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Reasonable Gun Control - Support H.R. 648
Sierra Times ^ | 2/16/03 | Geoff Metcalf

Posted on 02/17/2003 4:25:09 PM PST by hoosierskypilot

Who would have thunk it? A Congressional bill has been introduced to defend your Second Amendment rights that is reasonable and makes sense. Which probably means Schumer/ Boxer/Feinstein/Clinton will go ballistic vilifying it.

H.R. 648 was recently introduced by Rep. Joe Wilson (R-SC), "To protect the right to obtain firearms for security, and to use firearms in defense of self, family, or home, and to provide for the enforcement of such right."

I have long argued that law abiding citizens should be armed, trained, and prepared.

H.R. 648 not only reaffirms many of my arguments but legislates reason. By congressional standards the bill is startlingly straightforward.

It states that: "A person not prohibited from receiving a firearm by Section 922(g) of title 18, United States Code, shall have the right to obtain firearms for security, and to use firearms -- in defense of self or family against a reasonably perceived threat of imminent and unlawful infliction of serious bodily injury; in defense of self or family in the course of the commission by another person of a violent felony against the person or a member of the person's family; and in defense of the person's home in the course of the commission of a felony by another person." Not bad.

Even better, it provides a citizen recourse if refused "permission" to purchase or own a weapon: "A person whose right under subsection (a) is violated in any manner may bring an action in any United States district court against the United States, any State, or any person for damages, injunctive relief, and such other relief as the court deems appropriate."

However, the "Findings" section (remarkably) includes some surprising statistics. These are facts most Second Amendment supporters already know, but it is significant to see them included in an actual congressional bill as supporting documentation:

(1) Police cannot protect, and are not legally liable for failing to protect, individual citizens, as evidenced by the following:

The courts have consistently ruled that the police do not have an obligation to protect individuals, only the public in general. (B) Former Florida Attorney General Jim Smith told Florida legislators that police responded to only 200,000 of 700,000 calls for help to Dade County authorities.

(C) The United States Department of Justice found that, in 1989, there were 168,881 crimes of violence for which police had not responded within 1 hour.

(2) Citizens frequently must use firearms to defend themselves, as evidenced by the following:

(A) Every year, more than 2,400,000 people in the United States use a gun to defend themselves against criminals -- more than 6,500 people a day. In other words, each year, firearms are used 60 times more often to protect the lives of honest citizens than to take lives.

(B) Of the 2,400,000 self-defense cases, more than 192,000 are by women defending themselves against sexual abuse.

(C) Of the 2,400,000 times citizens use their guns to defend themselves every year, 92 percent merely brandish their gun or fire a warning shot to scare off their attackers. Less than 8 percent of the time, does a citizen kill or wound his or her attacker.

(3) Law-abiding citizens, seeking only to provide for their families' defense, are routinely prosecuted for brandishing or using a firearm in self-defense. This is NUTS.

(4) The courts have granted immunity from prosecution to police officers who use firearms in the line of duty (creating a privileged class). Likewise, law-abiding citizens who use firearms to protect themselves, their families, and their homes against violent felons should not be subject to lawsuits by the violent felons who sought to victimize them. This 'should' be a no brainer.

H.R. 648 is an artfully crafted bill that even moderates in Congress should be able to embrace. Opponents will find themselves on thin partisan ice.

Some knuckle draggers are going to gripe, "Hey, that ain't good enough!" Well it is a damn sight better that what we have now. Please remember the gun grabber crowd hasn't broadened their unconstitutional-anti-gun base all at once. They have been fighting (and winning) a war of incrementalism. Pete Shields, founder of Handgun Control, said in 1976, "We'll take one step at a time, and the first is necessarily -given the political realities - very modest…Our ultimate goal, total control of hand guns, is going to take time."

We need to support H.R. 648. Call, write, and demand your representative vote for it.

This bill is not politics as usual. It is important. It is critical. And in this era of heightened threat, it is desperately needed.

If you are not part of the solution (to get this bill into law) then you become part of the problem.


TOPICS: Government
KEYWORDS: banglist
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1 posted on 02/17/2003 4:25:09 PM PST by hoosierskypilot
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To: hoosierskypilot
Marked for action.
2 posted on 02/17/2003 4:31:04 PM PST by Blue Collar Christian (Okie by proxy, raised by Yankees, temporarily Californian)
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To: hoosierskypilot
We also need to get the hi-capacity pistol mag ban removed. Also the stupid law that prevents flash-hiders.
3 posted on 02/17/2003 4:31:24 PM PST by glockmeister40
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To: *bang_list
Bang!
4 posted on 02/17/2003 4:34:34 PM PST by AdamSelene235 (Like all the jolly good fellows, I drink my whiskey clear.)
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To: glockmeister40
We also need to get the hi-capacity pistol mag ban removed.

One thing at a time.

5 posted on 02/17/2003 4:35:41 PM PST by elbucko
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To: glockmeister40
And repeal the "Assault Weapon Ban" and the NFA, and the "Gun Control Act of 1968" ...etc.
6 posted on 02/17/2003 4:35:42 PM PST by RKV
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To: hoosierskypilot
Gun Control is hitting the target.

This is a good first step at rolling back the People Control that has been going on since 1968.

FMCDH-BF Bump!

7 posted on 02/17/2003 4:39:04 PM PST by PeaceBeWithYou (De Oppresso Liber!)
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To: PeaceBeWithYou
Personally I am interested in pre-1932, i.e. before the NFA:)
8 posted on 02/17/2003 4:44:00 PM PST by RKV
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To: hoosierskypilot
Well, what does "reasonably perceived threat" mean? - isn't that turf for marginalism as well? Liberal states could perceive that threat very narrowly, couldn't they?, and a blanket access to a gun might not mean a handgun of your choosing?
A key reason why the 2A was adopted was that citizens cannot effectively overthrow the government if it becomes abusive of their rights (which it clearly is becoming). If the government became a police state couldn't they say that because of the additional security that there is no reasonable basis for a preceived threat?
I prefer to defend the 2A constitutionally, not legislatively (and certainly not by the federal Congress).
Also, if a state or city does interpret this too narrowly, I am not keen on my recourse being that you can sue other taxpayers for this decision?
9 posted on 02/17/2003 4:48:44 PM PST by kcar
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To: RKV
And repeal the "Assault Weapon Ban" and the NFA, and the "Gun Control Act of 1968" ...etc.

Some knuckle draggers are going to gripe, "Hey, that ain't good enough!"

Well it is a damn sight better that what we have now.

I, for one, are sick of the "knuckle draggers". They are dragging our rights down. Many of those "Alpha Hotels" are the ones that are supposed to be on the side of the RKBA, yet they seem to provide more ammunition for those in favor of gun control, than against it.

10 posted on 02/17/2003 4:49:57 PM PST by elbucko ("Blue steel, Walnut and a steady aim.)
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To: hoosierskypilot
Just my off-the-cuff reaction, but I think this is a mistake.

We need to continue the argument of the 2nd amendment's application to all citizens and not to narrow the argument through legislation. Legislation becomes fodder for lawyers and leads to the famous unintended consequences we all know so well.

And then, even when passed, legislation never answers the question. It simply paves the way for more legislation.

I don't disagree with a word of this proposed law, but I think it's a tactical error. We must stick with the principle that our nation was founded with: all citizens have the right to own firearms -- period.

We're probably winning this argument right now. It's no time to abandon the principle of self-defense to a law allowing self-defense (if that makes sense).

11 posted on 02/17/2003 5:00:03 PM PST by BfloGuy (The past is like a different country, they do things different there.)
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To: elbucko
The gun grabbers are the ones who are dragging our rights down. Not sure how you define a "knuckle dragger," but it seems to me that it is dishonest to ask for something other than what we want. Some will just never get it, and we should pander to their fears. IMHO, the issue here is how to get back to the Constitution (and for a lot of reasons, not only the 2nd Amendment).
12 posted on 02/17/2003 5:04:41 PM PST by RKV
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To: RKV
should = should NOT
13 posted on 02/17/2003 5:05:58 PM PST by RKV
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To: BfloGuy
"I don't disagree with a word of this proposed law, but I think it's a tactical error. We must stick with the principle that our nation was founded with: all citizens have the right to own firearms -- period."

I tend to agree. By supporting the law, it implies that the law is necessary.

Then again, perhaps it could be the basis for citizens to challenge anti-gun state laws as violating their civil right of self defense.

14 posted on 02/17/2003 5:06:09 PM PST by Atlas Sneezed
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To: Vic3O3; dd5339
2 Amendment PING!
15 posted on 02/17/2003 5:09:45 PM PST by cavtrooper21 (Why walk when you can ride?)
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To: BfloGuy
"all citizens have the right to own firearms -- period.",

Respectfully, I disagree. Not in spirit, but in practice. We have lost our ability to discriminate about who should and should not have a firearm and what kind of firearm is allowed.

In the time of G. Gordon Liddy's book; "When I was a Kid, this was a Free Country", one couldn't just walk into a sporting goods store and buy whatever one wanted. Especially in a small town or close community of larger cities. Where my Dad bought his guns, the proprietor was circumspect of "strangers" buying guns. If, as a youth, I went in to buy a gun, the store owner would have called my Dad.

We didn't have as much gun control then as we do now, but we sure had a lot more "self control' then, then we do now.

Sorry guys, that's the truth.

16 posted on 02/17/2003 5:16:03 PM PST by elbucko ("Blue steel, Walnut and a steady aim.)
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To: RKV
Some will just never get it, and we should pander to their fears.

The problem with those that "just never get it" are that they are starting to outnumber us at the polls. As for "knuckle dragger" that is a loaded term, but it can start with the DC shooter and I don't mean his race.

I agree with you about getting back to the Constitution, but it took us a long time and a lot of public relation mistakes to get into the state of gun control we are now in. If we don't police ourselves, the police will do it for us, or worse, Sarah Brady.

17 posted on 02/17/2003 5:27:41 PM PST by elbucko ("Blue steel, Walnut and a steady aim.)
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To: hoosierskypilot
a whole lot more words than ...shall not be infringed.
18 posted on 02/17/2003 7:18:51 PM PST by teeman8r
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To: hoosierskypilot
I prefer HR 153, "To restore the second amendment rights of all Americans."

"Public Law 103-159 is hereby replaced, and any provisions of law amended or repealed by such Act are restored or revived as if such Act had not been enacted."

"Title XI of Public Law 103-322 is hereby repealed, and any provisions of law amended or repealed by such title are restored or revived as if such title had not been enacted."

"Section 201 of title 11 of Public Law 90-618 is amended by striking `which the Secretary finds is generally recognized as particularly suitable for sporting purposes,' and `which the owner intends to use solely for sporting purposes.'
...
19 posted on 02/17/2003 9:40:42 PM PST by Celtman
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To: hoosierskypilot
Here's a thought from the serial killer Richard:


20 posted on 02/17/2003 10:57:02 PM PST by 2nd_Amendment_Defender
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