How the West Won : The Islamic Worldview and the End of Science

Breakpoint ^ | 1 Jan 03 | Chuck Colson

[Mr. Silverback]

No wonder bin Laden pines for the 11th century...

[DeFault User]

A science advisor to former Egyptian president Anwar el-Sadat said knowledge was part of Islam's creed. "When you know more, you'll see more evidence of God."

President Sadat chose to think for himself and was rewarded by his Islamic brothers. Sad.

[Eala]

What dimmed the light of Islamic scholarship? A Pakistani professor says one major factor is an increasing emphasis on rote learning based on the QUR'AN.

There is a superb analysis of this in the book "The Arab Mind" by Raphael Patai (1973), chapter 15, "The Question of Arab Stagnation." There too this is pointed out as a major factor, but not the sole factor.

This book was strongly recommended to my father-in-law by the foreign relations department of the (giant) corporation he worked for, before he went to the Middle East as a corporate exec.

[f.Christian]

A healthy worldview promotes healthy science. A flawed, or false, worldview leaves you in the dark.

tm...

The evolutionists are going to lose in America and they may end up having to find some other place to peddle their wares.

Perhaps Haiti...

1877 posted on 01/01/2003 7:14 AM PST by titanmike

[swarthyguy]

>>Overbye says that by the Middle Ages, Islamic academics had invented algebra,

More lies. Imported from India by an arab named Al-Jahabra.

The answer is simple. When the arabs ran out of lands to conquer -- to plunder for their wealth and knowledge, their love affair with science stopped.

The Ottomans and the Arabs resisted the Gutenberg Press. Perhaps one of the critical reasons. They have no one to blame except themselves.

[LS]

I have seen some interesting arguments that in fact Muslim science has NEVER been "the best in the world," and that in very small pockets, and only for very brief times, did the Muslim scientists ever "lead" anything; rather, they borrowed HEAVILY from the Greeks, Egyptians, and Romans.

[TransOxus]

What a load of crock!!! See:

Whoever wrote this is lying through their teeth to peedle how wonderful Islam was when actually it destroyed quickly any creative thought and advanced civilizations it invaded. One of the most glaring errors with regard to the entire mathematics claim in the article is that everything was entirely of Indian origin from the complete numerical system used today to the development of advanced mathematics which are mistakenly attributed to Arab and Western mathematicians. See: Islam's Other Victim: India

And one can go on about the Chinese, Egyptians, Persians from whom these Arab interlopers stole original ideas and claim as their own.

[livius]

Even for the 11th century, this article gives too much credit to Islamic societies. Basically, these things all came from the societies Islam conquered. These societies usually had about 100 years before Islam snuffed out native culture, learning and art. It would be much faster now because communications (and hence control) are much better. Those are modern inventions Islam would keep. Big Brother Mullah needs his tools, after all.

[RightWhale]

The Muslim world needs to revisit its past and get over its anger toward the West.

The Western Crusades ended, mainly due to reformation in the Western Church, a long time ago. It is past time to let it go. Get over it, even if it takes a reformation within Islam.

[Coeur de Lion]

The myth of the preponderance of Muslim advance in the sciences as versus that of Europe--is just--that a myth.

All that contributed to Muslim science came out of Graeco-Roman and Indian civilization. Even the proposition that they invented algebra is absurd. Any good student of the history of mathematics recognizes that this algebra was nothing more then a set of propositions used to develope algorithms. They consisted of logical statements in written form of axioms such as the communitive law for addtion and multiplication. The true advancements which constitute what we now consider to be algebra i.e. the definition of a variable, how we write and equation etc. were all created by European mathematicians of the Renaissance.

The reason for the popular myth of the superiority of science in the Muslim world as versus that of Europe has always been driven by the same reason that they present the fact that the Mayans had a more complex calendar than the Europeans--proof that the West is not the superior culture, which it is, with respect to all others.

[RightWhale]

proof that the West is not the superior culture, which it is, with respect to all others.

In 1003, 1000 years ago, the West was dead. The Byzantines and the Muslims were definitely alive. The Byzantines and the Muslims got along fairly well. When the West came out of its stupor, Arabic scholarship was the source of much of the light that came into the West. That was then, of course, and this is now. A lot has happened in the meantime.

[RonF]

Every time I hear about the crusades of 1000 years ago, and the great injustice done, I invite a look back 300 years earlier. Egypt, Syria, and other such now-Moslem lands were once Christian. Then the invaders came. Do you think everyone converted because earnest young men came to everyone's front door and said, "I'd like to share the Qu'ran with you today?" No, conversions were done at the point of the sword, as opposed to how Christianity had spread in those lands. I'll hold no brief for the Crusades, but I'll not grant the Moslems that were attacked any moral superiority.

[Monty22]

The modern islamics blew their load with 9/11. If they do anything in that range of destruction again, SLBMs/ICBMs/B2's will fly, loaded with B61-11's or possibly D5 Tridents.

Personally, I think 9/11 was all we needed for a full scale nuclear assault on the islamic world. Next time though, I think we'll do it.

[RightWhale]

not grant the Moslems that were attacked any moral superiority.

That's right. No one, including ALL the followers of the God of Abraham, has a clean history. It is time to stop stirring this up. The Wahabis will fail in their new Crusade, the sooner the better. Nobody is going to get anywhere.

[Cicero]

For five centuries, the Muslim world pioneered cutting-edge science.

This is a very doubtful assertion. For several centuries, survivors from the civilizations the Muslims conquered continued to work on science and mathematics. For the most part these scientists were slaves and dhimmi, not Muslims as such. The important Muslims were too busy swaggering about to do anything useful.

[RightWhale]

The important Muslims were too busy swaggering about to do anything useful.

Hasn't it always been so? Scientists and philosophers stay in their cloisters and leave management of the empire to swaggerers?

[Coeur de Lion]

I agree with everything you wrote. Indeed Arab scholarship preserved much from Graeco-Roman civilization which had been lost in the West. The issue I raise is that a lot of what drives these demonstrations of the cultural advancement of other cultures with respect to the West is multiculturalism, cultural relativism and an anti-Eurocentric bias. Most people learn very little regarding the history of mathematics or the origins of the science as we know it. All in the name of the need for inclusion.

[RonF]

Hasn't it always been so? Scientists and philosophers stay in their cloisters and leave management of the empire to swaggerers?

That stopped here in the U.S. once the first atomic bomb was dropped.

[wideawake]

A professor of the history of science at the University of Oklahoma says, "Nothing in Europe could hold a candle to what was going on in the Islamic world until about 1600."

This sentence alone is ridiculous. I can't believe that a professor of the history of science would never have heard of Albertus Magnus or Jean Buridan just to name two.