Conservatives Dispute Bush Portrayal of Islam as Peaceful

washington post ^ | 11/30/02

[Jhoffa_]

And go ahead and explain why you think anyone speaking their opinion, no matter what it is, is "no better" than the problem of the murdering Islamic terrorist.

Because I don't like Jihads of any flavor.

This kind of thing is no solution. It's still tyranny.

[Jael]

Are they saved without Christ?

I am of the opinion that forced religious behavior never produces good fruit.

These people do this out of fear of their god Allah. They fear punishment at his hands.

True worship is only done in spirit and truth.

There is no truth in Islam.

[Jhoffa_]

I believe a general war against saudi-dominated islum is what presently is in fact happening, as is appropriate defense against these nuts.

Sure, no one has a right to hurt anyone for peacefully pursuing their religion. So we are drawing distinctions between the Osama's and the Lamonte's of the world.

There's no doubt that there is danger here, it's not coming from the peaceful Muslim's however. That's my point.

Actually, it's only one of them the other's are:

2) Attacking Islam as a whole will give legitimacy to Osama's cries that we are "infidels trying to destroy the Muslim religion" This mistaken notion will encourage others to join and do his fighting for him. Naturally, I would like to deny him this.

3) It's politically unacceptable. Breeching the Constitution and some of the other things I head advocated frighten me. I think this is a huge mistake.

[Jael]

Because I don't like Jihads of any flavor.

You are still at it. Equating murder with people speaking their mind. Give it up. No one here has murdered anyone.

You certainly can not say the same regarding the Jihaddist, the REAL ones.

Stop accusing the good people here of being in the same category as murders.

1968 Robert Kennedy assassinated - Islamic Terrorist
1970 (?) 4 airliners hijacked, 3 airliners blownup in the Middle East in single operation - - Islamic Terrorists
1970 Jordanian citizens attacked, murdered (by PLO) - - Islamic Terrorists
1972 Munich massacre of Israelis - Islamic Terrorists
1975 Raid on Entebbe, Uganda - Israeli plane hijacked, Israelis murdered - Islamic Terrorists
1983 Lebanon Marine Barracks attack - 250 murdered - Islamic Terrorists
1985 Rome Airport murders - Islamic Terrorists
1985 TWA Flight 847 hijacked, U.S. Navy diver murdered - Islamic Terrorists
1985 Achille Lauro hijacking, murder - Islamic Terrorists
1986 Germany, Disco Bombing, U.S. military personnel murdered - Islamic Terrorists
1988 Pan Am 747 Flight 103 Bombing, Lockerbie, 100's murdered - Islamic Terrorists
1993 Khobar Towers attack - Islamic Terrorists
1993 World Trade Center attacked - Islamic Terrorists
1998 U.S. Kenya Embassy blown up, 100's murdered - Islamic Terrorists
1998 U.S. Tanzania Embassy blown up, 100's murdered - Islamic Terrorists
1999 Plot to blow up Space Needle - Islamic Terrorists
2000 USS Cole attacked, many U.S. Navy sailors murdered - Islamic Terrorists
2000-2002 Intifada against Israel - 100's dead and injured - Islamic Terrorists
2001 4 Commercial airliners hijacked, 250+ murdered - Islamic Terrorists
2001 World Trade Center attacked, 2800+ murdered - Islamic Terrorists
2001 Flight 93 murders - Islamic Terrorists
2001 Pentagon attacked, 180+ murdered - Islamic Terrorists
2002 Reporter Daniel Pearl, kidnapped and murdered - Islamic Terrorists
2002 Philippines American missionary, Filipino nurse killed - Islamic Terrorists
2002 July 4, El Al attack Los Angeles LAX, several murdered - Islamic Terrorist
2002 Bali bombing - 200 dead, 300 injured - Islamic Terrorists
2002 Yemen, French Oil Tanker attacked - Islamic Terrorists
2002 Marines attacked / murdered in Kuwait - Islamic Terrorists
2002 Washington D.C. sniper - Islamic Terrorist
2002 Russian Theater attacked, 100+ dead - Islamic Terrorists
2002 Nigerian riots against Miss World Pageant, 200 dead, dozens injured - Islamic Terrorists
2002 Mombasa Hotel Attacked, 12 dead, dozens injured - Islamic Terrorists
2002 Israeli Boeing 757 attacked by missiles, fortunately no one injured - Islamic Terrorists
PLO - Islamic Terrorists
PFLP - Islamic Terrorists
Black September - Islamic Terrorists
Fatah - Islamic Terrorists
Islamic Jihad - Islamic Terrorists
Hizbollah - Islamic Terrorists
Hamas - Islamic Terrorists
Yasser Arafat - Islamic Terrorist
Osama bin Laden - Islamic Terrorist

Now, your claim that Freepers speaking their mind are just as bad as the above problem???

Get real.

[Jhoffa_]

You are still at it. Equating murder with people speaking their mind. Give it up. No one here has murdered anyone.

If that's your standard then you are running out of points.

Because only 19 of 1.3 Billion Muslims trashed out Trade Center..

Now, your claim that Freepers speaking their mind are just as bad as the above problem???

To quote you Jael: "You will not be allowed to lie about people in this thread. Is that clear?"

What I said was:

There are many people here either outright calling for or implying the need for a war on Islam as a whole. They are no better than the problem they are addressing, imo.

And the answer is yes. If you address the problem of Islamic violence against innocents with Christian violence against innocents then yes. That answer is as bad as the problem it's intended to solve.

Violence against innocents isn't acceptable simply because it's put forth by Christians. That's nonsense and you know it.

[Jael]

Please do not give Hoffa any ammunition.
You can not declare war on a whole religion.

[Jael]

I do know that he has the Constitutional right to worship peacefully and there is no moral justification for anyone to interfere with him.

I totally agree with this comment.

Now, stop slamming Christians and Freepers and calling them Jihadist and equating opinions with murder.

[Jhoffa_]

You can not declare war on a whole religion.

What would you say about someone who tried?

What you tell the Crusaders? Yassir Arafat? Eh?

Hummmmm?

[Jael]

What you said in this post is not what you have said in others. Glad to see you backing down.

[Jael]

The Christian world (The West) hate the Muslims because they cannot stomach a society that cannot separtae God from it's government (politics).

Thank you for your views. I would have to point out to you that the West has not attempted to molest the Middle East. THere is no comparison of behaviors.
But again, thanks for weighing in.

[Jael]

What you tell the Crusaders?

I don't say anything to dead people. I am not Catholic anyway, so I would not defend what they did, except to say this: If they had been successful, we wouldn't face the problem we do today.
Also, it is my understanding that the Crusades were in response to Islamic atrocties and attacks in Spain.

[Jhoffa_]

Now, stop slamming Christians and Freepers and calling them Jihadist and equating opinions with murder.

I didn't slam "Christians"

I didn't slam "Freepers"

I didn't "equate opinions with murder"

You are splitting hairs in a vain attempt to keep this argument going.

If you want Jihad against innocents then you are no better than other who do same.

Posting it here doesn't make you better, being a Republican doesn't make you better and being a Christian doesn't make you better.

There. Now, if you're through being obtuse.

[Jael]

Violence against innocents isn't acceptable simply because it's put forth by Christians. That's nonsense and you know it.

Who said that? You? I certainly did not.

What Christians do you know that have done the following?

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/798150/posts?page=325#325

[Jael]

The current generation of islum is evil

Oh please. Evil exist in all cultures.

[Jhoffa_]

And the answer is yes. If you address the problem of Islamic violence against innocents with Christian violence against innocents then yes. That answer is as bad as the problem it's intended to solve.

I think this was the point all along.