What is Fascism?

Couples Company ^

[xm177e2]

But there are left-wing forms of socialism that stress nationalism, such as North Korea's "Juche" ("self-reliance")

[marron]

But there are left-wing forms of socialism that stress nationalism, such as North Korea's "Juche" ("self-reliance")

Stalinism, as I mentioned, used left-wing ideology to achieve a right-wing result, whether intentionally or not.

Which means that the Soviet and NK communism might better be described as fascism. The best example of truly internationalist socialism is the EU. It is not so extreme as to feel the need to shoot anybody, but ideologically, it fits.

[NMC EXP]

Socialism = the state owns the means of production (example: the People's Republic of China).

Fascism (corporatism) = the means of production are privately owned but highly regulated by the state (example: the United States of America).

Regards

J.R.

[harpseal]

You noticed many of the things I noticed about the definitions of fascism presented here. For "facist governments" we have as examples Mussolini's Italy and Spain's Falangist government under Francisco Franco. Neither government had a class of peoplepersecuted based upon a superficial characteristic. Borh employed socialist systems of governmentwith private ownership of the means of production. The classic definition of fascism is a totalitarian socialist state where the ownership of private property is allowed with state control of that property.

[Centurion2000]

This is a load of crap ..... simple definitions.

Capitalism : Private property is respected, free market economy

Communism : No private property (government owns the means of production), command economy.

Fascism: Private property with ultimate control residing in the government (rules and regulations) (illusion of ownership). Market is free, but limited by government regulations .

America boiled down is moving towards fascism. 'Communist' China is actually moving towards fascism as well.

[John Lenin]

The "left" and "right", actually, are a little deceptive, as the classic left-wing example was Stalin and the other Soviets, who promoted internationalist socialism, but this version always led back to Soviet control, which is to say, they used left-wing ideology to achieve a right-wing result.

As with anything the government gets involved with the most extreme thing that can happen from an idea will eventually happen. Thats why we have to fight the socialist movement but socialism turns into communism every time.

[Sparta]

FYI

[Billy_bob_bob]

I would say that China is already fully fascist. The big question now is whether or not their current "economic miracle" is sustainable under such a system. Cracks are appearing in the Hunan province, where Mao started out.

[DAnconia55]

Correct.

more info here

Fascism essentially is the goverment support of one group at the expense of another. Private property, controlled by the state. You use the property for government ends, you keep it. You don't you lose it.

Amerika is in the process of creating our own brand of Fascism today.

[DAnconia55]

The economic/industrial description does not fit America, but we do come superficially close to matching the ideological component. We do like having a strong leader, and we do celebrate our military victories, and we do place a very high social value on military service. We like having a strong military, we believe it is very important to our nation.

Convenient for you to ignore all federal workplace laws. ADA, 'racism' laws, 'AA', 'sexism' laws, EEOC, OSHA, EPA, etc.

Amerika is creating its own brand of fascism.

Perhaps Bush can stop it. I doubt it. And I doubt he'll try.

[Centurion2000]

I would say that China is already fully fascist. The big question now is whether or not their current "economic miracle" is sustainable under such a system.

Nope .... if you look at the world in the 1700's and today you'll see something odd.

In the 1700's America was a radical fledgling government.
Today America is one of the OLDEST governments with the oldest unbroken chain of succession of administrations. Freedom and capitalism is why. I don't wory about fascists/communists ever superceding our country. Our country will be eventually superceded by the ideological inheritors of the Constitution. (Probably off-worlders or colonists)

[Centurion2000]

forgot to add my point :) ....

No communist or fascist state has survived longer than 100 years.

[weikel]

provides legal justification for persecuting a specific segment of the population and operates behind a two tiered legal system.

Sounds like divorce court.

[The Duke]

I appreciate the fact that you have a definition for the word "fascism"...however the definition I was attempting to share was the one put forth by Mussolini - who is acknowledged as the father of fascism.

[weikel]

Hmmmm wouldn't agree there. Imperial Rome was pretty Facist in structure it kept on ticking and survived in a mummified form in the East for 1500 years( 1800 if you count the Holy Roman Empire as a legitimate heir to the Roman Empire in the West, I don't except perhaps for the reign of Charlemagne himself).

Democracies and Republics are what tend to fail. Don't know of any historically besides Switzerland which have gone 200 years without becoming a socialist mob rule statem. The mob gets full franchise rights eventually... the productive people get robbed blind to pay the looters and eventually when Atlas Shrugs a dictator comes to power.

[xm177e2]

I agree that the EU has more of the industrial component of fascism (wanting to have government control over industries), but it's very, very far from "fascism." It just doesn't resemble traditional fascism at all.

[UnBlinkingEye]

demoRATS = Republicrats

[Centurion2000]

Hmmm you have a point there.

[DAnconia55]

Our country will be eventually superceded by the ideological inheritors of the Constitution. (Probably off-worlders or colonists)

I have the best wishes for your peaceful pronouncement. This is also how I wish future history to go.

Realize, however, that the American Goverment is well aware of how colonies can rebel. And will try to prevent it.

Add to this, if you will, my own pet theory.
Offworld expansion is intentionally being shut down for these very reasons. The tyrant does not want the victim (or his kids) to escape.

There will be no off world colonies supported by the US, until they are willing to do one of two things :

1. Use powerful control paradigms to attempt to prevent colonial revolt. (Implants, threaten family members, etc.)

2. Surrender the Fascist/Socialist state they are creating to a Capitalist/Liberty based colonization program in DIRECT RESPONSE to threats of another nation (China or Russia) colonizing areas of space.

Hopefully, it will be #2 (I doubt it). More likely they'll try #1, and fail

I look forward to the day that inhabitants of the moon can look down on Earth and tell them to FO.

First ship out, I'm on.

[John Lenin]

Republicrats= RINOS