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New Hampshire Episcopalians Choose Gay Bishop, and Conflict
The New York Times ^ | 6/8/03 | Laurie Goodstein

Posted on 06/08/2003 12:31:17 AM PDT by ppaul

The New York Times Sponsored by Starbucks


June 8, 2003

New Hampshire Episcopalians Choose Gay Bishop, and Conflict

By LAURIE GOODSTEIN

CONCORD, N.H., June 7 — Episcopalians in the Diocese of New Hampshire today elected as their leader the first openly gay bishop anywhere in the worldwide Anglican communion, a step likely to roil the church in the United States and England, and deepen the disaffection of the more conservative Anglican churches in Africa, Asia and Latin America.

The bishop-elect, the Rev. Canon V. Gene Robinson, who had developed a loyal following here in 16 years as assistant to the current bishop, was elected from among four candidates on the second round of balloting at St. Paul's Church.

He received 58 of 77 votes from members of the clergy and 96 of 165 votes from laypeople. A majority in each group is needed for election.

When the tally was announced, the clergy and lay delegates leaped to their feet and applauded as Bishop-elect Robinson came to the front, stood before the altar rail and embraced his two grown daughters, his son-in-law and his partner.

He acknowledged that his election could precipitate outrage and division in his denomination. The Episcopal Church has 2.3 million members in the United States, while the Anglican Communion, a global association of churches that trace their heritage to the Church of England, has about 79 million members internationally.

But he urged the delegates who elected him to be "kind and sensitive and gentle" to believers who "will not understand what you've done here today."

"The world is hurting out there, and the Episcopal Church and the Anglican communion worldwide are divided by lots of things," he said to the delegates.

He said the rift could be healed if believers focused on God and the sacraments. "We can get through this if we keep coming to the altar rail," he said.

His election now forces a showdown in the Episcopal Church in the United States, which like most mainline Protestant denominations has been torn over the issue of homosexuality over the past two decades.

Bishop-elect Robinson cannot be ordained as bishop until he wins the consent of bishops and diocesan representatives at the General Convention, which begins on July 28 in Minneapolis.

The presiding bishop of the Episcopal Church, Frank T. Griswold III, declined, through a spokesman, to comment on today's development. But church members say they anticipate that the decision here could pose doctrinal problems for some Episcopalians who believe that the Bible prohibits homosexuality.

"The bishops and the delegates at General Convention are snarled up on the whole issue of whether to ordain gays and lesbians, and there is considerable opinion in the church, particularly emanating from the South and Southwest, that this should not happen," said the Rev. Dr. John E. Booty, a former historiographer of the Episcopal Church and an emeritus professor of Anglican studies at the University of the South in Sewanee, Tenn.

"My hunch is that Gene will get enough votes, but there will be people working furiously on either side of this to gather the votes for or against," Dr. Booty said in a telephone interview.

James Solheim, the church's press officer, said in a telephone interview tonight: "Reaction is already coming in by e-mail, and it is mixed. Some people are already announcing that this is the last straw, they're leaving the Episcopal Church."

The election is likely to be contentious in the Anglican Communion, which covers 38 regional churches in 164 countries, said the Rev. Dr. Ian T. Douglas, professor of mission and world christianity at the Episcopal Divinity School in Cambridge, Mass.

The growth in the church in the developing world is tipping it toward theological conservatism on some issues, including homosexuality, but it is a mixed picture, Dr. Douglas said. At the last Lambeth Conference, a gathering of Anglican bishops from around the world, in 1998, conservatives passed a resolution saying the church recognized only heterosexual, married relationships, Dr. Douglas said. But he also noted that at the same conference, a committee issued a report urging dialogue on the issue.

Bishop Douglas E. Theuner, the current bishop of New Hampshire, has championed gay causes in the church and approves of commitment ceremonies for same-sex couples.

Bishop Theuner said in an interview that there was no organized opposition in his diocese to Mr. Robinson's election. He said he believed Mr. Robinson was elected as bishop because the the delegates trusted him and were familiar with him, not that they wanted to make him a cause célèbre.

"His election pushes the envelope, but certainly that was not our intention in New Hampshire," Bishop Theuner said. "The people of the diocese are aware that they're part of the larger church, and value that, but we're selecting a bishop to be our bishop."

The Rev. David P. Jones, rector of St. Paul's Church and co-chairman of the search committee for the next bishop, said, "Ten years ago I would not have been happy about this because I would have felt it's clearly contrary to the Bible, contrary to the traditions of the church.

"It's all because I've experienced the ministry of this man and a couple of others that I think I was mistaken," Mr. Jones said.

Church experts say that the Episcopal Church has had gay bishops before and does now, but none who have made their sexual orientation known before they were elected.

The only gay bishop to disclose his sexuality before now is retired Bishop Otis Charles of Utah, who sent a letter to the church's House of Bishops in 1993 sharing his experience as a closeted gay churchman watching the bishops wrestle with the issue.

On Friday, the Daily Telegraph in London reported that leaders of the Church of England have known for years that Bishop Jeffrey John, a newly ordained suffragan bishop in the Diocese of Oxford, had been living with his gay partner of 25 years.

Bishop-elect Robinson, who is 56, is originally from Kentucky. He worked previously at a church in Ridgewood, N.J., and has run ministries for teenagers, AIDS patients and congregations going through conflicts.

He said in an interview after the vote that he came out as a gay man in 1986 and soon after divorced his wife, with whom he had two daughters.

He said he believed the Anglican church should be able to accommodate people who have opinions other than his on issues like homosexuality.

"I'm certain that I want to be in a church with them," he said. "I'm just not certain they want to be in a church with me."

In the history of the church in the United States, only one bishop-elect did not win affirmation by the General Convention, and that was in 1875, he said. He likened his election to that of Bishop Barbara Harris, the first woman bishop in the Episcopal Church, elected in 1988 in Massachusetts.

"There were dire predictions of schism then, and today the gifts of women in ministry are almost universally accepted," he said. Only 3 of the 100 Episcopal dioceses in the United States now do not ordain women.

The other candidates, who were not present for the election today, were the Rev. Pamela Jane Mott of Portland, Ore., and two supervisors of groups of parishes in Pennsylvania, the Very Revs. Robert L. Tate and Ruth Lawson Kirk. Another candidate withdrew after being selected as bishop of Nebraska.

As the clergy and laypeople here today left the service that followed the election, some said they had favored Bishop-elect Robinson because of his pastoral skills, his preaching and his devotion to the church. If confirmed by church officials, he would be only the ninth bishop in the history of the diocese, which dates to 1802.

"We made history," said Bayard Coolidge, a retired software engineer and a delegate from St. Stephen's Episcopal Church in Pittsfield.

"Everybody is going to be making a lot of the fact that he's gay, but that's not the point," Mr. Coolidge said. "The point is, he's well qualified."



The "Reverend" Canon V. Gene Robinson
was elected on Saturday. Behind him is
his "partner", Mark Andrew.



TOPICS: Breaking News; Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: New Hampshire
KEYWORDS: apostacy; apostate; deviancy; deviants; episcopal; fudgepakers; gay; hersheyhighway; homo; homos; homosexual; homosexualagenda; homosexuals; perversion; pervert; perverts; queer; sexualdeviancy; sin; sodom; sodomites; sodomy
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Totally reprobate apostacy.
1 posted on 06/08/2003 12:31:17 AM PDT by ppaul
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To: ppaul
He should be burned at the stake. It would set a good example.
2 posted on 06/08/2003 12:38:24 AM PDT by Paleo Conservative
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To: ppaul
Would the last Christian to leave the Episcopal Church please turn out the lights.

What? He already has? Well, that explains it then.

3 posted on 06/08/2003 12:56:49 AM PDT by FormerLib
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To: ppaul
"Everybody is going to be making a lot of the fact that he's gay, but that's not the point," Mr. Coolidge said. "The point is, he's well qualified."

What are the qualifications?

4 posted on 06/08/2003 1:21:08 AM PDT by Bogey78O (check it out... http://freepers.zill.net/users/bogey78o_fr/puppet.swf)
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To: Bogey78O
The qualifications? He left his wife and 2 children for a man. He cares about others and is a nice person. No wonder people are backing away from organized religion.
5 posted on 06/08/2003 4:51:33 AM PDT by oldironsides
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To: FormerLib
LOL

Actually, when the last Christian has left that church, he's taken the Light of the World with him.

6 posted on 06/08/2003 5:19:04 AM PDT by Hebrews 11:6 (Look it up!)
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To: oldironsides
He still has to be approved by the Diocesan Standing Committees and Bishops of the rest of the Episcopal Church. Which is probably likely.

Assuming he's approved, will the parts of the Anglican Communion that actually believe in the Bible - Africa, Asia and South America - stand for this? Time will tell.

Soon Episcopal Churches will be empty only kept going by old Foundation Money. They claim 2 Million. I would postulate there are less than 1 million people going to Episcopal Churches on any given Sunday.

7 posted on 06/08/2003 5:22:49 AM PDT by Credo
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To: Bogey78O
What are the qualifications?

Sixteen years service in the diocese.

8 posted on 06/08/2003 5:24:22 AM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: ppaul
The Rev. David P. Jones, rector of St. Paul's Church and co-chairman of the search committee for the next bishop, said, "Ten years ago I would not have been happy about this because I would have felt it's clearly contrary to the Bible, contrary to the traditions of the church.

Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: 27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

1 Cor. 6:9 ¶ Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. 11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.

Jude 1:7 Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

Heb 13:4 Marriage is honourable in all, and the bed undefiled: but whoremongers and adulterers God will judge.

"It's all because I've experienced the ministry of this man and a couple of others that I think I was mistaken," Mr. Jones said.

Acts 20:30 Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them.

Eph 5:11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them. 12 For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret.

9 posted on 06/08/2003 5:44:35 AM PDT by miner89
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To: Bogey78O
"Everybody is going to be making a lot of the fact that he's gay, but that's not the point," Mr. Coolidge said. "The point is, he's well qualified."

Well qualified, meaning ignoring parts of scripture this B.S. Church doesn't agree with, nor like!

10 posted on 06/08/2003 5:50:23 AM PDT by sirchtruth
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To: ppaul; scripter
Bump & Ping
11 posted on 06/08/2003 6:28:13 AM PDT by EdReform (Support Free Republic - Become a Monthly Donor)
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To: ppaul
"Everybody is going to be making a lot of the fact that he's gay, but that's not the point," Mr. Coolidge said. "The point is, he's well qualified."

Sheesh. When they elected their first black woman bishop they made much of her black and a woman -- while ignoring the fact that she was totally unqualified.

12 posted on 06/08/2003 7:09:20 AM PDT by Eala ("Here in France I feel at home." --Madonna. So go already.)
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To: Credo
If confirmed, he will not be the first homosexual bishop. In fact, he will probably not be the only serving homosexual bishop. He will, however, be the first acknowledged, opening practicing homosexual bishop. And one who abandoned his wife and children to boot.

What this says about the Episcopal Church of the United States is profound. It has been for some time a church that has abandoned the beliefs, doctrine, creed, and liturgy of its tradition. It has embraced secular humanism and moral relativism. It has abandoned God. I doubt that a majority of its clergy believe that there is a God. Certainly the bishops don't. This is why many, including myself have walked away. The institution will hang on because of the property that it owns and its endowments - but it is already dead as a House of God.
13 posted on 06/08/2003 7:12:12 AM PDT by centurion316
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To: ppaul
the Episcopal Church and the Anglican communion worldwide are divided by lots of things," he said to the delegates.

And he's just supplied one more big division.

How interesting that members of the worldwide Anglican communion (from Africa and Asia) now have missions in the United States - the Anglican Mission in America.

14 posted on 06/08/2003 7:13:31 AM PDT by Eala ("Here in France I feel at home." --Madonna. So go already.)
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To: ppaul
From the piece:

"But he urged the delegates who elected him to be "kind and sensitive and gentle" to believers who "will not understand what you've done here today.""

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Wow....there's a Freudian..if there ever was one.

15 posted on 06/08/2003 7:23:58 AM PDT by Osage Orange (Hillary Clinton: "She makes a hornet look cuddly.")
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To: ppaul
The American Episcopalians have turned their back on God's Word, and instead chosen to follow the Gospel of John Spong. Where is church discipline when you need it?
16 posted on 06/08/2003 7:34:51 AM PDT by Kuksool
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To: ppaul
"Everybody is going to be making a lot of the fact that he's gay, but that's not the point," Mr. Coolidge said. "The point is, he's well qualified."

I can't get over these nitwits - they base their faith on a book that they dismiss whenever it says something inconvenient - like the fact that homosexuality is immediate and final grounds for preventing one from serving in a position of Church leadership.

These "Christians" need to face the truth and call their group something else.

17 posted on 06/08/2003 7:47:08 AM PDT by txzman (Jer 23:29)
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To: centurion316
Will they will renamd the church the house of fudge?
18 posted on 06/08/2003 8:07:44 AM PDT by Vaduz
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To: miner89
If one rejects both Scripture and Tradition,or the universal belief of mankind that homosexuality is wrong then on what principle does one stand? The obvious answer is, none whatsoever: simply the shifting tides of public opinion.
19 posted on 06/08/2003 8:10:28 AM PDT by RobbyS
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To: ppaul
What do you expect from heretics?

They reap what they sow.

20 posted on 06/08/2003 9:00:40 AM PDT by Rome2000 (Convicted felons for Kerry)
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To: centurion316
My family left the Episcopal Church about 15 years ago after the Pastor said, "The Bible is not the Word of God, but a history of man's efforts to find God."

This Pastor was one of the most dedicated humanitarian I have known, and he really loved people, but he did not accept the reality of God and the Scriptures. My shame was that I was the chairman of the committee that called him.

This followed closely after our 12 year old son came home from his confirmation in a sad mood. When asked, he said that none of the 10 or so kids in his confirmation class really believed, but were going through the motions. He wanted to quit and find a "real church". He said they had hung athesist rock star posters in the Sunday School room.

The final decision was speeded up by Bishop John Spong of New Jersey. Of his many writings the one that said that the church needed to get rid of the "icons" like the virgin birth and the physical bodily resurrection of Jesus. It seems that it did not matter if there was a physical resurrection of Jesus. One "theologian" said that it was the resurrection in his heart that really mattered.

I ended up writing a 20 page paper on why I left the Episcopal Church....
21 posted on 06/08/2003 9:06:58 AM PDT by bobg (Bob G.)
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Comment #22 Removed by Moderator

To: bobg
We have the same types in the Catholic Church, and I am not just talking about the Gary Wills of the world. And the Episcopal Church would seem to fit their needs. But, of course, we both know why they won't go that way. The Episcopal Church is a shell of what it used to be. The Catholic Church, on the other hand, is a large organization that they hope to take over and mold to their purposes.
23 posted on 06/08/2003 12:04:51 PM PDT by RobbyS
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To: ppaul
I was a lifelong Episcopalian, and loved that church, but saw that, like our education sysytem in this country, had been taken over by the far left.
I left the church four years ago, and not likely to return.
24 posted on 06/08/2003 12:14:48 PM PDT by AlexW
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To: ppaul
Episcopalian Freepers, please take no offense...

...but right now I'm a very happy man.
Because I didn't end up marrying an Episcopalian.

The Lord does work in strange ways...
The Epicopalian lady is in the place she wants to be,
and I'm not in a place I would NOT want to be.

This is not gloating...MANY pillars of the great hall of Christendom are being weakened.
25 posted on 06/08/2003 12:16:53 PM PDT by VOA
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To: ppaul
But he urged the delegates who elected him to be "kind and sensitive and gentle"
to believers who "will not understand what you've done here today."


Talk about your haughty "vision of the anointed".

This must be why "advanced civilizations" crumble and fall.
In a less advanced society, this sort of lunacy would elicit the proper response
from the parishoners with implements you just don't find in most modern homes:
axes to knock open the doors, buckets of tar and feathers for epidermal
application, and pitchforks for the application of "motivation" for the scroundrels
to get out of town and to stay the H-E-Double Toothpicks out of town.
26 posted on 06/08/2003 12:20:50 PM PDT by VOA
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To: ppaul
Some people are already announcing that this is the last straw, they're leaving the Episcopal Church."

To bad one of history's toughtest Episcopalians couldn't make an appearance
in order to put them back on "the straight and narrow".

For a look at Episcopalian General George S. Patton ,
go to the URL below.

http://www.pattonhq.com/church.html

I suspect the new bishop and member of his cabal would get rougher treatment
than Old Blood And Guts gave to that one unfortunate fellow in the field hospital.
27 posted on 06/08/2003 12:35:05 PM PDT by VOA
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To: ppaul
I pray for

SCHISM!

28 posted on 06/08/2003 1:03:42 PM PDT by Clint N. Suhks
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To: ppaul
The presiding bishop of the Episcopal Church, Frank T. Griswold III, declined, through a spokesman, to comment on today's development.

Because he, like the rest of our diocese, are liberals who want our church to to accept perversion and forget what the Bible says. I'm ashamed of him.

29 posted on 06/08/2003 1:08:36 PM PDT by Clint N. Suhks
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To: Vaduz
Bowling up cadbury alley.
30 posted on 06/08/2003 4:38:55 PM PDT by Uncle Kermie
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To: Paleo Conservative
But wouldn't that make him a flaming queer?;)))
31 posted on 06/08/2003 6:48:34 PM PDT by Frank_2001
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To: FormerLib
Amen.
If a church rejects the plain teaching of the only authoritative documents which tell us about the religion of Christ, why even claim to be a church of Jesus at all? They (The Episcopals) clearly do not believe the scriptures any more. Sinners are justified when they have the kind of faith that Abraham had, Romans 4, Galatians 3, James 2. When God stated a fact Abraham believed it. When God told him to do something, he did it. These people are DENYING the word of God. Why not just come out and admit it? Oh yeah -- they want to keep their jobs.
32 posted on 06/08/2003 8:53:15 PM PDT by Designed
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To: ppaul
I'm having a terrible time trying to figure out why the man wants to be a bishop, especially knowing the offense it would give to a large portion of those to whom they would minister.

We shouldn't have to deal with this stuff. We shouldn't be hateful towards them, but when they get so blatant and arrogant, how can you help resenting them?

33 posted on 06/08/2003 9:03:54 PM PDT by Aliska
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To: Designed
If a church rejects the plain teaching of the only authoritative documents which tell us about the religion of Christ, why even claim to be a church of Jesus at all?

Because they can then mislead believers in Jesus to believe in something else.

But I know you already knew that!

34 posted on 06/08/2003 9:14:25 PM PDT by FormerLib
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To: FormerLib
"Because they can then mislead believers in Jesus to believe in something else."

hmmm, hadnt thought of it that way.

I think it is important for the apostates among the Christian clergy to be honest about who and what they really are and if they are not believers and try to hide it, to be exposed.

It does beg a question of whether this gay man's belief systems includes the need to be faithful in marriage, or whether he believes in the divinity of Jesus and the preachings of the Epistles of Paul. IN other words, he is an Episcopalian - but is he a Christian?

35 posted on 06/08/2003 10:32:15 PM PDT by WOSG (We liberated Iraq)
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To: VOA
This is not gloating...MANY pillars of the great hall of Christendom are being weakened.

Take heart; Christendom is being strengthened. Never forget to look at this as a spiritual battle fought in a spiritual realm. It is not the temple that matters; it is He Who dwells therein that matters.

Events such as these are delineating the followers of Christ from those He spoke about who have ticklish ears.

Not so long ago, Christians were divided, vertically if you will, along denominational lines. There is a major shift underway where the emphasis is not so much on denominational divisions, but more so on the fundamentals of the Christian faith. The new divisions, horizontal one might say, and much fret over, are happening within all denominations and divide the disciples from the apostates. Believers from many churches are seeing commonalties across the street and differences within the pews.

Given what the Sciptures reveal about the Bride, this is a Good thing. Don't fret over the temple being torn down because the Temple is being rebuilt.

36 posted on 06/09/2003 8:36:23 AM PDT by LTCJ
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To: ppaul
"Liberalism is a philosophy of consolation for the West as it commits suicide."

— James Burnham
37 posted on 06/09/2003 10:56:07 AM PDT by TheWillardHotel
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To: miner89
Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

Lev: 18:22

You forgot another verse.
Sorry for the double post.
38 posted on 06/09/2003 10:59:23 AM PDT by TheWillardHotel
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To: ppaul
Man, we got out of that state in the nick of time!
39 posted on 06/09/2003 12:13:38 PM PDT by Redleg Duke (Stir the pot...don't let anything settle to the bottom where the lawyers can feed off of it!)
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To: ppaul
What? No Amazonian shaman available for the job?
40 posted on 06/09/2003 12:17:37 PM PDT by Redcloak (All work and no FReep makes Jack a dull boy. All work and no FReep make s Jack a dul boy. Allwork an)
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To: ppaul
When the tally was announced, the clergy and lay delegates leaped to their feet and applauded as Bishop-elect Robinson came to the front, stood before the altar rail and embraced his two grown daughters, his son-in-law and his partner.

Here is a trustworthy saying: If anyone sets his heart on being an overseer, he desires a noble task. Now the overseer must be above reproach, the husband of but one wife, temperate, self- controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, not given to drunkenness, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money. He must manage his own family well and see that his children obey him with proper respect. (If anyone does not know how to manage his own family, how can he take care of God's church?) He must not be a recent convert, or he may become conceited and fall under the same judgment as the devil. He must also have a good reputation with outsiders, so that he will not fall into disgrace and into the devil's trap.
(1 Tim. 3:1-7)

Apparently he left his wife for his gay lover. He's not qualified.

41 posted on 06/09/2003 12:20:11 PM PDT by r9etb
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To: txzman
"These "Christians" need to face the truth and call their group something else."

Unitarians?

42 posted on 06/09/2003 12:24:09 PM PDT by cherry
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To: RobbyS
Robby, I am Catholic too......I see what the organized churchs are doing and it scares the "hell" out of me....

there will be a day where God-fearing people who believe in traditional morals and theology, will have to ban together for self-protection....not to make one large church....too many differances...but at least an acknowedgment of what we are up against....that basically, our very values and believes even as workers, citizens, parents, spouses are being torpedoed...

43 posted on 06/09/2003 12:30:33 PM PDT by cherry
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To: ppaul
They are going to have a little problem with this little bit of Scripture:

Paul's Letter to the Romans, Chapter 1, v 24-27:

"24 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves, 25 because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed for ever! Amen."

26 "For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. Their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural, 27 and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in their own persons the due penalty for their error."

44 posted on 06/09/2003 1:27:43 PM PDT by 45Auto (Big holes are (almost) always better.)
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To: cherry
I hope that what happened last year serves as a wake-up call. The "American" Catholics--the liberals who dominated the Catholic Church in the United States during the 1970s--would have had the Church become what the Episcopal Church has in fact become. But many "conservative"bishops did not dare tell us what was going on. The fat had to hit the skillet before we were aware that something was wrong.
45 posted on 06/09/2003 1:43:02 PM PDT by RobbyS
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To: centurion316
Amen! The headline in my local paper read: Man of the People referring to Bishop Sullivan, retiring as Catholic Bishop of the Archdiocese of Richmond. Sullivan, long hailed by the press for his Liberalism, is forced to retire at 75. I though, “How very fitting.” He was a man of the people – like any other politician. But as the headline writer inadvertently admitted, this church leader will not go down in history as a man of God.
46 posted on 06/09/2003 6:35:23 PM PDT by moneyrunner (I have not flattered its rank breath, nor bowed to its idolatries a patient knee.)
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To: TheWillardHotel
I intentionally left out Old Testament references since the Christian is under the law of Christ and not the old testament law, and these people claim to be Christians.

However, it is obvious that the Bible teaches that God has made some things wrong at all times and places (drunkeness lying, stealing, etc.), homosexuality being one of them.

47 posted on 06/09/2003 8:16:21 PM PDT by miner89
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To: Credo
"Assuming he's approved, will the parts of the Anglican Communion that actually believe in the Bible - Africa, Asia and South America - stand for this? "

There's been a movement for many years to start a more biblically-oriented Anglican church in the US. How ironic if it happens as a result of the Episcopalians being tossed out of the Anglican communion!

48 posted on 06/09/2003 8:39:36 PM PDT by cookcounty
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To: LTCJ
"There is a major shift underway where the emphasis is not so much on denominational divisions, but more so on the fundamentals of the Christian faith. The new divisions, horizontal one might say, and much fret over, are happening within all denominations......."

Definitely an observable phenomenon.

49 posted on 06/09/2003 8:47:32 PM PDT by cookcounty
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To: Uncle Kermie
Bowling up Cadbury Alley.

LOL
Michael Moore's next production?

50 posted on 06/09/2003 11:50:52 PM PDT by ppaul
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