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'First Americans Were Australian'
BBC ^ | 6-15-2003

Posted on 06/15/2003 9:18:19 PM PDT by blam

'First Americans were Australian'

This is the face of the first known American, Lucia

The first Americans were descended from Australian aborigines, according to evidence in a new BBC documentary.

The skulls suggest faces like those of Australian aborigines

The programme, Ancient Voices, shows that the dimensions of prehistoric skulls found in Brazil match those of the aboriginal peoples of Australia and Melanesia. Other evidence suggests that these first Americans were later massacred by invaders from Asia.

Until now, native Americans were believed to have descended from Asian ancestors who arrived over a land bridge between Siberia and Alaska and then migrated across the whole of north and south America. The land bridge was formed 11,000 years ago during the ice age, when sea level dropped.

How rock art suggests a violent end for the "Australian" Americans However, the new evidence shows that these people did not arrive in an empty wilderness. Stone tools and charcoal from the site in Brazil show evidence of human habitation as long ago as 50,000 years.

The site is at Serra Da Capivara in remote northeast Brazil. This area is now inhabited by the descendants of European settlers and African slaves who arrived just 500 years ago.

But cave paintings found here provided the first clue to the existence of a much older people.

The costumes and rituals shown in rock art survived in Terra del Fuego

Images of giant armadillos, which died out before the last ice age, show the artists who drew them lived before even the natives who greeted the Europeans.

These Asian people have facial features described as mongoloid. However, skulls dug from a depth equivalent to 9,000 to 12,000 years ago are very different.

Walter Neves, an archaeologist from the University of Sao Paolo, has taken extensive skull measurements from dozens of skulls, including the oldest, a young woman who has been named Lucia.

"The measurements show that Lucia was anything but mongoloid," he says.

Walter Neves has measured hundreds of skulls

The next step was to reconstruct a face from Lucia's skull. First, a CAT scan of the skull was done, to allow an accurate working model to be made.

Then a forensic artist, Richard Neave from the University of Manchester, UK, created a face for Lucia. The result was surprising: "It has all the features of a negroid face," says Dr Neave.

Lucia's skull is 12,000 years old

The skull dimensions and facial features match most closely the native people of Australia and Melanesia. These people date back to about 60,000 years, and were themselves descended from the first humans, who left Africa about 100,000 years ago.

But how could the early Australians have travelled more than 13,500 kilometres (8,450 miles) at that time? The answer comes from more cave paintings, this time from the Kimberley, a region at the northern tip of Western Australia.

Here, Grahame Walsh, an expert on Australian rock art, found the oldest painting of a boat anywhere in the world. The style of the art means it is at least 17,000 years old, but it could be up to 50,000 years old.

And the crucial detail is the high prow of the boat. This would have been unnecessary for boats used in calm, inland waters. The design suggests it was used on the open ocean.

Fantastic voyage

Archaeologists speculate that such an incredible sea voyage, from Australia to Brazil, would not have been undertaken knowingly but by accident.

Just three years ago, five African fishermen were caught in a storm and a few weeks later were washed up on the shores of South America. Two of the fishermen died, but three made it alive.

Walter Neves says the negroid people disappear 7,000 years ago But if the first Americans had drifted from Australia, where are their descendants now? Again, the skulls suggest an answer.

The shape of the skulls changes between 9,000 and 7,000 years ago from being exclusively negroid to exclusively mongoloid. Combined with rock art evidence of increasing violence at this time, it appears that the mongoloid people from the north invaded and wiped out the original Americans.

Fuegean Cristina Calderon may be one of the few surviving descendants of the first Americans

The only evidence of any survivors comes from Terra del Fuego, the islands at the remotest southern tip of South America.

The pre-European Fuegeans, who lived stone age-style lives until this century, show hybrid skull features which could have resulted from intermarrying between mongoloid and negroid peoples. Their rituals and traditions also bear some resemblance to the ancient rock art in Brazil.

The identity of the first Americans is an emotive and controversial question. But the evidence from Brazil, and a handful of people who still live at the very tip of South America, suggests that the Americas have been home to a greater diversity of humans than previously thought - and for much longer.


TOPICS: Australia/New Zealand; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aborigines; americans; americas; archaeology; australia; australian; catastrophism; clovis; first; ggg; godsgravesglyphs; history; multiregionalism; neandertal; origins; preclovis; precolumbian; replacement
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* When Humboldt was touring this southern area, he recorded that there were two types of people. One was tall and slim and wore a lot of clothes, the other was short and fat and wore few clothes

* There is a recently discovered skeleton on one of the California Islands that will predate Luzia in age, I think she has been named, 'Arlington Springs Woman.'

1 posted on 06/15/2003 9:18:19 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
Arlington Springs Woman, 13,000 Year Old Skeleton, California Island
2 posted on 06/15/2003 9:21:11 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
This crap never ends...There from West Africa/East Asia/Northern Russia/Greenland/Atlantis and now Australia...does it ever end????
3 posted on 06/15/2003 9:21:20 PM PDT by Porterville (I support US total global, world domination; how's that for sensitive??)
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To: blam
This crap never ends...There from West Africa/East Asia/Northern Russia/Greenland/Atlantis and now Australia...does it ever end????
4 posted on 06/15/2003 9:21:23 PM PDT by Porterville (I support US total global, world domination; how's that for sensitive??)
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To: Porterville
If you don't like, stay the hell off my threads then!!
5 posted on 06/15/2003 9:22:22 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
This stuff makes me dizzy. When are the scientists ever going to get on the same page for more than a month or two?
6 posted on 06/15/2003 9:23:27 PM PDT by Pan_Yans Wife (Lurking since 2000.)
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To: blam
Relax it no reflection on you what I feel about an article. It is just an article after all.
7 posted on 06/15/2003 9:23:30 PM PDT by Porterville (I support US total global, world domination; how's that for sensitive??)
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To: Porterville
Excuse me then. I'm just getting tired of my threads being hijacked by the Creationists, I thought that was where you were headed.
8 posted on 06/15/2003 9:25:14 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
...don't tell me--they found cavewriting that translated to:

"NOOOOOOOO POOFTERS!!!"
9 posted on 06/15/2003 9:25:33 PM PDT by RichInOC ("Australia, Australia, we love you, amen!")
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To: blam
The more we find, the less we know. But, it is fun too see cenvention turned upside down.
10 posted on 06/15/2003 9:25:59 PM PDT by umgud (gov't has more money than it needs, but never as much as it wants)
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To: umgud
convention, not cenvention
11 posted on 06/15/2003 9:26:57 PM PDT by umgud (gov't has more money than it needs, but never as much as it wants)
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To: Porterville
hopefully this will mean everyone will be able to open a tax free casino.
12 posted on 06/15/2003 9:32:36 PM PDT by longtermmemmory
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To: blam
It just that the Aboriginees sailing to Brazil 12,000 years ago and wind up as a not so technological society, is a stretch. If the Olmecs, Aztecs, Incas, Mayans, Anasazi, etc. etc. are decendents of Aboriginal Australians, would it not make sense that Aboriginals be a little more sophisticated than their history suggest???

And isn't it a little convenient to just say they were killed off by the Asian tribes???

University of Sao Paolo, Brazil, first Americans, where??? Brazil or adjacent to Argentina...Prime location of civilization of the American cultures. It is called bragging rights. For countries like Brazil, if you can't be first bend the rules to fit your Carnival.

13 posted on 06/15/2003 9:36:32 PM PDT by Porterville (I support US total global, world domination; how's that for sensitive??)
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To: Porterville
does it ever end????

Why should it? I think the mobility of the ancient man has been severely underestimated by the modern man.

It's not a competition, is just an interest in unraveling the truth of the past and that takes time.

I may be way off base here, but isn't archeology a relatively "new" science. Prior to the last one hundred years it seems like it's just been grave robbing.

14 posted on 06/15/2003 9:47:56 PM PDT by lizma
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To: Porterville
It's just another piece of the complicated puzzle of the settling of the Americas. Which I believe was done by people from all continents over many thousands of years ocassionally interrupted by world affecting catastrophic events.
15 posted on 06/15/2003 9:51:09 PM PDT by blam
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To: lizma
It isn't a little suspicious that a Brazilian anthtopologist is trying to prove the first people in the Americas were in Brazil or adjacent nations???
16 posted on 06/15/2003 9:54:48 PM PDT by Porterville (I support US total global, world domination; how's that for sensitive??)
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To: blam
". . . my threads"

In more than five years here, I have never before seen that.

Now, "my web site", I've seen that. Of course, he owns the place.

yitbos

17 posted on 06/15/2003 9:55:22 PM PDT by bruinbirdman (Veritas Vos Liberabit)
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To: blam
fascinating stuff!
18 posted on 06/15/2003 9:55:32 PM PDT by Ernest_at_the_Beach (Iran Mullahs will feel the heat from our Iraq victory!)
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To: blam
Bump
19 posted on 06/15/2003 9:56:25 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (~~~ http://www.ourgangnet.net ~~~~~)
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To: Porterville

Spirit Cave Man Is the oldest mummy ever found in the Americas. He died in his mid-40's, 9,400 years ago in Nevada. Still had all his clothes and his shoes on when found.

Some believe he is from the same human group as Kennewick Man, Buhl Woman and many un-named others.

20 posted on 06/15/2003 9:58:20 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
It looks like Jean-Luc Picard.
21 posted on 06/15/2003 10:02:13 PM PDT by Koblenz (There's usually a free market solution)
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To: blam
"9,400 years ago in Nevada."

There are petroglyphs not far from here that have never been dated or translated. Yet, there are Indians all around here.

yitbos, BBM, Boulder City, Nevada

22 posted on 06/15/2003 10:02:52 PM PDT by bruinbirdman (Veritas Vos Liberabit)
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To: bruinbirdman
Perhaps and Australian Abo should take a look at them.
23 posted on 06/15/2003 10:04:29 PM PDT by bruinbirdman (Veritas Vos Liberabit)
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To: Koblenz

9,300 year old Kennewick Man, He die in his mid-40's too. (In Washington State)

24 posted on 06/15/2003 10:05:29 PM PDT by blam
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To: Koblenz
Jean-Luc must have gotten his orbit co-ord's backwards....
25 posted on 06/15/2003 10:07:48 PM PDT by TLI (...........ITINERIS IMPENDEO VALHALLA..........)
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To: blam
The identity of the first Americans is an emotive and controversial question.

Which is why, without the Internet and the BBC, this news would
never make the popular press in the US of A.
26 posted on 06/15/2003 10:08:46 PM PDT by gcruse (Support home churching.)
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To: bruinbirdman

Here is the picture of the Australian Aborigine that didn't post (second picture) in the original article.

27 posted on 06/15/2003 10:08:54 PM PDT by blam
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To: Porterville
Maybe but have patience.

Consider the change in land mass. Consider the genetic studies. Time will hopefully tell.

What bothers me much more than possible slanted findings is stopping research dead in it's tracts for political gain (a.k.a. Kennewick man fiasco)
28 posted on 06/15/2003 10:11:30 PM PDT by lizma
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To: blam
YEC SPOTREP
29 posted on 06/15/2003 10:11:38 PM PDT by LiteKeeper
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To: longtermmemmory
Comps on your evidently wonderful sense of irony! :^)
30 posted on 06/15/2003 10:15:02 PM PDT by SAJ
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To: blam
No mention of what's his name, up in Washington, or wherever. The one that the Native American's laid claim to...

(I'm trying to think of a clever Creationist/Darwinist jibe, but I can't)

31 posted on 06/15/2003 10:16:15 PM PDT by KayEyeDoubleDee (const KayEyeDoubleDee& otherKIDD)
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To: lizma
The First Americans

(long but good read)

32 posted on 06/15/2003 10:17:29 PM PDT by blam
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To: KayEyeDoubleDee
Kennewick man!!!
33 posted on 06/15/2003 10:18:01 PM PDT by KayEyeDoubleDee (const KayEyeDoubleDee& otherKIDD)
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To: blam
Re: Kennewick Man

As I recall, the Washington Indians want nothing to do with this dude. If his ancestry is verified it would ruin about 90% of, ahem, "native American" claims concerning ancestral rights, many of which have been written into law.

yitbos

34 posted on 06/15/2003 10:20:13 PM PDT by bruinbirdman (Veritas Vos Liberabit)
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To: KayEyeDoubleDee
"No mention of what's his name, up in Washington, or wherever. The one that the Native American's laid claim to... "

Kennewick Man, the Indians have lost a couple times on this but, I think it is in court again on appeal.

35 posted on 06/15/2003 10:21:58 PM PDT by blam
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To: bruinbirdman
David Chatters, the archaeologist who did the major work on Kennewick Man, in his book, Ancient Encounters, said that the Indians spit on him, physically assaulted and threatened to kill him. (...and a lot of other shenigans)

The Clintons ordered the Corps Of Engineers to destroy the discovery site by hauling in dirt, rocks and etc. and covered the site and would not allow further evacuation. It got pretty hot and heavy for a while.

36 posted on 06/15/2003 10:29:30 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
One little problem with the "drifted and washed ashore" theory: Note that the modern occurrence was fisherMEN. There's no reason to assume that women were out on fishing expeditions which were blown off-course.

On the other hand, if like the Polynesians the purported Aborigines were trying to retreat from enemies they might have loaded whole families into boats and tried to find new uninhabited lands.

Did you know that the Lombok Straits between Bali and Lombok (both in the country of Indonesia) separate the Indo-Malayan realm from the Austro-Malayan realm? Bali and west: elephants, orangs, tigers (once), cattle, rhinos. Lombok and east: kangaroos, birds-of-paradise, parrots, eucalyptus trees, platypus.

The animals, birds, and trees did not or could not cross the deep, treacherous Lombok Straits. But humans did, maybe as long ago as 50 or 60,000 years. The date is definitely subject to speculation; that humans DID cross the Straits long ago is not. Maybe they made the 40-mile crossing on rafts or in dugout canoes (outriggers?). Who knows? The thing to remember is, "Primitive doesn't mean stupid".

People got around in prehistoric times; we're interrelated to a greater degree than almost any other species.
37 posted on 06/15/2003 10:29:33 PM PDT by petuniasevan (I'm hitting the control key but it's not giving me any!)
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To: longtermmemmory
...hopefully this will mean everyone will be able to open a tax free casino.

LOL! And tax free cigarettes, don't forget that!

38 posted on 06/15/2003 10:31:04 PM PDT by yankeedame ("Born with the gift of laughter and a sense that the world was mad.")
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To: petuniasevan
"The animals, birds, and trees did not or could not cross the deep, treacherous Lombok Straits. But humans did, maybe as long ago as 50 or 60,000 years."

Yes, I did know that.

You must be talking about Mungo Man and his gang (68,000 years ago), huh.

BTW, recent DNA analysis indicates that he has a modern human body but is not related to any human alive today. (A dead end human line?)

39 posted on 06/15/2003 10:39:39 PM PDT by blam
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To: petuniasevan

Statue unearthed by archaeologists at an Olmec(1200BC) site in Mexico.

(Just needs a skull-cap, huh?)

40 posted on 06/15/2003 10:48:43 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
Thank you.
41 posted on 06/15/2003 11:01:27 PM PDT by lizma
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To: blam
I went to see the Olmec heads at the Museum of Anthropology in Xalapa in July 1979 (sister city exchange Covina, CA, USA < ---- > Xalapa, Veracruz, Mexico).

Yes, they looked non-native. Certainly not "Indian" (Asian) or Caucasian. The stone heads were very round and had quite thick lips and broad noses and cheekbones, like Aborigines, sub-Saharan Africans, and Melanesians today.

The plot thickens...
42 posted on 06/15/2003 11:03:10 PM PDT by petuniasevan
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To: blam
American Indians were these peaceful nature lovers who lived off the land, the first Americans, the real Americans. They were murdered and plundered by the mean white man who stole their land

And, then, along came Kenniwick Man who seemed to predate "native Americans".

Hmmmm. If Kenny were here before the Indians, how did the Indians get their land? Of course!!! By murder, plunder, genocide and land grabbing.

We can't have the text books even give a hint of that, now, can we? So, in the name of truth and justice, Clinton ordered the digs bulldozed and returned to their natural condition. History closed.

yitbos, is that about how it happened?

43 posted on 06/15/2003 11:07:11 PM PDT by bruinbirdman (Veritas Vos Liberabit)
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To: blam
Based on your interest in archaeology/ancient-history, do you have any of your own theories as to how all the puzzle pieces fit together? I've enjoyed your articles. I have an interest myself in the subject and have even considered studying archaeology/paleontology in college. It's damn exciting how all these discoveries from all over the world and from all time periods are literally re-writing history.
44 posted on 06/15/2003 11:13:28 PM PDT by ForOurFuture
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To: blam
(Just needs a skull-cap, huh?)

LOL! That might work.

Lost tribe??

45 posted on 06/15/2003 11:15:59 PM PDT by lizma
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To: petuniasevan

Unraveling The Origins Of The Mysterious Olmecs

The Olmecs have pottery that is called cord pottery that is identical to the pottery of the ancient Jomons of Japan.

Jomon Womens Pottery


46 posted on 06/15/2003 11:16:13 PM PDT by blam
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To: ForOurFuture
"Based on your interest in archaeology/ancient-history, do you have any of your own theories as to how all the puzzle pieces fit together?"

Yes, In a broad brush sort of way. I'm a catastrophist. The below link will give you a hint of what I mean

Did Asteroids And Comets Turn The Tides Of Civilizations

The tree rings indicate that there have been worldwide affecting events (some say near extinction events) at 3195BC, 2354BC, 1628BC,1159BC and 540AD, with two smaller events at 207BC and 44BC. Civilizations have risen only to be 'smacked' back down by these catastropic events. For example, I believe 1628BC was the Exodus and 540AD was the beginning of the Dark Ages. The asteroid that struck Iraq in 2354BC probably provided all the imagery for Revelations, etc. (Then of cource, all the water from the ending of the Ice Age did a number too, Noah's Flood?)

Disaster That Struck The Ancients

47 posted on 06/15/2003 11:36:21 PM PDT by blam
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To: lizma
"Lost tribe??"

FReeper LostTribe got banned, LOL. I miss him.

48 posted on 06/15/2003 11:39:20 PM PDT by blam
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To: blam
BTT
49 posted on 06/15/2003 11:41:24 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: blam
That guy was a complete nut, and was the bandwidth-wasting king.
50 posted on 06/15/2003 11:42:33 PM PDT by Mr. Mojo
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