COMING POLICE STATE

Fiedor Report On the News #305 ^ | 3-9-03 | Ron Paul

[steve-b]

There is only one right, that every human being from the beginning of time until the end of time can agree on: the right not to be arbitrarily killed.

Two stupidities in one sentence. First, it is manifestly not true that every human being has agreed that there is a right not to be killed (unless you're going to tell us that Hitler and Stalin, for example, were really space aliens).

Second, your "arbitrarily" weasel word is a painfully obvious attempt to wriggle out of difficulties (killing in self-defense, execution as punishment for a crime, etc). Sorry, but you don't get to do that -- or, if you do, then you must allow no less latitude to the rights of property, freedom of speech, etc. Since these other rights do not, in fact, require such weaselry to avoid contradiction (but instead require only equal regard for the rights of others), your position in arguing against them collapses.

[Moby Grape]

A Public Service Announcement From the Chicken Little Sky Is Falling Society.

[steve-b]

Similarly, I believe you have no "right" to own a firearm. However, it is impossible for a government to extend protection to all people in a society at all times; in fact, to try would result in tyranny and gross abuses of Right #1. So my system would more or less demand firarms ownership because--you have a right not to be arbitrarily killed and government cannot secure that right at all places at all times. Thus, prudentially, private firearms ownership would be extended to everyone.

A white southerner of a century ago would nod and say, "Yes, ma'am; keepin' the public ordah is exactly why we need to make sure the good ol' boys got shotguns so them Nigras don't git uppity" -- and your philosophy would leave you utterly without a counterargument.

[HumanaeVitae]

Steve, you never answered my original question from eight months ago: why is it wrong to kill your own children?

You're something like a chihuahua, aren't you?

First, it is manifestly not true that every human being has agreed that there is a right not to be killed.

So, you're arguing for arbitrarily killing?

Second, your "arbitrarily" weasel word is a painfully obvious attempt to wriggle out of difficulties (killing in self-defense, execution as punishment for a crime, etc

I'm against the death penalty. And apparently you, unlike me, are against self-defense.

Steve, stop trying to defeat my positions and start examining how foolish and stupid some of yours are. Don't make me offer you a burger from the Gunga Diner.

[HumanaeVitae]

and your philosophy would leave you utterly without a counterargument.

Except for the part where I stated that all people are equal before the law because of their intrinsic worth.

You sound a lot smarter than you really are steve.

[steve-b]

Nope; if you start from the position that the only right is a right to life then you are forced to defend any social order, no matter how repressive by any other standard, that keeps order. Having claimed that all else is a mere privilege, then you're stuck with the logical implications of that position, and will be repeatedly reminded of them until you admit that your premise doesn't work.

[steve-b]

Pathetic. Answer the question that has been put to you: Were Hitler and Stalin space aliens or people?

[steve-b]

stop trying to defeat my positions

"Trying"? You flatter yourself amongst the broken wreckage of what passes for your "position".

[steve-b]

Except for the part where I stated that all people are equal before the law because of their intrinsic worth.

On the contrary, in your statement that you would allow speech that did not offend you and prohibit that which did, you expressly rejected any notion of equality before the law.

[Cato]

Know your rights-All 3 of them.

1.You have the right to free speech as long as you are not dumb enough to use it.

2. You have the right not to be killed unless it is by a POLICEMAN OR AN ARISTOCRAT.

3. You have the right to food money as long as you don't mind a little intimidation, investigation and a little humiliation.

Are these some of your recognised rights of man?

Sheeeeeeeeeeeeessssshhhhhh.

CATO

[HumanaeVitae]

Read it again. You know steve, I put you on an ignore list of mine a while back. Tpaine has made my permanent ignore list. I think after this conversation you're on there as well. You've got nothing to say exept a bunch of snide insults, and you won't put forward what you believe because you know I'll tear it apart.

[HumanaeVitae]

Nope; if you start from the position that the only right is a right to life then you are forced to defend any social order, no matter how repressive by any other standard, that keeps order. Having claimed that all else is a mere privilege, then you're stuck with the logical implications of that position, and will be repeatedly reminded of them until you admit that your premise doesn't work.

Steve, are you a homosexual? Your level of immaturity would imply as such.

[HumanaeVitae]

Actually, let me amend that. You could be Michael Kinsley going incognito. He's straight, but just as annoying as a flamer.

[tpaine]

"I believe you have no "right" to own a firearm." -hv-

No one on FR should ignore your idiocy, as above.

[steve-b]

you won't put forward what you believe

BWAAAAHAAAHAAAHAAA

Oh, this is a new level of delusional inanity, even for you.

[steve-b]

To: HumanaeVitae
Actually, let me amend that. You could be Michael Kinsley going incognito.

Nah, HV sounds like any of a dozen DUmpster denizens who barely rise to the rank of Kinsley wannabees. Admittedly, "I believe you have no "right" to own a firearm." is a good attempt at making the leftist position sound intellectualoid enough to be coming from a TV talking head, but the various juvie insults (e.g. "Are you a homosexual?") drop the mask.

You can take the troll out of the DUmpster, but you can't take the DUmpster out of the troll.

[HumanaeVitae]

You are now on the permanent ignore list. I don't know how many times I've completely defeated you in arguments, i.e. you went away and didn't come back.

You're dim, my friend, very dim. But worse, you're an intellectual coward. Goodbye.

[steve-b]

I don't know how many times I've completely defeated you in arguments

For the benefit of those keeping score at home, that would be "zero".

[steve-b]

You are now on the permanent ignore list.

[ ROCKET J. SQUIRREL ] Again? [ /ROCKET J. SQUIRREL ]

[tpaine]

Given enough time, HV will be 'ignoring' everyone on FR.

-- We can hope.