country has seen streets fill with demonstrators eight times this month, some protesting for the government, others against it.

None of this was supposed to happen. Eight years ago the world intervened in Haiti to stop it from spinning down into disaster, but now things may be worse than ever.

What happened eight years ago this fall had never happened before in world history. A United Nations force led by America headed to the shores of Haiti, prepared for the first time ever to invade a sovereign nation, ready to oust a far-right military dictator and restore a far-left leader to power.

In 1994, President Clinton and the United Nations decided to send some 20,000 troops and sink $3 billion of aid into Haiti in an attempt to save the sinking state. Eight years later, the question is, did it do anything at all?

The leader who Clinton helped restore was Jean Bertrand Aristide, a defrocked Catholic priest and Marxist, kicked out of the priesthood for preaching violence. Still, he was Haiti's first democratically elected leader before the 1991 coup forced him out.

With Haitian boat-people flooding America in 1994 to escape the murderous military dictatorship, Clinton felt Aristide could stem the tide before these boat people caused U.S. Democrats to lose seats in the 1994 midterm elections.

LINK TO FULL ARTICLE

(Excerpt) Read more at cbn.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Foreign Affairs; Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: chaos; haiti

1 posted on 11/26/2002 12:47:54 PM PST by KriegerGeist
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To: Geist Krieger
Some solutions for Haiti and any other third world nation the US defeats in the War on Terror.

(1) Occupy the nation with US troops and appoint a military governor to administer until the nation becomes sufficently civilized to administer its own affairs.
(2) Completely de-Nazify the national government by arresting all loyal supporters of the dictator and detain them indefinitely.
(3) Kick the UN out of that country. They propogate communist/socialist ideas which are harmful for that nation.
(4) Draft that nation's new constitution based on the US Constitution and the same with the nation's economy.
(5) Train the nation's new military based on US doctrine and values.
(6) Demand a free and fair election for new national government.
(7) Build that nation's government based on the US Government.

The failure with all previous nation-building attempts is that they have often built new dictatorships and socialist economies. Haiti is no exception.
2 posted on 11/26/2002 1:17:36 PM PST by Sparta
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To: Sparta
I couldn't suggest a better seven solutions.
Isn't is amazing that the other half of the Island (Dominican Republic) is completely in the opposite condition of Haiti?
Really shows you the difference between Bill Clinton's foreign policy and George W. Bush's foreign policy.
I would not be surprised if the Bush administration or our government as it is changing, may eventually do some or all of the things you suggest. That boat load that landed in Florida just befor Election Day had to be somewhat of a wake-up call concerning Haiti as it effects the U.S.
3 posted on 11/26/2002 1:31:04 PM PST by KriegerGeist
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To: Geist Krieger
We tossed 3 billion tax dollars down that abyss and never heard it hit bottom. Let that be a lesson not to poop off our money.
4 posted on 11/26/2002 1:31:19 PM PST by TexasRepublic
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To: Geist Krieger
Isn't is amazing that the other half of the Island (Dominican Republic) is completely in the opposite condition of Haiti?

I read we're sending troops to the Dominican Republic to police their border with Haiti. Clinton was a socialist-enabling traitor.
5 posted on 11/26/2002 1:34:41 PM PST by Sparta
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To: Geist Krieger
Some additions to those solutions.

(8) Impose death sentances for all drug smugglers, murderers, kidnappers, and human smugglers in the nation.
(9) All riots in the occupied nation will be suppressed with the use of live ammunition.
6 posted on 11/26/2002 1:38:10 PM PST by Sparta
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To: Geist Krieger

7 posted on 11/26/2002 1:38:46 PM PST by Consort
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To: Sparta
Clinton didn't like the fact Haiti was competently run under a right wing military dictatorship. He just had to parachute in a Marxist to tut off his developed sense of moral superiority. A decade later thanks to his catering to the Dem Left, Haiti is back in the dumps and out of the news. But you won't hear him claim credit for the foreign policy fiasco in the Carribean on his watch.
8 posted on 11/26/2002 1:38:50 PM PST by goldstategop
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To: Geist Krieger
Haiti: yet another U.S. Liberals' success story...
9 posted on 11/26/2002 2:02:02 PM PST by pabianice
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To: Sparta
"(1) Occupy the nation with US troops and appoint a military governor to administer until the nation becomes sufficently civilized to administer its own affairs. "

OPTIMIST!!!!

10 posted on 11/26/2002 2:13:37 PM PST by litehaus
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To: litehaus
OPTIMIST!!!!

Guilty. Look at Japan and Germany after we rebuilt them after WWII.
11 posted on 11/26/2002 2:14:49 PM PST by Sparta
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To: Geist Krieger
If memory serves, the US intervened in Haiti more than 20 times during the 20th century. Haiti was even a USMC 'fiefdom' from 1928-1932 and its people never had it so good. It appears to be incapable of self-government, crushed in a morass of illiteracy and voodoo. IMHO, if we want to be sympathetic, we should take it over (again) and keep it as some sort of commonwealth or something. PS: I visited there on a cruise ship and found the island to be beautiful (the untouched parts) and the people friendly when allowed to be.
12 posted on 11/26/2002 2:21:37 PM PST by silverdog
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To: Sparta
I like it. I've been saying for quite some time that, in the wake of WWII, the main reason for the success of integrating Japan and Germany into the realm of civilized nations was the fact that there was a transitional government run by military proconsuls.

I do admit to wondering if any society with Islam as a religious base can be brought into the modern world.
13 posted on 11/26/2002 2:35:35 PM PST by FreedomPoster
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To: Sparta
Sorry, Sparta. You don't know what you're talking about.

(1) Occupy the nation with US troops and appoint a military governor ... We've done this before at the early 1900s. It didn't work. Even in the 90s, the money that our troops, the UN, CNN, etc., spend in Haiti drives up the cost of everything in the country and decimates the middle class. This just scratches the surface of the problems we can cause. All it does is make us feel better because we did SOMETHING, and it gives the NEXT dictator something to blame the country's problems on.

(2) Completely de-Nazify the national government by arresting all loyal supporters of the dictator and detain them indefinitely. So where are we going to put them? Gitmo? The US does not have a base in Haiti. And there are no facilities there to take over.

(3) Kick the UN out of that country. They propogate communist/socialist ideas which are harmful for that nation. The UN is not Haiti's problem. The UN doesn't waste much time or money in Haiti.

(4) Draft that nation's new constitution based on the US Constitution and the same with the nation's economy.Apparently you're not familiar with Haiti's current US-based constitution.

(5) Train the nation's new military based on US doctrine and values. That's what Cedras was trying to do when Bush-1 and Clinton kicked him out.

(6) Demand a free and fair election for new national government. A Haitian election is a wondrous thing to behold. 95% of the people cannot read. Democracy in America is shaky enough. How can an almost entirely uninformed, misinformed population possibly choose among six to ten political parties which are each as corrupt as the other? When a Haitian goes to vote they hand him a sheet of paper with different colored boxes on it. He is supposed to make an X in the box of the color of the party he wants to vote for. After the voting is done, the ballots are taken to a central collection area, and then to the major cities for hand-counting. Absolutely anything can happen to those ballots at any point along the way. Haiti is not ready for democracy. It just gives monsters like Aristide a cloak of legitimacy. Democracy so far has been a cruel practical joke played on the Haitian public.

(7) Build that nation's government based on the US Government.This cannot be done overnight, and it definitely can't be done with military force.

The failure with all previous nation-building attempts is that they have often built new dictatorships and socialist economies. Haiti is no exception. The only real force for positive change in Haiti today is the Protestant Church. I'm not a Catholic basher and I'm not anti-Catholic. But voodooism is the scourge of Haiti and it is practically synonymous with Catholocism there. It gave us Aristide, who like most Haitian priests, had voodoo symbols (veve's) embroidered on the inside of his vestments.

The only thing that can possibly save Haiti is prayer, committed Christian workers, and the US keeping its big nose out of that country if at all possible. There is probably NOTHING that the US Government can do for Haiti that will not make the situation worse.

14 posted on 11/26/2002 2:52:02 PM PST by far sider
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To: Geist Krieger
Eight years later, the question is, did it do anything at all?

Sure. It made matters worse. It took the country away from a relatively benign dictator (Baby Doc was much more decent than his father, Papa Doc) and a cabal of businessmen, and gave it into the hands of a fanatical left-wing whacko, whose first act was to burn down the Catholic cathedral because he was angry at the Pope.

I'm sure watching what happened gave clinton and carter a nice warm feeling in their hearts.

15 posted on 11/26/2002 2:55:19 PM PST by Cicero
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To: far sider
(1) We didn't have a military governor in Haiti. We turned it over to a UN civilian prick.
(2) Concentration camps are not hard to set up. A tent city encircled with barbed wire and armed guards is not hard to build.
(3) The UN may not be a problem now, but they'll scream and want to come in after the liberation.
(4) The checks and balances are rarely used, if at all. Also, a free market economy needs to be instituted, at gunpoint if necessary.
(5) No arguement there.
(6) I'm not saying turn it over immediately, but before we do, we need to launch a crash literacy program for the adults and institute an effective education system(Administered by missionaries, temporarily) for the children.
(7) That's why we have a transition period.
16 posted on 11/26/2002 3:03:02 PM PST by Sparta
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To: Cicero
Close. We didn't take it away from Babydoc. He had long since been deposed by Aristide. We "took the country away" from Raoul Cedras, the guy that ran Aristide off. Cedras is a decent man who had a chance at straightening out Haiti, but unfortunately Bush-1 listened to the UN (instead of the CIA) and started the process to put Aristide back in power. (Clinton just finished what Bush started.)

Babydoc was just as bad as his father, but incompetent.

17 posted on 11/26/2002 3:06:44 PM PST by far sider
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To: Sparta
A few comments:

Haiti is already a concentration camp.

Here's what happens if we send troops to Haiti. Middle class Haitians who pay $20 dollars a month for rent are quickly displaced by soldiers, or reporters, or UN observers who pay $300 a month for rent. A loaf of bread that costs a nickel goes up to a dollar. Local mobsters import young girls from the Dominican Republic for the soldiers. Rich and powerful make a lot of money, and the middle class, such as it is, is devastated.

The best thing we (the US Government) can do for Haiti is leave it alone.

18 posted on 11/26/2002 3:22:30 PM PST by far sider
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To: Geist Krieger
I think it is of some interest to remember that Haiti's principal lobbyist in the US during that time was Ron Brown, the head of the DNC. He represented the Baby Doc Duvalier regime, and then Aristide. When Aristide was overthrown, and we froze Haiti's accounts, a special dispensation was granted by the president (Clinton) unfreezing funds to allow Ron Brown to get paid.

Cedras's mistake was in not paying off the DNC.
19 posted on 11/26/2002 3:23:06 PM PST by marron
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To: Geist Krieger; Sparta
BETTER SOLUTION:

1,000 God-fearing, robust, gun-owning conservatives land and take over the island in a bloodless coup.

They deport all the Haitians to Miami, fully expecting the US media to raise a ruckus, asking "how can we expect the poor Haitians to survive under the senior-starving Republicans"?

Thanks to the useful idiots in the media, all Haitians make it safely to southern FL, in the process Hialeah gets renamed to Aristideville.

Then, we send a mass email to all Freepers, asking them to come to the Robinson Republic. There are no income taxes, just a 5% tariff on all imported goods, except ammunition and guns. There is not a standing army, instead a militia patterned after Switzerland and the Minutemen. etc. etc.

Augustus Glock (founder of Glock) is the first president of the country. He serves for 2 years before stepping down, but not before appointing Thomas Sowell Finance Minister for life. The election boils down to a choice between Alan Keyes, Massad Ayoob and Jeff Cooper.

20 posted on 11/26/2002 3:28:45 PM PST by ikka
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To: marron
Whoa! That IS interesting. I would love to know your source for that. (Maybe it was voodoo that took out Brown...)
21 posted on 11/26/2002 3:29:16 PM PST by far sider
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To: far sider
The best thing we (the US Government) can do for Haiti is leave it alone.

And let the illegal Haitians invade America. This is premption to prevent the Aztlan reconquista situation from occuring in Florida. Anyway, the occupying soldiers will live in old Haitian Army barracks or at Port-au-Prince airport(The case in all peacekeeping deployments). As for food prices going up, well NGO aid organizations and missionaries will come in to take care of all short-term humanitarian concerns. Haiti will eventually have US companies come in to do business, providing jobs, and local entrepenurs(with assistance from the State Department and a smarter foreign aid program that teaches people how to make a living, not just hand out food.) The local mobsters will always find a way to make money, they'll just have to be shot when caught.
22 posted on 11/26/2002 3:33:14 PM PST by Sparta
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To: Geist Krieger
The problem with Haiti is the voodoo. The voodoo has to be stopped, because demonic powers are magnified by voodoo. Its hold on these people prevents any form of government from succeeding.

Haiti has always been a dark, poor place. And the voodoo is the main culprit. Those who are spiritually sensitive know exactily what I mean.
23 posted on 11/26/2002 3:33:49 PM PST by exit82
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To: ikka
I love it except for the presidential choices. I would make Tom Tancredo the first president of the republic and Benjamin Netanyahu defence minister for life. I like Walter Williams instead for finance minister and Sowell at education. Ayoob would be head of the marshals service and Glock would just stick to what he does best, building excellent pistols. Be interested in who you think should command the Army though. As for Keyes, he can run for President when Tancredo is term-limited after six years. Also, we would update the Confederate Constitution and use it for our constitution.
24 posted on 11/26/2002 3:40:56 PM PST by Sparta
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To: far sider
A Haitian election is a wondrous thing to behold. 95% of the people cannot read. Democracy in America is shaky enough. How can an almost entirely uninformed, misinformed population possibly choose among six to ten political parties which are each as corrupt as the other?

America is a Constitutional Republic, not a democracy. Never has been a democracy, and hopefully never will be. In a democracy, if "50% + 1" of the people decide that certain people should be dragged away and tortured to death, then that's that

A Constitutional Republic like the US will work, more or less, as long as certain conditions exist. These are:

  1. The majority of the voting populace are literate
  2. The majority of the voting population are property owners to some extent
  3. A large percentage of the population is armed and sufficiently willing to resist being raped by mob rule that the idea doesn't come up
If any of the above conditions are not met, then you have a bad situation, like when Europeans democraticly elect people like Adolph Hitler, and the US has to go in and settle things.
25 posted on 11/26/2002 3:47:11 PM PST by SauronOfMordor
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To: far sider
Its been awhile. Shortly before his health turned for the worse, there were a couple of good expose's written detailing his financial matters. He was one of those kind of guys that get paid a lot of money but don't have a job.

But one of his sources of income was that he was the registered lobbyist for the Government of Haiti, both under the Duvalier's, and then for Aristide.

For sources, after this much time, I'll have to dig.
26 posted on 11/26/2002 3:49:59 PM PST by marron
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To: Geist Krieger
In 1994, President Clinton and the United Nations decided to send some 20,000 troops and sink $3 billion of aid into Haiti in an attempt to save the sinking state. Eight years later, the question is, did it do anything at all?

I don't recall that the UN had anything to do with Clinton's destruction of Haiti. But Clinton's aggression against the civilized Haitians, who were headed at the time by General Cedras, a West Point graduate with our values, certainly did do something! It destroyed any prospect that Haiti had to make any real progress in the direction of a better life for her people!

When you have a country wallowing in poverty, you do not run off the affluent, educated leadership--the people who not only can direct progress, but finance it and purchase the products of an improving economy--were it ever to improve--and expect anything but disaster. Add in the fact that Clinton turned the country over to a recognized Marxist, who could be expected to tear down any one who actually did still succeed, and you had and have a recipe for total chaos.

The very idea of "Democracy" in a country without a strong middle class, with both the intelligence, education and leisure time, to understand the political processes, is itself absurd. There is no place on earth that such has ever worked for the betterment of a people. The sort of head in the sands, sloganizing, that went on in the Clinton Administration over the point was as nauseating as it was criminal in its impact upon the civilized element in Haiti.

It was for such outrageous abuses of power as this, that Clinton should have been impeached. Unfortunately, by 1998, almost no one even remembered what he had done--misusing his position as Commander-In-Chief--in the tabloid like concentration on his personal affairs.

William Flax Return Of The Gods Web Site

27 posted on 11/26/2002 3:50:39 PM PST by Ohioan
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To: marron
Still digging. Found an article that says Aristide is presently paying Patton Boggs (Ron Brown's old company) $50,000 per month for its lobbying services.

And I found this:

Haitian Connections

How Clinton's cronies cashed in on foreign policy. (Wall Street Journal Online)

Tuesday, May 29, 2001 12:01 a.m. EDT

Regarded as Haiti's legitimate president at that time, U.S. authorities granted Mr. Aristide access to the country's frozen assets, most notably the long distance telephone royalties due to Haitian Teleco. According to Christopher Caldwell, writing in the July 1994 American Spectator, Mr. Aristide "raised hackles at the Latin America division of AT&T by ordering the proceeds from Haiti's international phone traffic moved to a numbered Panamanian account."

In November 1993, The Wall Street Journal reported that Mr. Aristide was paying Democratic Party operative Michael Barnes $55,000 a month to lobby for U.S. action to reinstate him. With the help of U.S. troops, he returned to Haiti. After regaining Haiti's presidency, the telephone monopoly continued to be useful. Because Haiti is one of the top three markets in the region for long distance calls from the U.S., the monopoly is a cash cow. Mr. Aristide placed loyal Lavalas followers in charge of it, keeping it under his control.

So, this article has him paying someone in the DNC $55,000 a month back when he was in exile.

But my memory is that he paid Brown with unfrozen funds.

I am digging for the old American Spectator article, by Christopher Caldwell. Maybe someone else will have better luck than I...

28 posted on 11/26/2002 5:24:07 PM PST by marron
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To: Sparta; litehaus
litehaus: "'(1) Occupy the nation with US troops and appoint a military governor to administer until the nation becomes sufficently civilized to administer its own affairs.'"
"OPTIMIST!!!!"

Has Africa become "sufficently civilized"? No. There is, in some cases, a veneer of civilization, but it peels away easily. Let's not mince words. These people are savages, and it will take centuries to civilize them.

While I would love to see Sparta's plan executed, simply because it would stem a tide of Haitian immigration, it is Utopian.

_________________________________________________________


Sparta: "'OPTIMIST!!!!'
Guilty. Look at Japan and Germany after we rebuilt them after WWII."

We started out with advanced, literate cultures; a gigantic advantage.
29 posted on 11/27/2002 6:19:49 AM PST by VMI70
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To: VMI70
Has Africa become "sufficently civilized"?

I agree it hasn't, but the natives in many cases were not sufficently trained for self-government so the Soviets came in and imposed communism through their flunkies. Rhodesia and pre-ANC South Africa were shining examples of civilization in an uncivilized continent. This program also allows missionaries and other pro-freedom, pro-civilization individuals and teach these people civilization. This plan, I admit, would take around 50 years to complete, but it's worth a shot to protect our economy and American lives in the long run.
30 posted on 11/27/2002 6:25:44 AM PST by Sparta
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To: Sparta
"This plan, I admit, would take around 50 years to complete"

Even with all the technologies we have today, I think your timeline is way too optimistic to rework centuries of virtually no civil development.
31 posted on 11/27/2002 6:36:13 AM PST by VMI70
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