Turkish Military Backs Role in U.S. Drive on Iraq

New York Times ^ | March 6, 2003 | DEXTER FILKINS

[Highwayman2003]

Turkish Military Backs Role in U.S. Drive on Iraq By DEXTER FILKINS

STANBUL, March 5 — Turkey's military stepped into the political battle over the country's role in a conflict with Iraq today, signaling its support for a measure that would allow thousands of American troops to launch an attack from Turkish soil.

In a rare public statement, Gen. Hilmi Ozkok, the chief of the Turkish general staff, appeared to back efforts by the country's political leaders to ask Parliament to reconsider a resolution that would allow as many 62,000 American troops to attack from bases here. The measure was voted down by Parliament on Saturday.

"The Turkish armed forces' view is the same as the government's and is reflected in the motion that our government sent to Parliament," General Ozkok told reporters. "The war will be short if a second front is opened from the north."

Only hours before General Ozkok's remarks, a senior member in the ruling Justice and Development Party said that Turkey's leaders were determined to take the measure back to the Parliament and push harder to guarantee its success. The official said the government probably would not act until after elections Sunday that are expected to lead to Recep Tayyip Erdogan, the party leader, becoming prime minister.

Today's events appeared to set the stage for a political struggle in which Turkish political and military leadership would push the Parliament against public opinion.

The measure authorizing American troops had been endorsed by both Mr. Erdogan and the current prime minister, Abdullah Gul, and both men had predicted its passage. But nearly 100 members of the ruling party defied their leaders and voted against it. The measure failed by three votes.

Many of those who voted against the resolution cited the opinions of Turkey's voters, who polls show oppose their country's involvement in a war by an overwhelming margin.

Turkish officials and commentators said it was unlikely that the Turkish military was trying to force the government to reconsider the motion, but rather that it was trying to provide political cover for them so they could push the Parliament against public opinion.

"It's a good statement," Mr. Gul said of the general's remarks.

Turkish officials close to Mr. Gul and Mr. Erdogan said neither man approves of America's plans for Iraq, but that both have concluded that they cannot afford to spurn Turkey's most important ally or the $6 billion in direct aid the United States has offered.

Turkey's leaders have been under intense American pressure to ask the Parliament to reconsider the measure. On Sunday, Secretary of State Colin L. Powell telephoned Mr. Gul to talk about the issue.

American diplomats here have been busy pressing their case, meeting privately with members of the majority party, including legislators who voted against the measure.

Emin Sirin, a legislator in the governing party who opposed the American plan, said American diplomats asked him what they could do to improve relations between the two countries, but he said he had not been asked to change his vote.

"They had a very gentlemanly attitude," Mr. Sirin said. "They didn't have that attitude a month ago."

Mr. Sirin said he had not decided to change his vote, but might if the United States government offered a more generous economic package.

There were indications that others who had opposed the measure would be willing to change their minds, if only to prop up a government that had seen its credibility badly damaged by Saturday's defeat.

In an interview in Sabah, a daily newspaper, one influential member of Parliament who had opposed the measure suggested many of the 96 legislators who opposed the resolution last week would change their minds.

"If the same motion comes today, it would 100 percent be accepted," said Mehmet Elkatmis, a member of the ruling party who voted against the deployment.

It was unclear what motivated the Turkish generals to intervene in the debate over American troops. The military had assumed a low profile in the days leading up the vote, refusing to offer an opinion on the question of American troops. Some Turkish officials said the hands-off approach was due primarily to the generals' dislike of the ruling party, which they regard with suspicion for its Islamist past.

The Turkish military has had an extensive role in domestic politics, having deposed civilian governments in several times in the last four decades. In 1997, it orchestrated the removal of an Islamic-minded government; many members of that body are now in the present government.

A Turkish official, speaking on the condition of anonymity, said the generals were particularly alarmed that Saturday's vote, by canceling the deployment of Turkey's troops into northern Iraq, had effectively forfeited Turkey's role over the future of northern Iraq.

Turkey's leaders are worried that the Kurdish region in northern Iraq could become an independent state. That, they fear, could rekindle desires for independence among the Kurds in Turkey.

The Turkish official said that Turkey's generals were skeptical of the ability of the United States to ensure that the Iraqi Kurds did not try to break away if the Saddam Hussein were deposed.

In his remarks, General Ozkok alluded to those concerns, and sent a terse warning to the Kurds of northern Iraq.

"I remind them of our legitimate right to defend our national interests, and I hope they will be prudent and cooperative," General Ozkok said. "Those who want to replace peace with confrontation will also take the responsibility and bear the consequences."

[Highwayman2003]

The Turks redefine the phrase "kicking yourself in the ass". Too little, too late. Too bad, Ankara!

[KansasCanadian]

An amazingly clear picture of what is really going on in Turkey! Good post

[maro]

I'm sure Greater Kurdistan could use $6 billion in cash.

[Highwayman2003]

You think the Kurds will give us a "good price" on their oil in N. Iraq?

[ping jockey]

Good grief. Just send in a little personal touch in the form of direct payments to members and lifetime membership in some swanky carribean club and the deal is done. the reason turkey is stalling is because we aren't ready to move. When we need Turkey , Turkey will help .Everything in Turkey is corrupt from the judical system to their parliment .Need something done, just bring your wallet.The bigger the something , the bigger the wallet.

[Angelus Errare]

Just be sure they remember all of this Kurdophilia when the PKK restarts the suicide bombings.

[Rain-maker]

Confucious say, "He who imitate ostrich miss many opportunity."

 

[a_Turk]

>> Emin Sirin, a legislator in the governing party who opposed the American plan, said American diplomats asked him what they could do to improve relations between the two countries

The Turks Americans redefine the phrase "kicking yourself in the ass". Too little, too late. Too bad, Ankara Washington!

[Ramius]

Confucious say, "He who imitate ostrich miss many opportunity.

Sun Tsu say: "Never pick a fair fight."

[RobFromGa]

I am confused.

I thought that the Turks (including the right-wing ones) are all on the same page. They all think that the US is evil, in bed with their mortal enemies, and not to be trusted regardless of how much money we offer them to proistitute their country to our horrible wishes.

This makes no sense. Some of them want to deal with the devil? Anybody else figure this out?

[Ramius]

We what?

[Highwayman2003]

Those Turkish Generals want a piece of those "Billions" that got flushed down the toilet... LOL

[a_Turk]

>> "They had a very gentlemanly attitude," Mr. Sirin said. "They didn't have that attitude a month ago."

Look! Your diplo-boys have opted to kissing our asses!

>> Everything in Turkey is corrupt from the judical system to their parliment

It's this attitude that has cost you. These men have turned you down despite your "wallet." You have forgotten the meaning of the word "honor."

I feel bad for your proud military who have to risk their lives for unworthy maggots like you.

[RobFromGa]

Turkish officials close to Mr. Gul and Mr. Erdogan said neither man approves of America's plans for Iraq, but that both have concluded that they cannot afford to spurn Turkey's most important ally or the $6 billion in direct aid the United States has offered...

Mr. Sirin said he had not decided to change his vote, but might if the United States government offered a more generous economic package.

We've already established what they are, we're just haggling over the price?

[a_Turk]

>> We what?

We don't want your money.

[nunya bidness]

This is hardly a suprise and probably a relief to the parliment. Once again the military will have to make all the hard decisions and do the heavy lifting.

Pity the matter coulnd't have been handled better but the footnote to this portion of history will be short.

[Highwayman2003]

I hope we aren't haggling over anything. Those "honorable" Turkish politicians (~lol~), cast their vote. Now it's time to negotiate with the Kurds. Can you say "Independent Republic of Kurdistan"? LOL.....

[Ramius]

I'm OK with that.

Are we on the same side or not?

[RobFromGa]

When Turkey eventually accepts our bribe-money in exchange for landing services without getting US approval to take over Northern Iraq (aka Kurdiraq), what are you going to say about it?

I imagine "Romancing the Stone", Danny DeVito driving with the Colombian general in the back seat, "Americaners, spit on 'em, phft.. phft.."

Do you really hate America as much as you now claim (this week and last)? Or are you just feeling jilted?

Are we going to be friends (our countries) after this is over? Or should we tell you all to take a flying **** right now? (leap)

Are we going to be friends (Conservative Americans and a_Turk) after this is over? Or is Bush too evil?

[a_Turk]

Of course we're on the same side, we've always been. In spite of the occasional bum that you or we might produce..

Tell you what though, if you folks give those northern Irakis stingers and they end up shooting down an airliner there's going to be hell to pay..

[RobFromGa]

I call it Kurdiraq.

We are committed to maintaining Iraq so all the new parts have to include the name iraq somewhere. I think we're going to call what is now Turkey Nordiraq.

[Angelus Errare]

"I thought that the Turks (including the right-wing ones) are all on the same page. They all think that the US is evil, in bed with their mortal enemies, and not to be trusted regardless of how much money we offer them to proistitute their country to our horrible wishes."

Hardly. The Turks are generally extremely pro-American and it one of the few Muslim states that recognizes Israel as a sovereign nation. The last war with Iraq all but destroyed the Turkish economy and unleashed a wave of Kurdish PKK suicide bombings against the Turkish people that killed over 30,000. So understand why they aren't too thrilled with this whole "Kurdistan" business.

The reason Turkey is denying us the right to base their troops is due to some partisan political bickering in the parliament, which is likely why the extremely pro-US military just stepped in to settle the matter. Assuming the parliament will agree with the military, we could still have our northern front in Iraq. That being said, I think it's wrong to blame all Turks for the actions of some partisan members in their parliament (Dear God, look at what the Democrats are currently doing in the US Senate) and is effectively burning bridges, but that is my own take on all of this.

[FITZ]

to ensure that the Iraqi Kurds did not try to break away if the Saddam Hussein were deposed.

Maybe we could give the Kurds a big chunk of Iraq but give another big chunk to the Turks.

[The Other Harry]

Screw Turkey. Keep the 20+ billion dollars and go with the Kurds on this one. They deserve it.

[Amerigomag]

This makes no sense. Some of them want to deal with the devil? Anybody else figure this out?

Yes.

The Turkish army appears to be at the bottom of all the recent developments. They appear to be driven by a strategic fear of the Kurds.

They're reportedly the ones that tipped off the nationalists in the parliment that the US was dealing from the bottom of the deck when Powell insisted the Turkish army be under US control while in Iraq but promised Gul that all groups in northern Iraq would get equal representation and then Myers turned right around and held a stategy planning session in northern Iraq and did not invite the Turkomans.

Now the Turkish army has reversed course, sensing the war will go on without them, and are willing to settle for some say in how much power the Kurds are given in a post Saddam Iraq.

Make sense to you?

[Angelus Errare]

My apologies, that post was directly to Ramius.

[a_Turk]

Turks, Kurds, Turkmen, Laz, and a variety of other ethnic groups had kicked the Brits south of the northern oilfields after WW1. There was no enmity then. We had to sacrifice northern Irak to get a treaty at Lausanne, allowing us to be divided.

If we play this right this artificial illusion of "centuries old hate" will be a thing of the past.

[a_Turk]

>> I am confused

You sure are. Who referred to you as the devil?

[RobFromGa]

I heard 95% of Turkey against America in the general population, and Turks that appeared to be pro-America on FR just weeks ago (specifically a_Turk) now think we are spawn of Satan. [In that way you are right in your Democrat analogy, they also think America is ths spawn of Satan]

The only reason left it appears for Turkey to sleep with us is the promise of a fat envelope in the morning, stuffed with cash for an excellent romp, even though they hate us and everything we stand for.

[RobbyS]

Kemalism lives.

[Torie]

The chaps are chasing a train that has left the station. The troops have been redeployed. Turkey may salvage a consolation prize, and maybe that is best in the long run. Indeed, I suspect it is best.

[a_Turk]

>> the footnote to this portion of history will be short.

LOL!

I wonder if the public can see the pathetic decisions their representatives made.

[RobbyS]

I wondered if the Army would let this go. Islamism would mean disaster for Turkey.

[teletech]

Screw Turkey! They had their chance now we go around them without further delay!

[Kay Soze]

"Turkey's leaders are worried that the Kurdish region in northern Iraq could become an independent state. That, they fear, could rekindle desires for independence among the Kurds in Turkey."

This Kurdish issue will be a huge problem for the Turks.

They blew thier chance at limiting the Kurds by pushing the US to ally more closely with the Kurds.

This will be viewed as the bonehead move of the 21st century in history books one day.

[RobbyS]

No way. Those bases are too valuable to give them up if that is possible. It may mean, however, that different units will be in place and will start a bit late.

[silversky]

Turkey's leaders were determined to take the measure back to the Parliament and push harder

Just wait a? I can see how the US army is keeping their collective breath till summer. A bunch of turkeys is trying to barbecue the infantry. Watta case.

[Scott from the Left Coast]

We don't want your money.

Mr. Sirin said he had not decided to change his vote, but might if the United States government offered a more generous economic package.

Excuse Me? Politicians everywhere are essentially the same thing, it's just a matter of haggling over the price.

For this time and place, it's too late anyway. Events will not wait for the process to rewind. But the Turkish military, and apparently American diplomats as well, are busy repairing fences. Turkey can simply sit this one out on the sidelines happily within their own borders. And maybe that's just what they want to do. There'll be plenty of lesser forms of cooperation, no one's going to break the pick over this one event.

[Highwayman2003]

And what would Turkey's "consolation prize" be? They are expecting a lot of displaced folks crossing over into Turkey after the war starts. Perhaps we could furnish the latrines...

[Angelus Errare]

"I heard 95% of Turkey against America in the general population, and Turks that appeared to be pro-America on FR just weeks ago (specifically a_Turk) now think we are spawn of Satan"

I've heard that around 80% of the population opposes the war, but that seems primarily due to economic and safety concerns (did I mention the PKK?), not any philosophical problems with the removal of Saddam Hussein. And I myself am rather inclined to cut a_turk some slack given that he and Turk2 have been all but set upon by an "online lynch mob" in various threads. I see no reason to blame him for the actions of his government in this regard and while I would have expected this behavior from some of our more outspoken advocates of Greek/Eastern Orthodoxy hegemony in the Balkans, to see it expressed by large numbers of posters is quite simply appauling IMO.

And if a_turk has referred to America as the spawn of Satan, I haven't seen it. He generally seems to have kept his wits about him despite the constant attacks on him simply due to his nationality. But I guess that in order to be a Muslim still posting on FR he has to have developed a fairly thick skin by this point.

[Torie]

A bit of money, a bit of a buffer zone, and the US continuing to support is aspirations in Europe. But a major role in the shaping of Iraq? Nope.

[Ramius]

I'll stipulate that the business of the Kurds in northern Iraq with respect to the Kurds of southern Turkey is something of a wild card. I can't say that I have a good feel for that one, and I'll be happy to defer to your judgment of that.

But I'm back to the idea that the "Kurdistan" issue exists separate from and apart from the issue of the Saddam regime in Iraq. Yes, it needs a solution, and I'm not clear on what that solution might be just yet, but the threat of Saddam is the bigger fish to fry on the barbie today.

I would respect your opinion on the matter: What's the right thing to do here?

[Torie]

This idea that Turkey is as fragile as porcelan glass, and that the Kurds will go wild within its borders, and pour in from outside, and fracture the place, if Turkey cannot wield the iron fist in Northern Iraq, and grab the oil fields for good measure, is frankly ludicrous. This disinformation is well within the spin zone.

[bybybill]

Your post#22 should be taken down because you have obviously have done your home work and know what you are talking about. Shame

[Scott from the Left Coast]

Tell you what though, if you folks give those northern Irakis stingers and they end up shooting down an airliner there's going to be hell to pay..

I strongly doubt anything of the sort (giving Anti-air weapons to the Kurds) is going to happen - there will be no point. There will be more than enough air cover from the U.S. and Britain -- within minutes total air control will be achieved, the Kurds will have no need of this.

The Kurds will need to be on their best behavior for quite a while, as their land in Iraq will essentially be occupied by U.S. forces. It is as much in the U.S. interest as it is in the Turkish interest to keep the north of Iraq pacified. I think the Turkish military will be very happy to stay out of this war (which is now all the U.S. really wishes of them), and provide simpler assistance such as overflight or even air bases.

[Reverend Bob]

Ditto to your post. Two other problems cropped up in this whole mess:

1. The Turkish military hates the Islamicist nature of much of the current ruling party. They sat back, let the party embarrass itself, and are only now coming to the fore.

2. The administration (ours) pulled the military out of the negotiations and let the State Department handle it. One of those Foggy Bottom idiots then leaked info to the press, much of which was inaccurate.

At root, the Turks are our allies.Heck, they want to BE us. They also, however, demand respect. They DESERVE that respect, even when our national interests differ (in re the Kurds, etc).

[KineticKitty]

From Ping Jockey's Bio, I would say he is a part of our 'proud military' for already serving. Just because you dislike his opinion or his 'take on it' doesn't make him a worthless maggot (as you put it). And to be honest most of the 'proud military' soldiers around here have the same feeling, that Turkey turned us down and out of pride because our wallet wasn't large enough, or at least as large as they were requesting it to be before the vote.

Your more than welcome to view it as honor, but some view it as greediness, there are a lot of folks who had a good opinion of turkey up until this vote. Turkey wanted more $$$$$, we put a cap on it (the millions & millions in aide and loan guarantees), they didn't get the MILLIONS they wanted and voted it down.(which is their right) But, some will view that turn down as having less to do with honor and more to do with financial gain, and rightly so.

[Amerigomag]

Turkey can simply sit this one out on the sidelines happily within their own borders..

Not really.

They've already deployed troops inside Iraq and more ar on the way. Yesterday it was reported that one of the larger airstrips in northern Iraq was ringed by Turkish armor.

[a_Turk]

>> Do you really hate America as much as you now claim (this week and last)?

Look, I never said I hate America or anything bone headed like that.

I did say that you people better not arm groups on our border who support terrorists, especially with heavy weapons.

Because that will do two things:

1- they will cause us aggrevation
2- it will bite you in the ass

Put those two together and since we're allies, that's not very good, wouldn't you say?

I have been pretty aggrevated with the actions of your government in that regard. What really took the cake was reading and hearing that the Turks were haggling over money. I know better. Many of you have figured it out too.

My hope was that our armies could partner in Irak. Now it's probably too late.

[Ramius]

My hope was that our armies could partner in Irak. Now it's probably too late.

Stay tuned... I don't think this thing is in the bag just yet.