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Posted on 01/14/2003 8:01:56 AM PST by JackelopeBreeder
Grijalva invites Ashcroft to see vigilante 'justice'
ARIZONA DAILY STAR; Tuesday, January 14, 2003
U.S. Rep. Raul Grijalva stepped up his campaign to crack down on vigilantes Monday by inviting Attorney General John Ashcroft to come to Southern Arizona to see the threat they pose to border security.
The Tucson Democrat told Ashcroft in a letter that the federal government's silence on the issue is "seen as giving official sanction to this racist movement, both by the perpetrators and victims of vigilante 'justice.' "
Ashcroft's voice, Grijalva added, "is needed now to make clear that private armed groups claiming law enforcement powers have no role in patrolling our border with Mexico."
Last week, shortly after he was sworn in, Grijalva called for a federal inquiry into the vigilante groups that have formed in response to the thousands of illegal immigrants who make their way across Arizona's border every year.
The destruction of the clarity of the English language that Clinton started continues apace with this bunch...
There's only one racist here. It's the one that thinks people of a certain ethnicity should be exempt from the immigration laws that everyone else in the world has to obey. This man is a traitor to our nation. The fact that traitors like this are elected to nationwide office makes me think the reconquista has already been successful.
How about you prove your point, as you are demanding that he prove a negative. It shouldn't be hard to find racist screeds on American Patrol. Go ahead, do it.
Hint - I spent a couple of nights doing just that. Didn't find anything. But if you want to repeat that exercise, please feel free. But from the nature of your posts so far I doubt you have the integrity to come back with an honest answer.
Vigilante group BUMP!
He doesn't need any. If english is your primary language, it's self evident.
American citizens of Mexican heritage (such as my wife) do not need to be crossing over the border on tractless desert, traversing private property. They can just present their ID at the border like any other American. So your argument there is absurd, as is your bigotry of calling them Pedros...
And how are the private border patrol groups racist? Or are you as prone to casually toss that slur at inconvenient groups as Jesse Jackson is? Once again, I spent two nights going through whatever I could find about Glenn Spencer and American Patrol. Couldn't find one bigoted utterance. You, however, seem more than willing to paint that group with the racist brush with no evidence whatsoever - and then have the gall to call that reality. You should pursue a career in global warming research - they love folks who will parrot an agenda in absence of supporting data.
Here's a good one. My wife is a fourth-generation American of Mexican heritage. She is strongly opposed to illegal immigration, and agrees with what the groups are doing on the border. Care to explain how that makes her a racist?
Actually, Rep. Grijalva (D-AZ) means bigoted or discriminatory when he claims racism, since Mexicans do not constitute a race. In order for that to be true, the civilian patrols must be found to be looking for or stopping only one nationality...Mexicans.
In fact, they are looking for and stopping any person who crosses the border illegally. This includes, but is not limited to, Nicaraguans, Egyptians, Chinese, Polish, Russians, Pakistanis, and Guatemalans. Please note that some of the people who have been detained crossing the border within 15 miles of my home include persons from nations that harbor terrorists.
I anxiously await your response.
OBTW, like dirtboy, my family includes Mexicans with the addition of a new daughter-in-law this weekend.
That people have been politically conditioned over the last thirty or forty years not to say: "I hate Mexicans and want to kill them on sight. Good for those who do" proves nothing. They have learned instead to talk about "the rule of law" which was certainly dead when Roe vs. Wade was handed down and probably forty years earlier. They have learned to yap about the constitution without the ability or willingness to understand that persons, as well as citizens, are protected by the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments to the federal constitution.
There are people who forget, like Jackelope Breeder who has previously posted his ancestry as partially Blackfoot that the spirit of the Chivington massacre and other bluebelly atrocities against American Indians lives on in the tortured souls of those who live to exclude Mexicans (largely of Indian blood) from this land. They have learned to claim that our "culture" is threatened. They have learned to speak in code.
If you think America depends on either keeping other people not quite like you out of it or at least upon being rude to others not like yourself, you are to be pitied but not supported. America is an idea and an ideal and not some membership club to kick people out of on the sorry grounds of looking or speaking differently.
If Montagnard villagers and Hmong people from Vietnam could come here from stone age civilizations after the war and see their children become valedictorians of their high schools through academic achievement not affirmative action in one generation, we should look to the Mexicans for similar performance.
The conservative movement is rooted in principles and not in bloodlines; in performance and not in soil. The Mexicans are coming whether you like it or not. There is nothing, consistent with the constitution of the United States that you can do about it. The question is whether you are prepared to respond like grownups. Learn some manners. Welcome these folks. Help them. Show them the hospitality which is more of an American tradition than the paranoid border hysteria that dominates so many of these threads.
On the other hand, if you don't like the idea of her Satanic Majesty, the junior Senatething from New York by way of Illinois and Arkansas in the White House as Supreme Commissar, you better adjust your attitudes because those Mexicans may be the one group who can stop her cold. It will take a lot of work but it can be done. She cannot pull the Mexican card on Dubya. His family contains many Mexicans unlike hers or Arkansas Bubba's. In 2008, it's either Jeb or whitebread. If it's whitebread, you better have dropped this insulting nonsense long earlier or we will be teaching our children the soviet goosestep.
Fantasies? Hardly. There are groups out there promoting the idea - including a college professor from New Mexico.
You can find the attacks on Pope John Paul II which reveal the anti-Catholic bigotry that underlies these border racist xenophobes with pickup trucks and shotguns playing make-believe government.
Please show where the groups on the border, or those supporting them here, have made anti-Catholic statements.
Right on this thread we have someone posting who apparently thinks that speaking English is the basic badge of Americanism
My ex-wife is half Asian Indian, half Pathan. Right now she is a coordinator for a refugee services agency. And the first thing she tells the new arrivals to do is to learn English. Second thing she tells them is to learn how to think like white males so they understand the mechanics of this country. Is she bigoted, or realistic? It helps the new arrivals to follow her advice, and it helps this country to maintain a common langauge. That's hardly bigotry, that's reality (the real kind, not your imagined reality).
That people have been politically conditioned over the last thirty or forty years not to say: "I hate Mexicans and want to kill them on sight. Good for those who do" proves nothing.
Folks who say that on FR are promptly shown the door, and, once again, the lead group down there, American Patrol, has been slimed by the SPLC - slime that is unsubstantiated, but slime that you seem more than willing to lap up.
They have learned to yap about the constitution without the ability or willingness to understand that persons, as well as citizens, are protected by the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments to the federal constitution.
Someone trespassing on private land is committing a crime. At the moment, these groups are simply patrolling private land. Even if they were patrolling public land, there is no consitutional right to enter this country illegally (although some folks seem to belive otherwise) - and they are allowed to make citizens arrests of lawbreakers if they see fit. So they are doing nothing wrong, hence the hyperbolic vitriol spewed by you and others to paint them as racist. Truly despicable tactics, but we've gotten used to it, although we hardly expect such from a so-called conservative.
If you think America depends on either keeping other people not quite like you out of it or at least upon being rude to others not like yourself, you are to be pitied but not supported.
That's not the issue here, as hard as you are trying to make it such. The issue is about dealing with illegal immigration and its impacts. The current wink-and-nod approach around the country is just as corrosive to the rule of law (a truly fundamental American concept) as Clinton's abuses as President. The immigration laws either mean something, or the law means nothing. Race has nothing to do with it - if this country truly needs millions of Mexican laborers, then let's figure out a way to have them here legally. Better for them, and better for the law.
The conservative movement is rooted in principles and not in bloodlines; in performance and not in soil.
It's also, first and foremost, rooted in law. Since you left that out, I think it's safe to say that you're a CINO.
The Mexicans are coming whether you like it or not.
I'm married to one. You'll have to come up with another line of insinuation to impunge my motives, but I'm sure someone of your poor character will have no problem coming up with one.
Not quite. We are suppose to keep our heads down and continue to vote for the same politicians that intentionally ignore this crisis and massive lawlessness, year after year after year.......
Show ONE place where I have either said this or even remotely insinuated it. You're truly despicable with your tactics here...
As to CINO, you define conservative if you can and I will respond.
Yeah, she was subject to real racism as a kid - was called "taco bender" more times than she cares to recall. She recognizes the real thing, as well as fake bleats of racism from the likes of Black Elk and Rep. Grijalva...
Principles, like in laws, and rules?
The Mexicans are coming whether you like it or not.
Does this mean you support an invasion of people that enter our country illegally by the millions?
Or are you suggesting that we cannot do anything about it, it's futile, so we may as well just ignore the massive lawlessness and open our borders to the world?
Do you get some kind of perverse pleasure plumbing the depths of absurdity? In this country, the law stems from the consent of the governed, and current immigration law was crafted by elected representatives - and therefore should be enforced by the executive branch and law enforcement. In Cuba or Nazi Germany, the law came from the decree of a dictator - i.e., rule of man, not rule of law. But go ahead. Be like Bill Clinton, and decide that the law is something to be toyed with.
I've got an easier method. Since you are claiming that these groups are racist, why don't you first of all tell us the groups involved, and then point to SPECIFIC instances where they have made racist statements, or done racist acts, instead of launching into yet another display of complete absurdity.
BTW, I'm still waiting for you to demonstrate where I have said anything remotely resembling this.
Actually, enough of the illegals crossing from Mexico into Cochise County are indeed home invaders, carjackers, sneak thieves, murderers, drug smugglers, and the like that we have a real concern over our personal safety. No brag, just fact.
I think we've found our racist here.
This line was telling as well:
So what if a few Pedros who are American citizens get killed?
Calling Mexicans "Pedros" - who is being condescending here? But then again, all he sees are votes, not people:
On the other hand, if you don't like the idea of her Satanic Majesty, the junior Senatething from New York by way of Illinois and Arkansas in the White House as Supreme Commissar, you better adjust your attitudes because those Mexicans may be the one group who can stop her cold
Considering that Hillary's hubby never won a majority of the vote, BlackElk seems to think that the existing American electorate is incapable of stopping Hillary, who has far more negatives. So he's willing to ignore immigration laws to try and stop here, which puts him in good league with the Clintons, seeing as they did a couple of rush naturalizations of immigrants, many of whom had criminal records...
Of course America is our home. Just like when New York got hit on 9-11 with the terrorist attack. We were all New Yorkers that day. We are suppose to be *UNITED STATES* made up of legal law abiding citizens.
Of course these are home invaders, homeland invaders etc. Call it what you want. It's an invasion of millions of people that have absolutley no respect for our laws, our rules, our borders or our sovereignty.
Now, I will await your answer to the following. Since 76% of the US population is Caucasian, and the GOP receives about 5% of the black vote, virtually none of the feminazi vote, a declining percentage of the higher educated brainwashed vote (at least until reality catches up with them), very little of the anti-WTO vote, a declining percentage of the union vote, less and less of the lavender vote, etc. Some of this is necessary. If you want to see vote drain, just let the GOP abandon its pro-life position and watch a lot of us walk right out.
Question #1: You show me how you put together a winning coalition for gun rights, lower taxes (of the sort that hit people who work with their hands for a living), renewed American morality, and strong national defense (from our actual enemies NOT our neighbors) while stringing the military all along the indefensible Mexican border much less the even longer Canadian border where actual terrorists cross with impunity and not merely people who come from countries of origin of OTHER PEOPLE who are actual terrorists.
Question #2: Shall we build an iron curtain around America? Lay a radioactive cobalt strip along each border (they may cross but they won't live long)? Use air patrols and strafing? Just waht, other than Bubba times 200 is your plan for sealing the border?
Your wife is a fourth generation Mexican? Aren't you glad her folks came here? Don't you wish others well, too?
I have no problem with them learning English and I bet they will and we ought to encourage it to keep them out of the clutches of ethnic poverty pimps. If you don't like the welfare bill, spread it across the country. That would seem reasonable. Better yet, abolish welfare which used to be the conservative idea as to welfare, but for everyone and not just the Mexicans.
You appear to be arguing from abstracts and history when you talk about 75 years of PRI rule and a draining away of voting blocks from the GOP.
I'm talking reality. 11 tons of trash removed from a National Conservation Area as a result of traffic from illegal aliens, home break-ins, robberies, carjackings, murders, and more misdemeanor harrassment than you can shake a big stick at.
You can continue to philosophize here on the forum, people like the JackelopeBreeder and myself are going to be out here on the frontlines protecting Americans from an invasion of lawless hooligans and worse.
I'm done with you.
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